Healing Ki question

[Arkai]

Hi, folks

Quick question about this move: I've read that it's more powerful when you get devotion+ skill points into heal.

Is that working the same way after the monk pass or the thing is melee power to get it stronger?

Thanks in advance (:

[BigErkyKid]

Hi, folks

Quick question about this move: I've read that it's more powerful when you get devotion+ skill points into heal.

Is that working the same way after the monk pass or the thing is melee power to get it stronger?

Thanks in advance (:

It is affected by monk levels, and then by positive spell power and positive spell power crit chances. It behaves very much like a spell right now. I have had it crit for around 1400 HPs and I am not even maxxed out on healing amp.

[DrawingGuy]

It works off Positive Spell Power, which means that Heal skill, Devotion, and Positive Lore (as it can crit) all affect it - this is why the Harmonious Path tree (Shintao) provides Positive Spell Power in the cores. The Monk pass took the finisher from an "OK" heal that you can supplement other healing with to a "good heal". Unfortunately it still faces a huge issue: It takes a minimum of 10 seconds and 40 Ki to cast, and while working on this you cannot use any of your other monk Elemental or Stance strikes. So while you could keep this stored and heal when needed, you're giving up a large chunk of your utility and DPS options... so you'll still need another heal for when you don't have time to build up the finisher to stay alive and not cripple yourself.

I'm still hoping they'll fix the rest of the Monk DCs. DCs are the only think holding Dark Monk back. Dark Monk has superior DPS and utility due to its great finishers and Touch of Death and there was a time no one touched Light Monks outside of a TOD raid anti-stun... Dark Monk DCs being fixed I don't think would bring back those days as Light Monk has been buffed with FoL damage being made less trash coupled with the buff to the Healing Ki finisher. I do think Light Monk finishers need a buff in duration as the slow combo-cast coupled with high-Ki cost makes only a 1 minute timer a bit silly, but now I'm getting a bit off topic.

TL;DR - Healing Ki finish goes off Devotion.

[BigErkyKid]

It works off Positive Spell Power, which means that Heal skill, Devotion, and Positive Lore (as it can crit) all affect it - this is why the Harmonious Path tree (Shintao) provides Positive Spell Power in the cores. The Monk pass took the finisher from an "OK" heal that you can supplement other healing with to a "good heal". Unfortunately it still faces a huge issue: It takes a minimum of 10 seconds and 40 Ki to cast, and while working on this you cannot use any of your other monk Elemental or Stance strikes. So while you could keep this stored and heal when needed, you're giving up a large chunk of your utility and DPS options... so you'll still need another heal for when you don't have time to build up the finisher to stay alive and not cripple yourself.

I'm still hoping they'll fix the rest of the Monk DCs. DCs are the only think holding Dark Monk back. Dark Monk has superior DPS and utility due to its great finishers and Touch of Death and there was a time no one touched Light Monks outside of a TOD raid anti-stun... Dark Monk DCs being fixed I don't think would bring back those days as Light Monk has been buffed with FoL damage being made less trash coupled with the buff to the Healing Ki finisher. I do think Light Monk finishers need a buff in duration as the slow combo-cast coupled with high-Ki cost makes only a 1 minute timer a bit silly, but now I'm getting a bit off topic.

TL;DR - Healing Ki finish goes off Devotion.

I am going to sound like a suck up, but I always look up to your posts when it refers to monks.

You are absolutely spot on. I cannot use other finishers because I must always have healing key in storage. Monks only have that and cocoon for heals. It is enough healing when played properly, most of the times. Not OP healing, not mindless I'm invincible, but enough for what I think characters should have anyway.

Now the other finishers are vastly outdated, and while some could be awesome, 1 minute cast together with incompatibility with having healing Ki stored just makes them impractical. At the very list duration should scale with monk level, and preferably the benefits too.

As for healing finisher, it's been enough for me. Even in high density quests like toee. The key to staying alive is good to miss chances. With over 200 Ac / 25 incorp / 34 dodge / even with just lesser displacement I can jump into a pack of 10 mobs and still not die.

[HuneyMunster]

. Unfortunately it still faces a huge issue: It takes a minimum of 10 seconds and 40 Ki to cast, and while working on this you cannot use any of your other monk Elemental or Stance strikes.

