The Prowler: Covert Assassin of House Thuranni

[Nightmanis]

barb with 18 rogue really flies--the wiz levels add the extra defenses so I really like them.
Since this build uses the racial tree so deeply, it means inherently that it would work great for someone with many racial past lives. I haven't done the AP but I imagine one could get elven grace, the AA tree, then maybe killer or KtA? Or some mechanic boosts? Since I will never be that player with the numerous racial past lives (right now I am doing a couple halfling ones while researching the ROGUE workbook), I can't say. I think people would prefer ranger levels for sniper shot, or monk for abundant step & extra feats, but this split would be one of the fastest. I suppose one could go bard/barb/ranger or bard/barb/6 fighter and get the displacement from bard spells.

I plan to return to this build post-halfling runs. Right now my main is 18 rogue/2 ranger which has been a lot of fun & functionality.

With 18 Rogue, 1 barb, 1 wiz Elf my AP is freakishly tight.

10RR+10 ap Elf for Aerenal Grace+Skill+AA
41 AA Capstone+whatever your heart desires
24 assassin for killer and nimbleness (stacking 10% dodge is worth 1ap)
3 TA Run speed

That leaves a grand total of 2ap. If I could squeeze 2 more ap (add 2 more non iconic races) I'd throw them into barb for tier 3 athletics. Use 1 rage for +35% run speed makes for a nice "oh sh*t" button. Other than that, 1 wiz just gives me a spell focus feat and sp from intelligence. I thought about putting 1ap into mechanic for +5m pbs range and 1ap into Archmagi for the cheap magic missile to charge arcane warrior (stupid, but you do get the spell twice over and do have cranked force spellpower to use for +20rp)

[unbongwah]

Phiarlan Seeker
13/6/1 Rogue/Ranger/Barbarian
True Neutral Elf

The main thing I wanted to add to this build - but couldn't afford without too many sacrifices at the time - was Killer for the +20% Doubleshot. Now with racial PLs, one can finally acquire the extra APs one needs.

Just posting Enhancements, the feats etc. are still basically the same.

Enhancements (80+5 AP)

Elf-Arcane Archer (42 AP)
Arcane Archer, Morphic Arrows, Metalline Arrows, Aligned Arrows, Shadow Arrows, Mystical Archer
Conjure Arrows, Energy of the Wild III, Corrosive Arrows
Force Arrows III, Elemental Damage
Terror Arrows, Soul Magic, Elemental Damage
Banishing Arrows, Paralyzing Arrows, Smiting Arrows, Elemental Damage
Moonbow, Arrow of Slaying, Final Strike, Elemental Damage, Runebow

Deepwood Stalker (23 AP)
Far Shot, Sneak Attack, Sniper Shot
Favored Defense I, Stealthy III
Faster Sneaking III, Improved Weapon Finesse, Melee/Range Power Boost III
Thrill of the Hunt III, Favored Hunter III
Killer III

Elf (16 AP)
Elven Accuracy, Elven Dexterity
Phiarlan Dragonmark Focus III
Lesser Dragonmark of Shadow, Arcanum I
Greater Dragonmark of Shadow, Arcane Archer

Thief-Acrobat (3 AP)
Staff Control
Fast Movement

Mechanic (1 AP)
Arbalester

Any additional APs from extra PLs can go to Assassin and/or Harper.

[Saekee]

I have still this build on the backburner but am playing the standard halfling dex assassin after LRg out of an 18/2 ranger faster sneaking split. The pure halfling assassin is very good but the sneak speed is just too slow for my taste. I need to compare a Prowler sneak build to a Hassan but will see. The 18/2 split had poorer dps and assassinate DC but you do not really notice it so much. It also had a ranged option, however weak.

With vistani & centering with daggers, a new fast stealth assassin is available. I will call it ‘The Courtesan’ for now: 18 rogue/1 monk/1 fighter (with variations of 18/2 monk and 19/1 monk). The idea is to get tier 5 assassin, 1 Ap henshin for 10 MP, 4 AP ninja spy faster sneaking, 4 AP deft strikes Shintao, 3 AP TA fast movement, then rest in Vistani. In this way you regain the MP and even more dex (GMoF wind stance) from monk, stacking faster sneaking, and BETTER dps from the exta 20% offhand from Deft Strikes to offset the loss of 5d6 sneak damage. Assassinate bonus goes down only 1 less than a pure due to higher dex. Without light armor buffs though, the Courtesan will be a glass cannon—part of the fun!

