TWF locks out Single weapon fighting and visa versa

[Pilgrim1]

So, I read and was aware that single weapon fighting and two hand weapon fighting were mutually exclusive, but no where did i see that claimed that single weapon fighting and two weapon fighting were also mutually exclusive.

This was quite a shock to discover mid LR on a toon that I wanted to have both stiles available to. Right now that toon is parked at lvl 3 in the reincarnation grove while i try to figure out how to scavenge it.

So let this be an announcement to those that don't know this: TWF and SWF are mutually exclusive.

[FlaviusMaximus]

Thanks for the info.

Pokes a hole in Druid animal form plans, doesn't it?

[Munkenmo]

Thanks for the info.

Pokes a hole in Druid animal form plans, doesn't it?

Yep back to 2wf and natural fighting I go.

[Dreppo]

Are they mutually exclusive in that you can't take both SWF and TWF feats on a given character, or are they mutually exclusive in that you can't benefit from both SWF and TWF feats at the same time?

[Pilgrim1]

Are they mutually exclusive in that you can't take both SWF and TWF feats on a given character, or are they mutually exclusive in that you can't benefit from both SWF and TWF feats at the same time?

you can not have the on the same toon, picking up one locks the other out of being able to take it.

[Nayus]

Thanks for the info.

Pokes a hole in Druid animal form plans, doesn't it?

It specifically says you can't Swashbuckle in animal form.

[thegreatneil]

It specifically says you can't Swashbuckle in animal form.

SWF =/= Swashbuckling

[01000010]

It specifically says you can't Swashbuckle in animal form.

Swf and swashbuckling not same thing, swf is feat line any class can use.

[Nightmanis]

It specifically says you can't Swashbuckle in animal form.

All swashbucklers are SWFighters. But not all SWFighters are Swashbucklers

[unbongwah]

All swashbucklers are SWFighters.

Actually, that's not entirely true, either; you could make a thrower-based Swashbuckler, in which case the SWF feats do nothing for you. Not saying that's a good idea, particularly when the SWF feats are so deliciously OP (for now), but it is an option.

For that matter, my TWF pure bard just spent 11 APs on SB, which was enough to add a few pts of Dodge, Blow by Blow, Deflect Arrows, Uncanny Dodge, and Fast Movement (if it's WAI, I'm now as fast as a pure monk). It appears Coup de Grace doesn't require Swashbuckling to be active, but I'd need to spend a lot of filler AP to get it.

[Blackheartox]

Actually, that's not entirely true, either; you could make a thrower-based Swashbuckler, in which case the SWF feats do nothing for you. Not saying that's a good idea, particularly when the SWF feats are so deliciously OP (for now), but it is an option.

For that matter, my TWF pure bard just spent 11 APs on SB, which was enough to add a few pts of Dodge, Blow by Blow, Deflect Arrows, Uncanny Dodge, and Fast Movement (if it's WAI, I'm now as fast as a pure monk). It appears Coup de Grace doesn't require Swashbuckling to be active, but I'd need to spend a lot of filler AP to get it.

They give you throwing speed.

Bdw, not only is 2weapon fight locked out but also 2handed fight, basically no 2weapon druids and no dwarven axe aoe 1 weapon users.
Good way to fix it a bit

[goodspeed]

Actually, that's not entirely true, either; you could make a thrower-based Swashbuckler, in which case the SWF feats do nothing for you. Not saying that's a good idea, particularly when the SWF feats are so deliciously OP (for now), but it is an option.

For that matter, my TWF pure bard just spent 11 APs on SB, which was enough to add a few pts of Dodge, Blow by Blow, Deflect Arrows, Uncanny Dodge, and Fast Movement (if it's WAI, I'm now as fast as a pure monk). It appears Coup de Grace doesn't require Swashbuckling to be active, but I'd need to spend a lot of filler AP to get it.

ya the speed of that thing with the dmg output is really, really up there. (no shield) And its not even an ed thing lol. Id say its got a bit though before anything is changed. They're to busy with the armor stuff right now.

[mna]

For that matter, my TWF pure bard just spent 11 APs on SB, which was enough to add a few pts of Dodge, Blow by Blow, Deflect Arrows, Uncanny Dodge, and Fast Movement (if it's WAI, I'm now as fast as a pure monk).

My barbarian-splash THF Warchanter runs really fast now, too.

It appears Coup de Grace doesn't require Swashbuckling to be active, but I'd need to spend a lot of filler AP to get it.

I especially like the fact that there's a ranged version of it, for 4-ranger Bardchers and such. (Does it work if the target was paralyzed in the same volley of Manyshot? ... looks like Improved Precise Shot with that would be nice.)

I'd sort of think going with the SWF/Precision line might make sense even for a bardcher now. Especially as Precision works with longbows, too...

[IronClan]

particularly when the SWF feats are so deliciously OP (for now), but it is an option.

It's only OP for people who don't do or look at existing maths. It is inferior to TWF for single target DPS and the more procs you put on the weapons the more inferior it is.

So especially when you get to TF weapons where the Developers have decided they wont be making expanded crit profile named weapons any more, the gap widens into not even close land. TWF with Thunder Forged on crit procs or mortal fear 5% proc is strictly superior to SWF. using like weapons.

Now they may need to buff THF a little bit but SWF is not OP, and IMO only the existence of eSoS has ever made THF even competitive with TWF.

[PermaBanned]

Thanks for the info.

Pokes a hole in Druid animal form plans, doesn't it?

Why did you think SWF would work for animal form? Afaik, animal form has always equated Unarmed which is boosted by TWF.

[Munkenmo]

Why did you think SWF would work for animal form? Afaik, animal form has always equated Unarmed which is boosted by TWF.

Because it was possible to get the double stat mod, off hand procs and natural fighting for a while.

[Lonnbeimnech]

take 9 druid levels and the swf line then take 11 ranger levels and get twf autogranted.

[01000010]

take 9 druid levels and the swf line then take 11 ranger levels and get twf autogranted.

Pretty obvious, lol. Switch outta form and manyshot, does suck no div might or monk lvls.

If they copout and make it so rangers cant swf as a way to stop this build ill lmao.

I suppose going 6 ranger and adding a couple lvl monk or cler/fvs for div might is an option too, might just be more overall dps either way.

I might try 13druid/6ranger/1fvs

[unbongwah]

Yeah, this was mentioned in the Lama forums after the last or next-to-last patch before go-live, I think. Apparently there was a *cough* work-around using rgr's free TWF feats; but I didn't check to see if it also works on live.