Conjure Bolts: No Point for Higher Levels

[droid327]

Conjure Bolt scrolls work now - wonderful, this is something that was sorely needed for a long time, and makes non-Arti Repeater builds actually viable.

That being established, maybe we can get a small tweak to how the spell functions natively, to do two things: make it more useful to use natively than from scrolls, and make it more useful to invest in more Arti levels. Right now, there's no functional difference in the type of bolts summoned, because the +bonus from your xbow is always going to be more than the +bonus from the bolts you can summon. Even a L20 Arti might as well just carry a stack of scrolls (not that there's anything more worthwhile to slot in L1, though).

Instead of just a non-stacking and pointless Enhancement bonus, add a multiselector with additional options as the CL of the spell improves, to provide some of the functionality for dedicated Arti RXB users that dedicated Archers get with AA?

CL1: Summon a stack of +1 bolts
CL3: Summon a stack of +1 Morphic bolts (ie, Bludgeon+Slash+Pierce)
CL6: Summon a stack of +1 Metalline bolts
CL12: Summon a stack of +1 Aligned bolts
CL18: Summon a stack of +1 Vorpal bolts (for the proc damage, obviously not the +[W] part)
CL20: Summon a stack of +1 Improved Vorpal bolts

So, again, this provides a reward for people going deep into Arti for RXB output (not just for spell DCs and L6 infusions on caster-focused Artis). It doesn't completely deprecate the Aligned/Metal weapon enchantments since you still have DRs like Silver+Good that'd require both ammo and weapon enchantment (and Aligned and Metal Weapons aren't used much now anyway). It provides Artis the same diversity in DR that AAs have (for the same reason).

[FranOhmsford]

Nice ideas.

However: I will say that the none stacking does help with crafting i.e. no need to add a + to your crafted X-bow and therefore can get better Pre and Suffixes.

[droid327]

Nice ideas.

However: I will say that the none stacking does help with crafting i.e. no need to add a + to your crafted X-bow and therefore can get better Pre and Suffixes.

I thought of that, on paper But in reality, the conditions required so that a conjured bolt is more effective than on-weapon Enhancement are very few and specific.

But, heck, there's no reason they actually all have to be +1. Keep the incremented Enhancement bonus, so it goes from +1 at CL1 to +6 at CL20, if that's not technically troublesome. The whole problem was that bonus was largely pointless anyway....so leave it in for the few times it isn't pointless

[Toro12]

It is a level 1 spell with little to no opportunity cost.
Log in cast a bunch and your done for the session.

If the spell cost increased significantly at each of the tiers and bolts disappeared at rest and or quest entrances, maybe.

[UurlockYgmeov]

if you want all that - be an AA.

conjure bolts increase + with levels; but do not return.
summon arrows (AA) are static +1; but do return.

Seems a fair trade off.

If you want other things - there is already a wand/spell/scroll that conjures fire bolt/arrow/et al.

[dontmater]

2.5 years in the making... do the deadly scrolls work too now?

[droid327]

2.5 years in the making... do the deadly scrolls work too now?

They work just fine. They enchant the scroll you're wielding, just as the spell says

Actually, you can use them for TWF, cant you, by enchanting each weapon in the offhand? Just horribly expensive since they're uncommon drops

[dontmater]

They work just fine. They enchant the scroll you're wielding, just as the spell says

Actually, you can use them for TWF, cant you, by enchanting each weapon in the offhand? Just horribly expensive since they're uncommon drops

try casting them on someone else..

[G_Lich]

if you want all that - be an AA.

conjure bolts increase + with levels; but do not return.
summon arrows (AA) are static +1; but do return.

Seems a fair trade off.

If you want other things - there is already a wand/spell/scroll that conjures fire bolt/arrow/et al.

Sounds like a dev's thought process, economical and logical, as you probably have to be... juggling a million tasks

Knowing how its designed and not how its being played is uninformed and uninformed comments then those devs have to dig through piles if **** to get the solid nuggets of useful info.

D&D takes the highest of the ammo or the weapon. Ammo never goes above the average weapon plus that one uses from level 10 forward. i.e. conjured +6 bolts would be as good as +0 bolts in a +6 weapon.

The "benefit" of summoning higher ammo falls flat when +5 weapons are plentiful. Arti/Mech may not have imbues, but they could definitely use a serious bump. Yes you can craft a WoP and use at level 7 with no +bonus but again this stops being good dead at level 11. and is pointless at 20+ - design runs out when epic is arrived but wouldnt help much considering battle engineer will take your thunderforged all the way up to +15

A returning bolt would be preferred to running out of bolts in the middle of a fusillade unless you want to micromanage bag space in quest. annoying... not fun

[Kipling]

Sounds like a dev's thought process, economical and logical, as you probably have to be... juggling a million tasks

Knowing how its designed and not how its being played is uninformed and uninformed comments then those devs have to dig through piles if **** to get the solid nuggets of useful info.

