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Thread: Merge Servers

  1. #21
    The Hatchery Cernunan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalkavianX View Post
    Say I have 9 out of 15 characters on Argo and 12 out of 15 on Cannith and they decide to merge Cannith and Argo. After the merger, do I have 21 characters out of 30 character slots? Or am I stuck with 21 characters out of 15 character slots, being unable to play 6 of my characters until I buy 6 more slots? If it was the 21/30 option I'd sign on the "merge the server" band wagon in a heartbeat. Otherwise....

    This question has yet to be addressed.

    The way it worked last time, the characters were added together, with your total slots remaining the same, so you would have 21 of 15.
    You would be able to actively play all 21, but if you ever wanted to make a new character you would need to buy up to 22 slots, or delete 7 characters.
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  2. #22
    Community Member Talonaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    No thank you.
    I am curious - as we talk about this, aside from the double names, and issues of having more than the limit of toons... what is the negative of merging some of the servers? You say "No thank you" but why? It was usually just blind luck that any of us picked the server we are on, and what if there are really cool people on that other server just waiting to be met. And believe me, I am not the best at meeting new people (As my guildies and friends will probably point out!) but I think it is important for the game.
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  3. #23
    Community Member Sidewaysgts86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    Nope...
    Ah I see.


    But isnt it a bit.. Ill just say silly, to assert that one reason you feel something shouldnt be done and youre not for- is based on monetary concerns, when you admit you have absolutely no idea how much money what your "concerned" over would actually need?

  4. #24
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
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    I'm not either for or against a server merge. I do have a few character names however, that I would not like to lose. Some of the character names being changed wouldn't bother me too much.


    Merge...Don't Merge...I don't really care much otherwise.
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  5. #25
    Community Member schelsullivan's Avatar
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    Im for merging, things are feeling like a ghost town too often on argo
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  6. #26
    Community Member Sokól's Avatar
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    /signed

    I want this to happen before the level cap is raised to 30 the game is rather stretched out as it is...

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  7. #27
    Community Member MalkavianX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cernunan View Post
    The way it worked last time, the characters were added together, with your total slots remaining the same, so you would have 21 of 15.
    You would be able to actively play all 21, but if you ever wanted to make a new character you would need to buy up to 22 slots, or delete 7 characters.
    So if the servers stay the same with no merger, I could create a total of 9 more characters on the two servers. If they merge, I can still play my 21 characters but am boned out of making 9 more. Well, I don't mind saying that's a fat load of horse carp.

    But if that's the case, then...

    /not signed (with extreme prejudice! )
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  8. #28
    Bwest Fwiends Memnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talonaise View Post
    I am curious - as we talk about this, aside from the double names, and issues of having more than the limit of toons... what is the negative of merging some of the servers? You say "No thank you" but why? It was usually just blind luck that any of us picked the server we are on, and what if there are really cool people on that other server just waiting to be met. And believe me, I am not the best at meeting new people (As my guildies and friends will probably point out!) but I think it is important for the game.
    Because a lot of folks who want to merge the servers feel it will help with grouping. In my opinion, it wouldn't do much of that at all. On all servers, the majority of grouping takes place in private channels or guilds. The LFM is a sparsely used tool, game-wide. The chances of meeting new people might increase slightly - but (and again, this is just my forecasting here) it would not help to any appreciable degree. When DDO first merged servers, we did not have the option for private channels - so yes, the LFMs increased for a time. But soon, they were back down to what they were before the merge. With the existance of channels - we would not even see that initial bloom on the LFM panel like we saw the first time.


    In the meantime, you would anger much of the customer base over naming issues, character-space issues, and displeasure at not merging the servers in the right combinations. It would happen again, because it's exactly what happened last time DDO merged. I know people who walked away from the game over those issues, and never came back in near equal proportions to those new people I met post-merge. So, you'd lose a fair number of people over this in a game that already is having population issues. People who would likely not have left otherwise.

    And then there is lag. More players means more lag - and DDO has always had a problem with large numbers of players on their servers at any given time. Merging the servers would mean more people complaining about increased lag, and likely getting fed up over the inability for that lag to get fixed. Which, again,could lead to less people playing that otherwise may have stuck around longer.


    I don't see any upside to merging that would really help out the players very much. I see merging servers as a red-herring that a lot of folks have latched on to, and one with a very short-term benefits that would actually hurt more then help in the longer view once the collateral effects of the merge start to sink in. IMHO, merging the servers would just drill new holes in the bottom of an already sinking ship.
    Last edited by Memnir; 05-05-2014 at 12:24 PM.
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  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewaysgts86 View Post
    Ah I see.

    But isnt it a bit.. Ill just say silly, to assert that one reason you feel something shouldnt be done and youre not for- is based on monetary concerns, when you admit you have absolutely no idea how much money what your "concerned" over would actually need?
    Ah, reading comprehension, it has failed you.

    I am neither for nor against a merge. I have listed off MAJOR issues that would cost monies to which end, as I said previously...

