Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 25
  1. #1
    Community Member Amidamarujhqz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    40

    Default Dragonborn DPS Paladin

    Need help to create a Dragonborn Paladin with this info:
    Class: Pure Paladin
    Race: Dragonborn.
    Strategy: High dps output.
    Build: First life 32pts.
    Fighting style: THF with Greatswords.
    Healing: If possible to squeeze in some healing it is surely welcome.
    Thanks in advance for the help.

  2. #2
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    I've been thinking about this already:
    Code:
    Lizard Knight
    Paladin 20
    Lawful Good Dragonborn
    
    
    Stats
                   28pt     32pt     34pt     36pt     Tome     Level Up
                   ----     ----     ----     ----     ----     --------
    Strength        18       18       18       18       +2       4: STR
    Dexterity        6        6        6        6       +2       8: STR
    Constitution    14       14       15       16       +2      12: STR
    Intelligence    14       14       14       14       +2      16: STR
    Wisdom           8        8        8        8       +2      20: STR
    Charisma        16       18       18       18       +2      24: STR
                                                                28: STR
    
    Skills
              1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
             ------------------------------------------------------------
    Concent   2  3     2     2     2     2     2     2     2     2     2  23
    Heal      4     1  1  1  1  1  2     2     2     2     2     2     2  23
    Intim     4  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  23
    UMD       2     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     11
    Balance                           1     1     1     1     1     1      6
    Diplo                       1                                          1
    Tumble    1                                                            1
             ------------------------------------------------------------
             16  4  4  4  4  4  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5
    
    
    Feats
    
     1        : Power Attack
     1 Dragon : Draconic Ancestry: Red
     1 Deity  : Follower of: Onatar
     3        : Two Handed Fighting
     6        : Improved Two Handed Fighting
     6 Deity  : Onatar's Forge
     9        : Improved Critical: Slashing
    12        : Greater Two Handed Fighting
    15        : Quicken Spell
    18        : Empower Healing Spell
    21 Epic   : Overwhelming Critical
    24 Epic   : Cleave OR Stunning Blow
    26 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
    27 Epic   : Epic Damage Reduction
    28 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting OR Elusive Target
    29 Destiny: Dire Charge OR Deific Warding
    30 Epic   : Bulwark of Defense OR Stunning Blow
    30 Legend : Scion of: Arborea OR Plane of Earth
    
    
    Enhancements (80 AP)
    
    Knight of the Chalice (41 AP)
    
