U24 - Ravager Update

[Qhualor]

40 hp from Blood Strength that must not be per hit because its once in awhile. I cleared the room in EE LOD, scrolled through my combat log and saw it twice. still not seeing any heals from kills. I need to figure out posting a video.

[poltt48]

Interesting. Is your take on the reliability based on theory or trying it out on Lamannia?

One test we did internally involved a moderately-geared first-life 20Brb/8Epic running Epic Hard eNecro quests with no other forms of healing besides Blood Strength; she never went below 90% health. Different players' playstyles may give varying mileage, though, so I'd be interested to see what people think after giving it a test drive (especially on pure Barbs).

I tried running a quest with blood str and I got it to work maybe 1 out of every 10 mob I killed when suppose to be 100% on killing mob and never worked on just hitting needless to say I died on EN since other procs from trees made me unable to cast at all and blood str sucked.

[Scrabbler]

It seems like Blood Strength should add both Barbarian and Epic level into your healing.

I imagine the self-healing in the other 2 trees should also include Epic level that way.

[Qhualor]

in case it wasn't seen. I put it originally in the wrong thread.

http://youtu.be/-Wddy2s3p5U

take what you will from this video. I wasn't concentrating on playing well. I just wanted to show more of the healing proc chances. the video is only 10 minutes and didn't make it to the shrine before I ran out of time. the gear is dojo stuff and not what I have for this character mostly on Live because same situation as my other characters, no TR cache. if you notice too I only have 100% fort which was reduced to 90% so that explains some of the big damage hits I was taking. didn't feel like spending a long time getting SF favor, but I wish I had after this run chugging all those CSW pots. pretty decent healing from CSW pots though. the 5 points is from Greater Regeneration. also, what is D N T NotForPlayers?

edit: after watching the video, you notice the new Monster Champion including the shadow from the Eidolons necklace.

[XxJFGxX]

It seems like Blood Strength should add both Barbarian and Epic level into your healing.

I imagine the self-healing in the other 2 trees should also include Epic level that way.

I think Blood Strength should give a 5% weapon damage increase/doublestrike/haste for 15 sec after you kill something while raged. It seems to be fitting for something called blood strength.

[Therrias]

Post your feedback about the changes to the Ravager tree here!

Capstone = ****. It has no DPS. Even if you take tier 5 in ravager, you are better off getting a different capstone. ADD DPS HERE, I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH.
Other cores = Pain touch, HP, and Heal amp are all good, but the fury mechanic is pointless if you are going to cap it at 6.
Blood Strength = bugged. Needs to proc when it says its going to proc, and that advertised rate should probably go up.
Critical Rage = bugged. Does not improve with Improved Critical (like all other + crit range abilities do). Also does not always apply to offhand weapons.
Critical Fury = pointless because so many other abilities give fury and it caps at 6 so it's always going to be capped anyway.
I like pain = good in theory...I never actually noticed it proc, so it probably needs a higher proc rate.

Action boost, hardy rage, and barbarian power attack are good as they are. Everything else is bland filler.

[Dagolar]

Ravager is by far the weakest of the trees-
Oh, I'm not talking about the enhancements, assuming Cruel Cut and Slaughter are no longer broken.

I'm saying that:
Ravager fails in damage comparison to Knight of the Chalice.
Ravager fails in damage comparison to Frenzied Berserker
Ravager fails in defense comparison to Occult Slayer
Ravager fails at having low level cores of interest
Ravager fails at having high level cores of interest

At the moment, getting up to the tier 5s is worth it, but building around the cores, or having any inclination to go high in the cores, or even being able to associate ravager with a concept [eg, FB for damage, Slayer for defense] is just not there.


So you've got a tree that fails to make you interested in its cores, and that fails in comparison to similar trees [eg, kotc], and fails to match up to the other barbarian trees, both in potency, and in fitting a concept.

Basically, I can't see anyone investing heavily into Ravager at the moment.

And if Slaughter and Cruel Cut are still broken? May as well scrap the tree altogether. :X


The main problems here are that Pain Touch adds negligible damage, and that the benefits to Fury in the core are, honestly, nothing more than a joke. Every single thing that matters to Fury is a single tier 5 enhancement.
Everything in core for fury wouldn't ever be worth getting, ever, for any reason.

[Cetus]

in case it wasn't seen. I put it originally in the wrong thread.

http://youtu.be/-Wddy2s3p5U

take what you will from this video. I wasn't concentrating on playing well. I just wanted to show more of the healing proc chances. the video is only 10 minutes and didn't make it to the shrine before I ran out of time. the gear is dojo stuff and not what I have for this character mostly on Live because same situation as my other characters, no TR cache. if you notice too I only have 100% fort which was reduced to 90% so that explains some of the big damage hits I was taking. didn't feel like spending a long time getting SF favor, but I wish I had after this run chugging all those CSW pots. pretty decent healing from CSW pots though. the 5 points is from Greater Regeneration. also, what is D N T NotForPlayers?

edit: after watching the video, you notice the new Monster Champion including the shadow from the Eidolons necklace.

