Warlock Enhancements: Enlightened Spirit

[spade413]

I may be wrong (please correct me if I am), but I believe you can get more PRR and MRR out of this Enhancement Tree than any other Enhancement Tree in the game... Standing still and wearing Medium armor, you get 19 PRR and 29 MRR out of this tree, which goes up to 39 PRR and 49 MRR when you get Spirit Armor fully running. (Note: I noticed that Spiritual Bastion and Spiritual Ward don't say that you also get the Allies portion yourself. Right now, you do. We'll fix the wording.) That's on top of your armor and any other external sources, plus you're buffing your friends' PRR/MRR as well. If we switched it to a static bonus, it'd be a smaller bonus, and a lot less interesting. Nobody likes getting hit, but if you can survive a few seconds of it, you'll be good for the fight.

Thanks for the reply! First, yes, absolutely (regardless of whether its the most) this tree offers wonderful PRR/MRR bonuses, and I didn't mean to imply that it was slouching in that regard, particularly in regards to other "squishy" classes. The basic concept of "Circumstantially get a significant boost to PRR/MRR" is also welcome. My point was directed more at the mechanism of "Get hit in order for hits to hurt less", and how it applies to a class that is, after all the buffs, still... kind of squishy. This is NOT to say that I'm advocating for Paladin-esque levels of damage mitigation from Warlocks!

My goal with the proximity-based buff suggestion was not to suggest those numbers specifically (i see now that I presented an increase to the numbers, I intended for them to be equal bonuses for ease of comparison, and I obviously failed in that regard). I was just trying to present triggers other than getting hit that could, theoretically, be utilized.

By needing to take the hits to get the bonus, there is definitely a sweet spot. If the hits aren't coming through hard (because of PRR, weak enemies, DR, whatever), then growing the PRR doesn't mean as much. If the hits are coming through too hard, then the extra PRR might not compile until its too late. This makes the ability very fluid in its effectiveness. It marginalizes the effectiveness in both challenging content above you (where you're more likely to really get creamed), and in weak content below you (where it isn't as likely to matter). Its easy to anticipate the effectiveness of other lvl 18 abilities like Crit Multiplier, which have a very consistent value in content, and is harder to really calculate Spirit Armor's value without playing it (and even then it may not be casually apparent). From a quick look, to me personally, the narrow window and steep decline of usefulness makes it an underwhelming choice.

Here's where I show my dirty logic: If I cared about defense on the character, rather than taking the 18th lvl slot, I'd consider 3 lvls of Paladin. Sacred Defense adding 25 PRR/MRR all the time is a huge bonus, and coupled with Divine Grace (even the theoretically neutered Divine Grace that has been rumored for so long), it's a solid choice. Of course, that is a big trade off! The capstone is just so well done, and other Warlock abilities grow so cleanly with level! But see, now I'm not comparing 3 lvls of Paladin to the 18th level ability, I'm comparing those 3 lvls with the capstone, with Eldritch Damage, and nearly disregarding the lvl 18 ability entirely.

On the other hand, maybe other things could make it more exciting, outside of just PRR! Maybe a chance to also proc a low level heal on hit. Again, consistent with the theme and scales some into Epics with Healing Amp and Positive Spell Power.

[FuryFlash]

Hello all,

This is for both trees: enlighted and tainted... I am not sure how they are supposed to interact with each other, but here is a few things I noticed:

Enlighted,

turns ability into an aura - That is awesome, and probably the only blast shape I care about.

1 ap - but most likely 6 warlock and 11 ap for the 4 second timer

Tainted tier 2 - makes this aura negative energy -
will this aura heal you if you are in undead form????
if yes, this is better than death aura already
if no, why not? That is exactly how it should work.
Negative should be higher in the tree.

Enlightened - tier 4 - Retribution
3d6 light dmg added to melee scaled by spell power -
For paladin, that is arguably overpowered right now this takes lvl 12,
proposed is a buffed up version only needing lvl 4.

OK... a negative energy Warlock/Wizard? Yes! Here's the first build that pops into my mind:

Warlock 13/Wizard 7

Positives

• Vampire form: +2 enchant, charisma, strength and more...
• Death aura, neg energy burst, lesser death aura
• Warlock aura w/ negative energy for healing and dmg
• Warlock enchantment spells up to one spell level 5
• Good synergy with melee - Vampire and melee bonuses from this tree

Negatives

• Very vulnerable to light damage
• Not too much melee damage, most comes from auras
• Less spells and blast damage
• Possibly lower DCs? (Vampire might make up for it)

An enchantment-based melee necromancer with good self healing. Sounds really fun, but probably a lot weaker than it seems.

