Were fort saves changed?

[Monkey-Boy]

CR54 mobs in Temple of EE are saving about 90% of the time against a DC77 necro. What changed?

[Wizza]

CR54 mobs in Temple of EE are saving about 90% of the time against a DC77 necro. What changed?

Saves are stupidly high on EE. They were saving Reflex and Will save based spells as well, 70+. Typed it down in my review of the quest in the official thread.

They need to dial them back.

[blerkington]

Hi,

I thought I read somewhere that dialling up mob HP, saves and damage in EH and EE Temple is somehow going to fix the difficulty problems that plague most of the rest of the game.

Or perhaps it was all a dream.

Thanks.

[Qhualor]

Sev said TOEE on hard and elite is supposed to be dialed up in challenge, but never read anything on the details of how they were going to do that. I don't know if I necessarily agree with those mobs having such high saves, unless its a threshold that can be realistically achieved without major drawbacks to builds. im intentionally not checking out TOEE because I want to be surprised when I do run it, but I just hope I wont be disappointed. hopefully the devs know the difference between challenge and difficulty.

[Monkey-Boy]

Has anyone brought a stunner in there yet? Curious as to if it was all fort saves or just necro affected.

[Monkey-Boy]

Hi,

I thought I read somewhere that dialling up mob HP, saves and damage in EH and EE Temple is somehow going to fix the difficulty problems that plague most of the rest of the game.

Or perhaps it was all a dream.

Thanks.

The mobs were a joke to chew through on melees.

[Wizza]

The mobs were a joke to chew through on melees.

Of course.

I already called this "The Barbarian Update". Endless running, mobs' saves over 9000, few shrines, mobs' HP over 300k.

[brzytki]

Has anyone brought a stunner in there yet? Curious as to if it was all fort saves or just necro affected.

It definitely is not only necro. I was playing on EE with my assassin with 74 DC and the vast majority of mobs saved against it. On some mobs without any deathward/deathblock i didn't even get sneak attack on my attempt, only a regular hit, which is kinda ridiulous since i had 130+ ms/hide. After 10 minutes i gave up on trying to inst-kill any mob and was just meleeing them down.

[Lonnbeimnech]

They give huge buffs to selected builds, then set mobs to that new benchmark. Thinking of 90+ stunning shield of vanguards, and 100+ coup de grace of bards. Good luck to everyone else.

[blerkington]

The mobs were a joke to chew through on melees.

Hi,

Thanks, good to know.

I wonder if anything is going to be done to address these differences before the release.

The higher difficulties were meant to be very challenging, so maybe HP and damage are yet to be dialled up.

Take care.

[slarden]

Someone with a swashbuckler should be able to figure out the exact save requirements on EH and EE.

Making characters with DC-based abilities useless is not a challenge.

[Full_Bleed]

It definitely is not only necro. I was playing on EE with my assassin with 74 DC and the vast majority of mobs saved against it. On some mobs without any deathward/deathblock i didn't even get sneak attack on my attempt, only a regular hit, which is kinda ridiulous since i had 130+ ms/hide. After 10 minutes i gave up on trying to inst-kill any mob and was just meleeing them down.

You, obviously, just don't know how to play an "advanced class" or build a DC character.

74 assassinate DC is so yesterday. We have a new "easily attainable" benchmark.

Heck, you were given +2 in your Cap and a +6 Assassinate item.

You need to step up to the big leagues and stop trying to get the devs to bard, pally, or barbarian the assassin.

They give huge buffs to selected builds, then set mobs to that new benchmark. Thinking of 90+ stunning shield of vanguards, and 100+ coup de grace of bards. Good luck to everyone else.

Everyone knows that they won't let DC's be set by the "over performing" classes.

Lets not start a panic.

[Wizza]

You, obviously, just don't know how to play an "advanced class" or build a DC character.

74 assassinate DC is so yesterday. We have a new "easily attainable" benchmark.

Heck, you were given +2 in your Cap and a +6 Assassinate item.

You need to step up to the big leagues and stop trying to get the devs to bard, pally, or barbarian the assassin.

So, how do I get more Evocation DC on my Sorcerer with this update? They gave me a +10 Evocation DC item and I missed it?

[brzytki]

You, obviously, just don't know how to play an "advanced class" or build a DC character.

74 assassinate DC is so yesterday. We have a new "easily attainable" benchmark.

Heck, you were given +2 in your Cap and a +6 Assassinate item.

You need to step up to the big leagues and stop trying to get the devs to bard, pally, or barbarian the assassin.

Lol, tell me more about me not knowing how to play an assassin or "stepping up to the big leagues", haha.

On a human with all the best gear (completionist, +3 insight, +2 profane, +6 EDs, +6 tome etc.) i had 74 DC. I could get +3 more INT if i were a drow/morninglord (+2 base +1 enh), +2 from Yugo pot (costing a twist for Brace), +1 insight (costing at least 10 dodge, 2d6 SA, 30% fort and some more), +3 if i twisted 3 more INT (yeah, who sane wastes 3 twists slots for 1,5 DC?). And +2 DC if the Devs would actually put the new items in this Lama version, and btw have you seen the enchantments on this dagger? The only thing that's somehow appealing is that +2 DC it has over mythic veneer.

So do tell me, what is this new "easily attainable" benchmark you were talking about when even if i had cut corners on survivability and DPS on my build, i'd still have 80% chance to fail assassinate?

Everyone knows that they won't let DC's be set by the "over performing" classes.

Do we, now? Have you played on EE on Lama with any DC build?

[Thalone]

From the Update 25, Patch 1 Notes:

The DC formulae have been updated. Success on a d20 roll is now based on (Player’s DC + 10.5) / (Target’s Save * 2) + 25%, rounded to nearest 5%.

[Monkey-Boy]

From the Update 25, Patch 1 Notes:

Link please, otherwise +1 for an excellent troll attempt.

[Monkey-Boy]

Everyone knows that they won't let DC's be set by the "over performing" classes.

Lets not start a panic.

Didn't the "all is fine" crowd say the same thing with Gianthold?

[Monkey-Boy]

Well, the good news is they didn't break the whole game just this quest. CR58 orcs in EE GH stuff is dying like it's supposed to (the same as in live).

This quest is what's wrong, not some overall broken mechanics change.

[maddong]

They give huge buffs to selected builds, then set mobs to that new benchmark. Thinking of 90+ stunning shield of vanguards, and 100+ coup de grace of bards. Good luck to everyone else.

Maybe they should fix those like they fixed quivering palm....

[Eth]

Making characters with DC-based abilities useless is not a challenge.

This. If you can't land spells on a caster that has the maximum possible DC in the game (even after debuffs), you might aswell just bring the barbarian.

Please adjust the saves.