    • Slayer of Evil, Courage of Heaven, Slayer of Evil II, Improved Courage of Heaven, Slayer of Evil III, Champion of Good
      1. Extra Turning III, Extra Smite II
      2. Divine Might III, Exalted Cleave III, Melee Power Boost III
      3. Divine Sacrifice I, Vigor of Life, Exalted Smite I
      4. Censure Demons, Passion I, Empowered Smite
      5. Censure Outsiders, Holy Retribution III, Avenging Cleave III, Sealed Life
    Sacred Defender (22 AP)
    • Holy Bastion, Sacred Defense, Divine Righteousness, Redemption
      1. Extra Lay On Hands III, Durable Defense III, Sacred Armor Mastery II
      2. Bulwark Aura III
      3. Resistance Aura III, Tenacious Defense III
      4. Swift Defense
    Dragonborn (17 AP)
    • Hardy, Strength
      1. Hard Scales III
      2. Harder Scales III, Extra Action Boost III
      3. (none)
      4. Memory of Flight
    Leveling Guide
    1. KoC0 Slayer of Evil; KoC1 Extra Smite I, II; SD0 Holy Bastion
    2. SD1 Extra Lay On Hands I, II, III; KoC1 Extra Turning I
    3. KoC1 Extra Turning II; KoC2 Exalted Cleave I, II, III
    4. KoC2 Divine Might I; KoC0 Courage of Heaven; KoC3 Divine Sacrifice I
    5. KoC3 Exalted Smite I; KoC2 Divine Might II
    6. KoC0 Slayer of Evil II; KoC2 Melee Power Boost I, II, III
    7. KoC4 Empowered Smite; KoC4 Passion I; KoC4 Censure Demons
    8. KoC2 Divine Might III; SD1 Durable Defense I; SD0 Sacred Defense
    9. SD1 Durable Defense II, III; SD1 Sacred Armor Mastery I, II
    10. SD3 Tenacious Defense I, II, III; KoC1 Extra Turning III
    11. KoC3 Vigor of Life; (Bank 2 AP)
    12. KoC0 Improved Courage of Heaven; KoC5 Avenging Cleave I, II, III; KoC5 Sealed Life
    13. KoC5 Holy Retribution I, II, III; KoC5 Censure Outsiders
    14. SD0 Divine Righteousness; SD2 Bulwark Aura I, II, III
    15. SD3 Resistance Aura I, II, III; SD4 Swift Defense
    16. SD0 Redemption; Dra0 Hardy; Dra0 Strength
    17. Dra1 Hard Scales I, II; Dra2 Extra Action Boost I
    18. KoC0 Slayer of Evil III; Dra1 Hard Scales III; Dra2 Extra Action Boost II
    19. Dra2 Extra Action Boost III; Dra2 Harder Scales I, II
    20. KoC0 Champion of Good; Dra2 Harder Scales III; Dra4 Memory of Flight
    Destiny (24 AP) Legendary Dreadnought
    1. Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III
    2. Momentum Swing III, Imp. Power Attack
    3. Lay Waste, Haste Boost III
    4. Volcano's Edge
    5. Advancing Blows, Devastating Critical
    6. Master's Blitz
    Twists of Fate (35 fate points)
    1. Sense Weakness (Tier 4 Fury)
    2. Grim Precision (Tier 3 Shadowdancer)
    3. Hail of Blows (Tier 2 Flowers)
    4. Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
    5. Brace for Impact (Tier 1 Sentinel)
    Skills aren't really that important, so if you want to dump INT for max STR, go ahead. As always, falchions are preferable to greatswords for better crit profile, unless you've got a SOS; switching to greataxes like Riftmaker is easy too. I'm intrigued by bolstering defenses thru DB + SD AC & PRR bonuses, I'm just not sure it's worth the APs. But whatever: easy enough to reset. Twists are a best-case scenario; take whatever's available & helpful while epic-leveling. Since it's a first-lifer, it's up to you whether you make a beeline for Dreadnought (US -> GMoF -> LD req's 1.8M XP so you can get there before lvl 23) or work on leveling your other EDs first to earn more Fate pts.
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

  3. #3
    Community Member ifumoveudie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    146

    Default

    Hey Urbongwah, how would you apply this to a legend toon with 36 point build, and all ED's unlocked? I have already run a Dborn Fvs on my main toon, but am thinking on going pally this life, and seeing what DPS would be like there. I have a +7 supreme tome, can craft most of my gear, and already have a few axes to use, unless you think flachion would be a better option. Any help on this one would be appreciated.
    Proud member of the ArchAngels guild, Thelanis.
    Policegirl Killz, Porklord Meatfield, Pilfering Pirate.

  4. #4
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    53

    Default Dragonborn Paladin

    I have been unable to create one of these. Have you heard of any bugs related to this?



    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    I've been thinking about this already:
    Code:
    Lizard Knight
    Paladin 20
    Lawful Good Dragonborn
    
    
    Stats
                   28pt     32pt     34pt     36pt     Tome     Level Up
                   ----     ----     ----     ----     ----     --------
    Strength        18       18       18       18       +2       4: STR
    Dexterity        6        6        6        6       +2       8: STR
    Constitution    14       14       15       16       +2      12: STR
    Intelligence    14       14       14       14       +2      16: STR
    Wisdom           8        8        8        8       +2      20: STR
    Charisma        16       18       18       18       +2      24: STR
                                                                28: STR
    
    Skills
              1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
             ------------------------------------------------------------
    Concent   2  3     2     2     2     2     2     2     2     2     2  23
    Heal      4     1  1  1  1  1  2     2     2     2     2     2     2  23
    Intim     4  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  23
    UMD       2     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     11
    Balance                           1     1     1     1     1     1      6
    Diplo                       1                                          1
    Tumble    1                                                            1
             ------------------------------------------------------------
             16  4  4  4  4  4  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5  5
    
