Best Dual Wield?

[AlfredTheTall]

I believe there are 3 classes that can dual wield, Fighters, Rangers, and Rogues. I'm guessing the basic game play is gonna be essentially the same, but I'm wondering which one is the best as a dual wield dps class? Essentially, which class will do the highest sustained dps in a standard dungeon run. I'm not talking about raiding, or anything like that. Also, is there a particular race that best compliments this style of play?

[RD2play]

I believe there are 3 classes that can dual wield, Fighters, Rangers, and Rogues. I'm guessing the basic game play is gonna be essentially the same, but I'm wondering which one is the best as a dual wield dps class? Essentially, which class will do the highest sustained dps in a standard dungeon run. I'm not talking about raiding, or anything like that. Also, is there a particular race that best compliments this style of play?

rog/rgr/ftr multi pick drow for ambidex lol

rog for evasion umd selfhealing + trapping
rgr for free 2wf feats and manyshot raged option
ftr for more feats and centered option (in which case mnk instead of rog makes more sence

[Spoonwelder]

rog/rgr/ftr multi pick drow for ambidex lol

rog for evasion umd selfhealing + trapping
rgr for free 2wf feats and manyshot raged option
ftr for more feats and centered option (in which case mnk instead of rog makes more sence

Technically anyone can TWF - my main Darlao is my TR on the path to completionist (slowly) - every life but this last one has been a TWF and two of the remaining will be TWF(and I only have Sorc(nuking), druid (twf/wolfform), bard(twf deathnips/celisticas) and arti (not sure yet))......so of the 13 classes I will have made 10 of them TWF and really I could have made 2 of the others (Wiz & Sorc).

And I would say all of them have been effective - maybe not top tier DPS for the relevant class but I am TRing and am building for versatility and survive-ability.

Now which classes have a distinct advantage with TWF - mainly Ranger (free feats plus tempest bonuses), Rogue (double up your main damage of SA) and Paladin (double procing smites and other special strike effects). Fighter has no special TWF advantage other than the feats to fit it in easily.

Races with bonus - Human, Drow and PDK get options for ambi-dexterity but thats only a +1tohit/dmg and not worth building around.

Best combo would probably be a 12/6/2 Drow Ranger, Cleric Monk using Shortswords (centered), AP in Tempest, Warpriest (weapons of faith), ambidexterity - would get you as much +9 to hit/dmg. I actually would build it 12/6/2 Cleric/Ranger/Monk - you get heal that way and only need one feat assigned to GTWF.

[CThruTheEgo]

I believe there are 3 classes that can dual wield, Fighters, Rangers, and Rogues. I'm guessing the basic game play is gonna be essentially the same, but I'm wondering which one is the best as a dual wield dps class? Essentially, which class will do the highest sustained dps in a standard dungeon run. I'm not talking about raiding, or anything like that. Also, is there a particular race that best compliments this style of play?

First off, any class can dual wield since to do so effectively only requires the two weapon fighting feats. There are a lot of options for a two weapon fighting build, so what is "best" will really depend on your goals for the character.

Second, a ranger and fighter will play similarly but a rogue plays very differently. A rogue's main source of dps comes from sneak attack damage, which you only get when you don't have agro, so you have to learn how to avoid getting agro to be most effective with a rogue.

Third, I have played a pure fighter (dps specced) and a pure rogue to cap. The rogue did a lot more damage then the fighter. Rogues can be somewhat difficult to solo with, however, if that is a goal of yours. I haven't played a ranger so I can't comment on that. But, a lot can be gained by multiclassing so staying pure may not be the best option depending on your goals.

As far as race, which one is best really depends on the rest of the build, including gear.

If you're looking for specific build ideas, then have a look at Santa's Little Slayer in my sig for a multiclass dual wielding dragonmarked elf. It is built for endgame and is heavily gear dependent so it may or may not fit your goals, but it might give you some things to consider.

Hope that helps.

[Saekee]

In terms purely of TWF DPS (whatever 'pure' actually means), consider the following as food for thought:

1) that an unarmed monk is the only one that gets full offhand damage. All the other classes only get 1/2 on the offhand. For a while Dex builds got full DEX on the offhand too but they nerfed that. (God knows why...It was one of the best reasons to go Dex-to-damage since otherwise the STR stat can be raised to much higher levels...)

