I am enamored with the Harper tree and wonder how feasible it would be to create a first-life solo wolf 32-pt build based on int. This would be a heroic only build. I would need a lot of feats since I like to include SWF & TWF plus PA, C, & GC so I assume I would need some fighter splashes. Perhaps 2 rogue for traps & evasion. Casting only for buffs & heals.
I am pretty new to DDO so any advice or recommendations would be appreciated.
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Thread: Int-based Wolf Build Possible
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12-10-2014, 07:25 AM #1Community Member
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Int-based Wolf Build Possible
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12-10-2014, 08:22 AM #2Community Member
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Here is my initial try at the first 8 levels:
Enough str for PA and enough dex for TWF. I have Vet II ability so it needs to be solo-able at level 7. I would have liked GC by then, but not enough BAB.Code:Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.23.01 DDO Character Planner Home Page CleverWolf Level 8 True Neutral Human Male (4 Fighter \ 1 Rogue \ 3 Druid) Hit Points: 111 Spell Points: 260 BAB: 6\6\11 Fortitude: 9 Reflex: 7 Will: 3 Starting Feat/Enhancement Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats (32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 8) Strength 13 13 Dexterity 15 15 Constitution 14 14 Intelligence 17 17 Wisdom 8 8 Charisma 8 8 Starting Feat/Enhancement Base Skills Modified Skills Skills (Level 1) (Level 8) Balance 2 2 Bluff -1 -1 Concentration 2 2 Diplomacy -1 -1 Disable Device n/a n/a Haggle -1 -1 Heal -1 -1 Hide 2 2 Intimidate -1 -1 Jump 1 1 Listen -1 -1 Move Silently 2 2 Open Lock n/a n/a Perform n/a n/a Repair 3 3 Search 3 3 Spellcraft 3 3 Spot -1 -1 Swim 1 1 Tumble n/a n/a Use Magic Device n/a n/a Level 1 (Rogue) Feat: (Selected) Single Weapon Fighting Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting Level 2 (Fighter) Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack Level 3 (Fighter) Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Cleave Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes Level 4 (Druid) Level 5 (Druid) Feat: (Druid Wild Shape) Wild Shape: Wolf Level 6 (Druid) Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell Level 7 (Fighter) Level 8 (Fighter) Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave
I am concerned about defense. Is there too much early emphasis on dps?
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12-10-2014, 09:20 AM #3Community Member
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the harper tree intelligence bonus to attack and damage DOESN'T apply to unarmed combat (so doesn't apply to wolf bites).
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12-10-2014, 10:25 AM #4Build Constructionist
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Unfortunately STR-to-dmg is the only option for unarmed builds, inc. shapeshifters.
Originally Posted by Larla
Although I believe Know the Angles will apply to unarmed dmg, so you could do a STR+INT-based wolf build if you wanted.
The only way to get both SWF and TWF is by taking rgr 2; so your third class can be either ftr for the extra feats & defensive stance, monk for Evasion, feats & stances, or rog for trap skills & Evasion.I would need a lot of feats since I like to include SWF & TWF plus PA, C, & GC so I assume I would need some fighter splashes. Perhaps 2 rogue for traps & evasion.Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.
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12-10-2014, 01:01 PM #5Community Member
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Well, I guess that answers my title question -- too bad.
Assuming I go with rogue for traps & evasion and ranger, what would be a good feat list (since I will have less feats to play with)?
And what class splits should I use -- I guess 2 for rogue but how many ranger?
