Axel's THF Melee Cleric Build

[Magdragons]

So whats your opinion on the upcoming changes axel? How do you think your build will change with the THF changes, falconry buffs, and other things.

[axel15810]

So whats your opinion on the upcoming changes axel? How do you think your build will change with the THF changes, falconry buffs, and other things.

I want to see how things go with the THF changes. And how other changes are finalized in U45. There are a variety of big changes and alternate builds I've been theorycrafting lately to make it more effective in reaper mode when U45 hits. As of right now, it's not as effective there as I'd like it to be. The Falconry buffs are welcome, but it's nothing game changing. I'm probably changing up the build when U45 hits. And if I find it to be better, I'll plan on updating the original post here with the changes.

[Anashan]

We see in update 45 that Diving Attacks in Falconry tree lowers its cooldown to 12 seconds from 20. This makes it perhaps worth taking. ****** More importantly, Coordinated Strikes, the AOE bird attack - from the Falconry tree as well - had its cooldown reduced significantly from 60 to 25 seconds. Helpless time just went up for me, and my friends. Good times will be had by all and much blood will be split.

[axel15810]

We see in update 45 that Diving Attacks in Falconry tree lowers its cooldown to 12 seconds from 20. This makes it perhaps worth taking. ****** More importantly, Coordinated Strikes, the AOE bird attack - from the Falconry tree as well - had its cooldown reduced significantly from 60 to 25 seconds. Helpless time just went up for me, and my friends. Good times will be had by all and much blood will be split.

Yep! The build got significantly better from this change, the cleave changes and the THF changes. It was really nice to see.

[Anashan]

OK I have taken Axel's build (I am playing it almost exactly as stated\designed) into Reaper now, and as I have progressed, I wanted to ask anyone who likes to comment and give advice on a few things I am encountering at various Reaper levels as I have progressed from r1 into r5-6 (even did my first r10 the other day and yes we got it done). I am fairly new to the end game, have only one character, and I have been at 30 for just a few months.

Quick Character\Build info: I did 3 cleric and 3 paladin heroic past lives and since I went Epic I did 3 epic lives (3 epic past lives: martial doublestrike) on my own and treated myself and bought another 6 epic lives with Otto's boxes (3 Divine>Brace - 3 Primal>Colors of the queen). Legendary Dreadnaught Destiny of course. I currently have 4 twists: Tier 4 Fury>Sense Weakness, Tier 3 Divine Crusader>Sacred Ground, Tier 2 Divine Crusader>Consecration, Tier 1 Unyielding Sentinel>Brace for Impact. Gear: 10 of 12 legendary gear (2 cannith crafted to fill holes - Part of the Family set bonus) aimed at healing, dps and survivability stuff. Have 10 filigrees (7 weapon, 3 ring) Prowess 5, Beast Mantle 2, Touch of Grace 3 - so filgrees are also split between Healing, DPS and survivability. Got other numbers up (all numbers unbuffed...they go up a fair bit with self and group buffs) >> PRR to 150, MRR to 110, AC to 135, dodge to 12. My saves are mid 90's to 108 (Will). I have 11 Reaper points ALL in Grim Barricade (survival) tree. 2800 Spell Points. 1480 hit points. Again all numbers unbuffed and do not include reaper enhancements even (as I mentioned I have 11 Reaper points all in defense so my saves, prr, and hit points go up a bit further on top of normal quest\raid buffs).

Reaper: This discussion is generic - there is a fairly big difference between having a tank and not having one. It mostly impacts playstyle as with a tank I can safely dps more. However, pug reaper groups often do not have a tank or only have a quasi tank or two.

Reaper 1-3: In R1-3 I found the build held up to its promise. Good heals, good dps (I have learned to NOT get aggro, or not for long, on big nasty monsters), I can take a quit a few hits if I have to before running scared, with a playstyle of simply stepping in, sometimes popping a Displacement and\or defensive cooldown or two - I do this in higher levels too but more on that below - and I get to whack around a bit, or a lot, and then step out and toss a few heals. Very fun to play IMO as I am able to dps a fairly high % of the time. What doesn't work is Mass Frog, my DC's are too low. It works for Hard and even Elite but not Reaper. In fact none of my DC's are high enough to CC anything. Also, the variety of Falconry helplessness options do not work often enough IMO. Should I find some bonuses to assassinate? In any case, I swapped Mass Frog for Guardian Angel Epic Destiny feat - why? just felt I need more survivability. More on survivability as we go, I swapped Perfect Two Weapon Fighting out for Elusive Target Epic Destiny feat (5% miss) as the loss of a little doublestrike did not seem to nerf my dps much (I have good double strike and insightful double strike on gear, + filigrees and such). After these swaps, which helped, the build, only slightly modified, seemed to hold up well at least for my skill level, play style and past lives and such. Thoughts?