    
    Feats
    
     1        : Power Attack
     1 Dragon : Draconic Ancestry: Red
     1 Deity  : Follower of: Onatar
     3        : Two Handed Fighting
     6        : Improved Two Handed Fighting
     6 Deity  : Onatar's Forge
     9        : Improved Critical: Slashing
    12        : Greater Two Handed Fighting
    15        : Quicken Spell
    18        : Empower Healing Spell
    21 Epic   : Overwhelming Critical
    24 Epic   : Cleave OR Stunning Blow
    26 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
    27 Epic   : Epic Damage Reduction
    28 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting OR Elusive Target
    29 Destiny: Dire Charge OR Deific Warding
    30 Epic   : Bulwark of Defense OR Stunning Blow
    30 Legend : Scion of: Arborea OR Plane of Earth
    
    
    Enhancements (80 AP)
    
    Knight of the Chalice (41 AP)
    
    • Slayer of Evil, Courage of Heaven, Slayer of Evil II, Improved Courage of Heaven, Slayer of Evil III, Champion of Good
      1. Extra Turning III, Extra Smite II
      2. Divine Might III, Exalted Cleave III, Melee Power Boost III
      3. Divine Sacrifice I, Vigor of Life, Exalted Smite I
      4. Censure Demons, Passion I, Empowered Smite
      5. Censure Outsiders, Holy Retribution III, Avenging Cleave III, Sealed Life
    Sacred Defender (22 AP)
    • Holy Bastion, Sacred Defense, Divine Righteousness, Redemption
      1. Extra Lay On Hands III, Durable Defense III, Sacred Armor Mastery II
      2. Bulwark Aura III
      3. Resistance Aura III, Tenacious Defense III
      4. Swift Defense
    Dragonborn (17 AP)
    • Hardy, Strength
      1. Hard Scales III
      2. Harder Scales III, Extra Action Boost III
      3. (none)
      4. Memory of Flight
    Leveling Guide
    1. KoC0 Slayer of Evil; KoC1 Extra Smite I, II; SD0 Holy Bastion
    2. SD1 Extra Lay On Hands I, II, III; KoC1 Extra Turning I
    3. KoC1 Extra Turning II; KoC2 Exalted Cleave I, II, III
    4. KoC2 Divine Might I; KoC0 Courage of Heaven; KoC3 Divine Sacrifice I
    5. KoC3 Exalted Smite I; KoC2 Divine Might II
    6. KoC0 Slayer of Evil II; KoC2 Melee Power Boost I, II, III
    7. KoC4 Empowered Smite; KoC4 Passion I; KoC4 Censure Demons
    8. KoC2 Divine Might III; SD1 Durable Defense I; SD0 Sacred Defense
    9. SD1 Durable Defense II, III; SD1 Sacred Armor Mastery I, II
    10. SD3 Tenacious Defense I, II, III; KoC1 Extra Turning III
    11. KoC3 Vigor of Life; (Bank 2 AP)
    12. KoC0 Improved Courage of Heaven; KoC5 Avenging Cleave I, II, III; KoC5 Sealed Life
    13. KoC5 Holy Retribution I, II, III; KoC5 Censure Outsiders
    14. SD0 Divine Righteousness; SD2 Bulwark Aura I, II, III
    15. SD3 Resistance Aura I, II, III; SD4 Swift Defense
    16. SD0 Redemption; Dra0 Hardy; Dra0 Strength
    17. Dra1 Hard Scales I, II; Dra2 Extra Action Boost I
    18. KoC0 Slayer of Evil III; Dra1 Hard Scales III; Dra2 Extra Action Boost II
    19. Dra2 Extra Action Boost III; Dra2 Harder Scales I, II
    20. KoC0 Champion of Good; Dra2 Harder Scales III; Dra4 Memory of Flight
    Destiny (24 AP) Legendary Dreadnought
    1. Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III
    2. Momentum Swing III, Imp. Power Attack
    3. Lay Waste, Haste Boost III
    4. Volcano's Edge
    5. Advancing Blows, Devastating Critical
    6. Master's Blitz
    Twists of Fate (35 fate points)
    1. Sense Weakness (Tier 4 Fury)
    2. Grim Precision (Tier 3 Shadowdancer)
    3. Hail of Blows (Tier 2 Flowers)
    4. Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
    5. Brace for Impact (Tier 1 Sentinel)
    Skills aren't really that important, so if you want to dump INT for max STR, go ahead. As always, falchions are preferable to greatswords for better crit profile, unless you've got a SOS; switching to greataxes like Riftmaker is easy too. I'm intrigued by bolstering defenses thru DB + SD AC & PRR bonuses, I'm just not sure it's worth the APs. But whatever: easy enough to reset. Twists are a best-case scenario; take whatever's available & helpful while epic-leveling. Since it's a first-lifer, it's up to you whether you make a beeline for Dreadnought (US -> GMoF -> LD req's 1.8M XP so you can get there before lvl 23) or work on leveling your other EDs first to earn more Fate pts.