Full mêlée wolf for heroic only --
Thanks --
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12-10-2014, 03:07 PM #6Build Constructionist
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Well, you could stop at rgr 2, but going to rgr 6 gets you ITWF free (and Manyshot); you can also pick up Dance of Death (which apparently works while shapeshifted, altho it means giving up NW T5s) and Exposing Strike (nice on a build with a decent amount of sneak atks). So, maybe druid 12 / rgr 6 / rog 2? [Or maybe druid 13 / rgr 6 / rog 1: skip Evasion for extra PRR/MRR and lvl 7 spells.] Feats are an issue, though, since you only get 8 heroic (presuming human) and 3 epic and your wishlist includes: SWF/ISWF/GSWF; GTWF; IC:Blunt; Power Atk and/or Precision; Natural Fighting x3; Overwhelming Crit. Oh, and because of BAB pre-reqs and needing druid 9 for Natural Fighting, you have a lot of feats fighting for the same higher-lvl slots.
I don't really know what's the optimal lvling order: maybe rog 1, druid 1-2, rgr 1-2, druid 3-8 (winter wolf), rgr 3-6, rog 2, druid 9-12? Or rog 1, druid 1-8 to get winter wolf ASAP, then rgr. The important thing is hitting rgr 6 in time to take GTWF, whenever you plan to grab that.
Regardless, feat progression would be something like: SWF (1), Power Atk (1), <opt 1> (3), <opt 2> (6), ISWF (9), IC:Blunt (12), GSWF (15), GTWF (18), Overwhelming Crit (21). The optional feats can be Cleave & GC, or a couple of metamagics, or whatever else you want. Ironically, I think the Natural Fighting feats provide the smallest DPS boost compared to the "broken" TWF feats, so they're the first I ditch.
Enhancements: I would put 11 APs into DWS for Exposing Strike, +4d6 SA, and some Pos Spellpower (or maybe Tendon Cut). Then it's a matter of which T5 you want, Tempest or NW; my hunch is Dance of Death is better for clearing trash mobs while Celerity is better for boss-killing, but don't take my word for it! Plenty of room for experimenting, anyway.Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.
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12-10-2014, 03:48 PM #7Build Constructionist
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Just playing with the builder:
8 APs saved for Harper (KtA). Went with NW T5, so thought I would go DWS for Killer (+20% doublestrike).Code:Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.23.01 DDO Character Planner Home Page Level 21 True Neutral Human Female (1 Rogue \ 6 Ranger \ 13 Druid \ 1 Epic) Hit Points: 250 Spell Points: 810 BAB: 15\15\20\25\25 Fortitude: 15 Reflex: 14 Will: 9 Starting Feat/Enhancement Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats (32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 21) Strength 16 26 Dexterity 14 17 Constitution 14 14 Intelligence 16 16 Wisdom 8 8 Charisma 8 8 Tomes Used +3 Tome of Strength used at level 11 +3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11 Level 1 (Rogue) Feat: (Selected) Power Attack Feat: (Human Bonus) Single Weapon Fighting Level 2 (Druid) Level 3 (Druid) Feat: (Selected) Cleave Feat: (Druid Wild Shape) Wild Shape: Wolf Level 4 (Druid) Ability Raise: STR Level 5 (Druid) Level 6 (Ranger) Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave Level 7 (Druid) Feat: (Druid Wild Shape) Wild Shape: Bear Level 8 (Druid) Ability Raise: STR Level 9 (Druid) Feat: (Selected) Improved Single Weapon Fighting Level 10 (Druid) Feat: (Druid Wild Shape) Wild Shape: Winter Wolf Level 11 (Ranger) Level 12 (Ranger) Ability Raise: STR Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons Level 13 (Ranger) Level 14 (Ranger) Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant Level 15 (Ranger) Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting Level 16 (Druid) Ability Raise: STR Level 17 (Druid) Level 18 (Druid) Feat: (Selected) Greater Single Weapon Fighting Feat: (Druid Wild Shape) Wild Shape: Dire Bear Level 19 (Druid) Level 20 (Druid) Ability Raise: STR Feat: (Druid Wild Shape) Wild Shape: Water Elemental Enhancement: Human - Human Versatility: Damage Boost (Rank 1) Enhancement: Human - Improved Recovery (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Nature's Warrior (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Instinctive Fighting (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Instinctive Fighting (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Instinctive Fighting (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Extra Wild Empathy (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Extra Wild Empathy (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Extra Wild Empathy (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Shifting Rake (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Shifting Rake (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Flight (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Flight (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Flight (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Vengeful Hunter (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Vengeful Hunter (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Vengeful Hunter (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Action Boost: Double Strike (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Action Boost: Double Strike (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Action Boost: Double Strike (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Fight (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Fight (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Fight (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Fatal Harrier (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Fatal Harrier (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Fatal Harrier (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Nature's Warrior Strength (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Essence of the Shrike (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Essence of the Shrike (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Nature's Warrior Strength (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Alpha Strike (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Alpha Strike (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Alpha Strike (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Celerity (Rank 1) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Celerity (Rank 2) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Celerity (Rank 3) Enhancement: Nature's Warrior (Drd) - Natural Adept (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Far Shot (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Sneak Attack (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Exposing Strike (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Stealthy (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Stealthy (Rank 2) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Increased Empathy (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Increased Empathy (Rank 2) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Tendon Cut (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Tendon Cut (Rank 2) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Tendon Cut (Rank 3) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Empathic Healing (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Favored Accuracy (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Favored Accuracy (Rank 2) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Favored Accuracy (Rank 3) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Favored Damage (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Favored Damage (Rank 2) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Favored Damage (Rank 3) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Killer (Rank 1) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Killer (Rank 2) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Killer (Rank 3) Enhancement: Deepwood Stalker (Rgr) - Merciful Strike (Rank 1) Enhancement: Season's Herald (Drd) - Seasoned (Rank 1) Enhancement: Season's Herald (Drd) - Beguile (Rank 1) Enhancement: Season's Herald (Drd) - Beguile (Rank 2) Enhancement: Season's Herald (Drd) - Beguile (Rank 3) Level 21 (Epic) Feat: (Selected) Epic: Overwhelming Critical
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12-11-2014, 03:14 AM #8Community Member
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How about Bearform?
Is this still viable for Bearform. Originally Posted by unbongwah
I tried the 8druid 12monk
Then I went the SWF + TWF 10druid,6ranger,4fighter . Base damage is about 160-180, crits 700-2400 depending on Attack skill used.
Is there any way to get DPS up?
Attack speed is 40% dbl strike is 35%
PRR in heavy Armor is 180
90 AC
I only ever use this toon for Bearform builds but am struggling to match my other toons Swashbuckler and Paladin builds and now Barbarian.
When will DDO update the animal form DPS?
Even the ED for animal form is terrible, fur needs some love.
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12-11-2014, 06:55 AM #9Community Member
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unbongwah -- thanks for the detailed response. I will start this build and see how it goes.
Any recommendations for low level equipment (lev 7). Usually use a scimitar when playing around with druids. Also, how to take advantage of SA while soloing?
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12-11-2014, 08:14 AM #10Build Constructionist
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Well, as viable as any bear build gets, which is to say your DPS will always be behind wolves, thanks to slower atk speed and worse crit specs. Originally Posted by Chimeran1
The most interesting bear build I saw relied on Cleave atks, which aren't affected by atk speed; so you cycle thru Cleave/GC/Supreme Cleave/Alpha Strike as fast as possible. And that build still would've done more DPS as a wolf, because there's no getting around the higher crit range of wolf form.
These days I would say druid 9 / monk 9 / rgr 2 is the better way to go on a Drunken Wolf; or rather, it's the only way to get TWF+SWF+Imp Evasion, for as long as that loophole lasts...I tried the 8druid 12monk
That would be my preferred approach: extra feats, defensive stance, hvy armor for more PRR/MRR. But OP wanted trap skills, soooo...Then I went the SWF + TWF 10druid,6ranger,4fighter .
If there is, you let us know.Is there any way to get DPS up?
