Please stop forcing iconics to take a class at first level.

[Royalties]

I think most will agree that the greatest part of DDO is character customization. Please change this so that we have more control over our characters without having to pay money to LR+1 our characters. I know many divines who are excited about gnomes, but they will be forced to pay for the deep gnomes, and then forced to pay for the LR+1. I don't even see the point in this thematically.

[eris2323]

100% agree... don't think it'll happen, but 100% agree. Maybe 150% agree.

[Uska]

they wouldn't be iconic then so NO

[eris2323]

they wouldn't be iconic then so NO

If these are supposed to be iconic classes, then they should be class trees.

Since they are not, it's valid to complain about this issue.

[Royalties]

they wouldn't be iconic then so NO

Nowhere in D&D are you forced to take a class at first level. Oh, except DDO.

[Uska]

Nowhere in D&D are you forced to take a class at first level. Oh, except DDO.

Ummm and you don't start a 15 they are called iconics for a reason

[Uska]

If these are supposed to be iconic classes, then they should be class trees.

Since they are not, it's valid to complain about this issue.

My complaint is they aren't forced to be pure at least up to 15

[Royalties]

Ummm and you don't start a 15 they are called iconics for a reason

No, I have started at 15. It's not uncommon to create a character that is higher level.

[MaximumCharisma]

No, I have started at 15. It's not uncommon to create a character that is higher level.

Not at all uncommon.

Also, Iconic requiring a level of a class is a revenue source for ddo. Plain and simple. My biggest complaint is that you can't choose to look like the normal version of the race. This is why I still do not own Bladeforged or Shadar Kai.

[Uska]

No, I have started at 15. It's not uncommon to create a character that is higher level.

Not normal to start pnp at that level and not attachment for characters you don't work up to,level not a good a good example to compare iconics to pnp ddo doesn't really resemble pnp very well

[Uska]

Not at all uncommon.

Also, Iconic requiring a level of a class is a revenue source for ddo. Plain and simple. My biggest complaint is that you can't choose to look like the normal version of the race. This is why I still do not own Bladeforged or Shadar Kai.

Not common in regular games in power gaming games it's common

[eris2323]

My complaint is they aren't forced to be pure at least up to 15

Well if that were the case, I wouldn't have bought ANY iconics.

[Vellrad]

I could see chose 1 level in unfitting class, 14 in whatever you want, or decline all the XP and start at lvl1 in any class (and forget veterans status there- you already declined XP).
But I don't think its gonna happen.

[Ayseifn]

Yeah the heart tax gets annoying as does having to re-level again just to get rid of that 1 level, bonus points for the Bladeforged alignment changes.

For TR's I'm fine with just sucking it up and burning the first level on a bad class but if I were building to stay at cap for a while it's a pretty big detriment to them, if the deep gnome past life weren't so strong I'd never even contemplate buying them.

I'd pay 3-4k TP to be able to start at level one on them as whatever class I want. I still have a handful of hearts of wood and am still TRing so in no great need of it, the peace of mind though of being able to start them as whatever I choose is worth that much to me.

[Axeyu]

they wouldn't be iconic then so NO

Wait what? Can you please explain what you mean?

[Royalties]

Not common in regular games in power gaming games it's common

I am sorry but you are absolutely wrong. I am 110% sure my mom and dad are not power gamers. Hahahaha.

[Royalties]

I could see chose 1 level in unfitting class, 14 in whatever you want, or decline all the XP and start at lvl1 in any class (and forget veterans status there- you already declined XP).
But I don't think its gonna happen.

I would absolutely level from 1 to 20 if this were a thing. In fact, I think this should be how they handle it. If you want to punish me then make me go from 1-20 for not taking the iconic class. Otherwise let me cap my character and stop trying to milk me for money. It's enough that iconic class is something you have to pay for. I don't even know why I pay for VIP if I have to buy everything anyway.

[FranOhmsford]

What gets me is that it's so blatant!

Morninglord is completely and utterly wrong! No these are NOT Iconic because the Iconic Grey {Sun in FR} Elf is a WIZARD! {Or Fighter/Mage, Or Fighter/Mage/Thief!}.
Cleric is about the LEAST Iconic Class for ANY Elf!

Now we've got Svirfneblin {No I'm not going to call them Deep Gnomes}, the ONLY +Wis Race in the game and the Devs force a Lvl of Wizard on us!
Now yes Wizard is Iconic {Illusionist} for Gnomes {and yes Svirfneblin too though less so} BUT....
DDO has certain classes that work {synergise} as splashes and other classes that DO NOT!

