U27 Items Official Discussion - Round 2

[Steve_Howe]

A good longsword is a long time coming. This sword looks to break the game.

Counter proposal: +15, Greater Vorpal, Doublestrike +5 (insight bonus), Red Augment, Orange Augment, Yellow Augment, Crit Range 17-20.

Jeez Louise! The sword hasn't even been made yet and you're calling for a nerf!

Maybe you should wait until it's released and tested by actual players so you have some hard data on it before you condemn if first???

[Infiltraitor]

Jeez Louise! The sword hasn't even been made yet and you're calling for a nerf!

Maybe you should wait until it's released and tested by actual players so you have some hard data on it before you condemn if first???

You are correct, I ran the numbers. The long sword isn't as strong as my mortal fear heavy pick and also the crit profile benefits very little from Celestial Champion +1 range due to having minimal threat multiplier.

[DrWily]

Finally, justice has been done.

[maddong]

I would think the goggles would be a must slot for a wisdom person if they were +12 wis or +4 insightful wis. There is no reason to have them both. If you want to put both bonuses on it reserve it for the mythic version.

[Xahtep]

The raid tower shield looks nice. Something on it caught my eye: it is [3d10]. With vanguard capstone and maybe paly holy sword buff that will go up to what, 3[3d10] 17-20 x4? It could be a typo too and meant to be 3[1d10] but if its the first case it will become THE tower shield to have.

[moo_cow]

yes, borderline no brainer.. and wisdom toons need something like this.
our wisdom toons have been passed over for far too long to not get some love.
Don't screw with this one .. I like it just the way it is... Monks and clerics can finally rejoice..

It is very OP for a monk IMO. All this does for my monk is it allow me to drop wisdom to 8 and use no level ups into wisdom, and still have a 76-78 stun dc in ld. Good for dc wisdom based builds, but I think it gives too much to a monk. I want my monk to have more damage not to have a higher than no fail stun dc.

[Steve_Howe]

It is very OP for a monk IMO. All this does for my monk is it allow me to drop wisdom to 8 and use no level ups into wisdom, and still have a 76-78 stun dc in ld. Good for dc wisdom based builds, but I think it gives too much to a monk. I want my monk to have more damage not to have a higher than no fail stun dc.

Nope.

My pure Monk has an 83 stunning fist DC. The goggles make it an 84. Big effing deal.

Leave the new goggles alone. They're fine.

[draven1]

And stop with the Illusion items. No one uses that school, ever. DDO is very limited with those spells anyway. Unless one of the devs personally dislikes how few spells ddo has compared to DnD and wants to right that wrong, then by all means continue with the Illusion items! I feel niche items as such would provide enough of a farm for players to deck out their alts or specific builds while not going down the path of +15 stat item, quality bonus, determination bonus, profane bonus, insightful bonus, exceptional bonus, sacred bonus, new bonus, old bonus, big bonus, little bonus.

I use illusion spells for my wiz
Don't presume every wiz is a necromancer

[BankCoffer]

I use illusion spells for my wiz
Don't presume every wiz is a necromancer

Yeah, because casting exactly one spell is a reason to spec for it.

[draven1]

Yeah, because casting exactly one spell is a reason to spec for it.

Phantasmal killer isn't only one that I cast on illusion spells
Yea, illusion has very narrow spell section now, but so, we can request more illusion spells for the future.
Like weird, nightmare, misdirection, mirror image, veil, rainbow pattern spells.

[BankCoffer]

Phantasmal killer isn't only one that I cast on illusion spells

Oh, my bad. You cast Hypnotic Pattern too

[moo_cow]

Nope.

My pure Monk has an 83 stunning fist DC. The goggles make it an 84. Big effing deal.

Leave the new goggles alone. They're fine.

Yes and you can get a no fail stun dc by investing no wisdom at all. That is completely stupid. Also it would give you a minimum of 4 to your dc, but okay.