You are being a little generous on that what you cant do while building up Healing Ki. So many things break the combo including looting, interacting, drinking and weapon swapping among others. When I know Im gonna most probably be taking damage and will need to heal my only attacks I can use are fist of light, stunning fist, smite, jades attacks and Kukan-do. This slows the the fast paced button mashing play-style. I can still use action boosts, void dragon, KtA, Shadow Veil, Ki bolt and Ki Shout.

I would prefer the Elemental Ki Strikes that are taken from the 3 trees be removed from the combo line so at least then Im not mostly auto attacking. If i was to use for example earth-light-earth I can just use grand master and master strikes instead of including fist of Iron to build it up fast.

[dunklezhan]

I think I'd prefer that healing ki did a smaller Heal and then a decent HoT, a bit like cocoon does. This might let me do an attack other than healing curse, as presently in epic it feels like that's all I'm using. I'm aware that the heal on hit is a HoT, but you have to keep applying it as each target dies, which tends to suck up all your 'spare' attacks anyway - for my monk it's still way more important to keep the heals coming than it is to apply full DPS.

Another option would be to make the fist of light finisher apply the healing curse to every hostile in the radius. HoT for everyone!

but yes - devotion. Also healing amp is very effective with this ability, because it also works on the healing curse on-hit incoming heals

[DrawingGuy]

Thank you BigErkyKid <3

Yes, now that the healing finisher has been buffed, it is enough to keep you up assuming you're not in 1-2 shot range nor get an unlucky string of getting hit. So the question is what are you giving up to keep the finisher stored?

- Finishing Moves: These are indeed in a sorry state. The elemental finishers are either weak or crippled by low saves. Light finishers are generally good but crippled by low duration. Dark finishers are also good, but crippled by low saves (though this isn't part of the equation). However this does not mean there is no use out of them. Earth > Light > Earth when fighting a group of mobs or a boss that stuns is obviously useful. Water > Light > Water can help the casters in party afford Metas, though that takes a lot of work to maintain. If DCs were fixed and durations buffed, Finishing Moves would become pretty important as you would then be able to slow attacks, stop casting, be able to realistically maintain cheaper casting, etc. They made no mention of this happening despite my years of asking, but if they did, this would make ignoring them a bigger mistake. Until then you can generally get away with only using the Healing Ki finisher.


- Stance Strikes: They don't break your attack cycle, so these are flat additional DPS. Worth using if you can afford the Ki, but not worth giving up your Healing Ki finisher unless you feel safe.


- Elemental Strikes: These offer DPS and/or utility for:
-- Unbalancing Strike allows you, or whomever may have aggro, to get their SA damage. For me, after melee power, that is over 100 damage per hit, so I want it on anything that isn't going to die in seconds. So this means at least on bosses, I can't keep Healing Ki finisher saved very long. Also the -10 Balance penalty makes a big difference on how quickly a mob stands up after a knockdown. Without they stand up in a second or two, with they usually stay down for the full duration. The Jade line buff does make trips less important than they used to be, but having a US > Trip in your back pocket for a crowned mob is still useful. (This needs to be used once every 60 seconds to maintain though can be broken from early, so keep an eye)
-- Knock on the Sky is what closes the gap between a Monk tank and a S&B tank. It's what allows me to handle hard hitting red names like Sor'Jek in LE Tempest Spine. However if other people tank or you are able to handle bosses without -20% damage, then you can get away without this. (This needs to be spammed to reach 5 stacks, then once every 30 seconds to maintain)
-- Eagle Claw Attack is Armor Destruction, and translates to +15 attack and +15% fort bypass. Assuming no one else is maintaining Armor Destruction and you're fighting a boss with fortification, you should be maintaining this. (This needs to be spammed 4 times to max stacks
-- Fists of Iron is a flat out DPS move. Outside of Touch of Death, this is the hardest hitting Monk move. I personally don't take this as I value utility more, but this is useful on everything while the others are generally going to be used on high HP targets like bosses.

These moves are really what separates if you're able to run without extra heals or not. Generally trash mobs are easy enough that you can get away with giving up DPS moves and utility moves in favor of keeping your heal ready. Bosses are a different story - maintaining all three means you'll never have a Healing Ki finisher ready so you'll either have to be ok for 10 seconds to build it up or have alternate heals ready. Or if you like to keep it simple, you should at least be rolling Unbalanced Strikes - especially if you tend to take aggro.