Reaper 5-6: Ouch. CC basically does not work. They hit very hard and I can generally cannot take many hits at all even with the attempts at boosting survivability discussed above. Heals are fine, dps is ok but I REALLY have to pick my spot to go in as I cannot take more than a few hits, at most, so someone has to have aggro or I have to think hard about how\when to dps to not die and need to be calculated about it. I am basically a healer and a calculated, but effective I think, spot\smart dps'er (need to think hard about popping in Displacement def. cooldowns before I go in for sure). Thoughts?

Reaper 8-10: I have not done a 7 nor a 9 but three 8's and one 10. Virtually instant death in melee if I take a hit. if I get aggro it is a small miracle if I survive even one hit, no cc of course and in essence, no self healing. I redid my enhancements to take the sprint from Falconry just for high Reaper as it has saved my life a few times. I am playing as nearly a pure healer as a consequence and as such, I am contemplating switching to Exalted Angel or something for high Reaper???? I do not know Exalted Angel but can guess at what to take, but the problem with my own thought is that the heal level of the build even with Legendary Dreadnought is generally good enough. In my limited experience in high reaper most people have high healing amp and the build holds up as is well enough though a little more heal heal power at high reaper does seem in order. Also, I could also use more Spell Points in High Reaper (looks like Exalted Angel would fix that ??) However, as I said, I really cant dps effectively in high reaper really even with Displacement\Def. Cooldowns up (My fault am I missing something?????), so maybe it makes sense to switch to Exalted Angel??? If I am pure heals in high reaper maybe twist out Sense Weakness for some heals\survivability???? Skip survivability in high Reaper as I cant get enough to make a difference anyway??? Different\Opposite thinking...go Unyielding Sentinel and do some Renewal spamming (so maybe that solves my minor to moderate spell point problem as Renewal is a cheap heal)???? Thoughts?

Thoughtful comments very much appreciated.

[axel15810]

*snip*

Pretty much echos my experiences.

First of all, this is not a build meant for high reaper. Its home is low to mid reaper. To really excel in high reaper you pretty much will want to run one of the best builds in the game. Which this is not.

It's not gonna be competitive there, and caster cleric definitely is gonna do better than a melee. The build could still function as a dedicated healer all tanked up in sentinel if the party wants it. But melee is gonna be too dangerous...fact is basically all melees struggle mightily in high reaper so it's not unique just to this build. Mobs hit too hard, you need range.

I've also swapped out mass frog for more survivability. Have swapped out some gear and added stuff in to boost falconry DCs, which seem to be hitting fine in low to mid reaper. I still don't have it optimized, but you really do need to make sacrifices so that blind can land consistently in the content you want to run. Having reliable CC is sooooooooo important on reaper, especially if solo'ing. Mobs just hit too hard.

[Anashan]

Pretty much echos my experiences.

First of all, this is not a build meant for high reaper. Its home is low to mid reaper. To really excel in high reaper you pretty much will want to run one of the best builds in the game. Which this is not.

It's not gonna be competitive there, and caster cleric definitely is gonna do better than a melee. The build could still function as a dedicated healer all tanked up in sentinel if the party wants it. But melee is gonna be too dangerous...fact is basically all melees struggle mightily in high reaper so it's not unique just to this build. Mobs hit too hard, you need range.

I've also swapped out mass frog for more survivability. Have swapped out some gear and added stuff in to boost falconry DCs, which seem to be hitting fine in low to mid reaper. I still don't have it optimized, but you really do need to make sacrifices so that blind can land consistently in the content you want to run. Having reliable CC is sooooooooo important on reaper, especially if solo'ing. Mobs just hit too hard.

