Devs: Please Read - About the Overlevel Penalties.

[FranOhmsford]

If Epic Characters aren't allowed to run ANY Heroic Quest on Reaper will Dreaming Dark count as Epic?
You will also significantly hurt the Lvl 17-19 Base Lvl Heroic Quests that are already hurting more than most due to Epic Normal XP being so much higher than these give on E-BB!

Suggestions:

Use BB rather than a Strict 2 levels above base - That way Lvl 26+ Quests would all count for Capped Toons to run in Reaper rather than 28+
This gives Capped Toons WGU for instance.

Expand the Epic BB system down to Base Lvl 17 to allow Lvl 20 Characters to run Lvl 17+ Quests on Reaper {AND Elite BB} rather than 18+
This reduces the heavy disincentive to running Lvl 17 Quests.

Raids should be EXEMPT or have a much wider Range allowed depending on the Raid.
Abbot for instance regularly STILL wipes Epic Groups on Elite never mind Reaper - Unless you're going to give us Legendary Abbot you might as well just make this Raid Exempt from this rule.


It's brilliant that you've decided that Reaper should have significant Overlevel Penalties and even a Lockout BUT you may have gone too far and been too strict.

[JOTMON]

Scrap over level lockout all together.

apply xp penalties for over level and xp bonus for under level.

If players want to farm low level bonus gear then let them.. its low level stuff...



Would rather have seen Reaper be level 34+ skulls to challenge capped and endgame ready toons across the old content.
Low level players can always attempt higher level content for challenge.

completely wrong direction with Reaper as far as I am concerned.

[rimble]

If players want to farm low level bonus gear then let them.. its low level stuff...

Yeah, this is where I'm at. Everyone seems to be jumping aboard "yeah, yeah, don't let them easily farm low level twink gear"...***? Who cares? What does that matter? The people doing that don't care about challenge, they just want to twink out and grind TRs, so what? They're not going to suddenly start grouping with you because of this.

I guess maybe remove Mythic or Reaper bonuses from items if you're significantly over level if you want, but so what if there are increased drop rates and you can actually get a twink TR item without farming the same quest 35 times at level 30 on HE? Oh no, the horror, you can actually go do something fun now.

[Renvar]

I would support using BB rules for the lockout, which would expand the range epics as well as a larger range for raids.

I would support removing the lockout all together and switching it to a "if you are more than base quest level +2 or higher you get no rewards. No xp. No reaper loot. No mythic drops. Just the fun and enjoyment of a reaper challenge.". No farming reaper loot over level. Get that weak stuff outta here. Farm gear at level or try a lower difficulty. #NoEasyButtonsInReaper

[Simard]

About the IQ and Amrath quests (plus some others) being in an odd window. Of course you can always run them at or under level so the content isn't completely locked out for reaper.

[FranOhmsford]

About the IQ and Amrath quests (plus some others) being in an odd window. Of course you can always run them at or under level so the content isn't completely locked out for reaper.

So for some reason Amrath has a Lvl 19 Cap rather than 21?

IQ1 a Lvl 19 Cap rather than 20?

I say this is wrong - Utterly wrong!

These quests are already stuck in a level range where people won't run them because they're too hard on elite for the Rewards they give comparatively to Lvl 16s which get you to Cap and Early Epic Normals which get you 3/4/5x or even more the XP in half the time!

Why punish them on Reaper too?

[Mr_Helmet]

This lockout needs to die in the womb, kill it. Period.

[Simard]

So for some reason Amrath has a Lvl 19 Cap rather than 21?

IQ1 a Lvl 19 Cap rather than 20?

I say this is wrong - Utterly wrong!

These quests are already stuck in a level range where people won't run them because they're too hard on elite for the Rewards they give comparatively to Lvl 16s which get you to Cap and Early Epic Normals which get you 3/4/5x or even more the XP in half the time!

Why punish them on Reaper too?

I'm OK with some challenges remaining. Extra challenge != punishment by my definition of punishment. In fact I'm sort of looking forward to some of those quests. Schemes of the Enemy, Wrath of the Flame, Demons Den I'm looking at you.

[Six_Gun]

If Reaper is too hard for you to run at +2 level, then try an easier difficulty setting.

Reaper wasn't made so that level 30 characters could farm twink gear, it was intended to add challenge.

[FranOhmsford]

If Reaper is too hard for you to run at +2 level, then try an easier difficulty setting.

Reaper wasn't made so that level 30 characters could farm twink gear, it was intended to add challenge.

That point isn't about difficulty - It is about giving Level 30s more content they can run - Opening up Lvl 26 and 27 to them adds another 14 quests they can run at Cap!


And my point about Heroics 17-19 is that it's wrong to treat those quests more harshly than Lvl 16s or Lvl 20s {Well ok Lvl 17 won't be treated differently but level 17 is in the worst possible position right now where already you cap 20 from 16s and then can't get BB on your 17s!}.
I'd up it to 3 Levels at 17 thru 21 and then 4 levels from 21-30 {I'd do this for BB too not just Reaper!}.