Anyway, love this synergy, please don't take this out!

[Ziindarax]

Hey Steelstar, about the retribution potentially being "too powerful", while I am inclined to think that 3d6 at t4 might be a bit powerful, I think what some folks are forgetting about is that there are DC's that calculate into the light damage depending on the pact, and EE mobs have RIDICULOUS saves.

That being said, having the ability to do 3d6 light damage + (let's say) 400 light spellpower per blast/weapon attack may seem powerful until you consider this damage getting halved, or outright negated by evasion. Another defense you could consider is having this effect flag as a sub-level 4 spell. Thus, even if the ability *is* too powerful (and I don't think it will be because if you're stacking paladin levels to get really high KotC base light damage, you're SACRIFICING caster DC's that makes your warlock power more likely to land, and from my understanding, Warlocks appear to almost require hardcore gearing and feat-focusing to get your DC to a reliable level of use).

On the other hand, as this was never answered by a dev - does Retribution apply to Thrown weapons? If it does, THEN I would understand some of the concern (considering if you go Halfling 17 Warlock/3 monk, maintaining Tenser's Transformation). For a Shiradi thrower with max BAB and ranged/throwing alacrity could probably crank out some insane damage (and for the matter, I may experiment with this very thing if Lama opens today).

Next, you mentioned PRR/MRR Bonuses being the highest of any class in the game. Are you saying that even the Sacred/Stalwart Defender's bonuses to PRR/MRR (at the expense of not being able to rage, or benefit from Rage-based effects such as Blood Rage, Madstone Rage, Barb Rage, Primal Scream, etc)?


My petition is thus:

Set up a contest whereby players are encouraged to roll Warlocks, and are encouraged to come up with some of the most synergistic, "game-breaking" builds humanly possible, and make fixes based on what can be easily attainable.. (would a 14 paladin, 6 Warlock rolling Knight of the Chalice, Sacred Defender, and Enlightened Spirit be too powerful? How about a Lord of Blades Warforged rocking Angel of Vengeance, Enlightened spirit, and Warpriest?).

With the advent of Warlocks, the Grey Knights may become a feasible build (Grey Knights are effectively Super Space Marines, warriors who are capable of easily besting two ordinary Space Marines, genetically augmented to be able to take on the Daemons of the Warp, while their mental and spiritual conditioning renders them effectively immune to corruption by the Fell Powers of the Warp). Build Levels - I am thinking Paladin 14 for Holy Sword, Warlock 4, fvs 2, IF I can fit the AP).

Or maybe have a High Summoner - triple past-lives in Druid gives +6 to all ability scores, Augment Summoning giving +4 again, and harper giving yet another +4 for a total of +14 to summoned ability scores - a shame there's nothing really benefiting epic levels. And since we're talking about giving summoned critters ALL the help they could possibly need, it would be nice if there were more feats improving summoned creatures altogether (and even feats that allowed you to summon more than one creature), with a Greater/Epic Summoning allowing pets and hirelings to enjoy full BAB (regardless of your actual class level), and maybe even have higher CR than the player. Furthermore, the aura that benefits you and your allies, should PROBABLY also have a stacking benefit for summoned creatures/hirelings/pets as well.

Enlightened Spirits in the pen-and-paper 3.5e (Complete Mage, page 60) get both of these abilities at level 1 as class features, which is the primary reason for their inclusion.


Pets/hirelings do have some AI issues that we're still working on. As for the Survivability/DPS end of things... that's a good argument for why abilities like this should be included. They won't improve if we don't add things to improve them.



We're still working on the balance, and if it's not good enough at low levels, or too good at high levels, we'll make adjustments; it's hard to say for sure until we get some builds running around with it. That said... it should do a lot more damage at 18 than, and a lot more at 10 than 5. We still want it to be viable for Multiclass Warlocks (who won't get as many Pact dice but will still scale with Spell Power), but it should shine on Pure/mainline Warlocks.



It may be too big. This ability came in to replace something else after Player's Council feedback, relatively close to this post. We'll take a look.


It has a small SP cost, but Warlocks do not get access to the Cure spells in their spell list, and the only other Healing abilities Warlocks get in their trees have extensive cooldowns. This one is fast.


This tree has a small Spell Power line in Power of Enlightenment, where you can get 30 (Light or Positive) plus 12 Universal Spell Power. If that, combined with other sources of Spell Power, still leaves Warlocks underpowered we'll look into adding some other sources in the trees.



Still subject to change, but right now it's about the same size as Death Aura, or any other "Standard" AOE - ~5 meters.



