Un-Nerf WooWoo (Life-Stealing) Weapons

[zwiebelring]

They considered Terror as being OP and nerfed it with the comment: *...can be hurtful if on the receiving end....* after they were so stupid and made the unique terror effect available for high threat range weapons. The woowoo won't get back. They are stubborn on this regard.

[Teh_Troll]

They considered Terror as eing OP and nerfed it with the comment: '...can be hurtful if on the receiving end....* after they were so stupid and made the unique terror effect available for high threat range weapons. The woowoo won't get back. They are stubborn on this regard.

That's insanely stupid also . . . with the saves mobs have now the I forgot the Nightmare had the "terror" effect.

The insane mob-saves also made earth-grab weapons worthless. I loved the triple-earth alchemicals . . . not they are ****.

[voodoogroves]

That's insanely stupid also . . . with the saves mobs have now the I forgot the Nightmare had the "terror" effect.

The insane mob-saves also made earth-grab weapons worthless. I loved the triple-earth alchemicals . . . not they are ****.

Would love to see some scaling based on item ML (with slots being able to alter the ML)

[HungarianRhapsody]

/signed. My Monk needs more combat options and Quarterstaff is a centered weapon.

[zwiebelring]

That's insanely stupid also . . . with the saves mobs have now the I forgot the Nightmare had the "terror" effect.

The insane mob-saves also made earth-grab weapons worthless. I loved the triple-earth alchemicals . . . not they are ****.

Absolutely agree. They want us to charge and get a mouthful, burst healin divines chucking pots like crazy and call that challenge. So the players fight back with the last legal trump they have: slpash builds with Monks.

[Seikojin]

Back when cannith was being tested on Lam, they had woo woo on a shard. made some whatever of woo woo scimis. lvl drain on crit was very, very often.

It is all about frequency. If your most powerful effect is on crit, you will see it soo often it becomes less useful or OP. If it is on vorpal, it seems right, however, when you attack 20+ times a second, you will see it fairly frequently. Especially compared to the initial vorpal rate which would have been based on 10+ hits per second.

Then you add doublestrike...

So it just is another rebalance to make woo woo less OP than it is; to fit with what it was when they released as a vorpal.

I guess you could say adjusting for inflation.

I would love it personally if it was back to the crit days. trash is trash. They die super fast no matter what. Have casters throw deathward on them

[Teh_Troll]

Everything said in the OP remains true. Now that we have a new producer I hope she will bring the woowoo back to DDO.

Un-nerf nightmares.

[whereispowderedsilve]

/Signed!

[Desonde]

Agreed!

Both Life Stealing and Nightmares on the named items need to be reverted to a useful version, especially when a party of two players and two npcs grants the monsters a 70% hp and damage boost to a single player and npc.

Nightmare, the Fallen Moon has both of these effects as it's selling features, the latter is even what it's named after, it's fitting that the DC of 36 on Nightmares isn't listed since monsters with a CR28 will save half the time vs DC 50, and since mobs in a level 23 dungeon are CR 26-32, people who know the numbers will know it's a joke.

The mistake was adding these affects to loot gen, and since that can't be changed to the existing items, the named items need to gain upgraded versions to remain competitive [You've reintroduced the numeral system, make it Life Stealing II on crit. and Nightmare II 5-40 no save Vorpal DC 56 Phantasmal Killer].

[Noctus]

This is rather like all the nerfs to CON dmg which eventually rendered WoP weapons moot. "Zero CON = instadeath! No, wait, too powerful: zero CON = helplessness! No, wait, helplessness is OP, we'll nerf that from 'free auto-crits' to '+50% dmg.' Hmmm, too many rednames can be dropped to zero CON - let's add stat immunities!"

Why even bother with the pretense than anything other than raw DPS (and the occasional CC effect) matters anymore?

Exactly.

Turbine has a long history of killing every non-DPS-weapon way of dealing with trashmobs.

Vorpal?
Paralysing?
Stat-damage?
Nightmare?
Level-drain?

All useless. Straight boring DPS always ends up being the best, after short-term "oversights" will be quickly "corrected". God beware if you switch weapons according to mobtype!

[Dandonk]

Exactly.

Turbine has a long history of killing every non-DPS-weapon way of dealing with trashmobs.

Vorpal?
Paralysing?
Stat-damage?
Nightmare?
Level-drain?

All useless. Straight boring DPS always ends up being the best, after short-term "oversights" will be quickly "corrected". God beware if you switch weapons according to mobtype!