The point was not to say that I have a fairly decent stun dc. The point was that you can wear these goggles and put 0 points into wisdom, start with a 6-8 wisdom, and still be able to stun everything in the game. 8 starting wisdom +0 level ups into wisdom + 0 point invested in wisdom in enhancement trees and you get a 76-78 stunning fist. The only useful tool based on wisdom for a monk and they are making it so easy to get.

[PermaBanned]

The SR 35 doesn't stack (no Spell Resistance does); it's mostly for flavor on a Bearded Devil themed item (hence why that item's got more effects than most others in this pack). Much like the Feather Fall clicky, we could remove it if people don't like it, but we're not likely to replace it with anything. That said, we've heard some feedback that people aren't super-happy with this item in general, we'll be taking a look at it today.

About that belt: would it be possible to change that Teleport clicky to something of a "Planar Travel" clicky? With destinations not available from Teleport/Greater Teleport like Eaveningstar & Shavrath? Let it count as a "flavor slot" like the Spell Resistance (which could really go away and not be missed) so it doesn't take up a "useful property" slot?

Edit: On that PT clicky idea - perhaps instead of Eaveningstar directly, have both Halls of Heros as destination options?

There are no new Augments in U27.

I don't recall all y'all having promised any either - I'm still disappointed at the lack of any new Augments, so much wasted opportunity... Make 'em 1) Friggin' cool, and 2) Raid only drops that aren't on the 20th list and suddenly Chest Ransack matters vs Raid Timer consumption rate.

To the best of my (quick-researching) knowledge, Dazing was fixed around U21. If there ARE problems with Dazing item effects in any form at the moment, please submit a bug report with the specific effect and we'll take a look.

Well, this was posted on 6/18/2015...

The Vertigo part has been fixed, but the Dazing part remains. I'll adjust the Known Issues today.

... and is reflected in the current Known Issues list. Do you still want bug reports on it? (For clarity: I don't want Dazing dropped from the goggles, but it would be nice to see Dazing fixed )

[bloodnose13]

im realy giddy about longsword, there is not many good ones in ddo, as oposed to bastard swords, khopeshes and all that kind,recent longswords were treated like utility offhand weapon, im happy to see a one that is treated like weapon, i think though that sword could use something else than improved banishment, something more unique than that for a longsword, like negative levels or limbchop, or a composite new effect that does few diffrent effects depending on if its a hit, crit or 20, but otherwise, waiting for it.

as for ultimatum - tower shield, two things, one- ac bonus could go bit higher to be closer to madstone aegis or as high as it has, and i would like to suggest changeing the immunity to bonus to saves against that spell and a reroll of save on first failed roll, it would keep the effect still dangerous to everyone while makeing it less of a problem, i think everyone still remmebers how poison and diesise immunities ended up, and how they were before.

[Steve_Howe]

Yes and you can get a no fail stun dc by investing no wisdom at all. That is completely stupid. Also it would give you a minimum of 4 to your dc, but okay.

The point was not to say that I have a fairly decent stun dc. The point was that you can wear these goggles and put 0 points into wisdom, start with a 6-8 wisdom, and still be able to stun everything in the game. 8 starting wisdom +0 level ups into wisdom + 0 point invested in wisdom in enhancement trees and you get a 76-78 stunning fist. The only useful tool based on wisdom for a monk and they are making it so easy to get.

A 76-78 Stun DC isn't no fail in EE Stormhorns. I'll bet it isn't no fail in U27 EE material either. Why don't you just wait until stuff comes Live when you can get actual data before calling for premature nerfs?

[DrawingGuy]

I would think the goggles would be a must slot for a wisdom person if they were +12 wis or +4 insightful wis. There is no reason to have them both. If you want to put both bonuses on it reserve it for the mythic version.