[Deathdefy]

Playing an 19 Rogue / 1 Monk variant on this at the moment. Int-based Xbows / Assassinate with 0 room to breath in feats or AP.

8 - Harper KTA 3/3
31 - Mech - +1 Competence Multiplier
34 - Assassin - Sneak Speed, Assassinate and 3/3 MTF
4 - Ninja Spy - Sneak Speed
3 - Acrobat - Move speed
80 - Total
Racial is just whatever reincarnation points you have.

Feats - Pure Standard Crossbow Ranged (no Rapid Shot) + Insightful Reflexes - use Monk Bonus for Precision or Deflect Arrows if you have wiggle room from not having Completionist or not being human.

It's fun so far. You feel the Ranged Power hit though and are forced into Repeaters imo as losing T5 Mech from Great Crossbows would hurt too badly.

[Saekee]

Playing an 19 Rogue / 1 Monk variant on this at the moment. Int-based Xbows / Assassinate with 0 room to breath in feats or AP.

8 - Harper KTA 3/3
31 - Mech - +1 Competence Multiplier
34 - Assassin - Sneak Speed, Assassinate and 3/3 MTF
4 - Ninja Spy - Sneak Speed
3 - Acrobat - Move speed
80 - Total
Racial is just whatever reincarnation points you have.

Feats - Pure Standard Crossbow Ranged (no Rapid Shot) + Insightful Reflexes - use Monk Bonus for Precision or Deflect Arrows if you have wiggle room from not having Completionist or not being human.

It's fun so far. You feel the Ranged Power hit though and are forced into Repeaters imo as losing T5 Mech from Great Crossbows would hurt too badly.

So the sneak speed boost works with repeaters and hence being incentered? That is one of the splits I propose but I had not considered the repeater

[Annex]

I will call it ‘The Courtesan’ for now

Umm...Saekee San. That word. Courtesan. It may not mean what you think it means.

[Aelonwy]

I agree with Annex.

The typical Courtesan would have bard levels, fighter and monk seem out of place with that title. Bard because many could perform music, play an instrument and/or sing, dance, tell stories, they were often very educated (bardic lore), and it was not entirely uncommon for some to nurse or care for the health of elderly patrons (bardic healing spells). Its true that an elite few were taught to be bodyguards, spies, thieves, and assassins.

[unbongwah]

I will call it ‘The Courtesan’ for now: 18 rogue/1 monk/1 fighter (with variations of 18/2 monk and 19/1 monk).

If we're talking stealth builds, I was thinking rog 12 / monk 6 / rgr 2: +22% base runspeed, triple-stacked stealth speed bonuses. Something like 41 Vistani / 8 DWS / 11 Ninja / 11 Henshin / 3 Acrobat / 4 Assassin with 2 APs to tweak things. Biggest DPS drawback is losing Lethality, but hey, some compromises are necessary if you want turbo stealth mode.

[Saekee]

If we're talking stealth builds, I was thinking rog 12 / monk 6 / rgr 2: +22% base runspeed, triple-stacked stealth speed bonuses. Something like 41 Vistani / 8 DWS / 11 Ninja / 11 Henshin / 3 Acrobat / 4 Assassin with 2 APs to tweak things. Biggest DPS drawback is losing Lethality, but hey, some compromises are necessary if you want turbo stealth mode.

Ok so I will not call it the Courtesan...


There really isn’t a huge difference or need to have all three faster sneaking enhancements; plus, DWS faster sneaking is tier 2. So if one is not a ranged build (faster sneaking is buggy with ranged weapons) then DWS is kind of a wash for AP.
That leaves monk and rogue for run & sneak speed. There are lots of options with those two classes. I am trying to keep assassinate but when I unlock Vistani, I can play around a bit with it.

I suspect that only knife spec and the bard one give the insane boost to the drow dagger (13-20) which is my sentient weapon (27 MP on it right now). Since it has so much MP I figure to buff sneak damage as much as possible

[TueNictGut]

Hey Saekee,
Just dipping in althaugh im not playing till the stealth and aggro system is revamped, im thrilled by the new Addon and im following the discussion concerning Assassin vistani builds and considering two splits. Iam interested in your opinion on them.

