Ranged Combat Improvement Discussion

[Thayion516]

The problem is not that MS is too weak, I'm not suggesting a buff my suggestion is to make manyshot a passive affect that is always on but less powerful so instead of _______^_____ it becomes ----------- and 10k stars would have a similar effect except be wisdom based.

This would:

1. Make it less abusable by melee characters (since its no longer a short duration MASSIVE burst)
2. Ranged characters would be more fun since their no longer SUPER slow during the former "off-MS" period
3. Make tanking less of a PITA w/ MS/10k users
4. Monks would no longer dominate since obviously MS & 10k would no longer stack

On Rangers:

They are perfectly welcome to do that, it doesn't mean they should get both combat styles for free otherwise Barbarians for example should get Toughness, The THF Line and Power Attack for free since most of them do anyways. (I'm NOT actually suggesting this, just using it to illustrate my point)

I actually like having the options of building tword manyshot on my non-ranger builds. I usually give up 4 feats to get Manyshot burst DPS. Seems fair to me.

Rangers should get the 2WF feats for free OR give them Bonus Feats every 4 levels.

Barbarians are a known issue for balance so that comparison is obviously meant to be lopsided. They are getting a pass very soon according to Sev.

[FestusHood]

The problem is not that MS is too weak, I'm not suggesting a buff my suggestion is to make manyshot a passive affect that is always on but less powerful so instead of _______^_____ it becomes ----------- and 10k stars would have a similar effect except be wisdom based.

I would not like to see manyshot and 10k stars basically turned into the same ability, just using different stats.

The only problem i see with manyshot is the ability to combine slayer arrow and adrenaline with it. That's the only time i see really wow numbers that make me think it might be overpowered.

I don't want to see adrenaline changed to only work on the first arrow of a manyshot volley. That would be a huge nerf, and i'm afraid it might leave archery non viable again. I would rather they just make it so that the slayer arrows can't be thrown into the mix.

Given all the above, it may be that just making it impossible to have manyshot and 10k stars available on the same build could be as much nerfing as is necessary.

Removing the doubleshot debuff is a good idea, provided they also make 10k stars and manyshot incompatible.

[Scrabbler]

I know, but I don't think being able to use Manyshot and THEN 10k stars after wards is WAI.

I believe the intent was to only have one "manyshot" ability available to everyone and one exclusively for Monks only.

Sorry, you're incorrect.

It does not make any sense to allow players to benefit from Manyshot and then 10k Stars in sequence, but I spoke to the designer immediately when he announced it and that was the plan. This was coming off 4 years of 10kstars being a pathetically worthless ability, so apparently he felt like shifting from one extreme to the other? Whatever.

The good design would be for Manyshot and 10kstars to share cooldown, so having both of them is no benefit (except for flexibility with bow vs shuriken).

[Thayion516]

I would not like to see manyshot and 10k stars basically turned into the same ability, just using different stats.

The only problem i see with manyshot is the ability to combine slayer arrow and adrenaline with it. That's the only time i see really wow numbers that make me think it might be overpowered.

I don't want to see adrenaline changed to only work on the first arrow of a manyshot volley. That would be a huge nerf, and i'm afraid it might leave archery non viable again. I would rather they just make it so that the slayer arrows can't be thrown into the mix.

Given all the above, it may be that just making it impossible to have manyshot and 10k stars available on the same build could be as much nerfing as is necessary.

Removing the doubleshot debuff is a good idea, provided they also make 10k stars and manyshot incompatible.

Yes I agree.

The equation of: Manyshot + Slayer Arrow + Adrenaline + 4 Arrow triggers + 10K Stars, is too much. Somthing in that equation is going to have to be removed.

[dontmater]

i would be happy if precise shot could be turned off... and NO not archers focus.. precise shot .... playing a lowbie archer without is fun

[Failedlegend]

i would be happy if precise shot could be turned off... and NO not archers focus.. precise shot .... playing a lowbie archer without is fun

Huh?

[Requiro]

Yes I agree.

The equation of: Manyshot + Slayer Arrow + Adrenaline + 4 Arrow triggers + 10K Stars, is too much. Somthing in that equation is going to have to be removed.

Well... Technically you can't use both Manyshot and 10K Stars in the same time ;-)

But without joke, maybe something like this:
• Extend duration Manyshot feat for 30 second, with the same cooldown.
• But you can only shoot 3 arrows ( 2nd with 6 BAB, 3rd with 11 BAB)
• And synergies:
- o Core 5 AA Ability set Debuf doubleshoot from Manyshoot feat to 40 second.
- o Core 6 AA Ability set Debuf doubleshoot from Manyshoot feat to 30 second (just for duration of the Active ability)
- o Core 6 DWS Ability Adds additional 4th arrow while Manyshoot with -50% to hit Penalty.

That will made more option for Ranged Fighting for everyone.