I whole heartedly disagree. +11 WIS only comes on Goggles, a caster helm, and orbs (which monks can't use). +3 INS WIS only comes on Goggles, caster helm, and planar trinkets or low level motu outfits. To lose helm for a crappy caster helm closes out tons of melee and survival based options. To be stuck with Spider-Spun Caparison is similarly frustrating. These goggles would be a major answer for Monks, and while Clerics and FvS benefit better from the caster helms, would also love the helm (though likely will still pocket Glimpse of the Soul). I think the WIS and INS WIS needs to stay. Finally unlocking my DC Monk from old and poor item choices coupled with finally a new Ki item has made it where never have I been more excited about an item.

The only balance area that may need work is the Dazing. This turns the item from a Monk and WIS DC caster item to everyone with Stun moves - stunning blow, Bard freeze moves (which don't need help), and shield stuns with the WIS just being a nice Will save boost. If it was shaved down to Dazing VII instead of X, or even just Stunning 12. At that point it would become a build option for stunning rather than a BIS item for stunning. As much as I like even higher SF, this actually would be a boon for Monks as now not every single melee that builds for CC will be vying for the item so they would be much more likely to be passed it in a Raid.

[moo_cow]

A 76-78 Stun DC isn't no fail in EE Stormhorns. I'll bet it isn't no fail in U27 EE material either. Why don't you just wait until stuff comes Live when you can get actual data before calling for premature nerfs?

That's odd because I have run stormhorns a **** ton and the only thing that can possibly save is shadowvars. And that is rare.

[Steve_Howe]

That's odd because I have run stormhorns a **** ton and the only thing that can possibly save is shadowvars. And that is rare.

Riiiiiiiight.

[MrWindupBird]

It is very OP for a monk IMO. All this does for my monk is it allow me to drop wisdom to 8 and use no level ups into wisdom, and still have a 76-78 stun dc in ld. Good for dc wisdom based builds, but I think it gives too much to a monk. I want my monk to have more damage not to have a higher than no fail stun dc.

I think it's sort of funny that the message that unarmed-is-terrible has finally percolated through, and they try to address it by making too-strong goggles which really wont help at all with dps (real issue). Bards and vanguards still will have higher stun DCs and more varied CC options, incidentally.

As far as this particular itemization, I would drop the wis to 11, and preferably avoid +12 stat items at all till lvl 30. +4 insight wis is great. Quality bonuses I am not a fan of: we have too many types already.

More importantly to me, and not mentioned yet, the enhanced ki should be dropped to +1. Currently ki-on-hit is a bit useless, since monks dont have anything useful to spend it on other than stunning fist and possibly QP (doubtful), and its very easy to regenerate enough without even a +1 on-hit item (or with a +1 item if you use QP a lot, for some quixotic reason).
However, I forsee a future where ki will actually be relevant again after monks get their enhancement pass, and at that point the existence of an item with +3 ki-on-hit wil be hugely unbalancing. TL;DR having +3 ki-on-hit doesn't actually give any benefit over +1 ki-on-hit in the current state of the game, but will likely make rebalancing monks down the line more difficult. The only toons who might actually benefit would be shuriken toons/AAs who drop into melee to whack things for 2 secs out of every 2 mins, which is neither here nor there.

Other items look strong, but unimaginative. Having effects unique to raid loot, rather than just stronger/consolidated affixes, would be a wonderful thing. The possibilities are endless, but on-hit-procs to provide a tensors buff (sort of like Fabricators bracers), chance to ignore enemy dodge (rare but it exists), more light-damage-type weaponry, unique clickies with an angelic theme are some example. I realize it's a tough balance to strike: Quelling Strikes from Purging the Pantheon is quite cool, but not quite useful. Deific Diadem buff is an example of a unique and useful affix. I'd toss a lot of possibilities at the PC/Lamma-land, let us help decide which work well.

[Vooduspyce]

Can we please get potency added to one of the caster items like the gloves? not enough epic level potency items out there. Or a potency augment would be sweet!