Warlock Balancing

[Strider1963]

Uhm... no? on several things. I have not had fun playing warlock, actually think it's rather boring. have yet to complete a single life on any of my main characters, because the test run I did was underwhelming, fun wise. but probably that's just cause of my personal idea of fun.

Anyhow, I absolutely disagree that a class you bought and payed for should get nerfed. in fact, I think it's a shame that other classes you have to buy have been allowed to fall as far behind as they have. sure, there is still viable monk and druid multiclasses, but running them pure? meh. Artificer? heh. Not really counting FVS among them, as it's so easy to unlock, but still... hehe.

I am absolutely defending the p2w aspect with this, I know, but let's face it, it does make sense.

I agree. DDO sold the Warlock class as it was, we paid for it, leave it alone. Enough with this "make a new race/class appealing to buy, and once everyone has it, nerf it . To me, warlock is op in heroics but not so much in epics. As ive said before on these forums, the Ubers make a class, or mix of classes OP, then they cry nerf. (You know, the Ubers are the ppl that complain everything is too easy and don't play that much anymore cause they have nothing to do, no challenge for them) If its gotta be nerfed, then it never should have been released that way in the first place. I call that "bait and switch" If its gonna be nerfed, then I want a 50% discount on what I paid for it put in my turbine points.

[JOTMON]

Relatively small, targeted balance adjustments to Warlock (especially Enlightened Spirit) are in the works for sometime after U32.



It always has.

doesn't mean it should...
There are lots of evil creatures that could be.. resistant/immune to evil damage, or healed by it.. like those undead types..
Something that encourages Warlocks to consider toggling that stance on/off, or to consider alternatives...

[Loromir]

Delete

[UurlockYgmeov]

Make a few types of mobs for each pact that actually get stronger from that type of pact damage and make them agro on the source because they want to devour it

hmmm... but then the forumites will yell even louder....

I say leave it be, so the new players can play with it as well.

Wonder how many who are clamoring for nerfing the warlock have their three warlock past lives already done(or more) ???

[Uska]

hmmm... but then the forumites will yell even louder....

I say leave it be, so the new players can play with it as well.

Wonder how many who are clamoring for nerfing the warlock have their three warlock past lives already done(or more) ???

Well wasn't calling for nerfs really just something to balance against them and it should only be special rare mobs not a possible power any mob could have

[Six_Gun]

Druid wolf builds and Tree build have been broken for a long time and haven't been "fixed", yet the Devs have time to Nerf Warlock because the Melee players are upset that their OP Paladins and Barbarians aren't miles ahead of all the Casters anymore.

BooHoo!

Until they Nerf Paladin DPS and Barbarian self healing I say leave Warlock alone. At end game it's fine and that's the only measure that should count.

[Requiro]

(...)
Now I am not saying warlocks don't need tweaking and adjustments.. but its not at end game where they need the fixes...
a starting warlock is 1d6 damage +1d4 pact damage without anything, right off the boat... that is a overly strong start..

I would have liked to have seen the starting eldritch start at 1d3 for levels 1&2 then go to 1d6 at level 3/4....and also have pact damage not start until about level 6.
(...)

Funny You could AT LEAST look to wiki...

Level 1: 1d6
Level 2: 1d6 + 1d4

(in the mean time Repeating Heavy Crossbow gets 3x1d10 with additional stuff on bolts… with 10% critical.. at level 1 !!)

Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.

Now is the best part:

Relatively small, targeted balance adjustments to Warlock (especially Enlightened Spirit) are in the works for sometime after U32.

I hope that it means that summoner line will be replaced by something useful? Or some improvements to almost useless Spiritual Defense? Or maybe some improvements to Core 1/3/6 that are almost garbage before level 12? That will be something…

If not, that maybe you consider improvements to Tainted Scholar, that is not very well balanced as well? Especially SLAs animation time, that made them useless. Or buff other Essences Stance because of the cost, they are not better then Utterdark Blast, or T5 abilities, that are far the worst from the other 2.

You could also consider some improvements to Core 20 Soul Eater, that is completely garbage compare to other 2. Also T3 abilities are not very helpful.

And please remove that bug, where you shoot with Ranged Magical Attack, blast hit the target, but target did not take damage at all? That is very irritating…

[Chilldude]

You don't have to be elite to be OP in enlightened spirit. Case in point, a player in my guild crushed everything with an ES Warlock (He is a good player I will grant). While he was in that build...the rest of us did nothing more than just follow him around while he completed all EE content for us. Granted I got great XP while we followed...but it was boring. Then he TR's into a Mechanic (Still a powerful build in DDO) and guess what? He then actually needed our help. We all contributed. We all had fun. It was truly a team effort.

Well fast forward a couple of weeks, he TR's back into an ES Warlock, and we are back to being nothing more than luggage while he completes each quest.

I'm not crying about elitist players being powerful. I'm griping about slightly above average players playing a cheese build and making it boring for me.

...and before you say, "then stop running with him". No...I consider him a friend and part of the fun in this game is the social aspect. But that is just part of it.

Sounds like your friend needs to learn to play a mechanic. That was a joke (sort of).

Seriously though, there are dozens of builds you can follow through EE and watch them solo it. DDO has always been a game of run as fast as you can and see who can get the most kills as opposed to strategy based teamwork. I'm not saying that's a good thing, but warlock certainly didn't make it that way. Next time you run with your friend, try to keep up.

