And while I'm at it - what's up with Horrid Wilting?

[Merwinspawn]

Was trying out Horrid Wilting in the brawling pit (due to lower than expected damage) and came to find a couple of important facts about this spell.

1. It is a WATER spell (not damage type--that is un-typed--but classification, which affects savant enhancements).

Thanks for not letting us in on that Turbine. Nowhere is that documented. I'm a part Fire Savant (4 Core levels) and at level 16 I was casting it as if I were a puny 12th level caster due to the penalties of casting a spell in a school opposing my expertise. I would still use this spell, as the damage is un-typed and boosted by impulse, but at a much later level to avoid being gimped by the loss of levels I suffer in casting it. If you're a Water Savant, yea for you; this spell's level and max level will be boosted for you, and provides a nice bit of force damage to more than 1 target at a time. If you're a Fire Savant I'd wait till you are level 26 - far far away for me ATM.

2. There is still a targeting bug, and a nasty one.

My play style has me using auto targeting much of the time. This spell does not land correctly with auto targeting. With a target clearly highlighted via auto-target, the spell emanates above (and possibly behind) the target, and the target almost never gets struck by it. When I hard target the victim, the spell properly emanates in a ring around their position. If you're the lazy auto targeting type this spell is not for you.

As with Cyclonic Blast, this targeting malfunction (or various targeting malfunctions) have been occurring for quite some time. Does anyone at Turbine actually care about making the spells WAI? This should be a very basic thing as spells are the lifeblood of casters, and as such should function flawlessly.

[Vellrad]

This spell evaporates moisture from the body of each subject living creature, dealing 1d3+3 points of damage per caster level. (Maximum damage 20d3+60.) This spell is especially devastating to water type outsiders like Water Elementals, and to Plants which instead take 1d4+4 points of damage per caster level. (Maximum damage 20d4+80.)

Its self explaining that its water type IMO.

And issue with targeting is not one with the spell, but with terrible auto target feature.

[Merwinspawn]

This spell evaporates moisture from the body of each subject living creature, dealing 1d3+3 points of damage per caster level. (Maximum damage 20d3+60.) This spell is especially devastating to water type outsiders like Water Elementals, and to Plants which instead take 1d4+4 points of damage per caster level. (Maximum damage 20d4+80.)

Its self explaining that its water type IMO.

And issue with targeting is not one with the spell, but with terrible auto target feature.

I don't take anything for granted. I READ the spell documentation, both the in-game tooltips, and the more verbose WIKI, which says that it is a Necromancy class spell with un-typed damage. Just because evaporation of water is involved doesn't automatically make it a water spell, although it does make sense.

For me, I have no other spells, and especially AOE spells, that suffer auto targeting issues. Glitterdust OK. Otto's works fine. Incendiary Cloud check. Horrid Wilting horribly broken. It's like it casts like Disco Ball - way high...but in Disco Ball's case this is fine.

And if auto targeting is indeed the culprit and/or broken, why isn't it being fixed? That is yet another very important thing.

[cru121]

Wiki updated:
-water spell
-targeting problems

[Highlander]

This spell evaporates moisture from the body of each subject living creature, dealing 1d3+3 points of damage per caster level. (Maximum damage 20d3+60.) This spell is especially devastating to water type outsiders like Water Elementals, and to Plants which instead take 1d4+4 points of damage per caster level. (Maximum damage 20d4+80.)

Its self explaining that its water type IMO.

How is that self explaining?
It evaporates water - sounds more like a thermal effect to me? How does a water/cold effect cause water to evaporate?
And the spell damages water elementals.... Which makes it make it being a Water spell self evident? Right.
So following that line of reasoning, anything that damages fire elementals (say Quench) must be a fire spell then?
Wonder why then burning hands, scorch and fireball don't seem to do much to those fire eles I'm targeting?

In DDO, the elemental spells have usually been setup such that opposites tend to have the most "devastating" effects on their counterparts.
To be so devastating to water elementals, it would make more sense to be either fire or Necro/force.

[Highlander]

And if auto targeting is indeed the culprit and/or broken, why isn't it being fixed? That is yet another very important thing.

Agree with you Merwin, But there are lots of broken things....
Try to get it on the known issues list first.
No chance of being fixed until it gets listed.

And even then, still pretty long odds unless a few hundred forumites jump up and down about it.
Not sure of your chances as the spell is not used by many, unlike Wail and that took 6months plus to fix.