Just...

wow

[Qhualor]

Just...

wow

can you be more specific? I can take that several different ways. don't worry, im a big boy and can handle it.

[Scrabbler]

Ravager versus Epic

• Cruel Cut is the central (active) part of playing Ravager, so it's continually painful and disappointing playing this tree once you get into Epic. Fix that, seriously!

[Scrabbler]

As predicted, the Ravager capstone is bad.

The passive hp stuff is sufficiently attractive to spend 2 AP (if you were high Ravager anyway), but the non-shared active part has little use. I have maybe 1-3 leftover Rages between shrines (depending on how careful I'm being about deaths and delays), and a 3x instakill spell doesn't have much of value (even if it was super-reliable). I think I've been through these problems enough in the older threads, and won't repeat it here.

Also, for some reason you can cast Visage of Fear without anything targeted, despite it being a single-target effect.

[XxJFGxX]

As predicted, the Ravager capstone is bad.

The passive hp stuff is sufficiently attractive to spend 2 AP (if you were high Ravager anyway), but the non-shared active part has little use. I have maybe 1-3 leftover Rages between shrines (depending on how careful I'm being about deaths and delays), and a 3x instakill spell doesn't have much of value (even if it was super-reliable). I think I've been through these problems enough in the older threads, and won't repeat it here.

Also, for some reason you can cast Visage of Fear without anything targeted, despite it being a single-target effect.

The Visage of Terror should be a AoE like a primal scream.

[Scrabbler]

The Visage of Terror should be a AoE like a primal scream.

One dev (who has probably moved to other things) said that Visage of Terror was already an AOE.

However, for the Ravager capstone they should really just move away from instakill spells as being an important part of the value.

[Severlin]

Visage of Terror is not currently an AoE on Lamannia. It is changing to be an AoE, and the Paralyze will no longer allow for a saving throw when the patch goes live.

(Also, Blood Strength is bugged and is not activating when you kill a foe.)

Sev~

[Scrabbler]

So the capstone VOT attack will change to kill or stun a whole pile of monsters, but you can only use it 9 times per rest, or realistically 1-3 times if you rely on Critical Rage or other important Barb powers.

That's not terrible, although it's of less use than I'd like a capstone to be. It's an emergency button that you will only rarely have an opportunity to get good use from- unless you're in over your head in which case you'll run out of uses fast. (A lot of the active-button capstones have that problem)


I still recommend a different approach to the Ravager capstone:

Add some other flavorful passive bonuses to the capstone (fear immune, Evil damage, poison on vorpals). Keep VOT as single-target with a save for death and para, but remove the Rage cost. Instead, the cost is 60 seconds of 1d6 less Pain Touch damage (can't use if already at zero).

[Qhualor]

Visage of Terror is not currently an AoE on Lamannia. It is changing to be an AoE, and the Paralyze will no longer allow for a saving throw when the patch goes live.

(Also, Blood Strength is bugged and is not activating when you kill a foe.)

Sev~

for a capstone and that it costs a rage per use, it seems excessive to me when rages are limited. typically you should be able to have enough rages to go from shrine to shrine, but it makes Visage of Terror useable maybe a couple times per shrine. off the top of my head, I cant think of any other class that has as big of a cost and (even though the cooldown is just 30 seconds) with such a long cooldown for an AOE attack. I believe its one or the other. this is also only good for trash mobs and does nothing on a boss fight. I like it as an AOE, but the rage cost interferes with its coolness.

I would suggest to remove the rage cost and increase the cooldown to at minimum 3 minutes.

or

make it more useful against bosses too. kinda chancey to use up your rages on a boss fight, but if its powerful enough it could be worth the risk.

[Cetus]

Visage of Terror is not currently an AoE on Lamannia. It is changing to be an AoE, and the Paralyze will no longer allow for a saving throw when the patch goes live.

(Also, Blood Strength is bugged and is not activating when you kill a foe.)

Sev~

Good move - but our limited rages really make this largely look like eye candy. Not very practical unless we have more either significantly more rages, or some kind of regen mechanic (which should really be part of the barbarian class upon hitting 20 or something).

[Seikojin]

Visage of Terror is not currently an AoE on Lamannia. It is changing to be an AoE, and the Paralyze will no longer allow for a saving throw when the patch goes live.

(Also, Blood Strength is bugged and is not activating when you kill a foe.)

Sev~

Can you get QA to drop a build on Lam this week? I would like to see closer to live changes since there is a lot of feedback saying barb still needs some buffing.

[Axcarth]

What about the barbarian ravager's visage of terror stops working after 4-5 times it is used? Is it a known issue?
You can use it only 3-4 (5) times top, and then it stops, and you can even see your toon's visage of terror animation showing on but it never gets sent through to terror anyone.