The plus 100% / 50% damage builds

[Nodoze]

The two main debuffs that can be applied that greatly help a Raid/Party are Epic Destiny: Exalted Angel's (ED:EA) "Rebuke Foe" and "Vulnerable" (which has multiple sources). This is not counting Condemnation which requires something actually to be hit...

With those 2 prime debuffs in mind I did a fair amount of testing and figured best to type all this up now before I forget my test results and decided to store it on the forums so anyone interested can benefit…

Regarding Rebuke Foe: As long as you have sufficient light spell casts Rebuke Foe is easy to cast and can be done easily at range (confirmed in FoT on both the Crystal & on TO when he flies high). Each refresh lasts for 30 seconds but if the stacks expire you lose all of them (not just 1). This can most easily & spell point efficiently be achieved via the Archon but you do need to watch that the archon doesn't kill prepped targets and that it stays refreshed (it lasts less than 5 mins) or you can lose your stacks & have to start rebuilding them. The second easiest and most controllable option is Divine Punishment which can generate charges whether meta'ed or not and the last option is via pew-pew from spells like ED:EA's Avenging-Light & Searing-Light & all of these options can be supplemented with multiple charges from Divine Wrath.

Regarding Vulnerable: Vulnerable stacks have multiple sources and is overall the broadest debuff (helps all damage sources) and gets the most benefit if it can be applied quickly and kept at max. It looses stacks quickly (1/3secs) and I have tested multiple sources and the following are my observations:

Vulnerable from melee WarPriest's Smite Weakness: The main downsides of this source are that it requires you to be at melee range and takes forever to build up to 20 stacks by itself as you gain 4-7 every 15 seconds but lose 5 every 15 seconds… If you can get stacks to 20 another way then this is a good tool to keep Vulnerable maxed as long as you can stay within melee range and don't miss.

Vulnerable from melee FrostBite Blades: The main downsides of this source are that you must be in melee range, can only apply 1 stack every 2 seconds but lose 1 stack every 3 secs, can only be centered if you have 8 levels of Fighter, and may be giving up personal DPS compared to other weapons. In my testing on the Ship's Training Dummy it took between 45-60 seconds to get a target fully Vulnerable: BAB17 with 1 FB: 60secs, with 1FB with Divine-Power: 51secs, with 2 FB and Divine Power: 45secs;

Vulnerable from melee WarPriest initially using FrostBite Blades: The main downsides of this source are that you must be in melee range & can only be centered if you have 8 levels of Fighter but after you get to 20 stacks you can switch to other weapons (& if relevant get centered again) and keep getting back to 20 stacks consistently (I estimate you would keep an average of ~18). In my testing on the Ship's Training Dummy while TWF dual Frostbites with Divine Power & Smite Weakness I can get a full 20 stacks consistently in ~19 seconds (fastest has been 17secs and slowest 21secs);

Vulnerable from ranged AA T5's Improved Elemental Arrows (shock Imbue stance): My testing with a level 15 (8Ranger/6Monk/1Cleric) was not very good. With Many-Shot AA by itself could not get to get to a full 20 stacks and then lost the stacks pretty quickly under regular rates of fire (testing details below). Even on a Monkcher adding 10K stars to Many-shot seemed sub-optimal as even starting with a full Ki bar I had trouble getting to 20 quickly let alone staying there (especially considering that I had to stop and melee to get Ki refilled)... Note that I tested with a quick and dirty level 15 Sun Lord on live (6monk/8Ranger/1Cleric) using a Bow of Sinew with IC:Ranged so this may be better with different builds/gear at level 28. When I get my Level 24 12FvS/6Monk/2Paladin to 28 I will try to transfer to the test server and do more testing with Divine-Power on or maybe even do a LR on live. I am also not sure what happens if a Boss is immune to Electricity like the TO is...

Vulnerable from ranged Artificer's Arcanotechnician T2's Shocking Vulnerability: The ddowiki says each Electricity cast has a 5% chance to apply 1d3 stacks of Vulnerability and I think that is accurate. In my testing I could never get more than a few stacks using a easy BF 14Artificer/1Paladin getting & spamming all electricity spells and Arcanotechnician SLAs (even with an Electricity based Run arm from the ddo store) on Sobrien...