First one would be 19Rog/1Barb or 18 Rog/1Barb/1fighter.
Enhancements would be ass 36 Assassinate, Lethality, Knife Spec, 2/3 MtF, Ta 3, Vis 41 for capstone.
Feats would be: imp. Feint, Precision, 3xTWF, imp.crit, dual defense to add to the 22prr from Vistani. And im really heavily considering Sap for Reaper (though i quited before Reaper went live) and Solo play.

Cooldown Sap 15 sec Duration from Stealth 30 sec.
Cooldown of Assassinate 12 sec. So should work well with Sap as both come available again in similiar timewindows

You could Sap one from Stealth for 30 sec, Sap a second one after 15 sec, Assassinate the third, burn down a fourth with all boosts and MtF going and sap the first again to assassinate the second. Rinse and Repeat
While this might need some exercise to pull it off reliably and some positioning close together with noisemakers, it might provide a fun way to play an Assassin solo again, handling at least grps of 4 (if this works ofc) despite the borked stealth system maybe.
Do you think this might be viable? And if so whats about Reaper 1 ?
Also: Do you have any Experience with Sap and Aggro in the current state? Whats your opinion on Sap in Reaper and its viability in soloplay generaly?
From my experience the difference between the Stealthspeed from my beloved Prowler (Im Tagedieb, changed my forumname) gaining sneakspeed from the barblvl and a Build adding two Sources of sneakspeed, say from Rogue and monk, is very narrow. I think u had some data on sneakspeed somewhere, can you confirm this or is the monksplit recognizable faster?

Second Split would be a Human 18Rog/2Rang with the same enchancementsplit mostly (only a T5 Vistanisplit for Dungeons, where Assassinate is useless, maybe backed up even by Fury in epics) with a strong ranged option with Throwing knives:
Feats would be: Precision, 3xTwf, 2x imp. Crit (dagger and Thrown) Rapid shot, pointblack, (quick draw from vistani ofc.) Precise Shot,
imp. Preciseshot > imp. feint in epics or the other way around.

This way the build would get the critbonus from Knifespec and dex to dmg for throwing knives from the assassitree, and all the goodies from vistani and all necessary ranged feats for a strong Ranged option asside to all the assassin stuff. On a fun sidenote favored enemy of ranger and vistani should stack to 4dmg so a nice little tool vs undead and maybe devils in heroic
With the option to skill for a weaker furyshot with Vistani Fortune> Damage boost>Vendetta> rapidthrow> whirling Blades> Adrenaline > Blessing Blades for the case Assassinate isnt viable. This should be nice with Scion of ethereal Plane for great Sa dmg on the Adrenaline daggers

As improved Feint was changed after i stopped playing, i would be interested in your opinion on it. How is it compared to shiv?
Also Do you have considered an Assassinbuild with strong throwing knife option and have any improvements or ideas to one of the builds i sketched?

Thx for your answer in advance and sry for the long post.
Keep up the Stealthplay!

[TueNictGut]

Contemplating some more on Solo Assassins in times of borked stealth and Agrosystems...
Would a Rog18 Brd2 Build with maxed fascinate be per chance a viable way to play an Assassin solo again?
I only played Rogues so far, so i have no experience with the fascinate skill of bards. But the fascinate should be a good possibility to setup a lot of Assassinates and otherwise get the one on one battles an Assassin is made for. Does Fascinate breaks Stealth and or invis? How high could it be pushed on a build with 2brd lvls with dex or int as the mainskill? And what fascinate rolls are needed in low Reaper and Legendary Elite Endgame?
Anyone got some insights on this? If it works maybe this could be called the Courtesan?

[Saekee]

Hey Saekee,
Just dipping in althaugh im not playing till the stealth and aggro system is revamped, im thrilled by the new Addon and im following the discussion concerning Assassin vistani builds and considering two splits. Iam interested in your opinion on them.

First one would be 19Rog/1Barb or 18 Rog/1Barb/1fighter.
Enhancements would be ass 36 Assassinate, Lethality, Knife Spec, 2/3 MtF, Ta 3, Vis 41 for capstone.
Feats would be: imp. Feint, Precision, 3xTWF, imp.crit, dual defense to add to the 22prr from Vistani. And im really heavily considering Sap for Reaper (though i quited before Reaper went live) and Solo play.

