The most twisted Game Concepts? Post your List.

[Powskier]

drow casting fire spells is kinda funny;Lighting up the Underdark would surely cause temporary blindness to them....I'm not really sure how Undead get damaged from Cold either....and the difference between ranged and melee in EE ,is way fustrating for melee players

[Ilindith]

Flesh can be frozen, skeletons don't take cold damage.

[Powskier]

Flesh can be frozen, skeletons don't take cold damage.

oh yea ,magical cold would do.....illl replace one with ,that w the scroll /shard /lol junk ...just the bag space all the stuff takes is crazy

[Ungood]

How is grinding the same end-quests over and over for loot (the other possible end-game) not a Hamster Wheel as well?

This always amused me, that people complained about the Epic TR Hamster Wheel that was put in, and wanted it replaced with a Epic Raid Loot Hamster Wheel.

[axel15810]

This always amused me, that people complained about the Epic TR Hamster Wheel that was put in, and wanted it replaced with a Epic Raid Loot Hamster Wheel.

Well if we actually had a wide variety of raids to grind for loot like we did when the cap was 20, it wouldn't feel like a hamster wheel. We would actually be able to sit at cap and have fun just playing the game....slowly improving our character without so much repetition. I would like to get to that point again. When cap was 20 we had Hound, VoD, DQ, Chrono, VoN 5/6, Shroud, ToD and Abbott. And we had incentives to run all of them because they all had valuable loot for a capped character. Plus we had all the epic quests to run for shard/scroll/seal.

It didn't feel like a hamster wheel then, and to me it wasn't, because we had so much to do...now with just 2 relevant raids with a grindy crafting system (maybe 3 if you include FoT) and no quest items to go for (most of them are meh and near everything can be bought on the auction house) ...it does.

We just need more relevant epic content.

I wish they'd just update the loot and/or add loot to these old raids to give people incentives to run them instead of letting all the hard work spent on that content go to waste...and make the others epic that aren't already. That would solve the problem...to me at least.

And the raids that come next shouldn't introduce new weapons and armor that make shadow weapons/armor obselete. The new raids made CiTW/FoT weapons obselete, now nobody will run them. Even if raiders boxes weren't given out, they'd still be dead. Why Turbine constantly crushes interest their own content blows my mind.

[BOgre]

Why Turbine constantly crushes interest their own content blows my mind.

Yeah, it also serves to further stratify the haves v. havenots. By the time the fattest part of the bell curve gets to the point of running yesterday's end-game, the best leaders have not only moved on to tomorrow's end-game, but have already beaten it, got all their loot, and went back on vacation.

At least these top 1% are still writing guides and posting vids so that the rest of us have the benefit of their experience.

[zeonardo]

My top 10

1- A level 28 pure cleric with 3 cleric past lives (+6 turn level), morninglord and radiant servant enhancements to turn (+6 and +3 turn level)
2- The best turn item (ML9-ish Silver Flame and Eternal Faith +2 turn level) for a total of 20 character level +6 +6 +3 +2 = 37
3- (yes! even DIVINE SPHERE ED levels won't count towards turning level)
4- CANNOT
5- TURN
6- ONE (01)
7- SINGLE
8- UNDEAD
9- RAT
10-ON EE!!!

[FranOhmsford]

I think this covers most of it for me:

1-Epic Destinies making your entire level 1-20 character obsolete.
-1.1-Character building in levels 21-28. Seriously nothing there makes much sense and doesn't fit with how character development worked in the previous 20 levels. That is just terribad design.

2-Monks not getting the same treatment that Sorc/Fvs SP bonus got (IE bonuses capped by levels in relevant class).
-2.1-Monk Form feats becoming general feats for anyone with monk levels.