The main reason is actually build diversity. For a lot of melees who splash into Warlock to get the aspects of this tree, the Aura alone is going to be a somewhat substantial bump in DPS. Tying these two abilities to the cooldown of Cleave means characters in this tree fall into one of three categories:

- Cleave/Great Cleave is stronger than Eldritch Burst/Spirit Blast. This will probably be true for low-level splashes and multiclasses with low Spell Power (but a lot of item effects), like Fighters. In that case, keep using Cleaves.

- Eldritch Burst/Spirit Blast is stronger than Cleave/Great Cleave. If you're a pure Warlock, or multiclassed something martial with a lot of spell power (a melee Arti, or an Eldritch Knight), this will probably be true. In this case, you may want to use Eldritch Burst/Spirit Blast instead of Cleave/Great Cleave.

- You're playing a character that couldn't use Cleave/Great Cleave anyway. Like a bow user, or pure caster that dumped STR. Hey, this choice is easy! Take EB/SB if you think you'll have enemies in that range often, or just ignore the line.

Essentially, the point is to encourage different styles for different kinds of characters, so the right choice isn't *always* to take *both* this line and the Cleave line for Melee Warlocks. Cleave builds are really good right now (lookin' at you, Barbarians) - This is an alternative, and it doesn't cost two Feat slots.



I may be wrong (please correct me if I am), but I believe you can get more PRR and MRR out of this Enhancement Tree than any other Enhancement Tree in the game... Standing still and wearing Medium armor, you get 19 PRR and 29 MRR out of this tree, which goes up to 39 PRR and 49 MRR when you get Spirit Armor fully running. (Note: I noticed that Spiritual Bastion and Spiritual Ward don't say that you also get the Allies portion yourself. Right now, you do. We'll fix the wording.) That's on top of your armor and any other external sources, plus you're buffing your friends' PRR/MRR as well. If we switched it to a static bonus, it'd be a smaller bonus, and a lot less interesting. Nobody likes getting hit, but if you can survive a few seconds of it, you'll be good for the fight.

[BananaHat]

How about adding the bonus light damage from the capstone core and retribution to the attacks and spells of summons/hires/etc. As was mentioned, they could use all the help they can get. Alternatively, make a separate passive called Celestial Summoning that adds light damage to their attacks and spells, maybe a small chance for a big burst of light damage like other abilities. Maybe even chuck in a low power healing aura on summons only similar to the radiant aura clerics get. Obviously it would be less powerful since the summon would have no feats and very little spellpower to enhance it. It would be nice for a summon to not be a distraction to mobs for only 3 seconds before they kill it at higher levels.

[Ausdoerrt]

@Steelstar: thank you for clarification re: aura range. In this case and if you indeed intend this tree to have good synergy w/ ranged, I'd suggest adding more options (in this or other trees, maybe), as the aura will be of limited use. At least, my ranged toons try to stay as far as possible while still in the PBS range, making the aura almost useless.

At the moment, ranged toons pretty much just get some ranged power and Retribution bonus damage from this tree. If thus is the go-to tree for ranged, then it's kinda weak for that.

[Vargouille]

@Steelstar: thank you for clarification re: aura range. In this case and if you indeed intend this tree to have good synergy w/ ranged, I'd suggest adding more options (in this or other trees, maybe), as the aura will be of limited use. At least, my ranged toons try to stay as far as possible while still in the PBS range, making the aura almost useless.

At the moment, ranged toons pretty much just get some ranged power and Retribution bonus damage from this tree. If thus is the go-to tree for ranged, then it's kinda weak for that.

We're still looking at details, but it may well be that Soul Eater will support Ranged combat (bows/etc.) best of all trees.

[BananaHat]

@Steelstar: thank you for clarification re: aura range. In this case and if you indeed intend this tree to have good synergy w/ ranged, I'd suggest adding more options (in this or other trees, maybe), as the aura will be of limited use. At least, my ranged toons try to stay as far as possible while still in the PBS range, making the aura almost useless.

At the moment, ranged toons pretty much just get some ranged power and Retribution bonus damage from this tree. If thus is the go-to tree for ranged, then it's kinda weak for that.

Agreed. What if there was a blast shape in the tree that essentially turned the aura into a single target version like the lantern archon? Give it double range, single target, and otherwise be the same as the aura.

[BananaHat]

We're still looking at details, but it may well be that Soul Eater will support Ranged combat (bows/etc.) best of all trees.

