Let us know how you're doing in the Legendary raids (at all difficulty levels)

[esojiul]

I know you probably wont listen as all the real feedback is on the other boards so I'll keep this short.

Tempest spine
Too easy roflstomp, even with noob groups. Sorjeck is the only dangerous thing in that raid

ok with me

Hound
Too easy. Instant teleport? You dont even have to heal the dogs anymore? ********.

true
Shroud
didnt try on LE-it fun makes most groups unplayable. You all really messed up by making ingredients bound. The reason shroud was popular was because EVERYONE was trading LDSs as currency. Instead you chose to bind them and sell them in the store...really?? Fix your damage on LE, being 1 shotted should not happen to 1500+ HP chars.

This was truly your last chance to save DDO from maintenance mode, and you guys screwed it. Way to go. Great testing and listening to Lama feedback.

need to fix the lag-main problem

[PsychoBlonde]

That is a load of carp,
1. There is nothing interesting about white dotting meatsack Endfights where a slivered Boss shifts aggro to someone who got tossed walks to the edge then resets to full HP.
2. people were thrown over the wall, so that is not a guarantee.

Looking to dev's to fix a bad reset mechanic, has nothing to do with how easy or uninteresting you think he is.

Oh, I'm sorry, yes, victory in one shot should be *guaranteed*.

I didn't say it was a good mechanic. I said I didn't MIND it, because it's not the end of the world--you CAN do something constructive about it, and if it doesn't work, well, you can DPS him down again. It's not like he goes invulnerable and you fail the raid. It's not substantially different from having to kill the mobs again on part 2 of shroud because the crystal didn't go down on the first pass, and people have been doing THAT for AGES.

Has anyone attempted the various methods of controlling aggro available in the game? Intim, diplomacy, bluff, heck, just dropping into sneak mode since you're out of LoS might be enough to clear aggro. These are all worth trying before you start screaming. Has everyone taken their feather fall off?

[JOTMON]

Oh, I'm sorry, yes, victory in one shot should be *guaranteed*.

I didn't say it was a good mechanic. I said I didn't MIND it, because it's not the end of the world--you CAN do something constructive about it, and if it doesn't work, well, you can DPS him down again. It's not like he goes invulnerable and you fail the raid. It's not substantially different from having to kill the mobs again on part 2 of shroud because the crystal didn't go down on the first pass, and people have been doing THAT for AGES.

Has anyone attempted the various methods of controlling aggro available in the game? Intim, diplomacy, bluff, heck, just dropping into sneak mode since you're out of LoS might be enough to clear aggro. These are all worth trying before you start screaming. Has everyone taken their feather fall off?

I didn't say anything about " victory in one shot should be *guaranteed*."
My post was about a screwed up white dot mechanic.
You seem enamoured with trying to derail this issue into some sort of irrelevent argument.

..there is a game interaction mechanic that is problematic and is being brought up in a thread asking for feedback on the Legendary content.

Problem.. boss white dotting during battle on the small contained platform.
Fixing the white-dotting/aggro for the Boss is something to clean up a currently glitchy mechanic with the endfight in the Tempest spine Raid.

This isn't about player skills, or sneaking while being tossed.. seriously.. stay on topic here..
We are all capable of using workarounds and a variety of cheese mechanics, and rerunning over and over again to restart a fight, but why should we..

[Captain_Wizbang]

shroud lag after today's hotfix was acceptable. only had a little in part 5

[Basura_Grande]

This isn't about player skills, or sneaking while being tossed.. seriously.. stay on topic here..
We are all capable of using workarounds and a variety of cheese mechanics, and rerunning over and over again to restart a fight, but why should we..

better question is why bother running Tempest Spine in the first place. Even on LE with a good group it presents too little challenge to be fun and the loot is garbage.

If a tree falls on a terrible raid in a forest and nobody's playing it, does anybody care?

[nokowi]

Ran all 3 raids today.

We had some lag in town when our guild split into two 12-person groups before going into TS. (24 people all in the same area).

We had a slight chest lag in pt 1 of shroud.

Other than this, there really was no lag to speak of.

[slarden]

We ran it and had no problems.

I had no issues with how hard enemies hit. We had no clerics - only res scrolls used to bring people back up. We did have someone effectively tanking the boss and that helped alot.

My only complaint is that if someone uses /stuck or gets pushed off and has aggro the boss resets. We must have done 5x damage to him by the time he finally went down without resetting.

Please address that for the next patch.

[AzureDragonas]

We ran it and had no problems.

I had no issues with how hard enemies hit. We had no clerics - only res scrolls used to bring people back up. We did have someone effectively tanking the boss and that helped alot.

My only complaint is that if someone uses /stuck or gets pushed off and has aggro the boss resets. We must have done 5x damage to him by the time he finally went down without resetting.

Please address that for the next patch.

BTW, when exactly he resets when entire group is pushed down or a single player? We did LE, had 4-6 people pushed and coming back but havent reseted a single time, most who used fom had no issues to stay at top.

[slarden]

BTW, when exactly he resets when entire group is pushed down or a single player? We did LE, had 4-6 people pushed and coming back but havent reseted a single time, most who used fom had no issues to stay at top.