    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    When it is economical to do so, expect them to do so and not before.
    As for just the databases..

    How much do database admins make up there?
    How large are these databases?
    How efficient are these databases that will have to be merged together?
    Would the merge of databases now require more robust hardware and utterly new contracts to support it vs a reduced version of the previous?
    How long does it take to verify the merging was good before going live?

    Those are sample of of questions we do NOT have answers for, hence why I'm not going to bother to take a guess.


    So no. I do not feel one bit silly for my post.

  10. #30
    Community Member Talonaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    Because a lot of folks who want to merge the servers feel it will help with grouping. In my opinion, it wouldn't do much of that at all. On all servers, the majority of grouping takes place in private channels or guilds. The LFM is a sparsely used tool, game-wide. The chances of meeting new people might increase slightly - but (and again, this is just my forecasting here) it would not help to any appreciable degree. When DDO first merged servers, we did not have the option for private channels - so yes, the LFMs increased for a time. But soon, they were back down to what they were before the merge. With the existance of channels - we would not even see that initial bloom on the LFM panel like we saw the first time.
    While I do agree that there is a chance this may not help, i doubt it would hurt. Yes we have channels, but knowing there were a lot more people out there - good quality players, would make many of us want to open up to meeting these new people.


    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    In the meantime, you would anger much of the customer base over naming issues, character-space issues, and displeasure at not merging the servers in the right combinations. It would happen again, because it's exactly what happened last time DDO merged. I know people who walked away from the game over those issues, and never came back in near equal proportions to those new people I met post-merge. So, you'd lose a fair number of people over this in a game that already is having population issues. People who would likely not have left otherwise.
    Yes - some may leave, but people are leaving now, so I really don't think this is different. YES you will make some people angry, but you are making people angry now. I see this as a net loss ... and if you a couple servers together, it will seem like I have more people


    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    And then there is lag. More players means more lag - and DDO has always had a problem with large numbers of players on their servers at any given time. Merging the servers would mean more people complaining about increased lag, and likely getting fed up over the inability for that lag to get fixed. Which, again,could lead to less people playing that otherwise may have stuck around longer.


    I don't see any upside to merging that would really help out the players very much. I see merging servers as a red-herring that a lot of folks have latched on to, and one with a very short-term benefits that would actually hurt more then help in the longer view once the collateral effects of the merge start to sink in. IMHO, merging the servers would just drill new holes in the bottom of an already sinking ship.
    Lag could be an issue, but if they house multiple servers on one computer server, or on the same ones -- then it likely would be about the same. That is for turbine to answer. (In fact I would love to see an official response that could answer some of our "what if" cost/hardware questions)

    You say you see a sinking ship -- yet to continue to do nothing would just allow it to continue to sink. I am more of the try something and see if it works philosophy, if it doesn't, oh well, but at least we tried.
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  11. #31
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    Because a lot of folks who want to merge the servers feel it will help with grouping. In my opinion, it wouldn't do much of that at all. On all servers, the majority of grouping takes place in private channels or guilds. The LFM is a sparsely used tool, game-wide. The chances of meeting new people might increase slightly - but (and again, this is just my forecasting here) it would not help to any appreciable degree. When DDO first merged servers, we did not have the option for private channels - so yes, the LFMs increased for a time. But soon, they were back down to what they were before the merge. With the existance of channels - we would not even see that initial bloom on the LFM panel like we saw the first time.


    .
    This is just not the way DDO really works. How do you think channels get started and get built up? It is through constantly adding people met outside of channels in game. Lfming is most definitely not dead. It may be not the way that you play the game, but there are lot of people that use lfms. I used lfms all the time up until I stopped playing 4 weeks ago.
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  12. #32
    Bwest Fwiends Memnir's Avatar
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    I don't mind that y'all don't see it my way, I never expected to convince anyone. Just stating why I do see it my way.
    To each their own, and no harm or foul.
    Last edited by Memnir; 05-06-2014 at 02:03 AM.
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  13. #33
    Community Member Minrothad's Avatar
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    A server merge would be interesting.
    As for the name issues, free re-name for everyone once per character?

  14. #34
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    Yes plz. Game is dead on argo. The population is getting to low to the point where I wonder if I should even be playing, there just seems like there is nothing going on. I'm also not gonna leave my guild behind and go to a slightly more populated server.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    1. Turbine does not have server hardware of their own. It is rented. Aka they are bound by contracts.
    2. Merging servers costs Turbine monies because they they have to merge databases of characters
    3. Merging also means players are going to LOSE their names. This does and will cause loss of players.

    There is a LOT more than just going "merge the servers" to make it happen AND make it cost effective to do so.

    When it is economical to do so, expect them to do so and not before.
    They have merged server before I don't see why they can't do it again.

    Also, they are going to lose more money by loss of player due to low server population then they would for the cost of a merge.

    So my name changes, I will put 1 extra letter at the end of my name and I will have a lot more people to play with. How is this a bad idea?