3-Giant Rift between Worlds having no impact on the events of BOTH worlds.
-3.1-The nearly complete abandonment of Ebberon by the Devs.
-3.2-Elminster taking credit for every quest you do as if by level 20+ you don't have enough knowledge about the workings of magic to perform simple magical rituals yourself (maybe using the lore abilities you introduced just before those quests). To be honest I would feel this way about any big name the devs used to force the players into a sidekick role. Beyond a novelty appearance, such things have no place alongside players.

4-Epic wolves, spiders, rats, etc.
-4.1-Entire villages of Epic Commoners, that got that way by normal day to day routines. The streets must have been cobbled by Otto.
-4.2-Making low level PnP modules into Epic DDO Quests. Do I even need to explain why I think this shouldn't have been done?

5-The way Turbine handles both exploits and bugs

6-Doors that are sealed until everything is dead. It sucks from the players perspective and makes no sense from the bosses perspective.
-6.1-Devs that think they should be deciding how I play a quest instead of spending time making awesome quests that I want to spend time in.
-6.2-Bosses that are invulnerable while they monologue. If they have that power why don't they monologue while killing us. They would always win.
-6.3-Devs that spend time making mechanics to force players to appreciate their special snowflake's lines of special snowflake dialogue rather than making interesting fights filled with witty repartee from the powerful boss.

7-Secret Door Changes, and the subsequently broken secret doors. The game was not made better by this in any way at all.

8-A "Good" kingdom that imprisoned an entire city of innocent people because they could not be bothered to find the bad guys hiding in the city.

9-The abandonment of every single system in the game within 2 updates of the system being put in. Not just different crafting systems, but other systems too, like the lore abilities that are only used in one quest in the entire game, as well.

10-Spells that the devs made have no save when an NPC/Spellward use because... well I honestly have no idea what motivated them to think this was a good idea at all. It's not, it sucks, and is ********.

-10.1-Spells/abilities that bypass immunities when an NPC/Spellward uses them without rhyme or reason.
-10.2-Poison Changes. Changing the rules of the game because your players would actually be prepared for what should have been a minor threat is among the dumbest and worst reasons to change a rule. Your story or bad guys sucked (or were an inappropriate challenge that you just couldn't get over and replace with something that actually was appropriate, or just put at a level that it would have been appropriate for), the rules did not.
-10.3-Disease Changes. See 10.2 for reasons.

Yup - Agree with every single point! Well said.

[axel15810]

Yeah, it also serves to further stratify the haves v. havenots. By the time the fattest part of the bell curve gets to the point of running yesterday's end-game, the best leaders have not only moved on to tomorrow's end-game, but have already beaten it, got all their loot, and went back on vacation.

At least these top 1% are still writing guides and posting vids so that the rest of us have the benefit of their experience.

Agreed.

What I believe we should have at end game is a variety of raids with loot that complements but does not override each other. This is what we had to a large extent when cap was 20.

DQ had the best Necklace
ToD had the best rings/belts
VoN 5/6 had the best weapon
Chrono had great sets for DC casting/DC tactics
Abbott had the best Trinket
Hound had the best healing sets and tanking sets
Shroud had the best clickies and items you could craft to any slot to fit what was missing from your character.

ect.

For whatever reason they now introduced shadow weapons/armor, which makes recently introduced CiTW weapons and flawless dragonscale obselete. And even the more recently introduced FoT items obsolete. Now there is pretty much no reason to run CiTW or FoT. In effect, the 2 new raids didn't give us any additional relevant content at cap, because while they added 2 raids (deathwyrm and fire peaks) they also made 2 raids obselete (CiTW and FoT).

The next new raid introduced shouldn't have better weapons/armor...but the best in slot for other slots to complement Thunderforged weapons/armor but not powerlevel it into obselesense.

We should have a reason to run a variety of raids at cap, not just incentive to run the newest one.

[Chai]

How is grinding the same end-quests over and over for loot (the other possible end-game) not a Hamster Wheel as well?

Playing at a characters full power potential and killing unique end game mobs is more fun for MMOers than running the same level spread over and over again to gain minor increases in power, and having to do so at a fraction of the characters full potential in power for the majority of the time.

