Bags no longer allowed in guild chests - why?

[LrdSlvrhnd]

NEW: Bags are no longer allowed in Guild Chests.

Apologies if this has already been discussed, but my search fu is weak and I couldn't find anything.

With all the changes that could be made to improve DDO, why this one? What was so game-breaking about allowing bags in ship chests? Some of my guildies have zero interest in Cannith Crafting; I do. Even though crafting was pretty much dropped like a hot potato almost immediately after launch (there's been, what, one, maybe two, updates to it and then nothing?) I still like to keep my hand in. My gimpy hagglebard crafterbot hangs out in the K crafting hall for the convenient access to the bank, AH, and mailbox... and yes, the occasional crafting station, because even though lootgen gear tends to outclass crafted gear even at lowbie levels, it's still more convenient to simply craft a +5 Screaming of PG than find a good generic weapon. Sometimes I see somebody else wants something crafted so I volunteer.

But my point is... my guildies have no interest in Cannith Crafting at all. So I keep a large ing bag in the guild chest for them to put looted essences in. About once a week or so, I pick them up. This is a huge convenience that lets them quickly and easily get rid of their essences whenever they think of it/feel like it, and lets me quickly and easily get more essences whenever I think of it/feel like it. With this change, that will no longer be possible. Now they'll have to wait for me to get on. And they'll have to do it for individual characters. Or they'll have to mail them. (At least one of my guildies isn't a VIP, and doesn't have a shared bank. Another's shared bank is filled. Almost nobody trusts bags in the shared bank because of all the horror stories about losing them, even if that bug truly has been squashed. Large bags are extremely - almost prohibitively - expensive if you're not TRing and Shroud flagging every life, and medium bags are exclusive, making giving the ones who *could* use their shared bank a bag specifically for essences so they don't risk losing all their other ings impossible.)

So... what is so game-breaking to disallow bags in guild chests, yet not game-breaking enough to warrant a hotfix? I'm probably going to end up telling my guildies to trash or vend essences as they see fit, because it simply won't be worth the hassle to get them to me unless I happen to be in the quest for them to pass to me in the chest.

[Loromir]

Apologies if this has already been discussed, but my search fu is weak and I couldn't find anything.

With all the changes that could be made to improve DDO, why this one? What was so game-breaking about allowing bags in ship chests? Some of my guildies have zero interest in Cannith Crafting; I do. Even though crafting was pretty much dropped like a hot potato almost immediately after launch (there's been, what, one, maybe two, updates to it and then nothing?) I still like to keep my hand in. My gimpy hagglebard crafterbot hangs out in the K crafting hall for the convenient access to the bank, AH, and mailbox... and yes, the occasional crafting station, because even though lootgen gear tends to outclass crafted gear even at lowbie levels, it's still more convenient to simply craft a +5 Screaming of PG than find a good generic weapon. Sometimes I see somebody else wants something crafted so I volunteer.

But my point is... my guildies have no interest in Cannith Crafting at all. So I keep a large ing bag in the guild chest for them to put looted essences in. About once a week or so, I pick them up. This is a huge convenience that lets them quickly and easily get rid of their essences whenever they think of it/feel like it, and lets me quickly and easily get more essences whenever I think of it/feel like it. With this change, that will no longer be possible. Now they'll have to wait for me to get on. And they'll have to do it for individual characters. Or they'll have to mail them. (At least one of my guildies isn't a VIP, and doesn't have a shared bank. Another's shared bank is filled. Almost nobody trusts bags in the shared bank because of all the horror stories about losing them, even if that bug truly has been squashed. Large bags are extremely - almost prohibitively - expensive if you're not TRing and Shroud flagging every life, and medium bags are exclusive, making giving the ones who *could* use their shared bank a bag specifically for essences so they don't risk losing all their other ings impossible.)

So... what is so game-breaking to disallow bags in guild chests, yet not game-breaking enough to warrant a hotfix? I'm probably going to end up telling my guildies to trash or vend essences as they see fit, because it simply won't be worth the hassle to get them to me unless I happen to be in the quest for them to pass to me in the chest.

I beleive this is a consequence of the hotfix to quash the recent exploit.

[RedOrm]

So... what is so game-breaking to disallow bags in guild chests, yet not game-breaking enough to warrant a hotfix? I'm probably going to end up telling my guildies to trash or vend essences as they see fit, because it simply won't be worth the hassle to get them to me unless I happen to be in the quest for them to pass to me in the chest.

From what I hear, there was an exploit there, so they removed the chests till that's fixed. Presumably the chests will be back later on.

Greetz,
Red Orm

[LrdSlvrhnd]

I beleive this is a consequence of the hotfix to quash the recent exploit.