  16. #36

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    Minrothad: The way they did it before is that if there was a name conflict, your character would get renamed to "character name-server name". You were also provided a free rename token to handle that. ((You were supposed to use the token and rename your character in one month, but I never bothered. I enjoyed having the "title" as it were.))

    Quote Originally Posted by moo_cow View Post
    They have merged server before I don't see why they can't do it again.
    No one has said they are incapable of doing so.

    Quote Originally Posted by moo_cow View Post
    Also, they are going to lose more money by loss of player due to low server population then they would for the cost of a merge.
    So you know the costs of everything I've stated?
    You know how many players they are bleeding and the rough "value" that one player has?

    Do you work for Turbine? How did you come by this confidential data?
    No, what you have is pure speculation at the current time. Just because you may not see many players on the LFG or what have you, only Turbine knows the facts of how many people are on, how much is being spent, and how bad the bleed is. As I stated, Turbine will merge when it is cost effective to do so and not before. However, do not confuse cost effective with optimal.

    Quote Originally Posted by moo_cow View Post
    So my name changes, I will put 1 extra letter at the end of my name and I will have a lot more people to play with. How is this a bad idea?
    And for some, that is an utter deal breaker. The fact is some people won't have issues with name changing, and others will have a big issue with it. There is not "correct" answer for it. (other than they should NEVER have made it so singular name limited. That archaic method was outdated even before DDO started.)

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalkavianX View Post
    I think this will be the third or fourth (maybe fifth?) "Merge the servers" post I've replied to with the same reply.

    Say I have 9 out of 15 characters on Argo and 12 out of 15 on Cannith and they decide to merge Cannith and Argo. After the merger, do I have 21 characters out of 30 character slots? Or am I stuck with 21 characters out of 15 character slots, being unable to play 6 of my characters until I buy 6 more slots? If it was the 21/30 option I'd sign on the "merge the server" band wagon in a heartbeat. Otherwise....

    This question has yet to be addressed.

    On a side note, they should sticky one of the multitude of "merge the server" posts. Then everyone can just post there instead of opening up a new one every 5 to 7 days. Or, more to the point, the mods could close down new posts asap.
    I don't know and I really don't care. Sorry but this is why we can't have nice things, people complaining about irrelevant stuff all the time.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post

    No one has said they are incapable of doing so.


    So you know the costs of everything I've stated?
    You know how many players they are bleeding and the rough "value" that one player has?

    Do you work for Turbine? How did you come by this confidential data?
    No, what you have is pure speculation at the current time. Just because you may not see many players on the LFG or what have you, only Turbine knows the facts of how many people are on, how much is being spent, and how bad the bleed is. As I stated, Turbine will merge when it is cost effective to do so and not before. However, do not confuse cost effective with optimal.


    And for some, that is an utter deal breaker. The fact is some people won't have issues with name changing, and others will have a big issue with it. There is not "correct" answer for it. (other than they should NEVER have made it so singular name limited. That archaic method was outdated even before DDO started.)
    I never said that someone said that they were incapable of doing so.

    Obviously I don't know the costs associated with it, but population has turned into a huge problem. I suppose I can't just say that it will save money! do it now! But if they don't merge servers the population of players is just going to keep plummeting. And if they are just gonna do it when it's most effective, then that may be a stupid idea.(their idea of effective may be different) People are leaving because of endgame? well lets start developing endgame.... ya little late for that.... should of been developing end game content while focusing on enhancement changes. So they started developing more endgame when they saw it would be most effective? Brilliant. So they lost a **** ton of players, but they did it when they saw it would be most effective? I don't have faith that they will merge the servers when it is most effective, because by that time it will most likely be to late.

    Speculation based on past experience with this game ....


    And if they knew anything about their bleed and that basically no one is playing, maybe they would do something. i don't believe they do know though, I play on argo, I'm in an end game guild and in 4 chat channel (most of which are some of the most active on the server). There is just no one to play with....if they think that the population is doing fine, then whoever is in charge needs to be fired.
    Last edited by moo_cow; 05-08-2014 at 02:24 PM.

  19. #39
    Community Member darkly_dreaming's Avatar
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    Must be that time of the week again.
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  20. #40
    Community Member MalkavianX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cathimon View Post
    I don't know and I really don't care. Sorry but this is why we can't have nice things, people complaining about irrelevant stuff all the time.
    Irrelevant? In what way is it irrelevant? With the way it is now I can create, for example, 20 characters out of 30 slots. Then if/when they merge I still have my 20 characters but with only 15 slots. If I want to create any more characters on the newly merged server I have to delete 6 of my current characters to do so. So I'll ask you again, how is this in any way, shape, or form irrelevant? I don't think that word means what you think it means...
    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    This game has been such an absurd grind that I’d rather stick my junk in a beehive than make another toon.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    An expansion . .. with a set of packs for each plane to come out every month or two . . . it'll be like crack to Whitney Houston.

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