U22 Loot Thread - Epic 3BC

[Grimlock]

My Keen insight is common sense. As you say "This is Dr. Loot. The guy in charge of loot in game" and would it not be silly to make LVL 28 gear in a LVL 25 wilderness. He is doing his job. The person to complain to is the producers. Just saying if you are going to vent then direct it where it should be.

I do not disagree with you on what they should be working on. To ask them to abort 3BC now is really short sighted of you and a wee bit selfish. You are asking them to throw months of work away, to give no "Newish" content to all the playerbase, and asking the rest of us partners to wait another 3 - 4 months for any new content.

I hear what you are saying. You make a good point about justifying this style and level of loot being somewhat appropriate for the level range - although it is in need of some serious tweaking.

My argument for this entire 3BC pack is that it does not matter. Players do not hover around level 24-25. They are doing VoN 3, EH/EE quests worth 50-100k+ a pop and will not be around this level range for long. Why? Thunderholme, ETR, end-game quests and loot that far surpasses this sub-par offering. We have a plethora of content available to us at this level range and we certainly do not need more quests to flesh out this level range.

Turbine has set the hard ceiling at Level 30. End-game needs to be expanded. We need content at levels 28-30 to keep players interested as they grind away their lives. Putting on level 24-25 loot items for a week or so seems pointless to me. The juice is not worth the squeeze while I am grinding my way towards cap.

[JOTMON]

About the hypothetical slotted mitts, you know that +8 str is a level 28 augment.

Yes, this could be a unique preloaded bonus.. or even a coloured slot stat that can be slotted at lower level but not usable in a clear slot like the current existing stat ones are.
So a yellow/blue stat could be 4 levels lower and a green slot stat could be slotted 8 levels lower..
In theory based on extrapolating current augments of +1/4 levels a clear slot +9 stat should be level 32 and +10 should be level 36.... which are both beyond the expected level cap of 30..
Adding coloured augment stat slots would bridge the usefulness of higher stat augments on level restrictions and make higher level coloured augment slot gear more desirable.
The more rare the colour the better augments could be made available and still restrictively viable.

My point is this would allow for more flexibility and usefulness of these items for all players in a wider level range while expanding the overall augment system. = win win.

[Ausdoerrt]

I hear what you are saying. You make a good point about justifying this style and level of loot being somewhat appropriate for the level range - although it is in need of some serious tweaking.

My argument for this entire 3BC pack is that it does not matter. Players do not hover around level 24-25. They are doing VoN 3, EH/EE quests worth 50-100k+ a pop and will not be around this level range for long. Why? Thunderholme, ETR, end-game quests and loot that far surpasses this sub-par offering. We have a plethora of content available to us at this level range and we certainly do not need more quests to flesh out this level range.

Turbine has set the hard ceiling at Level 30. End-game needs to be expanded. We need content at levels 28-30 to keep players interested as they grind away their lives. Putting on level 24-25 loot items for a week or so seems pointless to me. The juice is not worth the squeeze while I am grinding my way towards cap.

What if someone doesn't like GH? Variety is good.

Also, they're exploring new interesting game mechanics and possibilities in this pack, which is a good thing and could lead to more cool stuff in the future.

[Portalcat]

Seriously guys, they are not going to put 30% healing amp, vitality 40, and 3 augment slots on a level 24 item. Asking them to slot a level 28 augment on top of all that is a meaningless debate to have.

Keep your asks realistic and you might actually get them.

My argument for this entire 3BC pack is that it does not matter. Players do not hover around level 24-25.

These will be level 26 quests on EH and level 27 on EE. You know, the final levels of the ER train. They'll also drop more valcomms than eGH.


Your argument makes no sense; stop throwing complaints at the wall in the hopes that something sticks.

[Thrudh]

My argument for this entire 3BC pack is that it does not matter. Players do not hover around level 24-25. They are doing VoN 3, EH/EE quests worth 50-100k+ a pop and will not be around this level range for long. Why? Thunderholme, ETR, end-game quests and loot that far surpasses this sub-par offering. We have a plethora of content available to us at this level range and we certainly do not need more quests to flesh out this level range.

I respectfully disagree... This is a level 25 pack, hard and elite will be level 26 and level 27... In a game that currently goes to 28, I don't see why you would say they will not be run past level 25.

Plus, I would submit that many players do not hover around level 28, either... At this time, with many people eTRing, a case can certainly be made that level 24 gear, and a level 25 adventure pack is very useful.

I understand that you want more reasons to hang around level 28... more of a end-game. And many people like you want that too... But not everyone wants or needs that, right now...

Hopefully the devs are reading this thread and realize that that the only way to restore end-game for the powergamers is to create some REALLY nice loot in a level 30 super difficult dungeon, and make it super super rare to give powergamers a few months of grinding happily.

Me, and many like me, don't want that... But I'm fine with the next update being focused on people who do want that.

I promise I won't call that update worthless when it comes like you did with this update.