It seemed to be 2 things
1) the person with agro was pushed down
2) someone used /stuck - whenever someone did it he reset - we told people not to do it and finally finished without him resetting. While I realize this isn't a legit action, people are used to doing it from heroic and when in a party of 12 it's hard to control what people do.

[AzureDragonas]

It seemed to be 2 things
1) the person with agro was pushed down
2) someone used /stuck - whenever someone did it he reset - we told people not to do it and finally finished without him resetting. While I realize this isn't a legit action, people are used to doing it from heroic and when in a party of 12 it's hard to control what people do.

For 2nd we had /stuck users too, no change on his hp, he havent reseted at all. For pushing aggro guy, hard to tell he was changing aggro all time 1 thing for sure, each of his hit was deadly, if i recall correct stormreavers hit twice with each attack, and that boss hits 1500-2500 on single swing if he lands hit

[Captain_Wizbang]

better question is why bother running Tempest Spine in the first place. Even on LE with a good group it presents too little challenge to be fun and the loot is garbage.

Not to derail the thread, BUT, why do you play this game?
personally, Ive rage/quit a few times. Complained & whined, and in the end I'm still here to play a game and have fun.

Sure, it would be nice to get all the uber loot, xp & whatever, but this is just a game.

Turbine is a game company & is trying to keep us playing and having fun while the employees make a living.

Can we as a community come up with better ideas? In some cases yes, but in the end we're just gamers.

Don't like something? Don't run it. Last night I joined a L Shroud normal. At 1st I thought, "normal?" then why not, I'll get mats & xp and have fun in a pug like we used to.

Not enough of a challenge? Then try starting over, take a 1st life toon and run it up lvl 30.

I am as much at fault as a lot of us are. I thought the loot would be better, and was disappointed with my 1st turn-ins. I think we should look at finding new character gear set-ups that will make our toons better, and that will be a combo of raid loot & new random loot.

No offence, this is not directed at you, as it is the general populous of the game.

[Basura_Grande]

Not to derail the thread, BUT, why do you play this game?

Nostalgia and hope things will get better.

[Captain_Wizbang]

Nostalgia and hope things will get better.

/signed

[JOTMON]

It seemed to be 2 things
1) the person with agro was pushed down
2) someone used /stuck - whenever someone did it he reset - we told people not to do it and finally finished without him resetting. While I realize this isn't a legit action, people are used to doing it from heroic and when in a party of 12 it's hard to control what people do.

I only noticed the white dotting when Sor'jek aggro'd on someone who was not on the platform, irregardless of how far away they were.

1.. had one tanky melee player get launched, 2nd tanky melee player was melee'ing Sor'jek with aggro, got one-shotted, Sor'jek shifted aggro back to person who was FF 25 miles away(had bounced off the outer wall boundary and was trying to drift to a spot to start running back to entrance) on the far end of the unexplored map, Sor'jek walked to the edge and few seconds later white dotted while ignoring everyone else melee'ing/dotting him.
1.. had person tanking get thrown over the wall Sor'jek stopped attacking for a couple seconds, switched to his bow.. then white dotted.
1.. had Sor'jek stop attacking multiple players melee'ing, walk to the edge and whitedot (assuming he aggro'd on a player (caster) that had been launched a couple minutes earlier and was working their way back.)

/stuck did not appear to impact this in any way...several players had /stuck back to platform during the repetitive battle

[Silverleafeon]

I only noticed the white dotting when Sor'jek aggro'd on someone who was not on the platform, irregardless of how far away they were.

Good find.
Definite bug, Sor is trying to race/teleport down the mountainside obviously and rubber bands.

[PsychoBlonde]

Problem.. boss white dotting during battle on the small contained platform.
Fixing the white-dotting/aggro for the Boss is something to clean up a currently glitchy mechanic with the endfight in the Tempest spine Raid.

Declaring something a glitch because you don't like it does not *make* it a glitch. Declaring after that that it should be fixed BECAUSE it is a glitch is completely circular.

There are a LOT of fights in the game where it's possible to re-set a boss--even to do it completely by accident or just through bad luck. This does not necessarily imply that said fight is "glitched" or "bugged" or is somehow non-functional. Fortis making Legendary Shroud uncompletable is a glitch. A completely functional aggro mechanic working exactly as it was designed to is NOT.

If the devs feel it could stand a change, that's fine. If not, also fine. People will learn to cope.

[JOTMON]

Declaring something a glitch because you don't like it does not *make* it a glitch. Declaring after that that it should be fixed BECAUSE it is a glitch is completely circular.

There are a LOT of fights in the game where it's possible to re-set a boss--even to do it completely by accident or just through bad luck. This does not necessarily imply that said fight is "glitched" or "bugged" or is somehow non-functional. Fortis making Legendary Shroud uncompletable is a glitch. A completely functional aggro mechanic working exactly as it was designed to is NOT.

If the devs feel it could stand a change, that's fine. If not, also fine. People will learn to cope.

I see you are still trying to derail my feedback on something I believe to be bugged with pointless commentary and turn this into something its not.
What I don't understand why you are so focussed on trying to turn this particular specific issue and turn it into something else.

