Turbine, could you please respond to the current TR concerns?

[danotmano1998]

It appears that a player would have to run sagas around 117 times to TR, according to all the flurry of posts in the forums.
(17 comms, 2000 comms for a heart)

Can ANYONE there reply to ANY of these threads and tell us if this is actually going through as it is now?
Are those numbers placeholders?
Is anyone there considering changing any of this?

Why the deafening silence?

[ReaperAlexEU]

It appears that a player would have to run sagas around 117 times to TR, according to all the flurry of posts in the forums.
(17 comms, 2000 comms for a heart)

Can ANYONE there reply to ANY of these threads and tell us if this is actually going through as it is now?
Are those numbers placeholders?
Is anyone there considering changing any of this?

Why the deafening silence?

you just missed their first post on the matter:

Good morning everyone! Just wanted to give a quick heads up that we've been reviewing all the Lamannia feedback so far, and we're working on a more detailed post regarding the rate at which Hearts can be earned. Thank you for taking time to provide feedback, to try the system, and to highlight areas of frustration.

[Flavilandile]

In all honesty, that Please Wait post should have been made Saturday ( evening for us Europeans ) or Sunday ( morning for us Europeans ) instead of today.

[ReaperAlexEU]

In all honesty, that Please Wait post should have been made Saturday ( evening for us Europeans ) or Sunday ( morning for us Europeans ) instead of today.

assuming they have someone on forum watch over the weekend to cube any obscene posts then yeah, an official "i'm only here to manage the forums but i've passed this up the line for an official response" would have helped a lot. might not have come from our normal dev/community employees we are used to interacting with but it would still have helped.

personally i was busy with RL this weekend so i've just been catching up on the excitement. does seem like a classic /facepalm moment though, from running 30 quests to well over 100 to farm for a TR, and having that restricted via BtC to boot. smells like torches and pitchfork sauce to me so it's no surprise to see so much drama over it. why they can't maintain the current balance when moving to a new system i don't know, that would just avoid all the drama and only generate the normal amount of change resistant grumblings.

[Flavilandile]

assuming they have someone on forum watch over the weekend to cube any obscene posts then yeah, an official "i'm only here to manage the forums but i've passed this up the line for an official response" would have helped a lot. might not have come from our normal dev/community employees we are used to interacting with but it would still have helped.

personally i was busy with RL this weekend so i've just been catching up on the excitement. does seem like a classic /facepalm moment though, from running 30 quests to well over 100 to farm for a TR, and having that restricted via BtC to boot. smells like torches and pitchfork sauce to me so it's no surprise to see so much drama over it. why they can't maintain the current balance when moving to a new system i don't know, that would just avoid all the drama and only generate the normal amount of change resistant grumblings.

Well Tolero, Cordovan and The Cube spent a lot of time moving threads around, unlocking to all Lammania Forums and Eating Threads Saturday, so yes some people were around at that time and they were our usual suspects.

And you really missed the drama... you should have seen Saturday... 10+ threads were Locked/deleted, 20+ threads were moved to Lammania...

[Eistander]

From my perspective, its not so much the addition of new TRing alternatives that is bringing people up in arms, its that this is a removal of the previous system, which while some were taking the path of least resistance (which is normal, not knocking it) to acquire their hearts, and the addition of the Saga system which was a promising method of getting people to play the new stuff to a railroaded system which requires only playing the latest expansions, or pay to avoid it. In effect this is what, in my opinion, is causing an uproar.

Justifying this new system of "play only the latest things, even though they don't get run much in the first place or perhaps aren't favored by players in certain parts" is pushing us nearly to a new Vast and Mysterious, however the players know what is there and paying cash is the only way out of it, outside of running only what the devs want us to in order to TR. The heavy-handedness and what I feel is a bait and switch with the Saga system from a passive, nice bonus for doing everything in FR/eGH to a requirement is the trigger to me, and what seems to be a lot of others.

Of course these numbers are placeholders, but it seems cemented that this new system is a go no matter what.. so Sagas or Store your TRs, never mind the illusion of choice to get around at the 20+ range for tokens or the like.

[Flavilandile]

As far as I can tell the rage is only about the BTC Commendations, the Saga requirement and the quantities required to get Hearts of Wood... not the rest of the changes.

[danotmano1998]

you just missed their first post on the matter:

Yes, it appears so. Thanks for that, I've been combing through them and now I'm waiting to hear the latest, like everyone else.

[ReaperAlexEU]

Well Tolero, Cordovan and The Cube spent a lot of time moving threads around, unlocking to all Lammania Forums and Eating Threads Saturday, so yes some people were around at that time and they were our usual suspects.

And you really missed the drama... you should have seen Saturday... 10+ threads were Locked/deleted, 20+ threads were moved to Lammania...

heh, i really did miss a good show then

ok, you're right, seeing as the usual suspects were kicking about then they really should have just dropped a few words. sure they might not have been able to promise that the dev team would review the feedback, but they could have at least promised to raise it to the dev team come monday.

maybe they wanted to collect the full wrath of the community by letting it stew to make things very clear on how the player base was reacting to the explosion in grind required to TR? hmm, it's not beyond the realm of believability that those closest to the community and furthest from the bean counters might want to use the mighty power of the nerd rage to show the bean counters what's what.

[Beethoven]

In all honesty, that Please Wait post should have been made Saturday ( evening for us Europeans ) or Sunday ( morning for us Europeans ) instead of today.

Why?

Lets leave aside the fact the sole purpose of having a preview server to preview changes weeks ahead of time is for both sides to have more time to respond to each other?

I mean it is a little bit silly to complain that you did not get a same day response on a system which only exists so both sides do not have to give same-day responses.

What would the gain have been if Turbine did announce it on Friday? The way things went down turned out to be a win/win for everyone.

* Trolls got to spew their usual garbage and got two days worth of time to delude themselves into thinking anyone actually gives a ... about the pathetic noises coming from them.

* Turbine got free advertisment from an independent third party effectively stating their seven year old game:
** has active development effort going on (without someone still working on the game there would be no changes)
** a size-able playerbase (you need that as pool to draw a sizeable amount of protesters from)
** an active forum community (a pre-requisite to having popular threads)
** players who deeply care about the game (otherwise they wouldn't protest)
** numerous players who have faith that the developers/company listens to them (no matter what they may claim, people generally do not spend a whole weekend on something they already know is pointless)

Now as for the damaging effect the public exposure the voices of dissent have: What damaging effect? Gamers throwing an angry tantrum about something that happens on a game is hardly news worthy. It is expected. Every forum of every game has their share of gamers who have nothing else to do but angrily stomp their feet about everything and cry out in impotent rage all the time.

It is about as sensational as the news some petulant two year olds threw a tamper tantrum because something didn't go their way.
It is so common we even have a phrase for it, we call it "the terrible two's".
Gamers engaging in a very similar behavior at times is so common it almost considered a defining attribute of being a gamer (as opposed to being a flower sniffer, fanboi, casual or whale). It is common enough we have a term for it, we call it "troll" and "trolling".

* a couple gaming sites got to post some news and likely got a couple more hits on their websites than they otherwise would.

* finally, fanbois likely got a chuckle out of when seeing those who spent the weekend ranting now complain what terrible time they had.

Seriously, what positive benefit for anyone do you think it would have had if they posted on Friday? That a handful of spoiled brats who never have shown any respect or consideration towards Turbine or their customers would have had a less horrible time this weekend? Trust me if I tell you that, nobody cares about them.