Warlocks!

[Vargouille]

Enhancements are up for two of the three trees! Still following along and considering changes, we've been trying to get these ready for you guys:

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...olar?p=5614558
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...irit?p=5614575

Soul Eater will be posted at a later date.

[ThrakThor]

To give feedback as requested and to keep it as short and sweet as possible:

Class Features:

• Hit die, light armor, base saves, BAB fine.
• Alignment: I am fine with the proposed options of limited by choice of pacts if feasible in programming.
• Spells:
  [**]I am in the camp that has a no SP option. Fast regen, large echoes all lends itself to abuse for multi-class.
  [**]Create an invocation spell list that grants lesser and greater invocations at levels in a way similar to the Rogue Special Ability Option.
  [***]For example at Level 1 you get a choice of 6 lesser invocation, at 4 you get to choose a second one, at 6 you get a choice from 10 greater, etc.
  [***]Some of the lesser and greater invocation can have level restrictions so that you can respec them at later levels.
  [**]Other people have already pointed out great invocation-like spells already in the game so please use their lists but blur, displace, improved invis, true seeing, etc. would all work.

Eldritch Blast:

• Force or Untyped – I am OK with either.
• I’d prefer shapes be linked to leveling option similar to Rogue Special Ability Option. NEEDS to have a weapon option (Glaive or Claws, or both).

Pacts:

• One poster suggested each pact had two damage options for each (from the enhancement line), something like Fey sonic/good, Fiend Fire/Cold and GOO was Acid/Light. Versatility options.
• Other posters had some good ideas about this and better recommended spells. I don’t have a major preference other than they simply need to be 0 cost spells or if that is not a possibility make it work like the spell ruin where it is added to a feat list and not a spell book and have it be 0 SP.
• If you absolutely MUST have a blue bar for the DDO mechanics to work for these invocations just grant them Magical Training at l.1

Enhancement Trees:

• Unless the pet/summon/charm makes them strong enough to last an encounter in EH then do not even bother.

Other

• I think the UMD stuff makes sense.
• The idea of an ability to have better saves fits with warlocks, an invocation probably.
• Take more spells from monsters and make them invocations. No need for creating spells and animations, simply using what you have and making unique caster class abilities.

[LordRodberg]

I noticed that at 20th level the Warlock will have a full compliment of spells in his/her spell book to choose from but can only have 2 learned to cast at any one time for each level on your hotbar. Why is it limited to 2?
I do like the Great Old One Granted Spells for each level. It does look good but kinda wondering why gimping it so much with spells to have learned to cast.

Can't wait.

[Tentaki]

Please, please tell me that warlock blasts will work in wolf form.

And that they're called Eldritch Barks.

[Seikojin]

I noticed that at 20th level the Warlock will have a full compliment of spells in his/her spell book to choose from but can only have 2 learned to cast at any one time for each level on your hotbar. Why is it limited to 2?
I do like the Great Old One Granted Spells for each level. It does look good but kinda wondering why gimping it so much with spells to have learned to cast.

Can't wait.

Because Warlocks in PnP are SLA users and in ddo it would be out of scope to make their spell choices into sla's.

[DrWily]

I'd like the Great Old One pact to have options for Light damage, like the 4E Warlock.

Geoff.

I concur. Or they should have at least Cold damage instead of Acid, since space is very cold.

[tanuki013]

I want status window can see current Eldritch Blast damage dice and the added damage dice (any enhancement) .
As it can confirm the damage of normal attacks that are displayed under the Inventory Window.

[decease]

ddo is a dnd game, and only because its a dnd game that we are still caring about this game.

Am sure you release warlock because they are a popular demand, but do you also realizing that what you have here is not warlock.. it is a bard with a rune arm.

Like I said before you can spend the time and effort to make things right, and most of us will come back. Or you can do it the easy way with less time and effort which accomplish less as well. Toee is not well done, a classic dungeon turn into a maze filled with cookie to cut... warlock could just be the straw it take to break the camel's back. Ddo have disappointed fans so much in these late years(beside haunted hall which is well done)

As of invocations there are many others options, for example you could make them into feat, that player pick up upon warlock level. After all there are only twelve known invocation. Or you could give warlock class a passive that make specific spell free cast, just like how you handle fvs capstone free spell. personally I suggest you to make new spell, a warlock class with wizard spell will not please anyone but fan boy. And no end fan will jump in to play a 'warlock' that is really a rune armed bard in disguise..