Vulnerable from ranged Sorcerer's Air Savant's Core 4's Conduction: This seemed by far the most flexible & promising as I was getting 1-2 stacks on ~75% of casts and if I go all out with spells I think I can max 20 stacks in ~22 seconds and then maintain them with SLAs... I was limited in my testing as I used a quick BF 14Sorc/1Paladin and could only start "Claw of Vulkoor" on Heroic Elite (HE) so Sobrien died too quickly if I used anything larger than the initial SLAs (even with no-metas besides quicken and eschew and no-magnetism item)... This 75% seemed consistent on all Electric spells including Eldar's Electric Surge (it only generates a counter on the initial cast and not successive ticks)... Before HE Sobrien would die the speed testing ranged from 13 stacks in 14 seconds (from EL, LB, BL, CL as fast as I could cast them while quickened) to 7 stacks in 10 seconds with SLAs mixed in... My only concern at this point is whether or not you can still get stacks if a Boss is immune to Electricity like the TO is...

Vulnerable from ranged Sorcerer's Air Savant's Core 4's Conduction combined with Artificer Arcanotechnician's Shocking Vulnerability: This was actually my first test toon on the arcane side using a quick BF 2Artificer/12Sorcerer/1Paladin. It seemed really fast to max the 20 stacks and then I decided to create a Sorc only test toon and a Artificer only test toon to see them separate to see which adds more stacks. I think this combo may be slightly faster than the Sorc version above but with only 5% on cast I don't know that it is worth it but if you are going for this debuff from range and can spare the 2 levels and have room for Arty in your build this combo is likely marginally the fastest.

My observations at this point are that for the current FoT raid being able to provide the debuffs quickly at range is most optimal/flexible and providing whatever other utility you can while doing that is also helpful. To get the most out of the combo by yourself and not rely on a tank you need to mix in condemnation and tank yourself. Also, unless you grind out many Epic past lives to unlock two T4s, you have to be in ED:EA...

With the above in mind I am currently thinking about the following builds:

-Elf 12FvS/6Monk/2Paladin: Very survivable first lifer with Displacement & 25% Incorp plus full heal that can do all the debuffs quickly via melee when working with a tank. Can keep rebuke going but loses vulnerable when boss flies away (currently testing at level 24 in FoT & CitW and what got me to do more testing)…

-Elf 12FvS/6Monk/2Paladin AA: This Moncher varient of the above may work & could be optimal with a tank… The key will be how much extra speed & arrows one can get with max Wis and level 28 gear/buffs. I may try this when I get my level 24 melee version to level 28.

-3+FvS/6+Paladin or Fighter PRR Meat Tank: This combo could do it all if it can figure out a way to hold agro and apply the debuffs while in EA:ED and survive. The problem with most tanks is that the bosses don't attack that much (big attacks but fewer hits) and to condemn you have to actually be hit so a high PRR non-miss tank would be best for condemnation. If you could get it to hold-agro/survive the main downside is that it is melee for Vulnerable so it will have to reestablish Vulnerable stacks when bosses can be gotten back into melee range.

-12+Sorc/3+FvS: Though it seems kinda Frankenstein to me this may actually be the best overall combo. Assuming the AP can be made to work a 12+Sorc/4+FvS can do it with another tank. If you could make a Tank out of a 12+Sorc/3+Fvs you can do it all by yourself. I am toying with the idea of a grotesque BF intimi-hate-Tank S&B 12+'Sorc/3+FvS/2+Paladin to see if a crazy idea like that could work...

There are tons of options/ideas that come to mind but those are the ones that have stuck so far after my testing...

[Nodoze]

... Regarding Vulnerable: ...

I updated the DDO Wiki page on Vulnerable to denote some missing sources of Vulnerability and to correct some inconsistencies.