Makes sense. I am gonna search for ways to get the Falconry Blind up to snuff for low to mid Reaper and if I do find myself in high Reaper I will just heal (role) and maybe move to Unyielding Sentinel (partially for Renewal spam including on my self), get myself a second maul to swap to (drop Prowess filigrees for more Heal\Survivability stuff), and finally find a tier 4 replacement for Sense Weakness dps twist. I did "ok" healing the three 8's and the one 10 Reaper I did so I do not think I need a massive boost to healing output just a modest boost in general, maybe a few spell points (and\or incorporate Renewal into my playstyle), and a little more survivability I will get from Unyielding Sentinel.

Thanks for responding Axel.

[Anashan]

I found this Assassinate DC breakdown below. In red are not realistic as some are doable but they feel like a BIG sacrifice: Some I can realistically get in white. My current dc on bird Blind (helplessness) is 75 which I do not get - 10 base + 20 level + 32 Wis bonus + 3 from Falconry = 65 - why is the tool tip showing 75?

10 Base
20 Rogue level 20 - for us Falconry Clerics we still get 20 so we are at 30 or 40? now. (is this where the mysterious extra 10 dc points is coming from? Are we getting 30 as a character level instead of 20??)

---

05 - Item: Insight - Ring of the Silver Tongue = Enhancement cannith crafting 7
02 - Item: Quality - The Family's Blessing = Insightful cannith crafting 4
so we are at 41 or 51?

---

02 - Item: Filigree - The Long Shadow 5-Peice Set Bonus
02 - Item: Filigree - Treachery 4-Peice Set Bonus
02 - Assassin Enh: Deadly Shadow
05 - Assassin Enh: Measure the Foe
03 - Falconry Enh: Watch the Centre = 3 but already counted in above so still at 41 or 51?

06 - Shadow Dancer ED: Stealthy T1 = 6 - this is tier one and thus twistable for me
02 - Shadow Dancer ED: Shadow Mastery - Innate
02 - Legendary dreadnought ED: Unusual Tactics T4 = 2
so we are at 49 or 59

---

+32 (for me) Wisdom bonus
04 - Feat: Scion of the Astral Plane = 4 - not sure whether to did this??
so we are at 85 or 95?

I still cannot account for the extra 10. If the tooltip is right I would have 95 for assassinate which would work, I think, for low to mid Reaper. I hear you need over 100 for high reaper maybe well over.

Is 85 or 95 enough? and how far does that carry you with low to mid reaper trash mobs (not necessarily champions, red,orange,bosses) ?? Reaper 4? 5?

[Spyder1228]

Pretty much echos my experiences.

First of all, this is not a build meant for high reaper. Its home is low to mid reaper. To really excel in high reaper you pretty much will want to run one of the best builds in the game. Which this is not.

It's not gonna be competitive there, and caster cleric definitely is gonna do better than a melee. The build could still function as a dedicated healer all tanked up in sentinel if the party wants it. But melee is gonna be too dangerous...fact is basically all melees struggle mightily in high reaper so it's not unique just to this build. Mobs hit too hard, you need range.

I've also swapped out mass frog for more survivability. Have swapped out some gear and added stuff in to boost falconry DCs, which seem to be hitting fine in low to mid reaper. I still don't have it optimized, but you really do need to make sacrifices so that blind can land consistently in the content you want to run. Having reliable CC is sooooooooo important on reaper, especially if solo'ing. Mobs just hit too hard.

Hey Axel! I just started this build as a test run, and so far so good.

But I do have a question. I am a returning player of a 6ish year hiatus. A lot has changed (mostly for the better, I think). I am about to TR my Warlock and my new group needs a frontline. We are slowly working our way up in reaper levels, but find the lack of CC and frontline an issue. I have read on the forums that melees are pretty screwed in terms of reaper levels, but I was wondering what class/build could do okay in mid-high level reapers? (Obviously, this is going to be dependent on past lives, equipment, etc. but I have searched the forums and they seem kind of dead.)

[C-Dog]

...but I have searched the forums and they seem kind of dead.)

Must not have looked in the right places - lots there. Nothing recently, admittedly - that horse got beaten dead and more a long time ago.

I'll let others address CC and melee specifically, but until then here are a few (unsorted) threads...

o This is for Soloing for RR's - balanced-group play does not have to be as self-sufficient (but it couldn't hurt!) https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6079661

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...t-ranger-build
& counter suggestion https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6145754

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6271313

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...aper-Clonklock

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...per-optimized)

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6101465
& https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6189864

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...k-Build-Thread

[LavidDynch]

Hey Axel! I just started this build as a test run, and so far so good.