P.s. if you believe that warlock will take much resource you could increase their price. 2k tp or even 3k tp would be alright if do it really well... it is not about money, we are willing to pay if you could make decent content

[Xoham]

Enhancements are up for two of the three trees! Still following along and considering changes, we've been trying to get these ready for you guys:

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...olar?p=5614558
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...irit?p=5614575

Soul Eater will be posted at a later date.

Since you are still following and considering changes, I thought I would try once more to convince you that Warlocks should not use spell points, and should not get access to high level wizard and sorcerer spells. Consider the following three important measures of difference between the classes warlock, wizard, and sorcerer. For simplicity I have explicitly compared warlock and sorcerer.

	D&D	Initial DDO proposal
Number of spells/invocations per rest	Warlock >>> Sorcerer Warlock can cast infinitely many more spells/invocations per rest than sorcerer Unlimited invocations for warlocks (At all levels 1-20: infinity) vs 54 spells for sorcerers (At level 20: 6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/6 spells)	Warlock << Sorcerer Warlock can cast far fewer spells/invocations per rest than sorcerer 525 SP for warlocks (At level 20) vs 1730 spell points for sorcerers (At level 20)
Power of each spell/invocation	Warlock << Sorcerer Warlock has much less powerful spells/invocations than sorcerer Wall of Perilous Flame at level 11 for warlocks vs Wall of Fire at level 8 for sorcerers Word of Changing at level 16 for warlocks vs Baleful Polymorph at level 10 for sorcerers Nothing more powerful for warlocks vs Finger of Death at level 14 for sorcerers Nothing more powerful for warlocks vs Wail of the Banshee and Mass Hold Monster at level 18 for sorcerers	Warlock > Sorcerer Warlock has slightly more powerful spells/invocations than sorcerer Finger of Death at level 13 for warlocks vs Finger of Death at level 14 for sorcerers Wail of the Banshee and Mass Hold Monster at level 16 for warlocks vs Wail of the Banshee and Mass Hold Monster at level 18 for sorcerers
Number of known spells/invocations	Warlock << Sorcerer Warlock knows far fewer spells/invocations than sorcerers 12 invocations for warlocks (At level 20: 3/3/3/3 invocations including eldritch blast shapes and eldritch essences) vs 34 spells for sorcerers (At level 20: 5/5/4/4/4/3/3/3/3 spells at level 20)	Warlock ~ Sorcerer Warlock knows approximately the same number of spells/invocations as sorcerer 35 spells/invocations/SLAs for warlocks (At level 20: 2/2/2/2/2/2 spells + 6 pact spells + 6 tainted scholar spells + 3 eldritch essences + 4 eldritch blast shapes + ~4 SLAs) vs 36 spells/SLAs for sorcerers (At level 20: 4/4/4/4/4/3/3/3/3 spells + ~4 SLAs)

Note that the difference between D&D and the proposed warlock is not just a matter of magnitude in the three measures of difference, but even the directions of the inequalities have switched.

Without a doubt the most important modification I would like to see made is to the first row, the number of spells/invocations per rest. The defining feature of the warlock is unlimited casting. However, I believe at least the second row, the power of spells/invocations, is also important. In D&D, a warlock's unlimited casting of invocations is balanced by the fact the invocations are much less powerful than the spells of a wizard or sorcerer. The proposed DDO warlock is balanced in the other direction, and would result in a play style far closer to the existing sorcerer. Importantly, the unlimited casting of invocations is lost resulting in the greatest loss of uniqueness.

I won't further lengthen this post by commenting on the two proposed enhancement trees aside from one point: the introduction of the Depravity mechanic. I think this is an excellent direction to take and hope that it can be expanded to completely replace spell points for warlocks and enable unlimited casting of invocations. Whilst my preference would be for balancing unlimited warlock invocations by cool-downs only, I think that introducing a regenerating resource is a fine alternative. I also concede, not being a game designer, that it may have other benefits. Importantly, I think it is a better option than giving spell point regeneration, or spell point cost reductions, since these would likely make balancing multi-classing and epic destiny use far more difficult.

A final comment is that for something like Brutal Spellcasting to be an effective option in comparison to Brute Fighting in a prolonged boss fight, unlimited invocations would be quite necessary.

Last, thank you for keeping up the reading and responding!

[Vargouille]

Thanks for the continued feedback. The team is still discussing some possibilities where changes could happen.

I want status window can see current Eldritch Blast damage dice and the added damage dice (any enhancement) .
As it can confirm the damage of normal attacks that are displayed under the Inventory Window.

There probably won't be a single total in one place, but as you gain Feats (see the Feat Table) those will show up in your character sheet, and the tool top will say how many times you got them. This is for both base damage and Pact damage. You'll have to remember to add in any other bonuses from Enhancements, though, or other sources (for instance, if we add Epic Feats that add Eldritch Blast dice.)