Cooldown Sap 15 sec Duration from Stealth 30 sec.
Cooldown of Assassinate 12 sec. So should work well with Sap as both come available again in similiar timewindows

You could Sap one from Stealth for 30 sec, Sap a second one after 15 sec, Assassinate the third, burn down a fourth with all boosts and MtF going and sap the first again to assassinate the second. Rinse and Repeat
While this might need some exercise to pull it off reliably and some positioning close together with noisemakers, it might provide a fun way to play an Assassin solo again, handling at least grps of 4 (if this works ofc) despite the borked stealth system maybe.
Do you think this might be viable? And if so whats about Reaper 1 ?
Also: Do you have any Experience with Sap and Aggro in the current state? Whats your opinion on Sap in Reaper and its viability in soloplay generaly?
From my experience the difference between the Stealthspeed from my beloved Prowler (Im Tagedieb, changed my forumname) gaining sneakspeed from the barblvl and a Build adding two Sources of sneakspeed, say from Rogue and monk, is very narrow. I think u had some data on sneakspeed somewhere, can you confirm this or is the monksplit recognizable faster?

Second Split would be a Human 18Rog/2Rang with the same enchancementsplit mostly (only a T5 Vistanisplit for Dungeons, where Assassinate is useless, maybe backed up even by Fury in epics) with a strong ranged option with Throwing knives:
Feats would be: Precision, 3xTwf, 2x imp. Crit (dagger and Thrown) Rapid shot, pointblack, (quick draw from vistani ofc.) Precise Shot,
imp. Preciseshot > imp. feint in epics or the other way around.

This way the build would get the critbonus from Knifespec and dex to dmg for throwing knives from the assassitree, and all the goodies from vistani and all necessary ranged feats for a strong Ranged option asside to all the assassin stuff. On a fun sidenote favored enemy of ranger and vistani should stack to 4dmg so a nice little tool vs undead and maybe devils in heroic
With the option to skill for a weaker furyshot with Vistani Fortune> Damage boost>Vendetta> rapidthrow> whirling Blades> Adrenaline > Blessing Blades for the case Assassinate isnt viable. This should be nice with Scion of ethereal Plane for great Sa dmg on the Adrenaline daggers

As improved Feint was changed after i stopped playing, i would be interested in your opinion on it. How is it compared to shiv?
Also Do you have considered an Assassinbuild with strong throwing knife option and have any improvements or ideas to one of the builds i sketched?

Thx for your answer in advance and sry for the long post.
Keep up the Stealthplay!

heya! I just did 18/2 ranger to cap. It is versatile—you can also take weapon finesse then improved weapon finesse (DWS since you take 8 there for faster sneaking). Fast sneak speed and ok ranged option.
The Prowler gives up the capstone for speed, defense (DMs) and invisi; the 18/2 gets versatility but loses a lot.
The monk split is interesting to me (18/1/1) since it actually gains DPS and sneak speed at the cost of defenses (pajamas).
So 19/1 barb is similar to 18/2–speed and some versatility.

I haven’t exactly measured the speed difference of Prowler vs 18/2 or similar but I imagine it is close!

Improved feint is a must-take feat and is a minor issue for Prowlers since there is not much wiggle room there. It has a faster cooldown, 180 degree arc of effect but requires a high bluff score.

Sap—I was not proccing 30 seconds from stealth but that may be because I had their aggro. Will need to test. I like using Sap to isolate a target like an enemy mage; then stealth-bluff-assassinate. I think the scenario you are describing is a bit too much to pull off. One minor blink of lag and it does not work...Plus any AoE from you or a party member will break the Sap state. So it is situationally useful.

[TueNictGut]

I have still this build on the backburner but am playing the standard halfling dex assassin after LRg out of an 18/2 ranger faster sneaking split. The pure halfling assassin is very good but the sneak speed is just too slow for my taste. I need to compare a Prowler sneak build to a Hassan but will see. The 18/2 split had poorer dps and assassinate DC but you do not really notice it so much. It also had a ranged option, however weak.