  5. #5
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    8,580

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sleeksilver View Post
    I have been unable to create one of these. Have you heard of any bugs related to this?
    I have not heard of an issue in creating a Dragonborn character.

    So my first question is do you meet the requirements (Pulled from DDO WIKI)
    Dragonborn is a premium race released in Update 35. Free to VIP accounts, it is available to non-VIP from the DDO Store for 1,295 .

  6. #6
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ifumoveudie View Post
    Hey Urbongwah, how would you apply this to a legend toon with 36 point build, and all ED's unlocked?
    It's not a tome-dependent build. Apart from skill pts, nothing really changes whether you have zero tomes or +7 Supreme. If you don't care about skills, you can start STR 20 CON 16 CHA 18 or STR 20 CON 12 CHA 20, depending on how dangerously you like to live.
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

  7. #7
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    0

    Default

    I know this thread asked for Pure....but what would you think about splashing 5 levels of Fighter...for some Kensai Goodness?
    Last edited by Loromir; 03-28-2017 at 10:36 AM.
    Leader of Legion of Eberron on Cannith.

    Characters: Loromir & Baldomir....among others.

  8. #8
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Loromir View Post
    I know this thread asked for Pure....but what would you think about splashing 5 levels of Fighter...for some Kensai Goodness?
    What did you have in mind?
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

  9. #9
    Community Member Miow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,676

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Loromir View Post
    I know this thread asked for Pure....but what would you think about splashing 5 levels of Fighter...for some Kensai Goodness?
    Not to mention the extra feats

  10. #10
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    What did you have in mind?
    I'm just not sure the extra 5 levels of Paladin outweigh what you can get from the kensai tree as well as the extra feats.

    You could go all the way to tier 5 in Kensai getting things like opportunity attack, a good death etc.
    Leader of Legion of Eberron on Cannith.

    Characters: Loromir & Baldomir....among others.

  11. #11
    Community Member Blastyswa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    1,083

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Loromir View Post
    I know this thread asked for Pure....but what would you think about splashing 5 levels of Fighter...for some Kensai Goodness?
    If doing a splash, I'd probably go 14/6 Paladin/Fighter. Drop Holy Sword, keep Zeal, switch enhancements to 34 Kensei/24 Sacred Defender/22 Knight of the Chalice, allowing you to keep full smite chain from chalice including +5 MP on hit, core 4 Sacred Defender as well as +20% HP and +6 strength, and picking up 8 damage with falchions with that line of feats and Weapon Specialization as well as Improved Destruction, Haste Boost without having to spend points from dreadnought, Liquid Courage to make up the hamp difference a little, +40 MP from Opportunity Attack+One With the Blade, Deadly Strike and A Good Death, and +1 crit multiplier from core 3/+1 threat range from tier 5 to make up for holy sword. The feats from 6 fighter would be spend on Weapon Focus: Slashing, Weapon Specialization: Slashing, and two others of your choice.