Right now the faltering blast essence with the chain shape and some bewitching blasts is probably higher up there for assisting ranged just by making kiting easier. I'm curious what will be in Soul Eater... Immobilizes? Stronger slows? Adding debuffs/DoTs to EBs and physical attacks?

[Vargouille]

Right now the faltering blast essence with the chain shape and some bewitching blasts is probably higher up there for assisting ranged just by making kiting easier. I'm curious what will be in Soul Eater... Immobilizes? Stronger slows? Adding debuffs/DoTs to EBs and physical attacks?

The chain is a Shape, which means you are using it all the time -- and therefore not firing a bow. Faltering Blast also doesn't trigger on bows.

If we're instead talking about which tree best support a ranged Eldritch Blast playstyle, that's probably a combination of Tainted Scholar and Soul Eater.

[Ziindarax]

The chain is a Shape, which means you are using it all the time -- and therefore not firing a bow. Faltering Blast also doesn't trigger on bows.

If we're instead talking about which tree best support a ranged Eldritch Blast playstyle, that's probably a combination of Tainted Scholar and Soul Eater.

And what of Necromancers running around in undead form? Would a vampire form melee benefit from Unholy (Utterdark) essence applied to the aura from Enlightened Spirit?

As a side note, when will Lamannia go live? Will we get enough time for changes to be made?

[edrein]

This isn't actually a bad core in itself. I'd definitely recommend you tie the Maximum HP bonus to the Enhancement bonus of the armor. Based on current epic armor at cap this would give Warlocks an additional 100/200HP respectively, and actually scale this core into Epic Levels.

Could I get a Dev response to that feedback? I definitely think this would be the best route to use the Shaped Vestimates core while making sure it is useful past heroic levels.

[Pnumbra]

I am excited to play this as a pure class. It seems to be aggressively built to handle the current content. Thanks Devs.

[Failedlegend]

The chain is a Shape, which means you are using it all the time -- and therefore not firing a bow. Faltering Blast also doesn't trigger on bows.

If we're instead talking about which tree best support a ranged Eldritch Blast playstyle, that's probably a combination of Tainted Scholar and Soul Eater.

OK I'm confused when using EB are you unable to use your equipped weapon I was under the impression that you would attack as normal and EB would proc every x amount of time (different depending on shape)

So for example an Warlock Arty would be firing off Rune Arm+X-Bow+Chain EB


Side-query: Is there any chance of adding "Universal Spell Power" to UMD (possibly only for Locks) Warlock seems very focused on being versatile especially the tainted scholar but a little bit in ES with Light damage so it's not efficient to have a different item for every element you might have access to and TS is +USP, which I really do think suits Warlock but there's no skill that increases USP only specific type. TO me adding it to UMD a skill that has you dabbling in various magical items would make sense to increase your skill at using all elements.

[Severlin]

OK I'm confused when using EB are you unable to use your equipped weapon I was under the impression that you would attack as normal and EB would proc every x amount of time (different depending on shape)

If you are firing Eldritch Blasts as a ray, or a ranged shape from Tainted Scholar (chain) or Souleater (cone) then your weapon is put away (I guess you could say suppressed) while you have it toggled on and pressing down the mouse button to attack instead fires Eldritch Blast attacks. If you toggle on the aura from Enlightened Spirit however, it begins to pulse its damage and you can no longer fire Eldritch Blast as a ray. If you click the mouse button to attack you instead attack with your equipped weapon while the aura is pulsing and thus you are free to use weapons while the aura is on.

Sev~

[Failedlegend]

If you are firing Eldritch Blasts as a ray, or a ranged shape from Tainted Scholar (chain) or Souleater (cone) then your weapon is put away (I guess you could say suppressed) while you have it toggled on and pressing down the mouse button to attack instead fires Eldritch Blast attacks. If you toggle on the aura from Enlightened Spirit however, it begins to pulse its damage and you can no longer fire Eldritch Blast as a ray. If you click the mouse button to attack you instead attack with your equipped weapon while the aura is pulsing and thus you are free to use weapons while the aura is on.

Sev~

Ok so ONLY the aura EB allows you to utilize you weapon...well there goes my Xorian Scholar Warlock/Arty Plans...although at least my Warlock/Barb can out a few points in ES to pick up the aura so he can swing his two-hander.

Actually will EB suppress shields, orbs, rune arms etc.? Also as far as enhancements and feats are concerned are you considered "wielding" your suppressed items (ie. Shield for Fighter/Pally Defensive Stances)

Anyways all that known is there any chance we can work in Eldritch Claws and Glaive...like flameblade except clear purpley and are usable with all EB shapes or as their own shape (I was fine w/o them before since I was under the impression you were imbueing your weapon with your EB thus any weapon would be an Eldritch weapon.)