I am not talking about any other quests where bosses reset, by whatever means, I never brought up anything about Fortis and his bugged mechanics due to something completely different..

I am pointing out a mechanic where Sor'jek white dots when aggro'd on Thrown players that are no longer within line or anywhere within the expected aoe for the aggro mechanics to function.


I am not talking about making the quest easier like you stated.. here...

Oh, I'm sorry, yes, victory in one shot should be *guaranteed*.

or even workarounds like you try to push here..

Has anyone attempted the various methods of controlling aggro available in the game? Intim, diplomacy, bluff, heck, just dropping into sneak mode since you're out of LoS might be enough to clear aggro. These are all worth trying before you start screaming. Has everyone taken their feather fall off?

I am not talking about the boss difficulty or even care how you successful led 2 quests by using ranged and changing tactics.

Yeah, people were complaining about this elsewhere.

I actually don't have a problem with this because it makes the fight more interesting. It IS possible to not get thrown off. I've led the raid twice now and both times I cautioned people to fight up against the wall, not chase him if he retreats, use your ranged weapon if he backs off, etc. Result? No problems whatsoever. He's an easy raid boss. He should have something to make him more interesting.

If you are going to reply to posts at least make them relevant to the conversation in the context of the original thread.
I have no interest in entertaining your attempts to derail this into something else..

Its a simple observation on a mechanic that I do not believe is working correctly that I believed was worth mentioning and should be something the dev's should take a look at.

If you don't agree, fine, whatever, but at least stay on topic....You have talked circles around the issue that have no relevance to the specific issue..


The issue (simplified without details or explanations) :

'Sor'jek white dots when aggro'd on Thrown players'

......If this is WAI, then a dev can say so and we can quote him to the end of time.. If not.. have a look and see if theres some coding or whatever that can address the issue.....

[Xionanx]

ON TOPIC: Enemies one shotting people are lame, new mechanics are lame.. and new random loot is lame.

Nostalgia and hope things will get better.

Same.. I have sworn off this game multiple times.. Every time I end up coming back, I read release notes it just ****ess me off, I try to play for a few days.. but ultimately I just feel like the developers are ******** on the players over and over again and leave again..

[Talon_Moonshadow]

Did an experiment today.

Stepped into the Shroud on LE.
I was curious whether it really was every monster that was doing 2k damage.

Well.... yeah... yeah it is...lol

I went into sneak mode.

Agroed a single Orthon and brought him over to play one on one.

I dodged, I displaced... then he hit me for 2452 after 452 were blocked by my damage reduction.....

Then went back.

Tried a Trog Warrior this time.
He damage was indeed less.... but he did some 1.5+k to me. (after damage reduction)

Then a Bezikira(sp)
About the same as the Trog.

Didn't feel like trying every single type of thing in there.. but yeah... 2 - 3k it seems.

Ok... who the heck has 2 -3 K HP?
Who has damage reduction that would reduce that to a survivable number?


But yes... we of course do have options in a full group.

Wish I had a caster flagged to test saves and spell resistance, but I don't right now....


One more thing (idea).
So I picked up the four Gauntlet items and took a look at them.
Although I cannot remember for sure, they appear un-changed from heroic Shroud.

Shame... you guys missed a great opportunity there.

How about you make those items (like the Shield for example) allow people using them to tank these monsters?

Anyway....
While we certainly have options....
The vast majority of players will not find it fun to die any time they take a single hit.

I do not know yet what new gear we have or how that will change things, but I find it diffult to believe the new gear is sooo good that it will make a 2 - 3k difference.



P.s. Variety maybe?
If it was just one mob... like the Orthons..... it might be ok IMO.
Variety is more fun anyway. I've preached that before. (but it seems no one listens. )

P.P.S. The blades were only doing something 140-150ish to me it seemed.
I think I would prefer it is the blades one-shotted us and not the monsters... just a thought.

[PNellesen]

Ran Tempest's Spine and Shroud a few times each, both on LN and LH. (No LE yet)

Tempest's Spine:

• LN is... well, I wouldn't be surprised to hear that at some point someone soloes it at level 20 on a first-life character with no Epic Destinies. Short-manned it with maybe 7 people and the mobs might as well not have been there. Call it a good level 30 loot run.
• LH - in a group of well-geared players who know it well, it's very, very easy. In a group of people less familiar with it, with little communication, and not-quite-ready-for-prime-time characters, it's tougher, but still not all that much of a challenge.

Legendary Shroud:

• LN - about the same difficulty as Heroic Normal was when cap was 20, though Part 2 and Part 3 can be a challenge if you have players unfamiliar with Heroic Shroud in the group.
• LH - have only ran it once, with a pretty strong group (1 round in Part 4, very few deaths overall). Seemed to be a good difficulty - smooth (but not a cakewalk) if everyone's paying attention and working together, but I can see it being a disaster for your typical pug raid group.

In both cases the portals were a boring slog. Not sure what the point of the curse is when they explode, but it's just annoying (and blockable by Spell Absorption item). Dropping their HP by at least 1/3 would be nice.