2) Then there is the proc of offhand. With GTWF you get 80% proc. Ranger Tempest enhancement will get 10% more at level 6 and then level 12. (Also note at level 12 they get Deflect arrows, which procs every 2 seconds with the Shield of Whirling Steel selected. Very handy...)

Monks can dump points in SHintao (6 plus at least 1 pt to begin) and get Deft strikes for another 10% offhand proc rate. For this reason, 6 ranger/X monk is a common splash for TWF as it will allow for 100% offhand procs.

3) There is the issue of qualifying for TWF feats. They require a high DEX stat (17 for GTWF). A ranger gets them for free even if his or her DEX is below that level. For this reason, some players may find it easier to maximize their STR damage by going Ranger and gimping their Dex. The epic feat Perfect TWF does not require any high Dex stat (go figure...Overwhelming critical requires the cleave feats and 21 STR, but PTWF does not require the DEX. Yet another slap to Dex builds.)

One final advantage of at least 6 levels of ranger is that you get many ranged feats as well so as not to be a one-trick pony.

4) TWF has a big benefit in that one may have two different weapons with different attributes. This is huge, especially since some attributes in the offhand (like Seeker and Deception) as influence the main hand. It allows for greater flexibility. Rogues benefit from this since their sneak attack die work on the offhand.

I am sure I am missing something here but this is off the top of my head. Good luck!

[Mindos]

All the other classes only get 1/2 on the offhand. For a while Dex builds got full DEX on the offhand too but they nerfed that.

When was this, do you remember? And how would one go checking their dex to offhand numbers?

[TheLegendOfAra]

I like a 11Ranger/7Rogue/2fighter myself. Gives you a ton of Sneak attack, a workable stunning blow in heroics, which means you always get sneak attack(Possibly doubles on helpless mobs? can't remember at this point) Self heals, access to everything you could want, and relatively newb friendly to build. Although it can be somewhat gear heavy to bring out it's absolute best, it does fine with your average AH stuff.

Make it a Khopesh build and you're golden.

[Nightmanis]

I like a 11Ranger/7Rogue/2fighter myself. Gives you a ton of Sneak attack, a workable stunning blow in heroics, which means you always get sneak attack(Possibly doubles on helpless mobs? can't remember at this point) Self heals, access to everything you could want, and relatively newb friendly to build. Although it can be somewhat gear heavy to bring out it's absolute best, it does fine with your average AH stuff.

Make it a Khopesh build and you're golden.

Adding on top of this, a 12 Rogue 6 Ranger 2 (fighter, paladin, druid, cleric, fvs) will outdps the above build, but will have a slight less bit of utility. I personally would go Bladeforged only because of that recon clicky to make healing just that much easier.

Of the setups, fvs or druid would be my choice if you weren't worried about saves. Otherwise, paladin for saves and divine might.

[Krelar]

When was this, do you remember? And how would one go checking their dex to offhand numbers?

It was at the same time as the enhancement pass. They changed it so that all stats used for damage work the same. (1/2 to off hand 1.5 when using two-handed)

[CThruTheEgo]

For a while Dex builds got full DEX on the offhand too but they nerfed that. (God knows why...It was one of the best reasons to go Dex-to-damage since otherwise the STR stat can be raised to much higher levels...)

When was this, do you remember? And how would one go checking their dex to offhand numbers?

IIRC this never actually made it to live. It was only like this on Lamannia. Then for some reason they decided to standardize how all stats affect thf and twf.

[goodspeed]

its not so much of class as enhancements. So for dueling your gonna want some of rangers stuff from tempest with the added double strike and whatnot, as well as the free 2 weapon fighting lineup along with manyshot.

Then u'll probably want fighter for the tactics, speed boost, extra boost uses and dmg. Could even do a lil cross over and hit up the defensive stance (without shield) for added prr and saves.

Then comes evasion and extra's. With that much ap going around ud have to sacrifice to get the real use out of mnks, so either a small splash of that or some rog for extra sa, wand scroll mastery, all that.

To get the most out of fighter id prolly go...maybe 8 for the min requirements of the keen edge to expand the crit range by 1. And its pretty much all dmg enhancements on the way up to it. I believe 12 fighter gives you a stacking boost of another 8 str. So maybe the trusted 12 fighter 6 ranger 2 evasion split? Or ajust em different for whatever enhancments your going for.