[dunklezhan]

There probably won't be a single total in one place, but as you gain Feats (see the Feat Table) those will show up in your character sheet, and the tool top will say how many times you got them. This is for both base damage and Pact damage. You'll have to remember to add in any other bonuses from Enhancements, though, or other sources (for instance, if we add Epic Feats that add Eldritch Blast dice.)

Huh. I kind of assumed if it was replacing the auto-attack-standard-attack-basic-attack-left-or-right-click-attack (I think that's what we're calling it now ) that it would replace the 'currently equipped' weapon attack info in the inventory. I'd also like somewhere I can at least tooltip and see a possible damage range for my current set up, so i can compare shapes, different gear and so on without having to go get myself killed in a quest and try to work it out based on experience, which will change anyway as gear and levels change.

I'd like that sort of information for spells and weapons too of course which factor in spellpower, melee and ranged power. I appreciate they might have to all come as a single 'fix' if it's even possible. In any case though, if blast is my main attack, it feels like I should be able to get more precise information on it somewhere. Where will this tooltip be that you mention in your post above?

It sounds like it will more or less cover the same sort of feedback we get from our weapon attacks, but could you maybe be a bit more precise and describe exactly what we will see when we tooltip over a toggled-on blast shape on the hotbar? How will this be laid out? Can we get a cropped screenshot even?

Sorry if it sounds like I'm making a big deal about this - UI is one of the pet peeves of new players in my experience (whether it be lack of scaling/skins, incorrect or unclear tooltips, tooltip mouseover bug, or whatever), and since I have a couple of newly returned players on the go at the moment, and since they have tried and left DDO before, and since I think at least one of them is quite excited about Warlock... I'm keen not to have them frustrated by something which from their perspective would be basic feedback they might expect (fortunately they're both programmers. They'll at least understand, even if they don't like, some of the design choices for Warlock, providing it is indeed awesome to play)!

[IronClan]

So it kinda looks like Warlocks are going to be the unrivaled kings of nuking, putting Sorc's, Druids and Wizards in a position of being completely outmoded.

Looking over the two trees posted and the Class based eldritch blast progression this stands out to me:

Enlightened Spirit tree:
Tier Three
Eldritch Burst: Fire your Eldritch Blast in an AOE centered on you. All enemies caught in the burst take 2d6 Light Damage that scales with Spell Power, plus any other effects and damage your Eldritch Blasts produce. This ability shares a cooldown with Cleave.

Tier Four
Retribution: Your Eldritch Blasts, Melee Attacks, and Ranged Attacks gain 1d6/2d6/3d6 Light damage that scales with Spell Power.

Tier Five
Spirit Blast: Fire your Eldritch Blast in an AOE centered on you. All enemies caught in the burst take 10d6 Light Damage that scales with spell power, plus any other effects and damage your Eldritch Blasts produce. This ability shares a cooldown with Great Cleave.

Tainted Scholar tree:
Cores
+60% more spell critical multiplier

Tier One through Five
Strong Pact: Bonus Eldritch Blast damage from your Pact is increased by 1d4. This scales with spellpower, like all Eldritch Blast damage. = 4d4

Tier Two
Eldritch Chain: Eldritch Blast Shape Stance: When toggled on, your basic attack an Eldritch Blast that chains to two other enemies. This scales with 66% spellpower.

Tier Four
Penetrating Blast: Eldritch Essence Stance: Your Eldritch Blast base damage is now untyped instead of Force. You deal +1d6 Eldritch Blast damage.

Tier Five
Eldritch Power: Your Eldritch Blast deals +1d6 damage.
Eldritch Ball: Shoot a projectile at a distant enemy, exploding in an area, dealing Eldritch Blast damage.


So we have:
A 2.6X crit multiplier
eBlast that is endless and resource-less and one assumes very high rate of fire that have the following Damage dice at level 20:
9d6 force damage
10d4 pact damage
4d4 from TS
1d6 from TS without taking Tier 5
3d6 from ES

And we have 3 AOE's to chose from 2 of them that are takeable at the same time and one ability that gets you two more targets at 66% spell power on every shot. and we have not seen the 3rd tree yet.

So there's two AOE's in ES that takes all of the above (13d6 and 14d4) and I assume any riders like Bewitching blast and Enervating shadow. allows a 2.6X crit multiplier and about ~400-500 Spell power and if that's not enough one of them adds 2d6 light and the other adds 10d6 light.