As an aside, every cleric has Implosion, and this has been and still is borked after months.
Not sure if that made it on known issues list either.
Players did the testing and identified that it is counting hirelings and pets in the 5 targets, even though they are not affected (yet - that will be the next patch). :-/

[Merwinspawn]

How is that self explaining?
It evaporates water - sounds more like a thermal effect to me? How does a water/cold effect cause water to evaporate?
And the spell damages water elementals.... Which makes it make it being a Water spell self evident? Right.
So following that line of reasoning, anything that damages fire elementals (say Quench) must be a fire spell then?
Wonder why then burning hands, scorch and fireball don't seem to do much to those fire eles I'm targeting?

In DDO, the elemental spells have usually been setup such that opposites tend to have the most "devastating" effects on their counterparts.
To be so devastating to water elementals, it would make more sense to be either fire or Necro/force.

Exactly. It is not patently obvious.

Thanks for the defense MacLeod. Would that be Connor or Duncan?

This is what is indeed confusing about the spell. You can look at it in a number of ways. Certainly Highlander's way makes a lot of sense. And looking at it as a water spell can also make sense in that a Water Savant has command over the element of water, so therefore could cause it to be removed from someone. As with many spells, the actual mechanics taking place to produce the effect are not precisely specified, thus you get ambiguity in interpretation and result, and why one should read the rules as closely as possible. If it's a water spell, for whatever reason, the rules/docs should state that. New players will appreciate the changes just made to the Wiki. Thank you for that.

[Merwinspawn]

Agree with you Merwin, But there are lots of broken things....
Try to get it on the known issues list first.
No chance of being fixed until it gets listed.

And even then, still pretty long odds unless a few hundred forumites jump up and down about it.
Not sure of your chances as the spell is not used by many, unlike Wail and that took 6months plus to fix.

As an aside, every cleric has Implosion, and this has been and still is borked after months.
Not sure if that made it on known issues list either.
Players did the testing and identified that it is counting hirelings and pets in the 5 targets, even though they are not affected (yet - that will be the next patch). :-/

Ok. This is good info. Just in case I have difficulty figuring out how to get something on that list (I'll do a search), might you add a brief comment on how that is done. It might help others too who find this thread.

Ya, seeing as how it looks like a good quantity of existing players shy away from this spell (perhaps because of the issues discussed here), the odds of a near term solution look unfavorable. Too bad, as this spell and Cyclonic Blast (which, for those following my posts, is also bugged) are the only 2 spells that deal substantial force damage to more than 1 target per cast. Whoops, there's Chain Missiles too, but as a 3rd level spell the base damage is not all that exciting.

Just to give people a perspective of why I'm highlighting issues with this spell and Cyclonic Blast, realize that any Nuker Sorcerer--and I'm sure there are quite a few out there--should be looking to figure out how to both maximize and diversify their spell repetiore. Given that there are huge bonuses for being an Elemental Savant, choosing to take that path is an easy decision, but it also removes quite a few spells from the list of ones that will be useful to you due to the penalties you receive in opposing elements. As a Fire/Air savant I'd be crazy to take any Earth/Water spells. This substantially reduces my available spell pool. If I'm up against foes that are immune to or resistant against fire, then I use electricity, and likewise fire for foes for which electricity is a problem. However, in order to NUKE such foes, you need DPS, and having spells of only one school to reply upon is not going to result in an optimal figure. Enter force. It's perfect for this kind of build. Force damage won't be reduced by my elemental bents, and is not likely resisted by opponents. Yes Shield renders MM ineffective, but MM/CM/FM aren't the only force spells, this is why we have Cyclonic Blast and Horrid Wilting. They round out this build in very synergistic ways. And I'm not asking that anything be done to make the spells more powerful, just that they Work-As-Intended.

[Dorian]

2. There is still a targeting bug, and a nasty one.

My play style has me using auto targeting much of the time. This spell does not land correctly with auto targeting. With a target clearly highlighted via auto-target, the spell emanates above (and possibly behind) the target, and the target almost never gets struck by it. When I hard target the victim, the spell properly emanates in a ring around their position. If you're the lazy auto targeting type this spell is not for you.

As with Cyclonic Blast, this targeting malfunction (or various targeting malfunctions) have been occurring for quite some time. Does anyone at Turbine actually care about making the spells WAI? This should be a very basic thing as spells are the lifeblood of casters, and as such should function flawlessly.

This targeting bug is really bad and it effects all ranged and spellcasters. I'm surprised we are not seeing more complaints on the forums.