    Potentially, in a small build alteration, I would recommend dropping Empower Healing spell (You can get plenty powerful heals without it) and then pick up Stunning Blow, Cleave, and Great Cleave in heroics. Then, for epic feats you can do Overwhelming Critical, Bulwark of Defense or something else, and Epic Will/Epic Reflexes. I'd then drop the brace for impact twist to pick up dragonhide from draconic incarnation, and all of a sudden you never fail saves and have +7 AC between Bulwark and Dragonhide, which is a +1 gain over the original versions +6 from Dragonborn enhancements.

    The basic breakdown of this change is:

    Pros:
    -More DPS (Same crit profile, +8 base damage, +40 MP)
    -More (powerful) clicked abilities (Easier to fit in Stunning Blow/Cleaves, and you get Deadly Strike, a Good Death, and Opportunity Attack)
    -More versatility (Haste Boost from Kensei means you can take +6 critical damage in Dreadnought, or something else if you wanted, I'd personally drop volcano's edgeand pick up 3 critical damage and 1 strength, also the +4 feats makes fitting stuff in easier)
    -No fail saves (No fail on a 1 saves for Will, Reflex, and Fortitude)

    Neutrals:
    -You keep Zeal for DPS in both versions, as well as the smiting line and the Sacred Defender line, and you keep t3 Knight of the Chalice for ghost touch.
    -Healing Amplification (This version drops Vigor of Life since it can't be fit in without dropping some Exalted Smite or Divine Might ranks if you're going 3 on both, but picks up +50 hamp from Kensei. Technically this is a pro, but since Kensei requires remembering to do the pots I counted it as Neutral, as well as since the dropping of Empower Healing means you'll be healing around the same around anyways)
    -AC (Stays around the same)

    Cons:
    -Only one level 4 Paladin spell, and it's Zeal. (Zeal is definitely the best choice for DPS, but you won't be able to get Restoration, Cure Serious Wounds, or Death Ward. You can live without those by carrying pots/scrolls/clickies and using cocoon+CMW/CLW, but it's a little less simple).
    -No higher tier Knight of the Chalice (You miss out on a little bit of light damage which is easily offset by the much higher offense gains from going with Kensei, which even including core 6 Knight of the Chalice and tier 5 smiting is +25 more melee power and more damage per hit, and you also won't stun outsiders, be immune to negative levels, or bypass good DR without using a beater or Blessed Blades. Personally none of those are big issues to me, but different strokes for different people)
    -No Memory of Flight. (Wings is very nice, and I could see this being a dealbreaker if you're particularly attached to them. Realistically you can't fit them in on this build unless you drop a ton of offense or a ton of defense.)

    From the breakdown I think that the fighter version would give superior performance in all categories, but also doesn't have wings, so if that's a dealbreaker then that's a dealbreaker. It also doesn't use Dragonborn for much more than just the high starting strength/charisma and the looks, although to be fair the original proposed build doesn't include breath either (Which I don't think would be good on this build, but also is a huge part of the flavor of dragonborn). The fighter splash version should give superior performance in most categories just based off the straight damage gain, but it's ultimately up to the individual player.
    Dazling of Cannith

  12. #12
    Barbarbarian Sam-u-r-eye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    2,024

    Default

    Pure Fighter
    Play in Divine Crusader and Pretend you're a Paladin
    Without new players DDO will go the way of the dodo.
    Old Sorc Build Guide, Ghallanda -> Orien

  13. #13
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Loromir View Post
    I'm just not sure the extra 5 levels of Paladin outweigh what you can get from the kensai tree as well as the extra feats.
    Once you start down the road of "I want better DPS than pure paladin," you need to ask yourself, "Why do I want to play a paladin in the first place?" Because taken to its logical extreme, you wind up with this:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam-u-r-eye View Post
    Pure Fighter
    Play in Divine Crusader and Pretend you're a Paladin
    Which is not what the OP requested.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blastyswa View Post
    Pros:
    -More DPS (Same crit profile, +8 base damage, +40 MP)
    You lose 15 MP from KotC (capstone + T5 bonus), so it's "only" a net gain of 25 MP - and only if you can sustain Opportunity Atk's bonus.
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

