Character Builder Lite

[EllisDee37]

The only thing I'll say is that the more I use the planner, the more I wish the "Details" box showed the ability description.

The more I think about this, the more I'm convinced that I shouldn't do it.

For this builder, the best (and easiest) way to go would be to be able to right-click any item in any listbox and show a context menu that lets you open the relevant wiki page. This would require little data, since I can just look at the name to determine the appropriate wiki page. Some things would require extra data, but far less data would be needed than to add descriptions for everything.

For enhancements, just open the page for that tree, linked directly to the tier. So like Keen Edge would link to this.

The main strength of this planner is the streamlined nature of the data. Granted I entered a TON of data, all by hand, but it's really a drop in the bucket compared to how much data is in Ron's planner. All that extra data would slow me down (I have nobody helping, and I am not soliciting for help) to much slower updates after each game update. I like being able to post up-to-date data files within a couple days after an update, though lesson learned that I need to check in-game instead of relying on wiki 12 hours after an update goes live. heh.

For these same reasons, I think it would be a mistake to try and incorporate stats into the builder, like melee power or double-strike. It doesn't seem like much, but it's a huge, massive amount of data to enter and maintain. I think the original design philosophy of "less is more" is the right way to go.

I do look forward to the new version of Ron's planner, and keeping this one "Lite" while his is "complete" appeals to me.

[UurlockYgmeov]

... I think the original design philosophy of "less is more" is the right way to go.

I do look forward to the new version of Ron's planner, and keeping this one "Lite" while his is "complete" appeals to me.

While I too would love the extra 'stuff' - streamlined and efficient, like you said is the original design philosophy and should stay such.

I too look forward to the new version of Ron's planner - and do thank you and Ron's and Ron's team for all their past, current and future hard work!

[MysticRhythms]

<sub>A simply amazing tool, sir. Excellent work! The "less is more" approach is very very very welcome and the final output format is so clean and should be used by everybody who ever posts a build in the forums. It's so clean and removes all of the white noise that I see in other output formats.

I can't thank you enough.</sub>

[Arkadios]

Hey, Thanks for sharing this with us .

I used it to build my pure paladin, however it appears that tier 5 of Vanguard enhancements are missing (didn't show up in the list when I selected show all). Perhaps I'm missing the latest version? Anyway I chose what I wanted using the wiki and left the required APs blank on the planner.

Cheers.

[changelingamuck]

I do look forward to the new version of Ron's planner, and keeping this one "Lite" while his is "complete" appeals to me.

I too look forward to the new version of Ron's planner - and do thank you and Ron's and Ron's team for all their past, current and future hard work!

Just an fyi, you might have a looooooooong wait looking forward to the new version of Ron's planner. This is from a recent post of his in the forums on rjcyberware.com:

"Okay gang,

Here's the deal. The planner at the moment is sitting idle. Not much has been done on it since December really.

The reason for this is simple. I just don't have the time to put into it. I gave the project over to Dragon for that very reason, because I wanted to focus on other things, and my "free" time is very limited (mainly due to my job and my family). So I have to pick the things I want to do during those few moments when I don't have other obligations.

So that was fine, Dragon carried the project for a while. Unfortunately, he then left DDO, which removed his motivation for working on the planner. Which is too bad. But people move on. He's been with DDO forever (nearly as long as me!), and at some point sometimes you just are "done" with a game like DDO. He reached that point. Perhaps one day he will come back, maybe not. Dragon is still here on these boards, he may want to comment on his reasons for leaving the game.

So anyway, we don't really have any coders. I could go back in and work on it. I very likely will at some point. I think BlackDae might come kill me if I gave up on the planner, given how much time and effort she put into inputting all the raw data entries. And of course both Dragon and I put many hours into the code. So I'm not going to let it just die.

As for me, my time right now is really being spent on YouTube, recording and editing videos (including a DDO project). When I have spare time from that I am working on my own game project (although I can say I'm not spending nearly the time I should be on that either). I find I really enjoy all the aspects of creating videos (especially the editing part, which plays into my creative side).

So yeah, the bottom line: Nothing is happening at the moment. I do think things will happen in the future. I may consider the idea of releasing it in it's current state if you guys want to see it in action (although you'd have to jump through a few hoops to get it to run), but don't expect a fully working planner, it's not at a real usable stage yet."