[Severlin]

Ok so ONLY the aura EB allows you to utilize you weapon...well there goes my Xorian Scholar Warlock/Arty Plans...although at least my Warlock/Barb can out a few points in ES to pick up the aura so he can swing his two-hander.

Yes, although Souleater was also designed to also be useful to melee and ranged characters.

Actually will EB suppress shields, orbs, rune arms etc.? Also as far as enhancements and feats are concerned are you considered "wielding" your suppressed items (ie. Shield for Fighter/Pally Defensive Stances)

The shield will be hidden visually but you will still benefit from it. There's some arcane spell failure chance you have to account for though.

Anyways all that known is there any chance we can work in Eldritch Claws and Glaive...like flameblade except clear purpley and are usable with all EB shapes or as their own shape (I was fine w/o them before since I was under the impression you were imbueing your weapon with your EB thus any weapon would be an Eldritch weapon.)

Eldritch Blast isn't like the Green Lantern power ring. Skilled Warlocks can overload the eldritch power into bigger blasts, but not form it into shapes.

What you are describing sounds more like a Hexblade thing.

Sev~

[InsanityIsYourFriend]

What you are describing sounds more like a Hexblade thing.

Sev~

I know I know, I'm not supposed to respond to this thread yet... but.... Can we have Hexblade next please? It sounds fun now!

[Artagon]

Yes, although Souleater was also designed to also be useful to melee and ranged characters.



The shield will be hidden visually but you will still benefit from it. There's some arcane spell failure chance you have to account for though.



Eldritch Blast isn't like the Green Lantern power ring. Skilled Warlocks can overload the eldritch power into bigger blasts, but not form it into shapes.

What you are describing sounds more like a Hexblade thing.

Sev~

They are actually both options from official WotC publications for the Warlock. Eldritch Glaive is a blast shape from 'Dragon Magic' that allowed melee touch attacks that does Eldritch Blast damage. It is great because as an SLA you could quicken it for double attacks a few times per day, plus it has reach like a polearm, allowing attacks of opportunity with it.

Eldritch Glaive

Least; 2nd; Blast Shape
Your eldritch blast takes on physical substance, appearing similar to a glaive. As a full-round action, you can make a single melee touch attack as if wielding a reach weapon. If you hit, your target is affected as if struck by your eldritch blast (including any eldritch essence applied to the blast). Unlike hideous blow, you cannot combine your eldritch glaive with damage from a held weapon.
Furthermore, until the start of your next turn, you also threaten nearby squares as if wielding a reach weapon, and you can make attacks of opportunity with your eldritch glaive. These are melee touch attacks.
If your base attack bonus is +6 or higher, you can (as part of the full-round action) make as many attacks with your eldritch glaive as your base attack bonus allows. For example, a 12th-level warlock could attack twice, once with a base attack bonus of +6, and again with a base attack bonus of +1.

Eldritch claws work well with unarmed combat and allow standard unarmed damage on top of the eldritch blast damage.

Eldritch Claws

You can deliver your eldritch blast as a melee attack.

Prerequisite: Eldritch blast 2d6
Benefit: As a free action, you can form the energy of your eldritch blast into a set of claws extending almost an entire foot from your hands. While your eldritch claws exist, you may make up to two claw attacks as natural weapons. You are automatically proficient with your eldritch claws.

On a successful attack with an eldritch claw, you deal your normal amount of unarmed strike damage plus you eldritch blast damage.

Once you form your eldritch claws, they remain until just before the beginning of your next turn. You cannot use your normal eldritch blast ability while your eldritch claws exist.

A monk may not use eldritch claws as part of her flurry of blows.

[bbqzor]

What you are describing sounds more like a Hexblade thing.

you are describing a Hexblade

Hexblade

When can we expect this to hit DDO? Because seriously, yes please. Nao!

[Failedlegend]

What you are describing sounds more like a Hexblade thing.
Sev~

Anyway we can work that Into Warlock or in one of the trees tier 5 maybe...I mean eldritch claw and glaive are a base warlock thing but Hexblade is a subclass of Warlock anyways. I really like the idea of funneling you EB through your weapone (I' m really saddened that my Warlock/Arty just won't function since my xbow and rune arm wont fire when using lock abilities)

I'd also like to see a skill that ups Universal spell power since Warlocks use several different elements (and tainted scholar only boosts USP) and spellcraft doesnt add to usp only elements...imo UMD makes the most sense since its used for dealing with all kinds of magical things.