You also have Elemental Words. Static Charge and Storm's Harness is a good combo, and if you have multiple ones, you could even look to vuln stack (though you need at least 3 of them to do that unless someone else is also adding Vuln or you're using TF). This only lasts 30 seconds, so boosting your Harneess DPS will also break your Healing Ki finisher.


TL;DR - On trash mobs you can get away with just using your Light moves and finishers (though maybe not so in Reaper mode), but on Bosses you're giving up a good bit IMO. So to not give up on that, what are your heal options:


Cocoon is the go-to heal for Epic Levels (Heroic is easy enough that just Serious potions from House K work), but comes at the cost of a Twist. Equipped and used properly, it can easily heal you to full, and I've seen it heal me for over 500 a tick (plus you get 150 temp HP which you can add to the heal amount). This heal is enough that you'll never really need the Healing Ki finisher, and if you're a Dark Monk, pretty much a must unless you have a heal bot in party.

Scrolls and Potions are also a good option. Scrolls face the issue of slow casting and being interruptible, but are a solid heal (especially on races with Scroll Mastery like Deep Gnome). Potions are more difficult to make work well unless you invest in store potions (Sovereign can easily cover your backup heal), have stacks of Iconic potions (like I do ), or use Silver Flame for the truly kitten moments (though their penalty might be what gets you killed). I've played the game for years with scrolls and potions as my main heal options, and while the game now hits harder than all of the old options, you can still make it work.


Work it to best fit your play style. Some will need cocoon and some won't. If you're finding yourself just using FoL and Healing Ki finisher, I would suggest asking yourself how you can fit in Elemental Strikes and Words (and I even fit in some standard Stance strikes) because you can help your own DPS and your party's by doing so. The reason why I like Monk is its complexity - if you're just looking for flat DPS with self-sustain, there are builds out there that can do it better.

[BigErkyKid]

Thank you BigErkyKid <3

Yes, now that the healing finisher has been buffed, it is enough to keep you up assuming you're not in 1-2 shot range nor get an unlucky string of getting hit. So the question is what are you giving up to keep the finisher stored?

- Finishing Moves: These are indeed in a sorry state. The elemental finishers are either weak or crippled by low saves. Light finishers are generally good but crippled by low duration. Dark finishers are also good, but crippled by low saves (though this isn't part of the equation). However this does not mean there is no use out of them. Earth > Light > Earth when fighting a group of mobs or a boss that stuns is obviously useful. Water > Light > Water can help the casters in party afford Metas, though that takes a lot of work to maintain. If DCs were fixed and durations buffed, Finishing Moves would become pretty important as you would then be able to slow attacks, stop casting, be able to realistically maintain cheaper casting, etc. They made no mention of this happening despite my years of asking, but if they did, this would make ignoring them a bigger mistake. Until then you can generally get away with only using the Healing Ki finisher.


- Stance Strikes: They don't break your attack cycle, so these are flat additional DPS. Worth using if you can afford the Ki, but not worth giving up your Healing Ki finisher unless you feel safe.


- Elemental Strikes: These offer DPS and/or utility for:
-- Unbalancing Strike allows you, or whomever may have aggro, to get their SA damage. For me, after melee power, that is over 100 damage per hit, so I want it on anything that isn't going to die in seconds. So this means at least on bosses, I can't keep Healing Ki finisher saved very long. Also the -10 Balance penalty makes a big difference on how quickly a mob stands up after a knockdown. Without they stand up in a second or two, with they usually stay down for the full duration. The Jade line buff does make trips less important than they used to be, but having a US > Trip in your back pocket for a crowned mob is still useful. (This needs to be used once every 60 seconds to maintain though can be broken from early, so keep an eye)
-- Knock on the Sky is what closes the gap between a Monk tank and a S&B tank. It's what allows me to handle hard hitting red names like Sor'Jek in LE Tempest Spine. However if other people tank or you are able to handle bosses without -20% damage, then you can get away without this. (This needs to be spammed to reach 5 stacks, then once every 30 seconds to maintain)
-- Eagle Claw Attack is Armor Destruction, and translates to +15 attack and +15% fort bypass. Assuming no one else is maintaining Armor Destruction and you're fighting a boss with fortification, you should be maintaining this. (This needs to be spammed 4 times to max stacks
-- Fists of Iron is a flat out DPS move. Outside of Touch of Death, this is the hardest hitting Monk move. I personally don't take this as I value utility more, but this is useful on everything while the others are generally going to be used on high HP targets like bosses.