I also created the wiki discussion page to see if it would be appropriate to add the following summary table of the above research/findings:

In testing the fastest methods to get a target fully vulnerable from a single character are follows:

• 19 seconds average (fastest 17 seconds) for a melee WarPriest using Smite Weakness while TWF with two Frostbite Blades; If a WarPriest keeps using 1 or more Frostbite blades the target can be kept maxed at 20 stacks indefinitely. If, after getting 20 stacks, a WarPriest switches to other weapons the WarPriest can indefinately maintain an average of approximately 18 stacks as between Smites the stacks will wear down from 20 to 16 and then get maxed again on the next smite.
• 22 seconds average for ranged Sorcerer's Air Savant's Core 4's Conduction while initially speed casting actual spells and then switching to SLAs to maintain. This can be done at range but may be limited by the Sorcerer's mana pool and not indefinte unless the Sorcerer has ways of continually generating sufficient mana (torc/con-opp/Halcyon Boots/etc). This may or may not work on targets who are immune to electricity like the Truthful One.
• 45 seconds average for non-WarPriest melee TWF with two Frostbite Blades;
• TBD : Arcane Archer with Ten Thousand Stars (AKA Monkcher). This combo should be able to get a target fully vulnerable quickly and maybe keep it there but this hasn't been proven in documented testing yet.
• > 60 seconds for a WarPriest not using a FrostBite Blade. It is possible to reach 20 stacks as a WarPriest as you gain 4-7 stacks (average 5.5) and lose 5 every 15 seconds but it takes too long (stopped after more than a minute trying). At an average gain of .5 stacks every 15 seconds it could be ~ 10 minutes to get to 20 stacks but once you get there you could keep ~18 stack active on average. The 10 minutes was estimated using the formula: 20stack/.5stack*15secs/60secs = ~10mins.
• NA : Arcane Archer without Ten Thousand Stars. In Testing an AA without a follow-up 10K stars burst could not read a full 20 stacks let alone sustain them.
• NA : Arcanotechnician Artificer using Shocking Vulnerability only has 5% per cast of getting a stack so can't build stack up high at all by itself.

Note: that the fastest combo may other combinations not listed nor test above. For example an Air Savant with access to WarPriest Tier II wielding Frostbite blade(s) could start at melee and and likely get the the fastest speed to 20 stacks. An Air Savant with a 2 Artificer splash would get a slight boost over a pure Air Savant but on average the 5% extra proc likely would not push it over the top.


Note: that the stacks of Vulnerable stack from multiple sources and max at 20 on a single target regardless of the source. In a Party or Raid with multiple characters working together you could still get to 20 with addition of the other sources that can't get there on their own (example: 2 AAs working together alternating Many Shot, etc).

[Nodoze]

U21.1 may take the builds to +110% / +60%...

Looking ahead to U21.1 we should be able to another +10% damage to the raid. Obviously testing will need to be done and things may change before they hit live. Staying in the Epic Destiny Exalted Angel with at least some minimal Favored Soul should allows the following twists from the new Divine Crusader Epic Destiny:

Twist1: Crusade (T4): You and your allies gain a 10% Sacred bonus to damage while standing on consecrated ground. This is a 4 second buff that activates every 4 seconds when standing on consecrated ground;

Twist2: Consecration (T2): Active Ability: The ground you are standing on is consecrated. Evil creatures standing on consecrated ground are burned every 3 seconds, gaining a stack of purification and taking 1d6 for each level you have. Half damage is fire, half is good-aligned. Both are affected by fire spell power. Cooldown: [25/20/15] seconds) Activation Cost: [50/40/30] Spell Points. Bug: There are 2 cooldown times indicated. This is the correct and tested one.

Optional addition (not multiplying damage but could be synergistic depending on one's goals):

Twist3: Sacred Ground (T3): Passive Bonus: While standing on consecrated ground you and your allies are healed every 3 seconds for 1 point of positive energy per character level. This is affected by your positive spell power.

Note: If one were to take this third twist the order of twists would more cost effectively be Crusade, Sacred Ground, Consecration;

If the Consecration works similarly to how it works in WoW then you basically are going to have to be up close to the team being buffed. If this is used for a melee team then the buffer will need to be in their midst. Similarly if buffing a ranged group the buffer will need to be in their midst as well...

[Nodoze]

Based upon what hit live it looks like U21.1 does take the builds to +110% / +60% if you add those twists (I plan to update the initial post).

Losing Blessed Blades from the Epic Destiny: Exalted Angel (ED:EA) may be a boon for those using Celestia but does take away some DR breaking affects from the Wyrm-Wrought weapons.