We did that to ourselves... People blew through heroic TRs so fast that they decided they had to make epic TRs take even LONGER to keep people playing....

Turbine put a paid bypass option in - so it takes no time at all for folks to buy their way through it. Without that it would still take some time. Did they expect folks to not use that? By degree its not the players fault. Turbine changed the timeframe in which this can be done by orders of magnitude.

One thing they did right was to front-load heroic and epic TRs pretty nicely... Only really need 2-3 Heroic TRs to get 80% of the bonus possible, and only need 3-6 epic TRs to get 70% of the bonus possible.

And since none of those bonuses are really needed to accomplish what people want to accomplish, folks are starting to wake up and smell the repetition. The error they made here was making previous endgame content irrelevant. Had they followed some of the suggestions for upgrading old school loot using coms, every raid could still be relevant again.

[zwiebelring]

I think this covers most of it for me:

1-Epic Destinies making your entire level 1-20 character obsolete.
-1.1-Character building in levels 21-28. Seriously nothing there makes much sense and doesn't fit with how character development worked in the previous 20 levels. That is just terribad design.
2-Monks not getting the same treatment that Sorc/Fvs SP bonus got (IE bonuses capped by levels in relevant class).
-2.1-Monk Form feats becoming general feats for anyone with monk levels.
3-Giant Rift between Worlds having no impact on the events of BOTH worlds.
-3.1-The nearly complete abandonment of Ebberon by the Devs.
-3.2-Elminster taking credit for every quest you do as if by level 20+ you don't have enough knowledge about the workings of magic to perform simple magical rituals yourself (maybe using the lore abilities you introduced just before those quests). To be honest I would feel this way about any big name the devs used to force the players into a sidekick role. Beyond a novelty appearance, such things have no place alongside players.
4-Epic wolves, spiders, rats, etc.
-4.1-Entire villages of Epic Commoners, that got that way by normal day to day routines. The streets must have been cobbled by Otto.
-4.2-Making low level PnP modules into Epic DDO Quests. Do I even need to explain why I think this shouldn't have been done?
5-The way Turbine handles both exploits and bugs
6-Doors that are sealed until everything is dead. It sucks from the players perspective and makes no sense from the bosses perspective.
-6.1-Devs that think they should be deciding how I play a quest instead of spending time making awesome quests that I want to spend time in.
-6.2-Booses that are invulnerable while they monologue. If they have that power why don't they monologue while killing us. They would always win.
-6.3-Devs that spend time making mechanics to force players to appreciate their special snowflake's lines of special snowflake dialogue rather than making interesting fights filled with witty repartee from the powerful boss.
7-Secret Door Changes, and the subsequently broken secret doors. The game was not made better by this in any way at all.
8-A "Good" kingdom that imprisoned an entire city of innocent people because they could not be bothered to find the bad guys hiding in the city.
9-The abandonment of every single system in the game within 2 updates of the system being put in. Not just different crafting systems, but other systems too, like the lore abilities that are only used in one quest in the entire game, as well.
10-Spells that the devs made have no save when an NPC/Spellward use because... well I honestly have no idea what motivated them to think this was a good idea at all. It's not, it sucks, and is ********.
-10.1-Spells/abilities that bypass immunities when an NPC/Spellward uses them without rhyme or reason.
-10.2-Poison Changes. Changing the rules of the game because your players would actually be prepared for what should have been a minor threat is among the dumbest and worst reasons to change a rule. Your story or bad guys sucked (or were an inappropriate challenge that you just couldn't get over and replace with something that actually was appropriate, or just put at a level that it would have been appropriate for), the rules did not.
-10.3-Disease Changes. See 10.2 for reasons.