For me, more content is always good... I don't need super-rare shinies to chase after to enjoy this game.

[Grimlock]

I respectfully disagree... This is a level 25 pack, hard and elite will be level 26 and level 27... In a game that currently goes to 28, I don't see why you would say they will not be run past level 25.

Plus, I would submit that many players do not hover around level 28, either... At this time, with many people eTRing, a case can certainly be made that level 24 gear, and a level 25 adventure pack is very useful.

I understand that you want more reasons to hang around level 28... more of a end-game. And many people like you want that too... But not everyone wants or needs that, right now...

Hopefully the devs are reading this thread and realize that that the only way to restore end-game for the powergamers is to create some REALLY nice loot in a level 30 super difficult dungeon, and make it super super rare to give powergamers a few months of grinding happily.

Me, and many like me, don't want that... But I'm fine with the next update being focused on people who do want that.

I promise I won't call that update worthless when it comes like you did with this update.

For me, more content is always good... I don't need super-rare shinies to chase after to enjoy this game.

I am sorry, but Three Barrel Cove has been completely redone once in the past. To constantly spend development time on old hat content is redundant and is, in my opinion, a waste of resources. They did this once before with Epic Gianthold and they are doing it again.

Turbine should flesh out more final/end game content - your assumption that end game content is for powergamers is baseless. As players reach the end of their TR cycle, and finalize their characters the way they want it is important to have new content at the end of the road to keep things new and shiny. Like you said - we need more content. We do not need to take the lazy road and add a couple of zeros to the hit point total of existing quests and call it done.

[Ausdoerrt]

I am sorry, but Three Barrel Cove has been completely redone once in the past. To constantly spend development time on old hat content is redundant and is, in my opinion, a waste of resources. They did this once before with Epic Gianthold and they are doing it again.

Turbine should flesh out more final/end game content - your assumption that end game content is for powergamers is baseless. As players reach the end of their TR cycle, and finalize their characters the way they want it is important to have new content at the end of the road to keep things new and shiny. Like you said - we need more content. We do not need to take the lazy road and add a couple of zeros to the hit point total of existing quests and call it done.

I dunno, it looks like there is a generally though-out plan for the game. It will be another few months till a majority of people reach the end of the cycle. It's also nice to focus on quality of life/more casual content every once in a while. My guess is U23-24 will be more focused on bridging to endgame and cap 30.

[patang01]

I am sorry, but Three Barrel Cove has been completely redone once in the past. To constantly spend development time on old hat content is redundant and is, in my opinion, a waste of resources. They did this once before with Epic Gianthold and they are doing it again.

Turbine should flesh out more final/end game content - your assumption that end game content is for powergamers is baseless. As players reach the end of their TR cycle, and finalize their characters the way they want it is important to have new content at the end of the road to keep things new and shiny. Like you said - we need more content. We do not need to take the lazy road and add a couple of zeros to the hit point total of existing quests and call it done.

It's not my favorite pack, but it fills a good slot in the middle of the ETR grind. It's probably quicker for them to epify existing content and add new cool features like ship combat, than to make brand new high level content (something we're getting in next update and beyond). I get what you're saying but that air ship have flown already. So lets argue for better focused loot and help Dr loot sharpen the stick a little than to argue about something that won't happen at all; Turbine is not scrapping this update, it is going to happen and rehashing what they should have done is pointless. They ARE working hard to give us end content. But adding brand new content takes longer then to epify existing stuff.

[dejafu]

Back to Teh_Troll's suggestion to make the items upgradable:

PLEASE do not introduce new ingredients. Make upgrading the items cost a certain number of Commendations of Valor.

Some ideas for upgrades:

Orcish Privateer's Boots
ML 24 becomes ML 28, Speed X becomes Speed XV, add Fire Shield proc

Iron Mitts
ML 24 becomes ML 28, Strength +8 becomes Strength +10, Resistance +7 becomes Resistance +10

Mutineer's Blade
ML 24 becomes ML 28, add Slash and Bludgeon damage

[poltt48]

It is useless to complain to turbine about them making more 24-25 loot they are not going to listen to us and just do what they want to do in the end. What even worst Update 23 loots like going to be level 22 with 21 loot since that level of quest in are adventure compendium. Guess turbine wants 80 level 21-25 quests and only 10 26-30.

[memloch]

They really should put a system in place to upgrade all named Epic items. The gear choices would be amazing, the replay value of all epic quests would increase and would keep everyone very busy for a long time.

[Steelstar]

What even worst Update 23 loots like going to be level 22 with 21 loot since that level of quest in are adventure compendium.

Let's quell that rumor here. This rumor seems to be based on the presence of a Level 22 Quest that is currently in the Adventure Compendium. This quest was an unused remnant of Update 21 (hence why it takes place in Thunderholme), and will not be used. The fact that it's listed as Level 22 should not be taken as any indication of any future anything. It will be removed from the Compendium in an upcoming patch.