ED:EA also lost Renewal but gained an SLA for Mass Cure Moderate Wounds;

ED:EA's Divine Wrath no longer needs charges but the cooldown increased from 15 to 20 seconds and mana-cost went from 30 to 40 sp.

[Ancient]

The theorycrafting appears to be comming along nicely, and the new dmg buff in divine crusader did make me think of this build.

Can you share some of your experience using it in a raid, how noticeable is the difference? Does reality match the paper numbers?

[Nodoze]

The theory-crafting appears to be coming along nicely, and the new dmg buff in divine crusader did make me think of this build.

Can you share some of your experience using it in a raid, how noticeable is the difference? Does reality match the paper numbers?

From using/testing in Raids at cap I can by myself pretty consistently get the Boss:

- Max Vulnerable 20% in about 17 seconds at melee range with WarPriest Smite Weakness combined with a weapon that gives Vulnerable stacks (Frostbite Blades or Wyrm-wrought weapons); Without Smite Weakness it can take up to a full minute to max it out as you gain 1 stack every 2 seconds but lose one every 3 seconds; Now that I also have a Vulnerable Bow (Wyrm-Wrought) I can keep a boss at 20% even when they move out of melee range; Up until recently (when I was using Frostbite blades and early adopter on Warm-Wroght) I was the only one applying stacks of vulnerable though now I am starting to see others ping-pong the stacks with me when they are maxed.

- Max Rebuked 25% in about 37 seconds if I spam Searing Light while the Archon is out and about 50 seconds if only Archon. I used to be able to do it much faster stacking Divine Punishment, the Archon, & Divine Wrath but it seems that Divine Punishment is only giving counters on initial cast now and I don't think Divine Wrath gives any counters anymore (doesn't need them, won't give them, but will consume them). Full Rebuke can be maintained at ray/double-range with Searing Light.

- -10 on Saving Throws can be maxed in about 10 secs as the new 'Shadows upon you' builds a stack on every hit and can be maintained at range;

- +100% Vulnerability to Poison used to be really easy but it may be broken at the moment. I am not sure if this can be maintained at range with Zen Archery or not as I am currently not centered at range (the tool tip does say melee weapons anyway);

- -10% Boss damage in about 15 seconds as it is easy to stack to 5 with Knock on the Sky but I think this is limited to ki melee weapons;

- -15% Fortification & -15 AC from Eagle Claw attack is easy to achieve last time I tested. I think it doesn't work the way the tool-tip lists and does not appear to stack with a Destruction weapons so subsequently I currently use an Improved Destruction off-hand instead of Eagle Claw (and am looking for a Destructor Augment to slot in a Worm-Wroght weapon instead).

- Healing Shield on boss is easy to apply-maintain with Fists of Light. I can see the little green numbers really well with TWF on the boss.

- +50% Light and Alignment damage & -50% Fort via the Shield of Condemnation (SoC) is much harder than any of the above for at least two main reasons. If you are not the tank (and I am not) then you can only transfer the SoC via the Crown of Retribution (CoR) for only 10 minutes per shrine. Frankly I find myself trying to save it for the 'right time' to not waste the 10 mins and often forget to use it in the heat of battle. The second reason is that the SoC/CoR requires you to actually be hit and most tanks these days seem to be mitigation tanks with high Conceal/Incorp/Dodge etc such that they don't get hit as much and don't build up nor maintain stacks well. I would really like to pair with a high HP/PRR "meat tank" with minimal mitigation to test it properly (especially one with 3+ FvS and that has it's own permanent SoC).

- +10% due to Consecration is theory-craft for me at this point as I have not ground out that destiny yet nor do I have enough fate points yet to do the full twists. I think someone may have been using Consecration for the first time in a raid that I noticed last night but I couldn't find/identify the +10% buff on my self nor see it on the Boss in the chaos. I did see the visual of it on the ground at one point and could briefly see the healing but not the +10% in combat.

============

I can now apply the above debuffs and keep the ones denoted above maintained at range after practice and keeping prescience of mind to shift weapons/tactics when bosses go out of range. I have chosen to stay melee for now as there are more debuffs from melee and more AoE healing to be given to the group when up with them in melee range though the Ranged variants do have their advantages (especially in survivability) and maybe could split time on both bosses on the dual red-dragon raid where I cannot on the Melee variant. If the DPS in the raid were/are mainly ranged/casters then the ranged option would be better.