These moves are really what separates if you're able to run without extra heals or not. Generally trash mobs are easy enough that you can get away with giving up DPS moves and utility moves in favor of keeping your heal ready. Bosses are a different story - maintaining all three means you'll never have a Healing Ki finisher ready so you'll either have to be ok for 10 seconds to build it up or have alternate heals ready. Or if you like to keep it simple, you should at least be rolling Unbalanced Strikes - especially if you tend to take aggro.


You also have Elemental Words. Static Charge and Storm's Harness is a good combo, and if you have multiple ones, you could even look to vuln stack (though you need at least 3 of them to do that unless someone else is also adding Vuln or you're using TF). This only lasts 30 seconds, so boosting your Harneess DPS will also break your Healing Ki finisher.


TL;DR - On trash mobs you can get away with just using your Light moves and finishers (though maybe not so in Reaper mode), but on Bosses you're giving up a good bit IMO. So to not give up on that, what are your heal options:


Cocoon is the go-to heal for Epic Levels (Heroic is easy enough that just Serious potions from House K work), but comes at the cost of a Twist. Equipped and used properly, it can easily heal you to full, and I've seen it heal me for over 500 a tick (plus you get 150 temp HP which you can add to the heal amount). This heal is enough that you'll never really need the Healing Ki finisher, and if you're a Dark Monk, pretty much a must unless you have a heal bot in party.

Scrolls and Potions are also a good option. Scrolls face the issue of slow casting and being interruptible, but are a solid heal (especially on races with Scroll Mastery like Deep Gnome). Potions are more difficult to make work well unless you invest in store potions (Sovereign can easily cover your backup heal), have stacks of Iconic potions (like I do ), or use Silver Flame for the truly kitten moments (though their penalty might be what gets you killed). I've played the game for years with scrolls and potions as my main heal options, and while the game now hits harder than all of the old options, you can still make it work.


Work it to best fit your play style. Some will need cocoon and some won't. If you're finding yourself just using FoL and Healing Ki finisher, I would suggest asking yourself how you can fit in Elemental Strikes and Words (and I even fit in some standard Stance strikes) because you can help your own DPS and your party's by doing so. The reason why I like Monk is its complexity - if you're just looking for flat DPS with self-sustain, there are builds out there that can do it better.

I agree with the majority of what you have said. Now, I would like to clarify. I do not always use ONLY the healing finisher. On bosses I just spam my debuffs, since usually it is not what kills me. It is a pack of trash getting a combo of lucky hits through my to be missed that ends me most of the time. So I have the healing ki ready to pop when I get to mid my health bar usually. It can tick really high, and I am not even maxxed out.

You have covered the problem with the finishers very well, not much to add there from my side.

I was kind of hoping that when Arl finishes his henshin life I could convince you both to help me put together a "report" on the monk pass. DCs, actual gameplay, damage, and so on. Seeing how previous attempts didn't even receive and answer from devs discourages me, but still.

[Niab]

It is affected by monk levels, and then by positive spell power and positive spell power crit chances. It behaves very much like a spell right now. I have had it crit for around 1400 HPs and I am not even maxxed out on healing amp.

So does negative energy spell power and crit chance help the FoD??

[DrawingGuy]

Niab - what do you mean by FoD? Typically that stands for "Finger of Death", a necro spell. Do you mean Ninja Spy's Touch of Death? That scales by Melee Power. Or do you mean Touch of Despair? That also does not use negative energy power.

Essentially the only spell power you care about is Positive. This helps your Healing Ki finisher as well as any healing move from an Epic Destiny you may be using (such as cocoon). This means that if you have Devotion items, it scales appropriately, and if you have Positive Lore items, the moves can crit heal. A lore item is how I'm able to sometimes get 1500+ heals.

[Niab]

Niab - what do you mean by FoD? Typically that stands for "Finger of Death", a necro spell. Do you mean Ninja Spy's Touch of Death? That scales by Melee Power. Or do you mean Touch of Despair? That also does not use negative energy power.

Essentially the only spell power you care about is Positive. This helps your Healing Ki finisher as well as any healing move from an Epic Destiny you may be using (such as cocoon). This means that if you have Devotion items, it scales appropriately, and if you have Positive Lore items, the moves can crit heal. A lore item is how I'm able to sometimes get 1500+ heals.

I meant Fists of darkness the opposite path to Fists of light ?? (1-20 neg energy damage ?)

I see now in Wiki it doesnt specify I thought it was neg energy