[FranOhmsford]

I'm OK with some challenges remaining. Extra challenge != punishment by my definition of punishment. In fact I'm sort of looking forward to some of those quests. Schemes of the Enemy, Wrath of the Flame, Demons Den I'm looking at you.

Extra challenge does not = punishment on its own no.

But my point is that these levels and quests are being treated more harshly than any other level outside ACTUAL End-Game Lvl 29-32 content!

This does not make sense!


And I've argued again and again in the past that lvl 17-19 content needs more incentive to run it while this just makes it less likely to be run!

[Memnir]

Devs, I have no interest in Reaper - but I can see that the penalty is unjustified and should be removed. It just seems counter to the whole Reaper thing.

[Cableman]

I very much like the lockout. Its reaper and for challenge, not for farming twink gear and xp.

[FranOhmsford]

I very much like the lockout. Its reaper and for challenge, not for farming twink gear and xp.

I like the lockout too - I just think it needs a bit more leeway - Have you seen the spitstorm it's stirred up!?!

Would it really hurt to have it follow BB rather than be a strict +2 base all the way from 1-30?

Does it really make sense for Lvl 18+19 quests to not be runnable by Lvl 20s on Reaper when Lvl 20s get full BB on both and Lvl 21s get full BB on base Lvl 19s?


It doesn't have to be all or nothing guys - And are Lvl 30s really going to be farming Tracker's Trap on Reaper because it's lower level than Desecrated Temple of Vol OR Would they actually farm the EASIER Quest!?!
Base Level has no meaning in upper Epics!

[Enoach]

I do think calling this a penalty seems to be the wrong nomenclature as this is actually a Overlevel Lockout

I actually like the idea of the lockout. As for the issue with Epic levels and especially level 30 I think that it would be better to get more quests in this level range.

I agree that a lot of 17 to 19 content is skipped by players, but that is more an issue of there being easier paths to capping at 20 using up to base 16 quests. I myself like to mix it up and not necessarily follow the same path each time so I do spend time running these 17 to 19 quests.

Now I am curious about how Reaper will work for those quests that +2 crosses over the level 20 barrier between being Heroic and Epic as this will effect Level 19 Quests which are currently open to both Heroic and Epic players and still qualify for BB.

[Qhualor]

I like how you sneak in the level 17-19 content issues you seem to think there is when there was already a discussion on this very recently.

[Atheok]

Scrap over level lockout all together.

completely wrong direction with Reaper as far as I am concerned.

+1

[Moon-Wolf]

The level Lockout is Awesome !!!!!!!!!!!!!! To me the reasoning behind it is on point !

If you are going to give out Reaper bonuses ( trees, gear, xp, cosmetics ,ect.).

Then also give out a bonus to balance it. Or the bonuses for running Reaper Mode well just become a new source of power creep and you'll need a new difficulty setting in 9 - 18 months.

As the Reaper is the Angel of Death ,( players are fighting Death itself). So to go with that story line , my idea would be as follows;

Reaper Death Penalty
Upon being returned to life by most means, you gain a permanent debuff that gives you negative levels and a temporary penalty to saving throws versus Fear. Multiple deaths in a short time add additional penalties. The maximum total penalty you can accumulate rises as you gain levels. This could work like the regular Death penalty as far as accumulation but the negative levels are permanent. No spells,or any other source, not even the Spirit Binders can remove the permanent negative levels.

Resting at a shrine, spells and going to a Spirit Binder only removes the temporary fear penalties , but not the negative levels as they are permanent.

It is just an idea , since players are fighting The Angel of Death this just seems to go with that story line to me.

If Reaper is too hard for players to run at +2 level limit, with this Reaper Death Penalty, then there are easier difficulty settings. There is still Elite with no level limit and no reaper death penalty.

Reaper wasn't made so that level 30 characters could farm twink gear, to give to lower level characters on their account , it was intended to add challenge. If they want to farm twink gear this would be a way to do just that. By getting permanent negative levels they can run lower level quests to get it , then they just have to run more quest to get back up in levels. This also gives them more stuff to do , like regain cap levels.

[Atheok]

The level Lockout is Awesome !!!!!!!!!!!!!! To me the reasoning behind it is on point !

The confusion sets in when Reaper is meant for end game. Not for low/mid-game. The lockout is as much needed as the heroic quests don't need reaper. No1 will play Reaper but lvl 30 characters. Or make it 99% of the Reaper player database will play it at lvl 30. So what about the lockout now?

[RD2play]

I feel the reasoning behind the level lockout is sound. That said I feel that the +2lvl above base (norm) might be a bit to restrictive. I would like to see it be reaper base +2 (or elite+2) rather. Especially for the End-Gamers among us that would allow for more content to be enjoyed at cap.

Another idea I had, is to increase the allowed entry for over-level characters to be based on the skull rating. Something like +1 level per 2 skulls of difficulty rating. This would allow for example allow for level 30 characters to run 8-10 skull CitW, -> 24 base, +2 generic, +4 (8 skull) = 30. This will still prevent lower quest 1 skull farming by high level characters but it does increase the number of quests that can be run on Reaper at cap.