I can certainly see my damage numbers significantly go up and go purple as the Debuffs are applied. Even with the fights going in phases I think the debuffs are being applied fast enough to be valuable. I have heard other members in the raid remark about being happy to see purple numbers though I don't know for sure that I am the one causing them nor if they notice a difference when I am there or not (can't speak for them). In all honesty since this is my first real raiding character I don't have enough experience to know for sure if things are going smoother with me there or not nor whether the timing is better or not. I think a more experienced Raider with better skills than I running one of these builds would honestly be able to comment better.

I do believe that just the +20% and +25% benefiting just 3 or more other DPSer does more for the raid than if you were just another DPSer.

For reference I am currently running this 1st lifer/no-grind melee build at cap (been trying different feats from time to time and still not 100% on which ones I like):

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...nd-friendly%29

I think a 2nd or 3rd life Drow or Human with Shortswords with Displacement clickies instead of Elven racial Displacement would be better but I really want to try to totally prove it out on a first lifer with minimal grinding. A human using short-swords and displacement clickies would gain 4 total feats after getting a free one from being human and freeing up feats by dropping ShadowMark & Whirling-Steel-Strike & Weapon Focus: Slashing. On this Elf I have thought about shifting to Wyrm-Wroght shortswords to free up the Whirling-Steel-Strike & Weapon Focus: Slashing but not sure I want to give up the +7+7 and spell casting implement bonuses on my LongSwords or Longbow or to break the Elven/Diety theme of the build. The one advantage of the Elven variant (in addition to built in Displacement) is that it can also switch to a Monker with this level split due to access to AA without Ranger.

[Nodoze]

The theorycrafting appears to be comming along nicely, and the new dmg buff in divine crusader did make me think of this build.

Can you share some of your experience using it in a raid, how noticeable is the difference? Does reality match the paper numbers?

To get some actual numbers from a real mob I went in on Sobrian with minimal buffs (no Divine Might, no Divine Power, no Divine Favor, not best gear on all slots, etc using only 1 Thunder-Forged Alloy Longsword with just 1st-Degree Burns. Methology-wise I hit him once and backed off letting debuffs expire at least 10 times to get a sample of hits with no buffs. After I had at least 10+ sword hits and 10+ Archon baseline hits I only applied the Vulnerable +20% (all damage) and Rebuke +25% (physical/light damage) and recorded at least 10 more hits with them maxed (though sometimes the vulnerable may have dropped to 19 stacks). Sobrien is immune to fire but for the Sword Slash and Archon Light damages I recorded the following:

- Sword Slash no debuffs Average: 50.0;
- Archon Light no debuffs Average: 44.4;

- Sword Slash with debuffs Average: 74.1;
- Archon Light with debuffs Average: 70.6;

- % Sword Slash damage increase with debuffs: +48%;
- % Archon Light damage increase with debuffs: +59%;

This seems consistent with what I notice on the Dragons in the raids as my numbers go purple almost immediately and go up-and-up pretty quickly. Unfortunately DDO has no log recording ability and my laptop that I game on can't handle recording the game (neither the space nor FPS to spare).

With only 10 samples of each I am not sure what the statistically valid +/- range. I originally expected an ~45% increase off of those 2 debuffs. Seeing a actual 48%-59% damage increase off of just 2 debuffs is frankly better than I conservatively estimated. This may mean that the bonuses are being added Multiplicatively which, if true, is better than what I had originally theorized (I assumed they were added and then multiplied).

That being said I have not sat there and purposefully gotten a baseline of hits with no-buffs in an actual raid as I start with a Smite-Weakness and Rebuke ASAP when I go in (plus start doing all the other Debuffs). I also alternate in the 3 AoE healing effects (dual-proc AS, Divine Wrath, SLA-Mass-Cure-Moderate all with quicken and Empower Heal where applicable). I have not been taking screenshots of my personal damage in actual Raids as my personal DPS was never my focus & my screen sometimes freezes briefly when I do and I don't want to die or miss maxing the Debuffs for my team-mates or a healing rotation for my team-mates.