Legendary Raids and Bypass Timers

[Chronic_1]

Please, for the love of god, stop listening to forum whiners! Why are you implementing every hair brained idea you read on here?!?!?!

[Holymunchkin]

Hello! We're writing today to let you know about a change in the way raid timer bypasses work in Legendary raids. We want to get this information out to you now, rather than wait before you see it on Lamannia, to separate out the discussion, and focus feedback on other aspects of Update 29 when Lamannia arrives with its first preview soon.

Update 29 introduces Legendary raiding to DDO, which are new raids that are CR31+. For Legendary raids, players will be able to bypass the three-day raid timer through the use of a Legendary Raid Timer Bypass, which will be available in Silver and Gold Daily Dice, as a rare chest drop, and in the DDO Store. Non-Legendary Raid Timer Bypasses will keep their current functionality in non-Legendary raids, and we will not be adjusting their ability to be used consecutively.

We've heard from the community about the impact that non-Legendary Raid Timer Bypasses have had over the past few years, including a desire by some to set usage limits on these timers. The feedback we've received on this subject has been often controversial and mixed, and we've spent quite a bit of time discussing the issue internally. We prefer to allow the current timers to function as they are without adjustment. The number of raid timer bypasses in the game is immense; partially due to duplication exploits of the past, and partially due to the volume of timers given out in the past via Daily Dice and the 8th Anniversary Card Event, which was too high. Regardless of the cause, we want to respond to the desire by the community to make sure our raiding scene remains healthy, and do it in a way that limits the impact on players' current timer functionality, by making this change.

We look forward to hearing your thoughts. Thanks!

Hey!

Please do not limit the new timers. Some of us have only 1 toon we will play in legendary content, and its not fair to limit our gameplay when older players have multiple raid-ready toons. Thanks!

[blerkington]

Clearly a conspiracy.

Couldn't possibly be a coincidence.

Evil forces are at work.

If you think it's a malicious act, then the best course of action would be to refuse to participate in any future raid timer promotions and never buy another one.

Hi,

It looks more like a case of the right hand not knowing what the left hand is doing, leading to another unfavourable outcome for some customers.

Some companies think about the timing and consequences of their promotions, but apparently others don't. Or perhaps they just don't care.

There's more malice in your post than what Turbine is doing here. But lack of malice doesn't excuse it.

Thanks.

[Delacroix21]

There is no change to your existing timer bypasses. They still work on the raids that were available when you bought them.



.

Actually there is! I didn't buy stacks of these timers for only the raids in the game now, but future raids as well.


I also bought a ton of lr 20 hearts, so if they add a new class or race that requires a separate lr 20 heart are you going to come in here and say the same condecending thing?


If they said when I bought them only good for raids update X and below I wouldn't have bought so many.

[Cetus]

Hello! We're writing today to let you know about a change in the way raid timer bypasses work in Legendary raids. We want to get this information out to you now, rather than wait before you see it on Lamannia, to separate out the discussion, and focus feedback on other aspects of Update 29 when Lamannia arrives with its first preview soon.

Update 29 introduces Legendary raiding to DDO, which are new raids that are CR31+. For Legendary raids, players will be able to bypass the three-day raid timer through the use of a Legendary Raid Timer Bypass, which will be available in Silver and Gold Daily Dice, as a rare chest drop, and in the DDO Store. Non-Legendary Raid Timer Bypasses will keep their current functionality in non-Legendary raids, and we will not be adjusting their ability to be used consecutively.

We've heard from the community about the impact that non-Legendary Raid Timer Bypasses have had over the past few years, including a desire by some to set usage limits on these timers. The feedback we've received on this subject has been often controversial and mixed, and we've spent quite a bit of time discussing the issue internally. We prefer to allow the current timers to function as they are without adjustment. The number of raid timer bypasses in the game is immense; partially due to duplication exploits of the past, and partially due to the volume of timers given out in the past via Daily Dice and the 8th Anniversary Card Event, which was too high. Regardless of the cause, we want to respond to the desire by the community to make sure our raiding scene remains healthy, and do it in a way that limits the impact on players' current timer functionality, by making this change.

We look forward to hearing your thoughts. Thanks!

This is a great step in the right direction.

Nicely done.