[EllisDee37]

I used it to build my pure paladin, however it appears that tier 5 of Vanguard enhancements are missing (didn't show up in the list when I selected show all). Perhaps I'm missing the latest version? Anyway I chose what I wanted using the wiki and left the required APs blank on the planner.

On the enhancement screen, go to the Trees tab and select your Tier 5 tree from the dropdown on the left below your selected list of trees.

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This isn't the first time someone's had trouble with tier 5s; I've also received a PM from someone who thought the tier 5s were missing. Any feedback on how to make it more obvious is welcome. I have several thoughts:

1. Same as it is now, except when you click the Enhancements tab, if you haven't selected a Tier 5 tree (and you qualify*), you get a messagebox prompting you to select one. You could opt not to select one if your build doesn't use tier 5s.
2. Same as it is now, except the first tree you choose is automatically set as your Tier 5 tree. Changeable, of course, but the first would be the default.
3. Remove the Tier 5 dropdown, show Tier 5s for all trees until you choose one, at which point you no longer see tier 5s for other trees.
4. Remove the dropdown, show Tier 5s for all trees always, but if you choose Tier 5 abilities from more than one tree those enhancements are flagged as errors. Add a note to details when displaying tier 5s, something like "You can only choose Tier 5 enhancements from one tree."
5. Other suggestions welcome.

*You must have 12 build levels to qualify for Tier 5s. Even a 4/4/4 build can take Tier 5 in the Harper Tree.


I'm leaning toward 1), but 3) is also appealing. Both 2) and 4) seem like they might just exchange one confusion for another.

All four options are simple and easy to implement. 1) is by far the easiest, of course, but 3) strikes me as more elegant. I'm not a fan of messageboxes, and prefer to avoid them where possible.

[Sisma]

*You must have 12 build levels to qualify for Tier 5s. Even a 4/4/4 build can take Tier 5 in the Harper Tree.

Actually only Harper tree lets you take tier 5 in a 4/4/4 build. All other class trees need a class level 5 AND character level 12 to qualify.

Btw, personally I would opt for choice 3), but I didn't have a problem with the actual system so far...

[EllisDee37]

Actually only Harper tree lets you take tier 5 in a 4/4/4 build. All other class trees need a class level 5 AND character level 12 to qualify.

Yep, that was my point, though I may have worded it poorly.

All builds have access to the Harper tree so any build with 12 character levels can select a Tier 5 tree. It's just that with a 4/4/4 build, the only tree you can select is Harper.

[Sisma]

Oh, kk, got it wrong.
My bad! XD

[Arkadios]

Thanks Ellis.

I'd go for 3) myself, there is however another option. Put the drop down on the top of the enhancements page, or just to the right of the drop down for what tree you're currently on. I think not only would it be more noticeable but it would also make more sense there.

[EllisDee37]

I'd go for 3) myself, there is however another option. Put the drop down on the top of the enhancements page, or just to the right of the drop down for what tree you're currently on. I think not only would it be more noticeable but it would also make more sense there.

Ah, that's not a bad idea either.

The more I think about it, the more I like option 3). I might additionally put a display of what has been selected as the tier 5 tree where you suggest.

[EllisDee37]

I just tried to send a PM to someone regarding another thread, but the forum throws an error saying I have too many PMs. So I went through and deleted a bunch, but I still get that error.

For the time being, I appear to be unreachable via PM, which is a bummer because I've probably gotten more feedback via PM than I have in-thread. I'll try to get this squared away quickly; if you get an "inbox full" error when trying to PM me, just hang tight and try again in a few days.

EDIT: All set now. I deleted over a hundred PMs from both my inbox and sent items, over 200 total.

[cestvel]

On the enhancement screen, go to the Trees tab and select your Tier 5 tree from the dropdown on the left below your selected list of trees.

----------------------------------------

This isn't the first time someone's had trouble with tier 5s; I've also received a PM from someone who thought the tier 5s were missing. Any feedback on how to make it more obvious is welcome. I have several thoughts:

1. Same as it is now, except when you click the Enhancements tab, if you haven't selected a Tier 5 tree (and you qualify*), you get a messagebox prompting you to select one. You could opt not to select one if your build doesn't use tier 5s.
2. Same as it is now, except the first tree you choose is automatically set as your Tier 5 tree. Changeable, of course, but the first would be the default.
3. Remove the Tier 5 dropdown, show Tier 5s for all trees until you choose one, at which point you no longer see tier 5s for other trees.
4. Remove the dropdown, show Tier 5s for all trees always, but if you choose Tier 5 abilities from more than one tree those enhancements are flagged as errors. Add a note to details when displaying tier 5s, something like "You can only choose Tier 5 enhancements from one tree."
5. Other suggestions welcome.

