More D&D interactive choices in quests

[Pehtis]

Bear with me as I try to articulate my suggestion.

Kings Forest wilderness area has several random encounters that allows the player to use a particular skill (diplomacy, intimidation etc.) to try and achieve a particular result.
Epic Orchard wilderness has Werewolves fighting Silver Flame characters .


There already exist within the game the mechanism to use a skill (diplomacy, intimidation ect.) to achieve particular results. I never really understood why so much of the game play involves very little D&D choices.

Do we really need every encounter to be a fight? What I'd like to see is more content that allows the player to make a skill check in an encounter. The result of the outcome can result in some very interesting game outcomes.

Take Epic Orchard example. Player approaches Silver Flame character and is must attempt to converse within 10 seconds (or they immediately turn red and attack). Bluff to pass by unharmed but can turn red again if pass by them again. Diplomacy to make them permanently friendly. Intimidate to get them to follow you for say 1 min (or small area space) and attack werewolves/undead or even rare boss nearby. Sure they won't make a real difference to any fight (other than allowing you to run away) but it adds a certain D&D feel to the encounter.

Another example could be Temple of Elemental Evil. I'd like to see some encounters with particular types of bandits for instance allow for a skill check. Haggle to bribe your way past them, and maybe even if it's high enough, buy their loyalty for 10 minutes (they can have a charmed icon if stay put or even dominated icon if they follow you).

There is so many possibilities resulting in an effect of some kind that can be catered for any content. You could even throw in Alignment or whether you are alive or dead to either boost or drop your chances if you really wanted.

You get the idea.


For some us, we would really like more game interactions with potential NPC's as part of the challenge instead of the usual non stop fighting spawns, puzzles, or just plain silly platform jumping (omg game platform is so terrible for it I always fume when I have do a quest with one).

[The_Human_Cypher]

A new quest could involve mostly NPC related skills, puzzles, finding hidden objects and doors, etc. with little combat except an end fight. Even though a quest like this would be an interesting change of pace, such as quest would involve much more time than normal to design, especially if some elements of it were random. Maybe we can see a quest with these characteristics as a stand alone, free to play quest like 'A Study in Sable' sometime in the future.

[Cordovan]

Thank you for the kind words and good suggestions. We do love to do these kind of more complex optionals when time permits. They aren't always easy to fit into the development schedule, but we agree they provide a nice change of pace.

[Ghwyn]

This is a nice suggestion.

[Thrudh]

I also like when skills get you more information...

In the original sets of quests way way back, a high Listen skill would give you DM info that other people in the party would not get...

I'd love to see more of that again. Someone with a high Concentration or Listen might notice something, or get a choice that others do not.

Let a high Balance or Tumble skill give you a choice to bypass a difficult physical puzzle or something.

Things like that.

[Lauf]

Thank you for the kind words and good suggestions. We do love to do these kind of more complex optionals when time permits. They aren't always easy to fit into the development schedule, but we agree they provide a nice change of pace.

here's a simple suggestion - do away with the "you're barred from progressing unless you kill these mobs" mechanisms in new quests. (or old ones, if you ever get around to fixing them)

I've enjoyed planning and building several sneaky characters, but I have to admit they are useless, for the simple reason that you can only sneak past smaller groups, because most large groups are mandatory fights on your way to a quest completion.

this basically makes the only valid soloing build someone who can handle the large group. apart from a few choice quests there's really no real way of completing without having to deal with massive group combat.

so much for role play...

[Robai]

Listen skill could have some use too.

For example, each champion has a chance to drop an invisible portal made of mysterious sonic essence, which means you do a roll d150 + Listen skill vs 150 to notice the portal (and reveal it to other party members).
If you click the portal some things might happen:
1) you enter a room with some trash mobs (useful for your conquest bonus), no reward
2) you enter a Mnemonic Laboratory with a red named Gnome caster making potions, he can spawn only if party lvl is not higher than quest lvl, he is fat (a lot of hp) and spams Sleet Storm/Grease spells, he also rings a bell for reinforcements each 30 secs. Reward after killing him is a chest, which always has 1 Major Mnemonic Potion (and nothing else), you also get some xp for this optional.
3) you get an option to teleport to the end of the quest to fight end boss and complete the quest faster (this option is available only in some quests, that doesn't break quest completion mechanics)
4) in a room you see a NPC that needs help: a) remove a collar (some skills needed) or b) heal some amount of hp (hp needed =10 * quest_lvl). Reward: +10% bonus xp in that quest.

[The_Human_Cypher]

Even though a quest like this may take two or three times the amount of development time, including them in the game is beneficial. A quest similar to this idea, 'A Study in Sable,' was very refreshing when it was added to the game and has a real following among the community (including myself). I hope to see a quest with these suggestions in the next few years.

[Jetrule]

There are several quests where using social skills or spot or listen even one with a wilderness lore check. They can provide a shortcut or advantage. I like all those too. I think the quest mask of deception went that route and it is interesting you can use your skills and wits or your brawn to complete it. More would be appreciated. A Lot of quests do this in a meta gaming style with zerger short cuts. I don't enjoy those as much but to each his own.

[J-mann]

Thank you for the kind words and good suggestions. We do love to do these kind of more complex optionals when time permits. They aren't always easy to fit into the development schedule, but we agree they provide a nice change of pace.

Not just social skill type things, but quests with multiple paths to completion, quests with optionals that effect the outcome of the quest (ala party crahsers... that quest is brilliant), and even quests that have differnt endings based on which path the party takes.... all of these things are lacking in most of the newer quests and these things make some of the best/most fun quests in the game.

[CThruTheEgo]

/signed.

I certainly enjoy a good beat down fest as well, but we have been getting way too many of those type of quests lately. It gets old. Some more variety is needed and there are many good suggestions in this thread.

I especially want to second the "stop making mandatory fights to progress" suggestion. This is just cheesy and destroys the entire stealth playstyle.

[bsquishwizzy]

I’m with the concept of the OP 110%. However, everyone needs to understand that this type of quest is not going to be for everyone. You still have the MMO-types whose focus is on building their character, and not immersion.

Likewise, having something with more complexity than killing everything in sight also takes a whole lot longer to test and finalize. You start having to go down paths and decision trees, and it starts getting ugly. Likewise, getting that immersion may require more expansive quests that take longer to complete. That could be a big issue.

I mean, I’d personally LOVE a ToEE with all of the suggestions being made. But that’s a lot of work to implement.

That was the beauty of the Neverwinter Nights I and II PC games. You could make them really complex and immersive if you had the time and the patience.

I personally think if Turbine wanted to pull off something like this, they should start with a fairly large quest with the current mechanisms. Then add the complexity to it across several releases to provide that immersion. Not sure if they – or even the player base - have the desire or the patience to pull that off.

[bloodnose13]

i would love ot see such more complex story driven quests, and study in sable was a welcome change from typical bash through, i would like to notice, stormreach has two.... i found only two, i call them mini quests, one is near lighthouse where we have to convince guard to let in refugees without paying, and second is in inspired quater where we can as divine character to convince inspired to change his mind on things, i would like to see more of such city based mini quests that could rotate daily, for example all of city taverns could have a message board where we could find what daily city quest is available, and they could range from simple "kill rats in my cellar" (go and kill x of monstes in slayer) to conversation story quests where we have to use skill check to get things done. i think stormreach would feel more alive with things like that and would promote exploration of it by new players.