[dg_evil]

First off, I have run a lot of different warlock builds and I find it a lot of fun. I do see that Warlocks can cut through Heroic content seemingly easily, but so can any other well built class with sufficient past lives. Once you get to EE and LE content, typical blast/aura build warlocks can't keep up in kills with bards, rangers, fighters, or wizards. In fact I got so sick of getting 10% of the kills of well built bards and rangers that I switched from running aura/blast builds to running DC warlocks in order to be able to feel useful with all the melees in the party doing 10k dmg per swing. Running a DC based warlock in EE and LE content requires so much gear and so many past lives that you can hardly call it OP. This conversation about OP warlocks only holds any water if all you look at is the low end easy content and completely falls apart when you start to look at the high end content.


Warlocks are not OP...nothing to see here...go fix the melee classes that are all OP. For those that feel they can't keep up with a warlock, you should build a stronger character. On Khyber, its melees that rule the kill count 90% of the time in EE and LE content and I can point you to a half dozen players, at least, that can teach you how to build a non-lock character that will beat 90% of warlocks in kills.

-Benton

[Chilldude]

Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.

Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.

Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.
Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.
Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.
Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.
Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.
Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.
Com'on guys. We have drama about OP Ranger with Ranger Pass, About Barb with Barb pass, with Paladin, Artificer, Rogue ect. ect. Now is time for Warlock? Devs, please, made pass another class, that this Warlock Drama ends.

[Requiro]

Druid wolf builds and Tree build have been broken for a long time and haven't been "fixed", yet the Devs have time to Nerf Warlock because the Melee players are upset that their OP Paladins and Barbarians aren't miles ahead of all the Casters anymore.

BooHoo!

Until they Nerf Paladin DPS and Barbarian self healing I say leave Warlock alone. At end game it's fine and that's the only measure that should count.

This ^

[Enoach]

I think a lot of the problem is people keep saying adjust/fix/nerf Warlock, but the issue is not all of the warlocks, it is a subset of the options.

Enlightened Spirit with Shining Threw and Two bursts that have a larger range then Cleave, combine that with Light/Alignment damage boosts and a high PRR all with a passive damaging aura that is also powered by Light/Alignment damage and what you have is a very hard to kill perpetual land mine.

So yes I get it, but this is not all warlocks. So lets discuss the right subset, the one that does not rely on saves of their Pact damage so going all in on Constitution to power Shining Threw and don't need to worry about DCs or even melee so has more feats to power damage of bursts and defense

[Steelstar]

Druid wolf builds and Tree build have been broken for a long time and haven't been "fixed", yet the Devs have time to Nerf Warlock because the Melee players are upset that their OP Paladins and Barbarians aren't miles ahead of all the Casters anymore.

BooHoo!

Until they Nerf Paladin DPS and Barbarian self healing I say leave Warlock alone. At end game it's fine and that's the only measure that should count.

Some interesting opinions there! Let's break that down:

• Wolf/Tree build fixes are coming.
  
  • The timing has less to do with the severity or priority and more to do with the complexity.
  • Yes, there is time to fix Warlock before broken Druid abilities. It takes less time to repair a crack than rebuild an entire wall.
  
  
• Planned Warlock changes are based primarily on data collection and testing.
  
  • Warlocks aren't the most powerful damage-dealers in the game right now, but neither are Paladins or Barbarians.
  • For that matter, we really haven't been hearing that "Melee players are upset that their OP Paladins and Barbarians aren't miles ahead of all the Casters anymore" at all. Even if we had, it would not be the sole deciding factor.
  
  
• Endgame is not the only measure that counts.
• The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

Anyway!

Hope everyone is having a fine morning.

[theboyftw]

I never understood people who get worked up about classes in a PVE game. If you don't like warlocks, don't play them and don't group with them.

I'd rather see Devs working on new content than class balance, since you'll never please everyone when you balance, and new content can be enjoyed by all.

if you're concerned about kill counts, go play call of duty.

[JOTMON]

Funny You could AT LEAST look to wiki...
Level 1: 1d6
Level 2: 1d6 + 1d4

really.. this is what you chose to nitpick about.....

[cdbd3rd]

hmmm...

I say leave it be, so the new players can play with it as well.

Well wasn't calling for nerfs really just something to balance against them and it should only be special rare mobs not a possible power any mob could have

Uska's suggestion is a good counter-suggestion to the current idea of blanket-nerfing down the class.

[Rys]

I never understood people who get worked up about classes in a PVE game. If you don't like warlocks, don't play them and don't group with them.

I'd rather see Devs working on new content than class balance, since you'll never please everyone when you balance, and new content can be enjoyed by all.

if you're concerned about kill counts, go play call of duty.

Amen.

[cdbd3rd]

*Takes too long finding just the right gif pic.*

*Winds up replying to missing post.*

*Le Sigh*

[Gurei23]

really.. this is what you chose to nitpick about.....

You're right, there were so many things wrong with your statement he should have gone into further detail about how wrong you were, oh well.

[Requiro]

really.. this is what you chose to nitpick about.....

Yes, because you refer to 1-4 levels, while this particular levels are the worst time for Warlock
Of course you will know that if you try Warlock. Or you try and just Gaxe or Xbow Repeater like all other Caster do on low levels...