  14. #14
    Community Member Blastyswa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    1,083

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    You lose 15 MP from KotC (capstone + T5 bonus), so it's "only" a net gain of 25 MP - and only if you can sustain Opportunity Atk's bonus.
    Cons:
    -Only one level 4 Paladin spell, and it's Zeal. (Zeal is definitely the best choice for DPS, but you won't be able to get Restoration, Cure Serious Wounds, or Death Ward. You can live without those by carrying pots/scrolls/clickies and using cocoon+CMW/CLW, but it's a little less simple).
    -No higher tier Knight of the Chalice (You miss out on a little bit of light damage which is easily offset by the much higher offense gains from going with Kensei, which even including core 6 Knight of the Chalice and tier 5 smiting is +25 more melee power and more damage per hit, and you also won't stun outsiders, be immune to negative levels, or bypass good DR without using a beater or Blessed Blades. Personally none of those are big issues to me, but different strokes for different people)

    Yep I mentioned that, just wasn't in that particular quote. If you can't sustain Opportunity Attack it's still a +5 MP gain, and while that isn't a massive gain it is a gain and not a loss, not to mention the +8 base damage which is a very big deal. Personally I've never had problems keeping up Opportunity Attack in epics, especially with haste boost, but YMMV. I agree that there's a point where you're no longer a paladin and just a fighter with extra saves, but I don't think the 14/6 version quite reaches that point; A majority of points (Including KoTC and Sacred Defender) are still spent on paladin enhancements, a majority of levels are still in the paladin class, you're still casting paladin spells and using powerful Lay on Hands, you still have high power smites, you still use Divine Might, etc. If the OP wants a pure paladin for sure then this split doesn't work for him, but personally I think it's about the best rough version (I made it up as I went, so it's not optimized by any means) for maximum DPS on the stated premise of a paladin that uses THF and wants to specialize in outputting damage, while still playing like a paladin. It also includes the nice little bonuses of no fail saves and some more clicky abilities, which keeps the build from becoming "swing swing swing swing swing swing smite, and repeat" and more of a "stunning blow-deadly strike-cleave-great cleave-momentum swing-exalted smite-a good death" type build, which I personally find much more enjoyable at least.

    With that said, your original build also does look very solid, this is just my recommendation on tweaks I'd make if a 6 fighter splash was acceptable.
    Dazling of Cannith

  15. #15
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    Sorry, I failed my save vs Wall of Text.
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

  16. #16
    Community Member Blastyswa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    1,083

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Sorry, I failed my save vs Wall of Text.
    True, I should have included the feat "Epic Reading" to negate failing on a 1. I went ahead and added it in on another version to make it less of a wall.

    If doing a splash, I'd probably go 14/6 Paladin/Fighter. Drop Holy Sword, keep Zeal, switch enhancements to 34 Kensei/24 Sacred Defender/22 Knight of the Chalice, allowing you to keep full smite chain from chalice including +5 MP on hit, core 4 Sacred Defender as well as +20% HP and +6 strength, and picking up 8 damage with falchions with that line of feats and Weapon Specialization as well as Improved Destruction, Haste Boost without having to spend points from dreadnought, Liquid Courage to make up the hamp difference a little, +40 MP from Opportunity Attack+One With the Blade, Deadly Strike and A Good Death, and +1 crit multiplier from core 3/+1 threat range from tier 5 to make up for holy sword. The feats from 6 fighter would be spend on Weapon Focus: Slashing, Weapon Specialization: Slashing, and two others of your choice.


    Potentially, in a small build alteration, I would recommend dropping Empower Healing spell (You can get plenty powerful heals without it) and then pick up Stunning Blow, Cleave, and Great Cleave in heroics. Then, for epic feats you can do Overwhelming Critical, Bulwark of Defense or something else, and Epic Will/Epic Reflexes. I'd then drop the brace for impact twist to pick up dragonhide from draconic incarnation, and all of a sudden you never fail saves and have +7 AC between Bulwark and Dragonhide, which is a +1 gain over the original versions +6 from Dragonborn enhancements.

