Let's Talk About Update 21 XP Changes

[Icywave]

a bit irrelevant to the xp topic, sorry about that, but these are 2 interesting changes i`d like to see in the future:

2) /ransack should also inform about the time still left, like /quest does. and if possible, the list should be sortied by the most recent quest to be offtimer, to the later ones.

That I agree with. Would be nice if such data gets to be part of the changes they wanna do for the Adventure Compendium info.

[Jasparion]

if EH would give 2,100, I think that's fair.

I guess SAGAs could reward you with a few hundred CoV.... that would get people to go through the various quests. Just an idea.

Except it goes against their stated policy of providing enough Comms so that a single life of EH runs will get us pretty much there. Half way is not "pretty much there".

I would think 20 runs at level 28 is fine. Its about what we needed for Herioc TRs (if we didnt do 5 minute challenges over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over).

80 runs is not fine. Not even making it half way is not fine.

And the thing is, the XP buffs to the higher level Epics mean we will get even fewer Comms on our trip to 28. So this makes it even harder, meaning we are even more likely to have to buy Hearts.

[Icywave]

Except it goes against their stated policy of providing enough Comms so that a single life of EH runs will get us pretty much there. Half way is not "pretty much there".

Link the stated policy then. Henceforth I'll be in agreement with it

[oradafu]

Link the stated policy then. Henceforth I'll be in agreement with it

Urhmmm...

[*]Our current plan is that Iconic and Epic Hearts of Wood each require 4200 Commendations of Valor. This is close to our estimate of how many Commendations of Valor you would get from playing Epic Hard, non-ransacked quests and usually taking Commendations as the end reward, based on how many quests characters would finish between levels 20-28 (again, on Epic Hard).

[Jasparion]

Urhmmm...

Looks like I overstated their policy. V said "usually" which I would say is maybe 75% of the time. I took them more than 95% of the time and still managed to not even get half.

[Qhualor]

yeah, Vargouille was only off by about a hundred or so

[Icywave]

Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post[*]Our current plan is that Iconic and Epic Hearts of Wood each require 4200 Commendations of Valor. This is close to our estimate of how many Commendations of Valor you would get from playing Epic Hard, non-ransacked quests and usually taking Commendations as the end reward, based on how many quests characters would finish between levels 20-28 (again, on Epic Hard).


CURRENT PLAN....

But yeah, I can see how people got to be angry on the matter, since reality isn't matching their expectations. False hopes were given.

I bet there were no further posts from Devs on the matter afterwards? Anyway ... My feeling is that financial reality hit them after that said " current plan ".

[oradafu]

Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post[*]Our current plan is that Iconic and Epic Hearts of Wood each require 4200 Commendations of Valor. This is close to our estimate of how many Commendations of Valor you would get from playing Epic Hard, non-ransacked quests and usually taking Commendations as the end reward, based on how many quests characters would finish between levels 20-28 (again, on Epic Hard).


CURRENT PLAN....

But yeah, I can see how people got to be angry on the matter, since reality isn't matching their expectations. False hopes were given.

I bet there were no further posts from Devs on the matter afterwards? Anyway ... My feeling is that financial reality hit them after that said " current plan ".

There were replies afterward. I'm too bored to look them up, but the replies were basically that players who were complaining were playing it wrong because playing strictly Epic Elite without ransack results in close enough CoVs to get Epic and Iconic Hearts. So they moved the goalposts and didn't announce it until well after players found out about it, even though they assured us that we could gather almost enough CoVs by sticking to the Epic Hard non-ransack leveling.

BTW, financial reality had already hit them when they were scrambling about because of those plans. The whole statement that Varg's quote came was in response to a mass protest that went hand-in-hand with a mass subscription cancellation. So that whole post and thread was a response to calm players down over a series of year long horrible directions for the game, which came to a head when CoVs and Epic/Iconic Hearts were introduced.

[Icywave]

There were replies afterward. I'm too bored to look them up, but the replies were basically that players who were complaining were playing it wrong because playing strictly Epic Elite without ransack results in close enough CoVs to get Epic and Iconic Hearts. So they moved the goalposts and didn't announce it until well after players found out about it, even though they assured us that we could gather almost enough CoVs by sticking to the Epic Hard non-ransack leveling.

BTW, financial reality had already hit them when they were scrambling about because of those plans. The whole statement that Varg's quote came was in response to a mass protest that went hand-in-hand with a mass subscription cancellation. So that whole post and thread was a response to calm players down over a series of year long horrible directions for the game, which came to a head when CoVs and Epic/Iconic Hearts were introduced.

Well, their math is wrong, I run mainly EH/EEs... and hell... it so doesn't add up.

Alright, ain't adding to this.

[lyrecono]

just capped a epic life, all the quests done on EH no more then once per day.
von3 played twice a week, no more.
Von 5&6 only played once this life
Killed 2 optionals in EGH wilderness area
2000!!! commendations of vallor (failure) short to epic tr-ing again.

Turbine, why do you think people don't take you serious anymore?
Dev's, fix this vallor thing asap!

[tephra]

My feed back is that it is a bad idea to change the exp in von 3. It is a nice treat and a little motivating to be able to move the needle toward cap with a bigger exp quest. 6.6 million exp is a long way to go.

DDO continuously moves the goal posts, and it is becoming tedious to: adapt, ddo changes, adapt again, repeat. Leave this one alone.