You're fighting a lost cause: it's clear Turbine intended bears to be the "tank-y" form, but apparently forgot how their own aggro mechanics work, in that you need DPS to hold threat. Any melee-oriented druid build will do better DPS in wolf form; and any caster-oriented druid would be better off in elemental form.I only ever use this toon for Bearform builds but am struggling to match my other toons Swashbuckler and Paladin builds and now Barbarian.
One of the perks of being a wolf is the base weapon type doesn't matter, only what bonuses it provides. [I think the non-prof. penalty now applies to animal forms, though; but don't forget you can UMD Master's Touch scrolls.] So for your mainhand weapon, look for <something> burst of <something useful> you can use. The biggest downside is +[W] modifiers on weapons don't carry over to animal-form atks. Originally Posted by Larla
However, remember that Shillelagh will, so wooden clubs & scepters actually become useful, at least for a while; +0.5[W] is better than nothing.
Named weapons with augment slots to tweak your DPS or Spellpower are also handy; e.g., Sickle of Sypheros can usually be bought cheap, gives you Frost + red aug.
For armor and shields, this list may help: http://ddowiki.com/page/Druid_equipment
Swampscale is the lowest-lvl "druid-compatible" named med armor, which will provide a decent boost to PRR & MRR over light leather. Its inherent bonuses are not great (who cares about Swim?), but you can use the aug slots to add, say, Heavy Fortification and a stat or skill bonus. Plus it's BTA, so you can pass it to any alts if you've got a shared bank.
Blind effects like Sleet Storm (don't forget to buff with FoM!) and Radiance weapons; Bluff skill + Baiting Bite; equipping Deception / Imp Deception items (pref. in a gear slot like Golden Guile, so your mainhand is reserved for DPS).Also, how to take advantage of SA while soloing?
Finally, don't forget that Ice Storm, Creeping Cold, and Gtr Creeping Cold have no saves, so it's worth investing in Glaciation spellpower to use them, at least while heroic leveling, IMHO. Sleet Storm+Ice Storm+Cleaves is a good way to make short work of mobs. Essence of the Shrike will give you a steady stream of temp SPs; so don't forget to use them for Alpha Strikes, Baiting Bite, heals, etc.Last edited by unbongwah; 12-18-2014 at 09:46 AM.
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12-11-2014, 11:28 AM #11Community Member
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If you are planning on reusing the Swampscale then I might suggest a Master's Gift for the Colorless slot. You can get much better stats or skill bonuses on gear than via augments and it's nice to be able to use your trinket slot for something other than a Voice (e.g. the Blur + Dodge trinket from Cove) without losing XP when you don't swap the Voice in at the right time. It's a bit of a pain running Delera's and Threnal to get one, but pays off in the long run IMO. Originally Posted by unbongwah
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12-11-2014, 11:32 AM #12Community Member
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Bear builds with whirlwind tho are really interesting.
Same principle as tree builds, but way way way less dps
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12-13-2014, 07:13 PM #13Community Member
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What about the fire sword spell? That uses wisdom for both damage and to-hit, doesn't it? Originally Posted by unbongwah
Unfortunately STR-to-dmg is the only option for unarmed builds, inc. shapeshifters. Although I believe Know the Angles will apply to unarmed dmg, so you could do a STR+INT-based wolf build if you wanted.
The only way to get both SWF and TWF is by taking rgr 2; so your third class can be either ftr for the extra feats & defensive stance, monk for Evasion, feats & stances, or rog for trap skills & Evasion.
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12-13-2014, 08:47 PM #14Community Member
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The swords themselves do, but damage mods are an innate weapon property, and not magical treasure effects, so don't transfer over in animal form when fighting unarmed with the magical treasure effects of your weapon. Every stat type, including damage range, damage mods, and crit profiles found on non-magical weapons should not transfer over. Originally Posted by chrissybunny
I never tested Harper Int to damage though, but unless it is bugged it shouldn't work in animal form either.Last edited by Tilomere; 12-13-2014 at 08:59 PM.
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