Agreed. It's a constant move towards straight DPS being the only thing that matters. It makes for a boring game when all interesting effects are nerfed into the ground.

[Teh_Troll]

Agreed. It's a constant move towards straight DPS being the only thing that matters. It makes for a boring game when all interesting effects are nerfed into the ground.

That it really, straight DPS is boring.

Lightning strikes are cool.

Vorpals were cool, I LOVED pre-U5 using Vorpal kamas on a tempest splash in Wind-stance.

And WooWoos were friggin cool! Sure, it might have gotten a little ridiculous when 5 guys in a group had dual Nightmares but after hundreds of hours in EE content I cannot say they were over the top compared to a lot of the other junk in this game.

[Cardtrick]

And WooWoos were friggin cool! Sure, it might have gotten a little ridiculous when 5 guys in a group had dual Nightmares but after hundreds of hours in EE content I cannot say they were over the top compared to a lot of the other junk in this game.

I miss the old days of epics, before difficulty settings and the nerfs to level draining and helplessness/autocrits, when my acrobat/kensai with stunning blow and a Dreamspitter used to be able to solo epics almost as fast as a caster.

It was fun. Haste Pot, Stun, Switch to Dreamspitter, Woo, Woo, WooWooWooWooWooWoo, DEAD!

Now the sorcerers are just as fast and fun as they always were, if not more so, but the melees have to rely on the much less interesting slow DPS beatdown "tactic."

Oh well, staffs are still cool.

[bsquishwizzy]

Exactly.

Turbine has a long history of killing every non-DPS-weapon way of dealing with trashmobs.

Vorpal?
Paralysing?
Stat-damage?
Nightmare?
Level-drain?

All useless. Straight boring DPS always ends up being the best, after short-term "oversights" will be quickly "corrected". God beware if you switch weapons according to mobtype!

yeah...but...you've got IMPROVED Vorpal and IMPROVED Paralyzing that drops on...uh...it drops quite often in...ummm...er...




...nevermind...

[Dandonk]

yeah...but...you've got IMPROVED Vorpal and IMPROVED Paralyzing that drops on...uh...it drops quite often in...ummm...er...




...nevermind...

You forgot Ghostbane

[bsquishwizzy]

Yeah, melee has issues.

I remember when I made my boss-beaters. Looked all over for silver, cold iron, and adamantine weapon types to get through DR. Now? I mean, does that even make a difference anymore?

With my fighter right now, I’m switching to my greensteel MIN weapon and/or my Vorpal Lacerating weapon. I did run a couple of wilderness areas with Terror, and that was kinda fun (someone explain to me how wolves get Deathblock, OK?) but really it has no use outside of that. Even with Vorpals, mob HP is so high on elite that is it basically useless until you pound them down below 1K, and with that the proc rate is really rather low.

At lower levels with so-so weapons (and I’ll go on board with the woo-woo weapons being mighty cool), I was dropping stuff left-and-right. At upper levels with BETTER WEAPONS I’m struggling. Mainly because the proc rates and the effects are essentially useless. It becomes a straight-ahead slugfest.

A wizzy’s effectiveness with combat effects is tied to their build. If I want to dance everything, it is tied to my stats, buffs, and the gear that I am using. However, if I have a weapon like Envenomed Blades, my effectiveness with paralyzing is tied directly to the weapon – it is static. There is next to nothing I can do to improve it. I think that’s half of the problem.

[Roziel_Longblade]

A wizzy’s effectiveness with combat effects is tied to their build. If I want to dance everything, it is tied to my stats, buffs, and the gear that I am using. However, if I have a weapon like Envenomed Blades, my effectiveness with paralyzing is tied directly to the weapon – it is static. There is next to nothing I can do to improve it. I think that’s half of the problem.

Do you think wizzy past life should affect weapon dc's in addition to wands?

[bsquishwizzy]

Do you think wizzy past life should affect weapon dc's in addition to wands?

Try "effectiveness of melee weapons are tied to the level of the melee toon."

It's a suggestion. Something to think about.

For example, a paralyzing weapon has a DC17 save. A paralyzing weapon at lvl 20 has near ZERO effectiveness because of mob saves. So, making paralyzing tied somehow to the level of the melee toon scales the DC.

[Relem]

Don't get be started on the 90% stat-damage immunity of Epic Ward. That should have gone as soon as Deathblock was removed.

Oh please do. I dropped the EE version of the Trapsmith's Crossbow, a great ml 27 weapon to use in heroic levels.