[Thrudh]

Some players like me enjoy raiding more than questing. We sometimes spend a whole weekend just raiding for the fun of it on multiple servers.

There are multiple raids, and you can have multiple alts. There was nothing stopping people from raiding all weekend in the past before bypass timers.

You couldn't run the same raid with the same character 10x in one night, but you could easily run 5x different raids with two different characters in one night.

[Jasparion]

Please, for the love of god, stop listening to forum whiners! Why are you implementing every hair brained idea you read on here?!?!?!

Because to solve the insane number of duped raid timer bypasses they set the drop rates so low that you were effectively forced to join the game or not bother raiding.

Now with no duped raid timer bypasses they can set reasonable drop rates so people can look at the loot list and decide they want to go for the gear.

Of course that assumes Turbine will set reasonable drop rates, and not continue the ridiculously low rates in the hope that people buy lots of bypasses.

As a Premium player I will be waiting to see what the drop rates are like before I buy new packs.

[EnziteBob]

Why not make it where the bypass runs don't count towards the 20th reward, or even give them there own 40th reward list idk.

[CThruTheEgo]

I get it, and I look forward to a more active raiding scene as a result of this. But this would have been more appropriately announced BEFORE raid timer bypasses were put on sale. Pretty shady announcing it after the fact imo. As a show of good faith, Turbine should offer a return option to those who purchased them during the sale.

[Seljuck]

This is step in good direction. I suggest also to limit repeatable usage of new timer bypasses to 1-3 / day / raid.

[stoopid_cowboy]

And to the very few who actually paid money or TP for legitimate raid timers I hope you offer a refund.

Why would they? I mean think about it, you got EXACTLY what you paid for! You bought raid timers that work perfectly fine in the current game. They will ALWAYS work fine for parts of the game in which they were released. Maybe the folks that "thought" they were being "smart" and bought up piles of them when they were on sale should stop for a moment and blame themselves and not Turbine.

The game changes and evolves people. Learn to accept change and evolve with the game.

Also, I vote for removing the raid timers COMPLETELY from the game. I have seen them damage too many raids already. We need to put the fire out, not throw more gasoline on it.

[Bobby88888]

The timer on raids should be dropped to 18-20 hours for all heroic, epic and legendary raids, the current bypass timers should work on all raids and the 20th rewards list should only have a change to drop the items or tomes(+6s, 6-7s and 7s with decreasing chance and skill tomes too i guess - bta or unbound). Of course the in raid loot drops would need to be increased to balance out the loss of the 20th which is currently the only way to get raid items, though only on hard and elite maybe.
This way you can get your run in more easily when others are running and should you desire to run again on any given day you can drop a bypass.
This seems like a good compromise between where it should be with no timer and bypass timers which are here to stay.

[count_spicoli]

I don't seem to understand. What exactly is the difference between the current rbt and the new legendary ones other that one works in legendary content and one doesnt. Did Cordovan say there would be limits to how often you can use legendary ones?

I would defiantly say make limits if the decision is still in the works to prolong the shelf life of the raids. Me and my bro were just talking how raids are not up nearly as much as the old days mostly due to burn out in the first few days a raid is out.

[Cleanincubus]

When is the whole blaming things on dupers going to stop? Nothing was done to stop the duping in the first place, and now all players are paying the price? It's time for Turbine to start taking responsibility for their action, or in this case, lack of actions. And stop punishing the players for the actions of a few. We didn't put the timers in the Anniversary event, Turbine did. The topic of the cards being duped was mentioned here on the forum, before the event even left Lamannia. Nothing was actually done to stop it, but the threads discussing it were certainly removed. Almost 2 years later, and the rest of us who aren't scum bags, still have to pay the price?

Too many timers given out from Daily Dice and the Anniversary Card event? Who's fault is that? Again, the answer is Turbine, not the players. That's the sort of thing that happens when events and content continues to be quickly shoveled out, rather than taking the time to think things out in detail. Why should we be punished because of that?

Legendary content huh... With new Raid Timers for sale in the Store. When the "older" versions were just on sale... Could we get the Executive Producer to chime in and tell us again that this was a coincidence, just like the Hearts of Wood?