[Wipey]

Mr Dejafu you just turned those boots and gloves into musthaves ( for good or bad )
Good bye Goat boots or basically any good resist Wondrous craftmanship from Wheloon/Stormhorns.

I could see maybe some rare special EE component to ugprade or make those heal amp, strength or resists super rare augments. Or rare saga reward or whatever.
It's too good for just commendations.

I also think that fire shield proc is bad, since it negate for example Electric Sheath.

[Ausdoerrt]

Back to Teh_Troll's suggestion to make the items upgradable:

PLEASE do not introduce new ingredients. Make upgrading the items cost a certain number of Commendations of Valor.

Some ideas for upgrades:

A bit too much, methinks, but thinking in the right direction.

Although, slash and bludgeon on a rapier? I get slash, maybe, but what da heck does a swashbuckler have to do to a rapier to make it hit like a club? )

[merridyan]

Let's quell that rumor here. This rumor seems to be based on the presence of a Level 22 Quest that is currently in the Adventure Compendium. This quest was an unused remnant of Update 21 (hence why it takes place in Thunderholme), and will not be used. The fact that it's listed as Level 22 should not be taken as any indication of any future anything. It will be removed from the Compendium in an upcoming patch.

Ok.. then share the plan, when the cap goes to 30, how many new quests level 28+ will we have added between then and now?

[Grimlock]

Ok.. then share the plan, when the cap goes to 30, how many new quests level 28+ will we have added between then and now?

You have been around for a while Merridyan. We both know that the answer to your question will remain a mystery. Maybe hope for a vague answer. They have had problems trying to figure out what to do with sagas for a month now and you expect them to figure out what new content to roll out between now and the end of the year when we get level 30?

I would hope for at best a 4-5 quest pack with 1-2 possible additional end game raids. Maybe a new explorer area, but that might be too much to hope for.

[Seikojin]

huh..

I always thought it was people who decided these things.

Indeed, no one we see or even the devs really, determine said timelines.

[Dilbon]

Each time in the history of DDO when the level cap has been raised there has been a new big adventure pack with a wilderness and at least one raid (desert, Gianthold, Vale, Shavarath, Underdark, ok Shadowfell didn't have a raid). Obviously this will be the case again with 30.

[IronClan]

The decision on whether or not to Epify existing items when Epifying a content pack is made on a case-by-case basis. For Epic 3BC, the decision was made to create new loot rather than Epify the existing items. We haven't abandoned the idea of Epic versions of Heroic loot at all, and it could most certainly appear in future Epified content.

Was there a particular reason? Didn't want the INT and DEX to damage stuff entering viable end game gear/build territory?

I'm going to guess there's some 3BC fans who are going to be pretty disappointed. Especially if they have already started thinking of some builds to use the weapons.

The first thing I did when I got over my disbelief that you guys were epifying 3BC was look at the heroic loot and say to myself "well at least this weapon can be the focus of some odd INT or DEX damage build and have an end game version the character can eventually equip...

[jaegarnel]

This could have been made alot more intersting if the glvoes had of had been preloaded with augments as opposed to static choices.
Especially with higehr level gear and the augment implementation.

Gloves could have been more like..

Iron Mitts.:

Vitality +40
Healing Amplification 30%
Green Slot: +8 STR
Blue Slot +7 Resistance
Empty Colourless slot

Then for EE 3BC you add some higher level Augment drop options.
like random +10 or +3 insightful stat augments


This would have allowed the gloves to transcend its limited level use range and made 3BC desirable to run at all difficulties for all players.

Personally I don't really care about the difficulty level that the Dev's decided was appropriate for 3BC, just means there will be no useful purpose to 3BC for me beyond running once for favor.
The current loot list so far is ... meh... nothing overwhelmingly encouraging for me to run this for loot. Nothing here jumps out with any unique... ooh ahh..., thats cool I could use that on...so no repeatability desire.

It is disapointing to see new content released and still no better core base items with lots of augment options and unique rare drop augments to slot them.
The augment system is a decent system but does need to be expanded exponentially.

Seriously?! You don't think that a non-raid item with 2 top-end effects and 3 augment slots might be just slightly OP? I'm all for having better gear, but if you want your requests to be taken seriously, you might want to keep them reasonable and in-line with loot we have now. I think we already have too much power creep as it is, so NO. Just no.


Just for the record, I still use at least situationally the PDK gloves at cap, on any toon that has a use for healing amp. Considering these gloves are a pretty big upgrade on the PDK gloves, they are a fine endgame item for many builds even at cap.
+8 strength instead of +10 or even +11 isn't that big of a loss except on chars that focus on tactics (oh boy I lose 1 to hit, and maybe 2 damage, whatever shall I do now that I'm so gimped). And while I agree that the +7 resistance is underwhelming, it's consistent with most named ML 24 items, and you can always equip something else for the saves boost.

To all the people who said this was a good idea, I'm wondering if you're either joking or drunk, because it's perfectly obvious that the item JOTMON asked for is completely OP.