With vistani & centering with daggers, a new fast stealth assassin is available. I will call it ‘The Courtesan’ for now: 18 rogue/1 monk/1 fighter (with variations of 18/2 monk and 19/1 monk). The idea is to get tier 5 assassin, 1 Ap henshin for 10 MP, 4 AP ninja spy faster sneaking, 4 AP deft strikes Shintao, 3 AP TA fast movement, then rest in Vistani. In this way you regain the MP and even more dex (GMoF wind stance) from monk, stacking faster sneaking, and BETTER dps from the exta 20% offhand from Deft Strikes to offset the loss of 5d6 sneak damage. Assassinate bonus goes down only 1 less than a pure due to higher dex. Without light armor buffs though, the Courtesan will be a glass cannon—part of the fun!

Some notes and Questions on the fast sneaking Rog/Mnk option:

- ddowiki says deft Strikes does only give 10%. Are deft Strikes and double daggers of Vistani stack to 110% offhandattacks, creating some kind of doublestrikechance? or why are u even taking deft strikes when u are planning on putting more then 22 aps in the vistanistree, which it looks like?
- Have u considerd to add another 4 points to shintao for ironskin?

Anyway i really think MonkSplashes are a great new possibility to create fastsneaking Assassins especially with GMoF wind stance with ocean stance as a nice defensive possibility or for traps. im just not sure the bit of sneakspeed justifies the loss of vistani capstone and leatherarmor compared to a rog 19/1Barb Split. It looses mpwise (20mp from Vistani capstone vs 10mp from henshin) and prrwise due to the loss of leatherarmor.
If the Sneakspeed is significally higher then barb maybe it would be a great split to try out my Sapidea. You could easily change the scenario to 3 enemy grps solo at first. with double Sap.
Do i understand it right that u need to bluff an enemy saped from Stealth to assassinate it? that would indeed spoil my scenario ...

[TueNictGut]

[QUOTE=Saekee;6051339]
The Prowler gives up the capstone for speed, defense (DMs) and invisi; the 18/2 gets versatility but loses a lot.

Yes i know i played it to lvl 30 and you use the pictures of my Character Harruszek in your Post
I just have changed my forumname form Tagedieb to TueNictGut sometime in between aparently ....
Thx for your answers so far, as not playing atm. im brainstorming ideas for future Assassinbuild atm.
Imp weaponfinesse is a nice option sometimes for the Rangersplash

[Saekee]

Some notes and Questions on the fast sneaking Rog/Mnk option:

- ddowiki says deft Strikes does only give 10%. Are deft Strikes and double daggers of Vistani stack to 110% offhandattacks, creating some kind of doublestrikechance? or why are u even taking deft strikes when u are planning on putting more then 22 aps in the vistanistree, which it looks like?
- Have u considerd to add another 4 points to shintao for ironskin?

Anyway i really think MonkSplashes are a great new possibility to create fastsneaking Assassins especially with GMoF wind stance with ocean stance as a nice defensive possibility or for traps. im just not sure the bit of sneakspeed justifies the loss of vistani capstone and leatherarmor compared to a rog 19/1Barb Split. It looses mpwise (20mp from capstone vs 10mp from henshin) and prrwise due to the loss of leatherarmor.
If the Sneakspeed is significally higher then barb maybe it would be a great split to try out my Sapidea. You could easily change the scenario to 3 enemy grps solo at first. with double Sap.
Do i understand it right that u need to bluff an enemy saped from Stealth to assassinate it? that would indeed spoil my scenario ...

Gahh great points--I had not realize that the vistani was a full 20%. I do not believe the offhand can be more than 100%. So i will need to rethink it.
Your idea of doing 19/1 barb has the merit of going vistani for the capstone, so that is interesting. I see that you can fit it in, just slowing down MtF buildup.

Yes, you must successfully bluff them to assassinate them if they have aggro on you. The only time this is not true is if they are blinded somehow.
Sap can be fun if you have an isolated mob--if you fail an assassinate, Sap them; before Sap cools down you can bluff-->assassinate them. If you fail again, you can just sap them and repeat the process. They become your trapped victim.

[TueNictGut]

Gahh great points--I had not realize that the vistani was a full 20%. I do not believe the offhand can be more than 100%. So i will need to rethink it.
Your idea of doing 19/1 barb has the merit of going vistani for the capstone, so that is interesting. I see that you can fit it in, just slowing down MtF buildup.