    The basic breakdown of this change is:

    Pros:
    -More DPS (Same crit profile, +8 base damage, +40 MP)
    -More (powerful) clicked abilities (Easier to fit in Stunning Blow/Cleaves, and you get Deadly Strike, a Good Death, and Opportunity Attack)
    -More versatility (Haste Boost from Kensei means you can take +6 critical damage in Dreadnought, or something else if you wanted, I'd personally drop volcano's edgeand pick up 3 critical damage and 1 strength, also the +4 feats makes fitting stuff in easier)
    -No fail saves (No fail on a 1 saves for Will, Reflex, and Fortitude)

    Neutrals:
    -You keep Zeal for DPS in both versions, as well as the smiting line and the Sacred Defender line, and you keep t3 Knight of the Chalice for ghost touch.
    -Healing Amplification (This version drops Vigor of Life since it can't be fit in without dropping some Exalted Smite or Divine Might ranks if you're going 3 on both, but picks up +50 hamp from Kensei. Technically this is a pro, but since Kensei requires remembering to do the pots I counted it as Neutral, as well as since the dropping of Empower Healing means you'll be healing around the same around anyways)
    -AC (Stays around the same)

    Cons:
    -Only one level 4 Paladin spell, and it's Zeal. (Zeal is definitely the best choice for DPS, but you won't be able to get Restoration, Cure Serious Wounds, or Death Ward. You can live without those by carrying pots/scrolls/clickies and using cocoon+CMW/CLW, but it's a little less simple).
    -No higher tier Knight of the Chalice (You miss out on a little bit of light damage which is easily offset by the much higher offense gains from going with Kensei, which even including core 6 Knight of the Chalice and tier 5 smiting is +25 more melee power and more damage per hit, and you also won't stun outsiders, be immune to negative levels, or bypass good DR without using a beater or Blessed Blades. Personally none of those are big issues to me, but different strokes for different people)
    -No Memory of Flight. (Wings is very nice, and I could see this being a dealbreaker if you're particularly attached to them. Realistically you can't fit them in on this build unless you drop a ton of offense or a ton of defense.)

    From the breakdown I think that the fighter version would give superior performance in all categories, but also doesn't have wings, so if that's a dealbreaker then that's a dealbreaker. It also doesn't use Dragonborn for much more than just the high starting strength/charisma and the looks, although to be fair the original proposed build doesn't include breath either (Which I don't think would be good on this build, but also is a huge part of the flavor of dragonborn). The fighter splash version should give superior performance in most categories just based off the straight damage gain, but it's ultimately up to the individual player.
    Dazling of Cannith

  17. #17
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Once you start down the road of "I want better DPS than pure paladin," you need to ask yourself, "Why do I want to play a paladin in the first place?" Because taken to its logical extreme, you wind up with this:

    Which is not what the OP requested.

    You lose 15 MP from KotC (capstone + T5 bonus), so it's "only" a net gain of 25 MP - and only if you can sustain Opportunity Atk's bonus.
    Well...its a bit more nuanced than that. You lose bonus to saves from Divine Grace. You lose Lay on of Hands. You lose access to some potential diety feats. You lose access to Divine might. You lose access to the Paladin spells.

    There are still valid reasons why you might want to have the Paladin Levels.
    Leader of Legion of Eberron on Cannith.

    Characters: Loromir & Baldomir....among others.

  18. #18
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blastyswa View Post
    "How may I serve you, evil one?"
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

  19. #19
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    266

    Default

    Why does this pally build, and many others, dump wisdom. What about Will Saves and spells? Are tomes and gear enough?
    Thanks!

  20. #20
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xathris View Post
    Why does this pally build, and many others, dump wisdom. What about Will Saves and spells? Are tomes and gear enough?
    Thanks!
    Gear is enough to get wis to 14 for Pally Spells. Pally's get good save bonuses without having to spend points in wis for will save. If you are interested you could even spend a feat for "Force of Personality" to make your will save work off Charisma.

    No real reason to spend those ever valuable points in Wisdom on a Paladin.
    Leader of Legion of Eberron on Cannith.

    Characters: Loromir & Baldomir....among others.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload