36-point unarmed build for U24+

[elg582]

I am ready to double reincarnate a 3rd-life monk that needs a rebuild (currently 12 monk/4 ranger/4 fighter), and looking for suggestions.

-Human/Half-Elf preferred, fleshie required
-Unarmed, stunning fist and vorpal strikes
-Tomes:
-- +4 STR
-- +3 DEX
-- +2 CON
-- +2 INT
-- +5 WIS
-- +2 CHA


Current thinking:

12 monk/6 paladin/2 fighter (credit to ftdOmen for the class split)
Human

STR 14 + 5 levels
DEX 14
CON 12
INT 12
WIS 16 + 2 levels
CHA 14


Feats:

1 Dodge
1h Mobility
1m Power Attack
2m Two Weapon Fighting
3 Past Life: Monk
6 Spring Attack
6m Stunning Fist
9 Improved Critical: Bludgeoning
12 Improved Two Weapon Fighting
15 Greater Two Weapon Fighting
18 Grandmaster of Forms
19f Combat Expertise
20f Whirlwind Attack
21 Vorpal Fists
24 Overwhelming Critical
26 Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Improved Martial Arts
28 Elusive Target


Enhancements:

Knight of the Chalice - 33 ap
Kensei - 12 ap
Shintao - 11 ap
Ninja Spy - 11 ap
Human - 7 ap
Sacred Defender - 6 ap


I would actually prefer to go pure monk, but the capstones just aren't that good.

Has anyone tried the kotc-cleaves + whirlwind combo?

Would Helf 12 monk/6 fighter/2 FVS paladin-dilettante be better? 2 extra feats for cleave/gcleave, DM from FVS, and take T5 Shintao...

[elg582]

Build 2:

12 monk/6 fighter/2 favored soul
Half Elf

STR 14 + 5 levels
DEX 14
CON 12
INT 12
WIS 16 + 2 levels
CHA 14


Feats:

1 Dodge
1m Power Attack
1he Paladin Dilettante
2m Two Weapon Fighting
3 Past Life: Monk
6 Mobility
6m Stunning Fist
7f Cleave
8f Great Cleave
9 Improved Critical: Bludgeoning
12 Improved Two Weapon Fighting
15 Greater Two Weapon Fighting
18 Spring Attack
19f Combat Expertise
20f Whirlwind Attack
21 Vorpal Fists
24 Overwhelming Critical
26 Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Blinding Speed
28 Elusive Target


Enhancements:
Shintao - 36 ap
Half Elf - 17 ap
Kensei - 6 ap
Ninja Spy - 11 ap
Warpriest - 10 ap

[JamesNiels]

I heard from a friend that the kotc cleaves dont work or are bugged or w/e with handwraps. He said he tried them and they didnt work.

That being said i still like the first build u posted a lot. Only thing thats wrong with it is the class split and ap distribution due to the kotc cleaves not working with unarmed, (and race). I would go 12 monk for all the good stuff that gives, 4 pally for acces to quicken spell, and 4 fighter for an extra feat, in comparison to 2 fighter.

3 paladin is required for sacred stance, which gives 25 prr and mrr. After a LOT of playing unarmed monks i found that since the update its weak point by far is lack of prr compared to even a lightly armored toon.

So 15m/3p/2f is what i would recommend at least, but since 13-15th monk levels give like nothing, except for quivering palm which was nerfed into uselessness, i would throw some more of pally, fighter or both in it.

Then theres ur race... if u like epic elite content then ur gonna have a problem keeping urself healed with cocoon.. first of all it has a long cooldown.. its 12 seconds.. second, it wont heal u when the temp hp is removed, which with some bad timing and close proximity to mobs can mean it doesnt even heal u for the first tic, ive had this happen a lot in quests where mobs hit for 150+, and the timing was just unfortunate. Cocoon heals for like 300-500, maybe 600 sometimes... which is good but not good enough, ur gonna end up having to kite to reduce damage intake and heal up... anyways im rambling now, my point is: make it bladeforged. U get reconstruct it heals for 500ish, heals right after its cast and in one go, 6 sec cooldown... its a massive improvement in survivability. Not to mention, bf tree gives +3 stun dc which as far as i know stacks with the kensei tactics (havent taken the trouble to check this however). And u get extra fortification, which is hard to get over 150 on this build if ur a fleshie. And u make enemies shaken on hit, making it easier to stun em.

Also, i wouldnt put my level ups in str. At end game, ur gonna be hitting for like 120 at least. Str only adds .5 damage per fist (however increased by like 50% by melee power). I would personally put it in wisdom and con, stunning a mob can add 115% damage, which also affects the sneak damage and weapon procs. This means it adds well over 150 damage per fist.... and in ee stormhorns/wheloon, ur stun dc should be like over 75 for a 95% succes rate.

Good luck.

P.s. u can start with 11 intel, since u dont plan on taking CE before lvl 7.

[elg582]

OK, good feedback, too bad about the paladin cleaves; if that's true, then we need to start &!^(#ing at Turbine to fix it. The sad part is that, even without the cleaves, KotC is still better than any of the monk trees.

I specified fleshie partly because all of my gear is already set up, but also because I already have 3 bladeforged builds, including a 3rd-life paladin/monk/rogue staff user, and their utility has been... exaggerated. The racial reconstruct, for example, never gets anywhere near 500-point heals (which as you point out, is still a little low); with a reconstruct augment slotted, I'm getting ~225 hp back. You can get that out out of a UMD'd Heal scroll.

The other problem is the cost to get full advantage out of BF, you have to blow 17 ap on the racial tree, which gets you a lot, but kind of limits your options in other trees. Fortification is easy, you just slot Brace for Impact from US ED, and you are good.

Level-ups... I'm not sure. CON is pointless, I almost dropped it down to 10 base. WIS is nice, although I get 70+ SF DC with 18 base + 5 tome WIS. CHA is tempting, although another +2 saves is pretty minor, too.

And yes, I only need 11 INT, but my stats are so spread out that the extra build point doesn't help.

[elg582]

OK, I made a test character to try out the KotC cleaves with unarmed; it works just fine

[Theolin]

Have you thought about going 4 cleric/ fvs for ameliorating strike? it can be a lot of healing with off hand and good double strike.
Though you may not have the APs for it

[Dalsheel]

Just some ideas to think about:

Cleaves + unarmed combat is terribad... breaks your attack sequence, there's half a second pause before you start attacking after cleaving (maybe less, but there is a small pause), no doublestrike, no off-hand attack (and no off-hand doublestrike as a result). Cleaves were needed for OC in the past, thankfully this is past.

With thunderforged handwraps you'll have 10.5[W] base damage as pure, better have this W be d8. It's +10.5dmg per fist compared to d6.

Idk if you have access to harper tree, but if you do, KtA is way better than DM for monks since your main tactical attack is not STR based. A simple spellpoints augment is enough to use it without problems (and INT of course )

The only benefit you get from Blinding Speed is 1% dodge if you're using an item with Speed XV, like Epic Boots of the Innocent. I recommend dropping it for Improved Martial Arts, since you're gonna have 12 monk levels anyway by the looks of it.


Cheers

[peng]

Kotc cleaves with handwraps proc off-hand attacks, but deal very low damage. Kotc cleaves completely unarmed (no wraps) have an animation and sound, but no attack happens. Regular cleave unarmed/with wraps has no off-hand, but great cleave unarmed/with wraps does (may only apply to some race/gender combinations). I think the off-hand procs on cleaves apply to all enemies hit but it might be just once per cleave.

Holy sword applies the +1 enhancement bonus (and previously the +1[w] bonus), but does not increase crit range unarmed. I don't know if it increases crit multiplier.

Cleaves may break your attack sequence, but vs large groups, it gives monks some much needed aoe dps. And with off-hand procs on great cleave, it can give quite a lot of ki in one swing.

[elg582]

Just some ideas to think about:

Cleaves + unarmed combat is terribad... breaks your attack sequence, there's half a second pause before you start attacking after cleaving (maybe less, but there is a small pause), no doublestrike, no off-hand attack (and no off-hand doublestrike as a result). Cleaves were needed for OC in the past, thankfully this is past.

I've done it both ways, and I always miss the AoE damage when fighting groups; I'm happier about not needing 23 STR! But you're right, I don't use cleaves against single enemies.

With thunderforged handwraps you'll have 10.5[W] base damage as pure, better have this W be d8. It's +10.5dmg per fist compared to d6.

DPS is less of a concern than survivability, and with as much undead running around end game, Sealed Life is huge. And, of course, the rest of the Shintao tree is ****

Idk if you have access to harper tree, but if you do, KtA is way better than DM for monks since your main tactical attack is not STR based. A simple spellpoints augment is enough to use it without problems (and INT of course )

Now, I thought KtA was bugged with unarmed; I can move some ap around, if need be.

The only benefit you get from Blinding Speed is 1% dodge if you're using an item with Speed XV, like Epic Boots of the Innocent. I recommend dropping it for Improved Martial Arts, since you're gonna have 12 monk levels anyway by the looks of it.


Cheers

Excellent point, I will swap out BS for IMA.

Thanks!

[Fafnir]

I specified fleshie partly because all of my gear is already set up, but also because I already have 3 bladeforged builds, including a 3rd-life paladin/monk/rogue staff user, and their utility has been... exaggerated. The racial reconstruct, for example, never gets anywhere near 500-point heals (which as you point out, is still a little low); with a reconstruct augment slotted, I'm getting ~225 hp back. You can get that out out of a UMD'd Heal scroll.

My reconstruct SLA hits for 774 per cast and is quickened. This is in full dps mode. It is fairly easy to get over 600 per cast and you could get as high as 900 (or more) if you wanted to.