The max damage of the self centered T5 AOE "mini Draconic energy burst" is 194, compare to a chain lightning or DBF which have a max base of 120 damage use SP and can not crit for more than X2

The max damage of the ranged AOE (Tainted Scholar T5) is 134, again compare to DBF and Chain Lightning.

Sorc's Druids and Wizards say hello to your new nuking overlords. Time to start lobbying for SP based nuking spells to automatically get X3 crit multiplier and put another in Archmage T5 full time and one in each Sorc T5... Even that might not cut it, as the Boss DPS of Warlocks is going to far exceed that of any other casting classes, simply due to the spamability and lack of resource use.

There basic attack which we have to assume is fairly rapid or it would not be very "pew pew pew" is as strong as most of the best heroic ray spells, it is not resisted by almost anything in the game and it will be able to crit for 0.6 more and it costs nothing. We haven't even seen the third tree. Hard to imagine it's not going to up the imbalance even more.

IMO casting especially heroic spell scaling needs some attention this seems like a great "fulcrum" to leverage this fact onto the front burner. After this goes live there wont be a Divine or Arcane SP based caster that isn't rabbling for it. I'll be right there with the angry mob.

[NarutoArgo]

Is EB subject to anti magic aura and globe of invulnerability? Or will it be more like a melee or ranged attack that isn't considered a spell in those instances?

[Wongar]

Will blast attacks be considered spells and subject to the extended cooldown penalties from things like Tenser's Transformation and Combat Expertise?

[Vargouille]

One possibility for Warlock Past Lives:

• Passive: You were a Warlock in a past life. You occasionally find yourself throwing your hands into the air. Each time you acquire this feat you gain +3 Magical Resistance. This feat can be stacked up to three times.
• Active/Slottable: You recall more about your past life as a Warlock. You gain +3 to the Spellcraft skill. You can attack enemies with an Eldritch Ball six times per rest, dealing 1d6 Force damage per two character levels.

Is EB subject to anti magic aura and globe of invulnerability? Or will it be more like a melee or ranged attack that isn't considered a spell in those instances?

Basic attack Eldritch Blast is likely going to be considered a level 9 spell. More or less because of this, also for DC purposes.

Will blast attacks be considered spells and subject to the extended cooldown penalties from things like Tenser's Transformation and Combat Expertise?

We have to explore this, but it is likely that spell cooldown changes will affect Eldritch Blasts.

[Grailhawk]

One possibility for Warlock Past Lives:

[LIST][*]Passive: You were a Warlock in a past life. You occasionally find yourself throwing your hands into the air. Each time you acquire this feat you gain +3 Magical Resistance.

Do you mean Spell Resistance, or MRR?

[Qhualor]

One possibility for Warlock Past Lives:

• Passive: You were a Warlock in a past life. You occasionally find yourself throwing your hands into the air. Each time you acquire this feat you gain +3 Magical Resistance. This feat can be stacked up to three times.
• Active/Slottable: You recall more about your past life as a Warlock. You gain +3 to the Spellcraft skill. You can attack enemies with an Eldritch Ball six times per rest, dealing 1d6 Force damage per two character levels.

Dude, this will make me play Warlock just for the past life. As of right now and it could change when I see them on Live, I have no real interest in playing one. Honestly though, does this make sense for a Warlock? Probably not many will argue against it though.

[Wongar]

We have to explore this, but it is likely that spell cooldown changes will affect Eldritch Blasts.

Thank you for the reply.
I hope that this is not the case because it will make anything with a spell cooldown more or less unusable. Why give Warlocks Tenser's Transformation if it is going to cut their DPS in half?

[Artagon]

Dude, this will make me play Warlock just for the past life. As of right now and it could change when I see them on Live, I have no real interest in playing one. Honestly though, does this make sense for a Warlock? Probably not many will argue against it though.

They gain MRR several times through level progression (for a total of +25 MRR, +30 MRR if GOO pact), so it makes sense to me.

[FestusHood]

One possibility for Warlock Past Lives:

• Passive: You were a Warlock in a past life. You occasionally find yourself throwing your hands into the air. Each time you acquire this feat you gain +3 Magical Resistance. This feat can be stacked up to three times.
• Active/Slottable: You recall more about your past life as a Warlock. You gain +3 to the Spellcraft skill. You can attack enemies with an Eldritch Ball six times per rest, dealing 1d6 Force damage per two character levels.

I can't really see anyone taking that active past life. The wizard and sorc actives which have limited charge attacks like that can fire 10 times, but i don't think anyone takes them for those abilities. I wouldn't find three spellcraft compelling for a feat.