But I do have a question. I am a returning player of a 6ish year hiatus. A lot has changed (mostly for the better, I think). I am about to TR my Warlock and my new group needs a frontline. We are slowly working our way up in reaper levels, but find the lack of CC and frontline an issue. I have read on the forums that melees are pretty screwed in terms of reaper levels, but I was wondering what class/build could do okay in mid-high level reapers? (Obviously, this is going to be dependent on past lives, equipment, etc. but I have searched the forums and they seem kind of dead.)

AFAIK no melee is super great in solo r7-10 mostly due to the useless self heal, and u will take dmg in reaper - solo and melee, in group its cool thou! not as OP as the pre.-nerfed inq with 250mmr/prr but melee is fun and might even be higher dps..... I did a cleric/barb/ftr PDK. lacked a bit of mmr but dmg is insane, fotw is fun also, LD is a bit boring.... ... but if you do enjoy LD, paladin is a great choice! better d-fenses too.

oh yeah a barb cleric split can easily selheal with ravager tree up til r3-5 with blood tribute and kill/hits procs if you got the gear for it; not a 28 point fresh character.... Can probably do higher reaper but I´m not a fan of soloing higher then 3-4 on melee.

a lot of things are relative in terms of builds. From pastlifes, lag, reaction, piano skills, lag etc etc etc to quest knowledge. Best thing is to build stuff you feel is fun and suits your own style; copy other guys builds and expect same results is rarely a wise choice, all thou you can pick up inspiration and imitate.

[Spyder1228]

Must not have looked in the right places - lots there. Nothing recently, admittedly - that horse got beaten dead and more a long time ago.

I'll let others address CC and melee specifically, but until then here are a few (unsorted) threads...

o This is for Soloing for RR's - balanced-group play does not have to be as self-sufficient (but it couldn't hurt!) https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6079661

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...t-ranger-build
& counter suggestion https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6145754

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6271313

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...aper-Clonklock

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...per-optimized)

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6101465
& https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6189864

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...k-Build-Thread

I found a bunch of these, but I assumed they were outdated because of them being old. Thanks!!

AFAIK no melee is super great in solo r7-10 mostly due to the useless self heal, and u will take dmg in reaper - solo and melee, in group its cool thou! not as OP as the pre.-nerfed inq with 250mmr/prr but melee is fun and might even be higher dps..... I did a cleric/barb/ftr PDK. lacked a bit of mmr but dmg is insane, fotw is fun also, LD is a bit boring.... ... but if you do enjoy LD, paladin is a great choice! better d-fenses too.

oh yeah a barb cleric split can easily selheal with ravager tree up til r3-5 with blood tribute and kill/hits procs if you got the gear for it; not a 28 point fresh character.... Can probably do higher reaper but I´m not a fan of soloing higher then 3-4 on melee.

a lot of things are relative in terms of builds. From pastlifes, lag, reaction, piano skills, lag etc etc etc to quest knowledge. Best thing is to build stuff you feel is fun and suits your own style; copy other guys builds and expect same results is rarely a wise choice, all thou you can pick up inspiration and imitate.

Yeah I wasn't thinking solo. Moreso in a group but have the ability to self-heal in a group. I considered doing a barb/cleric using falconry, but I was not sure of its viability nor split. I will have to do some playtesting

[LavidDynch]

I found a bunch of these, but I assumed they were outdated because of them being old. Thanks!!




Yeah I wasn't thinking solo. Moreso in a group but have the ability to self-heal in a group. I considered doing a barb/cleric using falconry, but I was not sure of its viability nor split. I will have to do some playtesting

The cleric part isn´t for selfhealing since you will be raged non-stop and have the range-disability; healing yourself and others on this build is beyond horrible.... but on the other hand you can drop rage and heal yourself with decent results in mid tier reaper, but its annoying. But in general you will be a worse healer than anyone with a LOH (i.e. aasimar etc etc).