And yet the hotfix is live and the bag is still allowed in the chest. So that can't be it.

Turbine promised "quality of life" fixes this year... well, this counts as one, but in the wrong direction. The implication was to IMPROVE quality of life.

[LrdSlvrhnd]

From what I hear, there was an exploit there, so they removed the chests till that's fixed. Presumably the chests will be back later on.

Greetz,
Red Orm

The chest is still there. All they're removing is the ability to put bags in them. If it's a new exploit on Lama that hasn't made its way to live... why bother doing anything? They give stuff out like candy on Lama, who cares if somebody exploits something there for more stuff? The only reason to remove bags from chests on Lama is if they're not going to bother fixing whatever it is for when it goes live.

[RedOrm]

Again from what I heard, the exploit here is not the duping exploit, it's something different (and not on lama, on life). Though as chests are involved I WAS Assuming existing chests would be locked for the time being... Anyway, that's all the info I have, I hope they bring the chests back for you soon.

Greetz,
Red Orm

[LrdSlvrhnd]

Again from what I heard, the exploit here is not the duping exploit, it's something different (and not on lama, on life). Though as chests are involved I WAS Assuming existing chests would be locked for the time being... Anyway, that's all the info I have, I hope they bring the chests back for you soon.

Greetz,
Red Orm

They're not, as far as I can tell, touching chests. It's "bags are no longer allowed in chests". Currently on live, bags are fully able to go in and out of guild chests. If the exploit is on live NOW... then what could possibly be so game breaking that they have to stop it, but not game-breaking enough that they say "Eh, it can wait until U20, there's no need for a hotfix to remove bags from chests on live"? (And for the record, that's a rhetorical question, I'm not asking for details on a potential exploit...) This would be like a bank finding out that a particular ATM is dispensing a counterfeit $20 for ever $100... and deciding that it can wait until the next scheduled maintenance of the machine to disconnect the source.

And if it's only on Lama... then again, why bother? Who cares if somebody finds a way to get more stuff on Lama? They hand stuff out like candy at Halloween on Lama. Presumably they'll fix it before it goes live... or they could have simply waited until live and remove the bags then if they hadn't managed to fix it... unless they're not planning to even attempt to fix it.

Either way, it's a deliberate and specific attempt to lower the quality of life in DDO. Either they simply decided that bags in chests were too convenient and need removing; or they introduced an exploit that they decided wasn't worth even trying to fix before live so might as well remove the bags from chests on Lama now.

To put another way... Even if there *is* some kind of exploit (and again, not asking for details, or confirmation), either it's:
* Already on live, in which case it's been deemed unimportant enough to not warrant an immediate hotfix, so is it really all that bad? or
* Only recently introduced on Lama, in which case who cares, it's Lama? Unless they have no plans to fix it.

This leads to the feeling of:
* Well, it's clearly not all that game-breaking, but we're going to inconvenience players anyway, or
* Dang, this is bad. Welp, rather than trying to fix it, we'll take the easy way out and simply inconvenience players.

And if there's *not* some kind of exploit, then it's merely:
* We just want to inconvenience players for no real reason. Suck it, players!

Any way you choose to shape it... I'm coming away with a very bad taste in my mouth about Turbine.

[toaftoaf]

i hear people can trade bound to account stuff in bags AGAIN!. i dont know forsure just what ive been hearing. funny how the same bugs come back over and over and over again

[Evennote]

i hear people can trade bound to account stuff in bags AGAIN!. i dont know forsure just what ive been hearing. funny how the same bugs come back over and over and over again

If it's again possible to trade bound stuff in bags, not allowing bags in guild chests is NOT going to solve anything. People will still be able to mail/trade the bags to each other if they want to give away bound ingredients.

I'm one of LrdSlvrhnd's guildies, the one who has no shared bank space as I'm a DDO packrat. I have a lot of toons, and I play a lot. I also occasionally buy essences for him if I see them at a good price. I do no crafting at all of my own. It's MUCH more convenient for me to just shove all my essences in a large bag and put it in the guild chest for him to pick up at his convenience than to have to mail them one type at a time or pull them out of my bag into inventory and trade them to him when we're both on and in the same place... not to mention, the trade method often takes at least one repetition because my inventory space is usually as limited as my shared bank space, so I can only pull so many essences out of the bag at once.

Plus, with one bag in the guild chest, our other guildies can also pass essences more easily.

I'd really like to know what the thought behind this is, if in fact there IS any thought behind it. My pessimistic side expects an announcement about some gizmo available only via Turbine points that will "replace" bags being allowed in guild chests.