Just stop. Let the existing timers work on new 31+ content, and make them BtC if you absolutely have to do something. If the new and old content is good enough to run over and over again, you should be happy. If it's boring and tedious, then make them better, instead of adding this new nonsense money grab.

[Jasparion]

Why would they? I mean think about it, you got EXACTLY what you paid for! You bought raid timers that work perfectly fine in the current game. They will ALWAYS work fine for parts of the game in which they were released. Maybe the folks that "thought" they were being "smart" and bought up piles of them when they were on sale should stop for a moment and blame themselves and not Turbine.

The game changes and evolves people. Learn to accept change and evolve with the game.

Also, I vote for removing the raid timers COMPLETELY from the game. I have seen them damage too many raids already. We need to put the fire out, not throw more gasoline on it.

They were put on sale a few weeks before the expansion comes out. Im sure some would have been stocking up in preparation.

Turbine should just offer a refund. Simple and easy and ensures people who were legitimately buying them arent punished because of the actions of those who knowingly and willingly grabbed dozens or even hundreds of duped ones.

[Qezuzu]

I don't seem to understand. What exactly is the difference between the current rbt and the new legendary ones other that one works in legendary content and one doesnt. Did Cordovan say there would be limits to how often you can use legendary ones?

I would defiantly say make limits if the decision is still in the works to prolong the shelf life of the raids. Me and my bro were just talking how raids are not up nearly as much as the old days mostly due to burn out in the first few days a raid is out.

The difference would be that there isn't an endless supply of LRBTs, and each LRBT will have had to have been bought from the store. Essentially, they're doing a do-over, and avoiding the mistakes they did before: LRBT's will likely never be available from any other source.

[Chai]

But at least now, Turbine is actually getting money when people pay to remove that barrier. As it is, you can RTBs without any real limit to almost no cost to you. If it costs actual money, far less people will use it.

But instead of people acquiring what they want out of the content in ~50% of the time it takes for Turbine to develop new content, those who pay can do it in 5% of the time, then go back on break for the other 95% of the time. How long until they go on break for 100% of that time? Is that worth the money they make off these?

[Ovrad]

Hello! We're writing today to let you know about a change in the way raid timer bypasses work in Legendary raids. We want to get this information out to you now, rather than wait before you see it on Lamannia, to separate out the discussion, and focus feedback on other aspects of Update 29 when Lamannia arrives with its first preview soon.

Update 29 introduces Legendary raiding to DDO, which are new raids that are CR31+. For Legendary raids, players will be able to bypass the three-day raid timer through the use of a Legendary Raid Timer Bypass, which will be available in Silver and Gold Daily Dice, as a rare chest drop, and in the DDO Store. Non-Legendary Raid Timer Bypasses will keep their current functionality in non-Legendary raids, and we will not be adjusting their ability to be used consecutively.

We've heard from the community about the impact that non-Legendary Raid Timer Bypasses have had over the past few years, including a desire by some to set usage limits on these timers. The feedback we've received on this subject has been often controversial and mixed, and we've spent quite a bit of time discussing the issue internally. We prefer to allow the current timers to function as they are without adjustment. The number of raid timer bypasses in the game is immense; partially due to duplication exploits of the past, and partially due to the volume of timers given out in the past via Daily Dice and the 8th Anniversary Card Event, which was too high. Regardless of the cause, we want to respond to the desire by the community to make sure our raiding scene remains healthy, and do it in a way that limits the impact on players' current timer functionality, by making this change.

We look forward to hearing your thoughts. Thanks!

It's good that legendary is separated from old timers. It sucks that nothing is being done to address the massive abuse of timers going on in game currently. Oh well, I guess all raids will only get a single month of lifetime at most...

At the VERY least, allow completions to stick though TRs. Come on! It would those that don't abuse timers a reason to run raid without having our char locked for 3 months+.

[Jetrule]

Woot!!! Thanks for striking another blow against the duppers!

[cdbd3rd]

... Make the timers bound to character retroactively so they cant be traded or sold then. That will fix your problem....

The only ones that idea would hurt are people who don't raid - who sell the bypasses from Daily Dice.


As I don't raid, I don't have any dogs in the pit for this one. I do remember how people communicated more to organize raid nights & such before timer bypasses.




Summary: This will be a no-win situation no matter which way the decision falls.