Build Request: swashbuckling bard/arti

[PhearThis]

Hello all, i am trying to find a build to base my character off of. i want to try the swashbuckling bard with a rune arm off hand. has anyone tried this build before? if so i would love to know how it worked and if it was viable at all. i love being able to disarm traps and i love melee. thank you for the help everyone.

[unbongwah]

The main problems with Runearms are (A) the DPS doesn't scale well in epic levels (in the long run, +15% doublestrike from Legendary Shield Mastery is worth more, IMHO); and (B) it can be tricky to aim them in melee unless you're using one with cone-shaped attack. Another downside of not going pure Swashbuckler is losing Evasion; you could splash rog as well, of course, though the trap skills become redundant with arty.

[Caprice]

I've theorycrafted a few of these. I never quite like the results. The Artificer enhancements really don't support Swashbuckling well because the weapon bonuses are focused on crossbows or hand-and-a-half weapons and none of those are compatible with Swashbuckling, and as Unbongwah says the Artificer abilities already don't scale well into epics and splashing makes them that much less useful.

If you are going to do it I would recommend that you focus on the Bard side and make the Artificer be just for trapping and leave the runearm as more of a "for fun" fixture than a key part of the build. I haven't reconsidered it since the Barbarian revisions came out to see if any of the new stuff would be interesting, but IIRC the one I liked the look of the best was Bard 15 / Artificer 2 / Rogue 2 +1. Bard 15 lets you qualify for the Epic song feat. Artificer 2 gives you Runearm use and a lever puller, and also Echoes for SP regeneration. Rogue 2 gives Evasion. After those key choices the +1 can go to Bard 16 for level 6 spells (Otto's Irresistible Dance, Mass CMW), Rogue 3 for an additional +1d6 sneak attack damage, or Artificer 3 for level 2 spells (e.g. Elemental Weapons buff, Insightful Strikes, Lightning Sphere).

Two possibilities for Artificer 3 are going INT-based without access to the Harper Prestige and getting an extra Daze option to use with Coup de Grace. For the first, you can combine the Insightful Strikes spell (INT modifier for attacks) with the Swashbuckler enhancement "Different Tack: Two Steps Ahead (INT modifier for damage) but you may have a rough time leveling until you get both of those. The other is that the spell description for Lightning Sphere is incorrect because its Daze effect cannot be saved against (a real nuisance when you fight multiple enemy arties at once). Lightning Sphere is extremely hard to target well, but when you do use it successfully you will get an AoE Daze that should let you Coup de Grace an affected enemy and gives you a few seconds to sing a Fascinate or cast a heal without being hit. However I haven't tested this to be sure that Lightning Sphere & CdG work together.

The ideal runearms for this sort of build are ones with good imbues and secondary effects, not good runearm damage. You will almost never charge the runearm because its damage scales with Artificer levels and you have none to speak of, and a charged runearm reduces your runspeed unless you take tier 5 Battle Engineer, which you shouldn't do because it locks you out the far better tier 5 Swashbuckling enhancements. The ideal DPS choice is the (epic only) one from Crystal Cove since it has 2 imbues on your main weapon, for +2d8 +2d10 damage on every hit, which should work well with the high SWF attack speed + Haste. The charge on it apparently is also great for clearing out lots of boxes at once. However you can also get effects like Deathblock, Healing Amplification, the older (i.e. weaker) version of Banishing or Disrupting, Potency, and Ghost Touch on lower level runearms and while leveling you should just pick whichever combination of effects and damage suits you.

I can probably dredge up my notes or recreate it if you are interested in one of those variations.

Some other thoughts could go Artificer 15 (for Blade Barrier & semi-ok runearm attacks) and then attach either Bard 3/Rogue 2 (bare minimum Swashbuckling + Evasion) or Bard 5 (tier 5 Swashbuckling). Bard 18/Artificer 2 gives you Slippery Mind and the Dodge cap bonus. However I think it's not a great idea to be in Light Armor and not have Evasion.

Another thought is not to go with Swashbuckler at all. You can mix Artificer with Paladin or Fighter to go for Heavy Armor and Defensive stance and melee with a Bastard Sword or Dwarven Axe. SWF works with Runearms as-is.

[PhearThis]

hmmm, thank you both for your input. it is much appreciated. ill have to think about what i want to do now, it just sounded like a really fun build and i have wanted to try a melee arti. i figured the swash tree would go well with it. thanks again.

[CThruTheEgo]

I know you're getting a lot of negative feedback regarding why a swashbuckling arti doesn't work very well and I hate to add to it, but I have to agree. I've looked at several options and the synergy just isn't there. It's unfortunate that the devs gave us this possible combination but not the means to actually make it viable.

The biggest problem is which tier 5 to take. If your going to melee, then swashbuckler tier 5s are definitely the best, there's no question about it. But without battle engineer tier 5s, you won't be using the rune arm much because of the reduced movement speed which is just annoying. Of course, without mostly arti levels, there isn't much point in using the rune arm since their damage scales with arti levels.

It's difficult to gear a hybrid build already because of the need to split gear between melee and casting, but it's even worse for a swashbuckler/arti because they emphasize different spell damage types. Arti spells focus on force, fire, and electric, while bard spells and swashbuckler enhancements focus on sonic. It would be ideal if there were a sonic based rune arm but there isn't. You can, however, use one of the rune arms that comes with it's own spell power and that will help a lot.

As mentioned previously, the arti enhancements focus on weapons that are not usable in swashbuckler stance, so there is yet another lack of synergy.

I think Caprice pretty much laid out all the best combinations, none of which are really ideal.

[Livmo]

A build or toon does not have to be optimal to be fun to play and survivable. Of course there are trade offs when you splash/multi-class.

I will not steal anyone's thunder since I know of a player out there doing this, but arty/bard is doable and fine in end game. Perhaps they will post their build here? The fella is using a rune arm as well and SWF/Swash.

[Caprice]

Yes, true enough, and I tried to leave that door open with some other build combos that would be workable. I'm not sure I'd want to play them, but that's largely preference.

I'll plug the non-Swashbuckler "heavy" melee Artificer again. Artificer is already set up to support this, with both appropriate free class feat choices for such a build and some supporting enhancements. I think the "min-max" version is probably splashed with Fighter or Paladin for Defensive stance but a pure Artificer should work too if someone prefers that. The Artificer enhancement trees are pretty anemic but you can still get some good performance out of them. Would you consider that sort of build instead?