Nah, these old builds works very well, as long as you know your role and gear to be a DPS, you actually got some minor healing that worked for me in low reaper in the warpriest tree, besides what is said above... For me right now there are 3 options I´m interested in 3 THF-builds that I know for certain are top notch in the current game as of this update at least.
1. 14clr/5brb/1ftr - PDK.
2. Pure Barb HO
3. 20 - pdk paladin (but this requires a +1 heart and I tend to TR every now and then anyway so paying for a class is always a risk due to the nature of the game)

#1 and #2 are very similar builds just different names. I have the one maul but I lack the proper weapon for a barb so I pick #1.
3. In general a bit lower dps, excludes FOTW due to rage-restrictions; turning off 30 AP is huge! so LD is almost the ED to pick which is kinda boring and its hard to keep up the blitz, better MMR/PRR/self heal/saves and utility clickys, might even be higher DPS during certain circumstances... don´t expect the super crits thou, those are exclusive for FOTW. Safer but not as much fun!

if you intend to group then it is a server-issue, if you often find problems finding ppl to heal or help out healing others perhaps the OP-build is for you or some other build.... most questing don´t require a dedicated healer anyway -- things still dies very fast in a decent group, and most deaths I´ve seen are still one or two shotted related...

[C-Dog]

I found a bunch of these, but I assumed they were outdated because of them being old...

Only 2 reasons that something is "outdated" - 1) because something in that build has changed, making a diff choice superior, or 2) something in a diff build has changed, making that build superior.

Between those links (which are, I'll repeat, unfiltered - just a copy/paste), I'd think you can tell which are which.

[C-Dog]

The cleric part isn´t for selfhealing since you will be raged non-stop and have the range-disability

"Rage" disalility...

Destruction Domain allows casting of Cleric spells while Raged. Just sayin'.

o https://ddowiki.com/page/Domain#Destruction

[LavidDynch]

"Rage" disalility...

Destruction Domain allows casting of Cleric spells while Raged. Just sayin'.

o https://ddowiki.com/page/Domain#Destruction

yes, but your going War Domain if your interested in DPS, 14 for the holy sword and the other minor bonuses.. just sayin´.

also, casting spells on others requires them to be very close to you since you will be going epic defensive stance. Hard enough to just cast spells on the ADHD crowd without the crippling stance; moving away when you try to raise them for no reason whatsoever, running around corners and screams for heals etc etc... A lot of things are summarized up in the DDO anthem by Six Foe ^^

[LavidDynch]

I tend to do this for myself got a few other similar boring vids of various builds (easier to analyze a video like this too).. but this is r1- Snarla farm on clr/brb.... notes: still want to fit in the Litany (+4 pure dps and +2 stats), you might need to configure the resolution.. and I dont play with I and C open...
edit. Im sorry if I hijacked OP thread -- not my intention.

[Wipey]

But I do have a question. I am a returning player of a 6ish year hiatus. A lot has changed (mostly for the better, I think). I am about to TR my Warlock and my new group needs a frontline. We are slowly working our way up in reaper levels, but find the lack of CC and frontline an issue. I have read on the forums that melees are pretty screwed in terms of reaper levels, but I was wondering what class/build could do okay in mid-high level reapers? (Obviously, this is going to be dependent on past lives, equipment, etc. but I have searched the forums and they seem kind of dead.)

If you wanna up the skull levels as a group, you need specialized builds/roles.
"Battle cleric" has always been not so good concept. Melee play requires full attention, so does keeping your party alive.
Amongst the other newbie trap builds that gets constant attention here for some reason. Nasty wake up if are ever interested in something more than hamster wheel.

Any good melees will do as "front line". Even more so now that the inquisitive pandemic is over. The damage, survivability and whole party dynamic is much better with melees. But you need someone on full time healing / complimentary cc / some instakills / boss debuffs. And sorc / wiz / lock as dedicated primary cc with added aoe and instakills on advanced toons or players.

Tempest is solid as ever, asassin, shintao, vkf alchy, kotc both s+b and thf or barbie. Lot of very good options now. Monk is still the best high reaper melee in my experience.

[Tilomere]

If you wanna up the skull levels as a group, you need specialized builds/roles ... the other newbie trap builds that gets constant attention here for some reason.

But you need someone on full time healing / complimentary cc / some instakills / boss debuffs. And sorc / wiz / lock as dedicated primary cc with added aoe and instakills on advanced toons or players.

How are new players supposed to get a full time healer and an advanced arcane toon to babysit specialized melee builds?

[SirValentine]

How are new players supposed to get a full time healer and an advanced arcane toon to babysit specialized melee builds?

How are new players supposed to get advanced melee builds to kill things for their specialized healing and/or CC characters?

I mean, it's not like we have some kind of system where we can let other players know we're what we're looking for, right?

And it's not like new players can start on something less than R10 before they go full bore, right?