[xaul17]

Hello!
I know you are focusing on epic quests, however there are a few low to mid level heroics that I feel badly need an upgrade due to quest length/difficulty:

- Taming the Flames
- Caverns of Korromar
- Hiding in Plain Sight
- Freshen the Air
- Proof is in the Poison

On the subject of VoN III - I am not going to say I am happy that you are doing this, but I see why you are. If it were up to me, I'd wait on this one until there are enough quests in the epic lvl range to make up for it. As of right now, players have no choice but to repeat the same content over and over in order to cap, and having this extra boost in the mix really helps.

[PsychoBlonde]

Please consider increasing the XP for *repeats* on epic challenges in both challenge packs. I enjoy doing these, but the repeat xp is too low now, IMO. I realize it was too high at one point, but a nice middle ground would be appreciated.

The optionals in the Phiarlan Carnival and Sentinels chain quests need a big buff, and the quests themselves could use a medium sized xp buff.

[sneerie]

- travel time to the quest should be considered when considering 'how long to complete'. DQ1, Chains of Flame, Many 3BC, are just a few that should get a boost.
- optional xp needs to be boosted, especially for those more complicated than simple optional orange/red named bosses.

[Eclaveriia]

EN Von 3--100k in 7ish minutes might be a bit over the top compared to, I don't know... EVERYTHING ELSE. I applaud this change (even though I currently run it a lot now).

As mentioned above, Epic Cabal needs a bump.
I'd also bump Feast or Famine.

Although you said specifically epic quests, Hold for Reinforcements needs the base XP increased by about 1000%!!!

I am not sold on the 7sh minute mark as an actual benchmark. What can a 1st life party of players on their 1st characters do it in?? That's what EN should be based around.

Hard and Elite should be based on more experienced players though.

[Hendrik]

- travel time to the quest should be considered when considering 'how long to complete'. DQ1, Chains of Flame, Many 3BC, are just a few that should get a boost.
- optional xp needs to be boosted, especially for those more complicated than simple optional orange/red named bosses.

If you want to consider travel time to increase XP then you would have to lower XP for all those Quests that take no time to get to.

You did not look at the other side of the coin nor think this through.

[FalseFlag]

The new content is more fun than running VON3 oodles of times

It really is not.

[EllisDee37]

Please consider increasing the XP for *repeats* on epic challenges in both challenge packs. I enjoy doing these, but the repeat xp is too low now, IMO. I realize it was too high at one point, but a nice middle ground would be appreciated.

Cannith challenge xp was never too high. It was 3k/minute sustainable, less than a third of the 10k/minute sustainable in rusted blades. (Later eclipsed by Impossible Demands when people figured out how to bug the priestess to prevent her going through the first door.)

Running quests now, when you factor in running to the quest and taking periodic breaks/ship rebuffs, you can fairly easily maintain 3-4k/minute over a period of hours. The old 3k/minute from cannith challenges is what it should be restored to.

They nerfed cannith challenge xp because they designed eveningstar challenges poorly, and for whatever reason they married the two challenge systems together with a single xp formula. So when they were forced to scramble to fix the eveningstar challenge exploit they nerfed cannith challenges into oblivion as a side effect.

Cannith challenges have never recovered, and in all likelihood never will. Last year the devs implemented their promised xp buff for cannith challenges, if you can believe it. They are still around 800/minute if you're good. It's truly sad; that content was quite fun for some of us.

But alas, cannith challenges are now and forever more in the "don't ever buy this, the pack isn't worth even 25 TP" category. They are the least attractive content purchase in the entire game, and by a wide margin. I love running cannith challenges, and I actively discourage anyone and everyone from buying them.

[Nodoze]

Cannith challenge xp was never too high. It was 3k/minute sustainable, less than a third of the 10k/minute sustainable in rusted blades. (Later eclipsed by Impossible Demands when people figured out how to bug the priestess to prevent her going through the first door.)

Running quests now, when you factor in running to the quest and taking periodic breaks/ship rebuffs, you can fairly easily maintain 3-4k/minute over a period of hours. The old 3k/minute from cannith challenges is what it should be restored to.

They nerfed cannith challenge xp because they designed eveningstar challenges poorly, and for whatever reason they married the two challenge systems together with a single xp formula. So when they were forced to scramble to fix the eveningstar challenge exploit they nerfed cannith challenges into oblivion as a side effect.

Cannith challenges have never recovered, and in all likelihood never will. Last year the devs implemented their promised xp buff for cannith challenges, if you can believe it. They are still around 800/minute if you're good. It's truly sad; that content was quite fun for some of us.

But alas, cannith challenges are now and forever more in the "don't ever buy this, the pack isn't worth even 25 TP" category. They are the least attractive content purchase in the entire game, and by a wide margin. I love running cannith challenges, and I actively discourage anyone and everyone from buying them.

I agree and liked them also. Cannith challenges also had some decent gear rewards to get after the effort as well. They should release ML24, ML28, &/or ML30 versions when the time comes.

[Danielson99]

If you want to consider travel time to increase XP then you would have to lower XP for all those Quests that take no time to get to.

You did not look at the other side of the coin nor think this through.

That makes no sense at all. You can easily do one, or the other. Increase xp for quests based on 'total time' to complete including getting to the quest OR reduce the xp for quests based on 'total time' including getting to the quest.

You're making a huge error assuming you "have to" lower xp for all Quests that take no time to get to.