Wizard does not synergise with anything as a Splash!
Neither does Cleric for that matter - Another problem with Morninglord!

The Devs could have said that Svirfneblin unlike the standard Gnome had +Wis instead of +Int & Cleric or Druid as their Base Class and we wouldn't have a problem because that would fit the Race AND everyone who wanted to play a Gnome Illusionist would have the Base Gnome available!
OR
The Devs could have made the required Level for Svirfneblin be:
Rogue {Trap/Evasion Splash}, Artificer {Repeater/Rune-Arm Splash}, Ranger {TWF/Bow Splash} or even Fighter {Feats Splash, Battle Cleric, Fighter/Mage etc. etc.} and any of those would have opened up multiple options for players!

1 level of Wizard = Extremely limited options!
Yes you could still build a Fighter/Mage easily enough as the fighter levels can be fitted in later but the most popular Multi for Wizards is out {18 Wiz/2 Rogue = Rogue at Lvl 1 NOT Wizard!}.




Suggestion:
Give ALL Iconics at least 2 options {preferably 3} for the first level:
- Bladeforged = Paladin, Sorc or Fighter {LG requirement only if taking Paladin}
- PDK = Fighter, Bard or Paladin
- Shadar-Kai = Rogue, Monk or Ranger
- Morninglord = Cleric, FavSoul or Wizard
- Svirfneblin = Wizard, Druid or Rogue {at least Rogue would open up the Rogue Splash!}.

[eris2323]

Not normal to start pnp at that level and not attachment for characters you don't work up to,level not a good a good example to compare iconics to pnp ddo doesn't really resemble pnp very well

Your definition of normal in pnp may be different from others... I've been told to make high level characters in numerous starter campaigns, because it fits the game that the DM wants to run.

PNP can be played many ways.... your definition of 'power gaming' may be another dm's definition of playing heroic, world spanning characters with richly interwoven back stories.

Just cause your DM always made you start at 1 doesn't mean others didn't.

also DDO isn't pnp so leave those misconceptions at the door...

[Uska]

What gets me is that it's so blatant!

Morninglord is completely and utterly wrong! No these are NOT Iconic because the Iconic Grey {Sun in FR} Elf is a WIZARD! {Or Fighter/Mage, Or Fighter/Mage/Thief!}.
Cleric is about the LEAST Iconic Class for ANY Elf!

Now we've got Svirfneblin {No I'm not going to call them Deep Gnomes}, the ONLY +Wis Race in the game and the Devs force a Lvl of Wizard on us!
Now yes Wizard is Iconic {Illusionist} for Gnomes {and yes Svirfneblin too though less so} BUT....
DDO has certain classes that work {synergise} as splashes and other classes that DO NOT!

Wizard does not synergise with anything as a Splash!
Neither does Cleric for that matter - Another problem with Morninglord!

The Devs could have said that Svirfneblin unlike the standard Gnome had +Wis instead of +Int & Cleric or Druid as their Base Class and we wouldn't have a problem because that would fit the Race AND everyone who wanted to play a Gnome Illusionist would have the Base Gnome available!
OR
The Devs could have made the required Level for Svirfneblin be:
Rogue {Trap/Evasion Splash}, Artificer {Repeater/Rune-Arm Splash}, Ranger {TWF/Bow Splash} or even Fighter {Feats Splash, Battle Cleric, Fighter/Mage etc. etc.} and any of those would have opened up multiple options for players!

1 level of Wizard = Extremely limited options!
Yes you could still build a Fighter/Mage easily enough as the fighter levels can be fitted in later but the most popular Multi for Wizards is out {18 Wiz/2 Rogue = Rogue at Lvl 1 NOT Wizard!}.




Suggestion:
Give ALL Iconics at least 2 options {preferably 3} for the first level:
- Bladeforged = Paladin, Sorc or Fighter {LG requirement only if taking Paladin}
- PDK = Fighter, Bard or Paladin
- Shadar-Kai = Rogue, Monk or Ranger
- Morninglord = Cleric, FavSoul or Wizard
- Svirfneblin = Wizard, Druid or Rogue {at least Rogue would open up the Rogue Splash!}.

Agree that morning lord wasn't the right class and was a surprise and a disappointment