Turbine please give Monks Wisdom to hit/damage

[Zendrakkos]

Thank you

[moo_cow]

Thank you

As the worlds biggest monk fan, no. We don't need anymore of this other stat to damage ****. It's lame.

[Uska]

Umm no

[AylinIsAwesome]

Maybe as part of Henshin capstone, but meh...

[Bloodskittle]

If you think about it from the definitions of the words it makes very little sense to do damage with wisdom, to-hit I could tolerate but what would be the point?

[silinteresting]

As the worlds biggest monk fan, no. We don't need anymore of this other stat to damage ****. It's lame.

so let me see we have every other stat to damage but for some unknown reason wisdom
is going to far yet its the only one left, unreal.

lets be honest here shall we, monks are not op these days so wisdom to damage would be
a good way to bring them in line with other classes.

for some reason which im still baffled by wisdom cant even have its own item with a +4 insightful
like every other stat so im guessing wisdom to damage wont ever happen.

your friend sil

[Toro12]

Only for henshin Mystics with quarterstaves

[Dalsheel]

As the worlds biggest monk fan...

Over my dead body... :P

[Missing_Minds]

so let me see we have every other stat to damage but for some unknown reason wisdom
is going to far yet its the only one left, unreal.

That is the only reason why I wouldn't have any issue with it (any more.)

I'm mostly in the camp of "No." But given how they've let every other stat be used... *throws hands in the air giving up* f-it. let them have it as well. *sigh* Fair is fair.

[Saekee]

That is the only reason why I wouldn't have any issue with it (any more.)

I'm mostly in the camp of "No." But given how they've let every other stat be used... *throws hands in the air giving up* f-it. let them have it as well. *sigh* Fair is fair.

Right! I understood the logic of int and dex for damage but. . .Charisma? Constitution?
Your persuasive argumentation can kill. So Plato was correct in booting the poets from The Republic. And good health can be bad for others. Let's add enlightenment to the list of damaging interpersonal effects.

[Saekee]

BTW if wisdom were added as a stat for damage, it wouldn't work anyway for handwraps.

[Braegan]

I'm also in the camp of since every other stat can be used we might as well let wis be used for monks, battle clerics, etc.

[Theolin]

Well considering every other stat can be used for hit & dam for at least one weapon, why not wisdom as well.....

There is after all a glaring hole (actually 2) in my little chart

[ThreadNecromancer]

wiki already has such a list! not sure which one is more complete though
http://ddowiki.com/page/List_of_weap...or_damage_mods

Beat me to it. Anyway...

http://ddowiki.com/page/Staff_of_Inner_Sight INT/WIS/CHA (also has 2d4 base dice)
http://ddowiki.com/page/Stave_of_the_Seer INT/WIS (also has 2d6 base dice)

[Zachski]

The idea of using Charisma for damage is that you rely on a series of confident flourishes and fancy moves that lead to your opponent working against their own defenses... such as dodging *into* your blade. Don't ask me how PDKs do it, though.

The idea of using Intelligence for damage (and hitting) is that you are thinking one step ahead of the enemy, knowing where they *will* be just based on where they currently are. Furthermore, you *know* the weak points in the armor, the joints in a shell, and the areas where you can strike for maximum damage.

The idea of using Dex for damage is leverage. You're so in control of your body and your hands that you can effectively angle the weapon correctly that it slides in easier than if you just put all of your force behind it.

The idea of using Con for damage is... literally using the weight of your body against your enemy? I don't like this one. It relies on the old myth that being fat is healthy (as opposed to the modern myth that being thin is healthy) and if it's mostly muscle (as in the Kingpin) that would be strength instead. At least it's race-specific and mostly useless outside of specific builds.

The idea of using Wis for damage and to-hit holds some amount of merit. For monks (which is currently the most relevant), the idea is that you're so in tune with the universe that you aren't fighting the enemy, you're fighting yourself... who is represented by the enemy. You let the universe guide your attacks, and they hit with resounding power, as you adeptly manipulate the ki of your body to strike with far more force than you are normally capable of. (It's why Goku can punch a hole in a mountain despite not having the muscle mass to do so, and it's the basis of a lot of martial arts movies - that the enlightened who rely on wisdom instead of brute force will always defeat the arrogant and haughty)

For clerics or favored souls, you have such faith in your religion that you don't even worry if your attacks will just hit - you have faith that you will. And since in this universe, faith has power, you will hit. And you will hit hard.

[LuKaSu]

Only for henshin Mystics with quarterstaves

I really like this idea. It would be a nice distinguishing mark between that an an acrobat build.

[silinteresting]

The idea of using Wis for damage and to-hit holds some amount of merit. For monks (which is currently the most relevant), the idea is that you're so in tune with the universe that you aren't fighting the enemy, you're fighting yourself... who is represented by the enemy. You let the universe guide your attacks, and they hit with resounding power, as you adeptly manipulate the ki of your body to strike with far more force than you are normally capable of. (It's why Goku can punch a hole in a mountain despite not having the muscle mass to do so, and it's the basis of a lot of martial arts movies - that the enlightened who rely on wisdom instead of brute force will always defeat the arrogant and haughty)

this is it, this is the best reason ive ever heard superb...

your friend sil

[relenttless]

Ok, so what might be the wider implications? Wis to damage in a monk tree.....will end up with clerics and FVS splashing...allow only when centered? ...needs to be at a low level..or do you go the divine grace route and give wisdom as a strength bonus?

[Zachski]

Ok, so what might be the wider implications? Wis to damage in a monk tree.....will end up with clerics and FVS splashing...allow only when centered? ...needs to be at a low level..or do you go the divine grace route and give wisdom as a strength bonus?

You'd only be able to use wis to damage while centered, yes. (And perhaps for the Cleric/FVS version, you'd only use wis to damage with faith weapons - though not necessarily limited to the weapons of *your* faith, maybe?)

For unarmed, assuming they don't just go "Okay handwraps are weapons now" (which they've hinted at?), it's a bit more complicated because of the nature of unarmed damage. On the other hand, Paladin taught me that you can *add* effects such as the Courage of Heaven and Light damage per swing to unarmed attacks (Oozes are a lot easier on Paladins than Non-Monk classes due to their fists having added effects). So something similar should work for Shintao, though I'm not sure what damage type I would even suggest, or how to nullify strength boost in the meantime.

[Dalsheel]

The idea of using Wis for damage and to-hit holds some amount of merit. For monks (which is currently the most relevant), the idea is that you're so in tune with the universe that you aren't fighting the enemy, you're fighting yourself... who is represented by the enemy. You let the universe guide your attacks, and they hit with resounding power, as you adeptly manipulate the ki of your body to strike with far more force than you are normally capable of. (It's why Goku can punch a hole in a mountain despite not having the muscle mass to do so, and it's the basis of a lot of martial arts movies - that the enlightened who rely on wisdom instead of brute force will always defeat the arrogant and haughty)

I'll admit this is a very compelling arguement, I really like it. Especially the example of Goku

But, the truth is giving INT/CHA/CON/WIS to attack/damage is a symptom endless powercreeping for the sake of powercreeping and homogenization of the classes.

With the exception of rogues having DEX to attack and damage, there shouldn't be any more alternate stat to attack/damage imo. Alternate stats give other bonuses to your character besides damage. Especially for monks, WIS offers tactics DC, Will save and AC. Do we really need it to give damage as well? We all know where that would lead.

edit: spelling