*You must have 12 build levels to qualify for Tier 5s. Even a 4/4/4 build can take Tier 5 in the Harper Tree.


I'm leaning toward 1), but 3) is also appealing. Both 2) and 4) seem like they might just exchange one confusion for another.

All four options are simple and easy to implement. 1) is by far the easiest, of course, but 3) strikes me as more elegant. I'm not a fan of messageboxes, and prefer to avoid them where possible.

I personally had not encountered an issue with this but I do not like annoying popups.
Not everyone takes the enhancements in the builds, because they may be obvious or personal flavour and just wants to make sure the feats work out.
So I would go with option 3).

[brzytki]

I'm loving your character builder. I know with the upcoming rogue revamp part II you'll have to change some enhancements in the builder but i wanted to point of 2 things i've found so far. First, in the assassin tree the Killer enhancement no longer requires Critical Mastery line, so you can already remove the req from your builder. Second thing is i was picking twists and took 4/3/1/1 split and both "APs spent in the tree" in Destiny section and "26 fate points" in the Twist section turned red. While i understand the latter (you probably haven't added the +2 fate points tome feature and it gives you a notice that you exceeded max fate points possible), i have no idea why the former occurs.

[EllisDee37]

in the assassin tree the Killer enhancement no longer requires Critical Mastery line

Good catch, thanks much.

Second thing is i was picking twists and took 4/3/1/1 split and both "APs spent in the tree" in Destiny section and "26 fate points" in the Twist section turned red. While i understand the latter (you probably haven't added the +2 fate points tome feature and it gives you a notice that you exceeded max fate points possible), i have no idea why the former occurs.

+2 Fate tomes are accounted for; 26 violates the absolute cap of 22:

60 destiny levels (all 12 destines maxed) = 20 fate points
+2 fate tome = 22 absolute max

The destiny section in your output includes an (Errors) tag due to the fate point violation. That's probably not the most elegant implementation, I admit.

EDIT: I see on wiki that you get 1 fate point for every 4 epic past lives, up to a max of 9 fate points at 36 epic past lives. I was not aware of that. Figure early next week for 1.0.1, which will correct that as well as the other minor bugs people have pointed out.

[AtomicMew]

Good catch, thanks much.

+2 Fate tomes are accounted for; 26 violates the absolute cap of 22:

60 destiny levels (all 12 destines maxed) = 20 fate points
+2 fate tome = 22 absolute max

The destiny section in your output includes an (Errors) tag due to the fate point violation. That's probably not the most elegant implementation, I admit.

EDIT: I see on wiki that you get 1 fate point for every 4 epic past lives, up to a max of 9 fate points at 36 epic past lives. I was not aware of that. Figure early next week for 1.0.1, which will correct that as well as the other minor bugs people have pointed out.

Drow did not seem to have shuriken expertise auto-granted.

[kanordog]

I just hopped in to express my appreciation for the builder.
I really like it, thanks for putting it together!

[EllisDee37]

Drow did not seem to have shuriken expertise auto-granted.

EDIT: Oh, Shuriken Expertise, not proficiency.

That is indeed missing; I'll get it added. Thanks much.

[EllisDee37]

Version 1.0.1 is up, which includes fixes for all the bugs pointed out in thread and via PM.

Note that this is purely a bugfix update, not a feature update, so the discussed changes to how the Tier 5 dropdown will be changed (it will be removed) is not implemented. That will be part of 1.1, which I'm hoping to have ready for when Warlock goes live.

EDIT: For the data fixes listed, I also made the same corrections on ddowiki.

[EllisDee37]

More explanation on the first release note: "Fixed error allocating bonus feats when primary/splash class order changes"

This refers to the "Primary/Splash 1/Splash 2" class selections along the left side of the overview screen. Manually changing those for a build that already has feats assigned used to throw a runtime error if you changed a class that has bonus feats into a class that does not. Changing those dropdowns now resets the bonus feat selections for that class.

The actual class split you define along the right side isn't related to this.