You forgot FoM change. Add this to 10.2 as well. In general I like to add that in DnD being immune at some point is meant to be since adventures are designed to be completed with success. That is why DnD gives an appropriate level suggestion at every adventure. FoM, Neutralize Poison and Hero's Feast are basic all time defenses. All nerfed to make special snowflake (like that ;P) spider poisons and webs a threat again. If the ressources at that suggested level aren't useful anymore, why give level suggestions at all.

I want my character to be epic and legendary and not just by Capshaw in harbor, but by Elminster and Lolth for the love of god.

[Powskier]

The aggro system. Yes mobs, please act like metagamers and run directly to casters with your 50k hp bloat since the melees arent dangerous enough..... and we all know melee players love to hunt the chicken being kited by a ranged toon/caster.

oh yea;my fighter runs in a room and all the enemies leave for a ranger or spell blaster......I like when a 5k hit point enemy, attacks my roderic wand scorpion 1st too,....Aggro?

[Havok.cry]

You forgot FoM change. Add this to 10.2 as well. In general I like to add that in DnD being immune at some point is meant to be since adventures are designed to be completed with success. That is why DnD gives an appropriate level suggestion at every adventure. FoM, Neutralize Poison and Hero's Feast are basic all time defenses. All nerfed to make special snowflake (like that ;P) spider poisons and webs a threat again. If the ressources at that suggested level aren't useful anymore, why give level suggestions at all.

I want my character to be epic and legendary and not just by Capshaw in harbor, but by Elminster and Lolth for the love of god.

Good point, had forgotten about that one. Will add it. This reminded me of another thing I added to my list as well.

[Paleus]

I want my character to be epic and legendary and not just by Capshaw in harbor, but by Elminster and Lolth for the love of god.

Here's some tips to be as epic and legendary as Elminister

Step 1: Post LFM
Step 2: Enter quest with full party
Step 3: Go AFK for duration of quest
Step 4: Come back at end to loot chests and praise everyone else's efforts

Follow these steps for every quest you play from levels 1 - 28 and you too can reach the lauded heights of Pikeminster. Who, by the way, should be added as another twisted game concept, along with the word "ye."

[Knobull]

-- the fact that every single monster character in game winds up behind you at first encounter, even when you can't push past them yourself.

^^ This.

The kicker is that it was introduced a couple of updates ago (undocumented) and very nearly ruined the game. (stuck-in-wall-bug, square-dance-dosie-do...) It is almost like the flank-the-player-at-all-costs-physics-be-damned code was added by an intern who was a relative of a senior developer and they haven't rolled it back to avoid hurt feelings. It was a really bad idea. It still is a really bad idea. Why not just give all mobs an additional +2 to attack all the time instead? Breaking game physics to give mobs a flanking bonus was obviously not worth it.

Terrain no longer has meaning. Doorways can no longer be used as funnels, the mobs pass right through you. It has had a very negative effect on gameplay, combat mechanics and tactics.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[Havok.cry]

^^ This.

The kicker is that it was introduced a couple of updates ago (undocumented) and very nearly ruined the game. (stuck-in-wall-bug, square-dance-dosie-do...) It is almost like the flank-the-player-at-all-costs-physics-be-damned code was added by an intern who was a relative of a senior developer and they haven't rolled it back to avoid hurt feelings. It was a really bad idea. It still is a really bad idea. Why not just give all mobs a +2 to attack all the time instead? Breaking game physics to give mobs a flanking bonus was obviously not worth it.

Terrain no longer has meaning. Doorways can no longer be used as funnels, the mobs pass right through you. It has had a very negative effect on gameplay, combat mechanics and tactics.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

It has actually been going on since 2010 at least (probably longer). It can be adjusted for with your own actions. It is however a very very ******** "feature." I imagine it is due to client/server arguments though, like the ladder bug, and don't foresee it ever getting fixed.

[Eth]

1. unavoidable dungeon alert
2. spell point drain beams
3. off-destiny karma
4. monks

[NaturalHazard]

Flesh can be frozen, skeletons don't take cold damage.

can't bones get brittle and shatter?