Yes, you must successfully bluff them to assassinate them if they have aggro on you. The only time this is not true is if they are blinded somehow.
Sap can be fun if you have an isolated mob--if you fail an assassinate, Sap them; before Sap cools down you can bluff-->assassinate them. If you fail again, you can just sap them and repeat the process. They become your trapped victim.

Ah well thats in any case a very nice strategy to back up single target Assassination! So Sap seems worth it if u can spare a feat.
My Sap scenario was for a solo Stealth Assassin, build on the asumption that you dont get any agro if u sap someone from behind while in Stealth. i fear though that if u get agro solo for assassinating some mob in a grp u also get it for Saping , as u seem to indicate with the blind...

So Question is : Do u get agro of the saped or even worse any enemies around it if u sap from behind while unnoticed and have no agro so far.
If u dont u could sneak in from behind and Sap one mob, wait 15 sec sap a second one and then assassinate the third, without getting immidiate agro of the 2 saped mobs and in this way handle smaller grps solo with an Assassin.

[Saekee]

Ah well thats in any case a very nice strategy to back up single target Assassination! So Sap seems worth it if u can spare a feat.
My Sap scenario was for a solo Stealth Assassin, build on the asumption that you dont get any agro if u sap someone from behind while in Stealth. i fear though that if u get agro solo for assassinating some mob in a grp u also get it for Saping , as u seem to indicate with the blind...

So Question is : Do u get agro of the saped or even worse any enemies around it if u sap from behind while unnoticed and have no agro so far.
If u dont u could sneak in from behind and Sap one mob, wait 15 sec sap a second one and then assassinate the third, without getting immidiate agro of the 2 saped mobs and in this way handle smaller grps solo with an Assassin.

Sap is an attack so that will alert everyone around them! So that chain will not work. You would need to assassinate a couple, sap; wait for assassinate cooldown to complete, then bluff and assassinate the next one.

It turns out that it is 30 seconds from stealth BUT they also cannot be aggroed onto you. Otherwise, 15 seconds or whatever it is (18?)

[TueNictGut]

Ah Thx for the clarification... its a Pity...
Its 18 sec for non Stealth Sap.
Do You think a 18rog/2bard or 18 rog brd /1 barb1 with maxed fascinate would make a good solo Rogue at least for content where fascinate and assassinate works? it woult let you pick your targets and setup one on one fights and make regular use of assassinate, i guess together with bluff too.

Is it possible to use imp feint followed by stealth assassinate btw?

[Saekee]

Ah Thx for the clarification... its a Pity...
Its 18 sec for non Stealth Sap.
Do You think a 18rog/2bard or 18 rog brd /1 barb1 with maxed fascinate would make a good solo Rogue at least for content where fascinate and assassinate works? it woult let you pick your targets and setup one on one fights and make regular use of assassinate, i guess together with bluff too.

Is it possible to use imp feint followed by stealth assassinate btw?

I have never played a bard! So I am unsure how fasciate might work. Given that you can use it on undead, spiders etc via that epic destiny (Magister?), it could be very good—covering a major weakness of stealth play. I do not know much about how it works...Maybe test it by running it? Plus, while doing so, you could try ROGUE Quatre in my sig.

You could technically go Improved feint (or shiv), drop into stealth and then hit assassinate. But the window of time is too small to do all those things. It is tricky to do that with bluff & assassinate due to slow animations!

I think blinding them is your friend for these tactics. A TF weapon with blinding fear; sleetstorm; glitterdust traps; heroic GS radiance weapon—so many ways this could be achieved, each with their own unique investment of resources, strategy & effort. For insta sapping, Guardbreaking items might be an option but then you would need 3 bard swash and the bucklers for it. Not worth it IMHO (I have toyed with Sap effects from Watcher’s Blade and Parasitic Breastplate; the latter is actually quite good for just befuddling mob chain actions)

[Saekee]

Let me add that there is a nice option for the 18/2 ranger split. In heroics, you can run as a ranged vorpal repeater build. At levels 1&3 take rapid reload and proficiency: light repeater. This assumes that you have an ML 4ish vorpal repeater. Swap them out before level 12 for improved feint and something else you may wish to do (like Dragonmarks or Sap etc).

In this way you can have fun in the lowbie quests running reaper difficulty from a safe distance. You are not an assassin until you can assassinate...so why be a gimped squishy melee before all the power of Tier 5 assassin?