D&D takes the highest of the ammo or the weapon. Ammo never goes above the average weapon plus that one uses from level 10 forward. i.e. conjured +6 bolts would be as good as +0 bolts in a +6 weapon.

The "benefit" of summoning higher ammo falls flat when +5 weapons are plentiful. Arti/Mech may not have imbues, but they could definitely use a serious bump. Yes you can craft a WoP and use at level 7 with no +bonus but again this stops being good dead at level 11. and is pointless at 20+ - design runs out when epic is arrived but wouldnt help much considering battle engineer will take your thunderforged all the way up to +15

A returning bolt would be preferred to running out of bolts in the middle of a fusillade unless you want to micromanage bag space in quest. annoying... not fun

One large thin quiver will hold 3k bolts. If 2k are 75% returning, how many quivers do you need for one quest?

[droid327]

One large thin quiver will hold 3k bolts. If 2k are 75% returning, how many quivers do you need for one quest?

I generally go through about 1 stack per quest, on average (more on Hard, less on Normal).

2k at 75% + 1k at 0% is 9k. I generally go through about 1k per quest on average (more on Hard, less on Normal, and depending on quest length). That means you'd have to run back to Deneith every 9th quest, or carry multiple quivers. That's inconvenient to the point of being inviable.

But the scrolls work now, so no one has to - what was the point with that? You can conjure up enough bolts for a quest when you buff up at the start.

Forgot about BE imbues, that's a good point - if you're getting your Enhancement bonus from your bolts, you lose out on the +1 at 3 and +2 at 12.

[Oxarhamar]

One large thin quiver will hold 3k bolts. If 2k are 75% returning, how many quivers do you need for one quest?

Much rather buy a stack of 100 conjure scrolls every other week than buy 3k bolts at the end of every quest chain.

[Kipling]

Sounds like the greatest advantage is for new lowbie toons

[Oxarhamar]

Sounds like the greatest advantage is for new lowbie toons

Or anyone who would rather carry 1 stack of 100 scrolls restocking on bolts every 33333 shots for a repeater instead of running to house D vender every other quest.

[Tscheuss]

Or anyone who would rather carry 1 stack of 100 scrolls restocking on bolts every 33333 shots for a repeater instead of running to house D vender every other quest.

I use my repeater for everything, and I cannot imagine running low on bolts "every other quest". A complete Gianthold saga run is less than 1k returning bolts. I do carry an extra quiver in case I get forgetful, but the times I use it are very rare. I may try the Conjure Bolts scrolls again when the fix comes out, since the scrolls are much lighter than their equivalent in bolts. A weak character would be less likely to be encumbered by ammunition that way.

[FranOhmsford]

One large thin quiver will hold 3k bolts. If 2k are 75% returning, how many quivers do you need for one quest?

Quivers have multiple slots BUT don't allow you to stack the same bolts in more than one slot!

Conjured Bolts don't even go in Quivers!

I cast 5 x Conjure Bolts on my Artis when I log on - Within 2 or 3 quests I'm casting more!

Having to go back to House D and buy up multiple types of Bolts every coupla quests is irritating and pure time wasting!

AND buying Multiple Quivers is all well and good but you cannot swap these in from your bar and have to open inventory to do so!

Also: Can we please get Bolt Cases AND have Quivers set to just accept Arrows! - 1 stack of Arrows picked up in a quest can really be annoying on a Rogue Mech!

[droid327]

I use my repeater for everything, and I cannot imagine running low on bolts "every other quest". A complete Gianthold saga run is less than 1k returning bolts. I do carry an extra quiver in case I get forgetful, but the times I use it are very rare. I may try the Conjure Bolts scrolls again when the fix comes out, since the scrolls are much lighter than their equivalent in bolts. A weak character would be less likely to be encumbered by ammunition that way.

Sorry but I gotta call bs on that. You cannot get through all of GH with 4000 shots fired. Defending the seers in Madstone alone would take a quarter of that...

[FranOhmsford]

Sorry but I gotta call bs on that. You cannot get through all of GH with 4000 shots fired. Defending the seers in Madstone alone would take a quarter of that...

You missed out a word at the end there.

That word is "EACH".

[Tscheuss]

Sorry but I gotta call bs on that. You cannot get through all of GH with 4000 shots fired. Defending the seers in Madstone alone would take a quarter of that...

You missed out a word at the end there.

That word is "EACH".

Hmm. If you are using so many bolts in one quest, then you are obviously doing it...


differently than I am.

[droid327]

Hmm. If you are using so many bolts in one quest, then you are obviously doing it...


differently than I am.

Yes, apparently we just need to start invisizerging on Casual