Radiant Titan revisited - Clr17/Pal2/Ftr1 melee/healing spec

[sirgog]

Preamble:

I've run a WF FVS for a long time and haven't been happy with their performance since update 11. Before U11 they could do basically anything (including solohealing an elite VOD while also maintanking the boss, albeit with a bard reconstructing me). But the game has changed and DR 13/- isn't nearly as relevant when bosses hit for over 400.

Finally while melee DPS output has skyrocketed for 'real' melee classes, Divine Punishment hasn't kept pace. My FVS was doing anemic damage, killing one mob in the time it took a barbarian to kill five (where back in the build's day I'd have killed three with melee attacks and hurt a fourth badly with Divine Punishment in that time).

Here's an attempt at a divine that can achieve the following goals, in the spirit of the old Soul Survivor build:

- Raidhealing: the character must be good enough at healing to soloheal epic elite 6-player dungeons and to two-heal epic elite raids.
- Significant melee DPS: the character must be able to contribute something significant to the group's success and completion speed when intense healing isn't required.
- Durability: the character needs to be downright tough to kill.
- Powerful solo: I want the toon to be able to perform well solo (although not necessarily be amazing at it).


Introducing: The Radiant Titan

This is a 36 point build. You are welcome to try with 34 or less but I don't recommend it.
I assume you will have access to +3 tomes early in your character's life and +4s in time. (Any +5s you fluke are a bonus). If these are beyond your reach now, remember EH VON3 has ~10 chests, drops +3 straight tomes and 3-to-4 upgrades, and is run a lot by most high level players in 15 minutes or less.

IMPORTANT: You MUST be Lawful Good for this build. Remember that in character creation, alignment swaps are not cheap.

Recommended Past Lives:
Like most melee builds, the build gains more from Paladin past lives (for the passive healing amp) than anything, although it can get some use out of other PLs too. It gains little from the main caster lives and if you have a toon with multiple FvS and Wiz lives you might be better served by another build altogether.

Race:
Human.
Part of your durability is your passive healing from your aura, which drastically increases the amount of damage you can suffer without having to spend a healing cooldown on yourself.
Humans and Half-elves have by far the best healing amplification of any race, giving them the best synergy with this build. As you are feat starved, human is the obvious choice.

Class split:
With the power level of Mass Heal and Energy Drain being so high, going under Clr17 is a very high cost. Drain does ~60000 damage no save to some EE orangenameds when they are at full health – meaning that if you cast Drain once and then go AFK all fight you will still likely be the group's top DPS.
I had previously run this build as Clr17/Mnk2/Ftr1 but found the saves too low to get maximum value from Evasion. Pal2 offers a lot to you now - stellar saves, the higher PRR of heavy armor (compared to Monk splashes in light armor) and more.

Level order:
I do not believe this matters much now, except go Clr at level 1 so you aren't crossclass training into Heal.

Feat selection:

Melee feats:
Power Attack
Cleave
Great Cleave
Two-Handed Fighting
ITHF
GTHF
Improved Critical: Slashing
Overwhelming Critical

Healing feats: (Some of these have incidental other uses, such as Divine Punishment/Bladebarrier)
Quicken Spell
Empower Healing
Maximize Spell

Destiny feats:
I'll have to look into these a bit more.

Stat array:
Please note - this is intended as a 36 point build.

Str: 16 + all level up points.
Dex: 14*
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 10**
Cha: 16

* I feel the need to explain this. I feel +3 Reflex saves helps your survivability quite a bit. But feel free to experiment, your results may vary. I hate hearing 'can't heal, Cometfalled' in raid situations.
You will notice an extraordinary emphasis in gear toward Reflex saves for this reason – again, you are welcome to play around with other setups.
** This is not new player friendly. Remember you can't cast spells without level-appropriate +Wisdom items. Again I'm assuming you have the resources to trade for +3 tomes.


Epic Destiny choice:
Legendary Dreadnought.
However, you should also seriously develop Unyielding Sentinel (for those situations where you just want to be tough as nails), Exalted Angel (for situations where you want maximum healing throughput) and Draconic Incarnation (for blitzing through easy content extremely fast with those lethal energy bursts of doom).
Fury of the Wild is excellent too and should be used in places where burst DPS trumps sustained DPS. Fury is a late-developing destiny - it doesn't do much until you have Fury Eternal, but stick with it.

Common Twists of Fate:
Brace for Impact
Renewal (for raid healing and EE healing when not in Exalted Angel, remember it cannot be used on yourself but it is still excellent)
Momentum Swing
Sense Weakness

Obviously change these as required. In non-EE content the Draconic Incarnation point-blank AoE damage spell is obscenely powerful and you won't need Renew.


Heroic AP suggestions:
Although you are a 'Warpriest' build at heart, you will spend more in the Radiant Servant tree. You will want all of the top tier RS abilities.
Kensai tree offers Haste Boost 3. Remember it.
Take the good stuff from early in the Warpriest tree but don't invest massively into it. Remember that pumping up your Devotion (by spending more on the RS tree) will pay off by allowing you to spend less time actively healing when in combat and this improves your damage output more than the abilities deep in Warpriest do.


Gear setup:

Looking for suggestions here.

[SirValentine]

Although you are a 'Warpriest' build at heart, you will spend more in the Radiant Servant tree. You will want all of the top tier RS abilities.
<snip>
Take the good stuff from early in the Warpriest tree but don't invest massively into it. Remember that pumping up your Devotion (by spending more on the RS tree) will pay off by allowing you to spend less time actively healing when in combat and this improves your damage output more than the abilities deep in Warpriest do.

I haven't played a melee divine in quite a while, but this confirms what I've seen/read/felt: the Warpriest tree is a failure, since it's target audience is better off NOT using it.

Thanks for the build, BTW.

[korsat]

I haven't played a melee divine in quite a while, but this confirms what I've seen/read/felt: the Warpriest tree is a failure, since it's target audience is better off NOT using it.

Thanks for the build, BTW.

the fact is that RS aura is too good for melee clerics, together with the healing bonuses if you want to be a decent healer. so simply it cannot be dropped.
warpriest isn't bad at all! you just have to spend 10-15 points in the tree, not more. take the dr 5/-, divine might, 10prr and inflame. other things do not worth.

btw which are your saves with 2 paladin levels? without investing in wisdom how many sp do you have at cap?

courious because on 2 monk/1 fighter version with ocean4 saves can be higher than 50 when it's needed.

also maybe you can find better feats in place of thf line, maybe other metas

[serthcore]

I'm actually playing this build with a few different things (different feats and stats).
Im on the same boat on the warpriest tree; grab just hp, divine might, prr and inflame. Healing aura is much better than higher tiers of warpriest.
About the lvl 26 and 28 feats i have perfect thf and perfect twf (it gives 5% doublestrike).
And a minor thing, you may want to go for medium armor, the extra dodge bonus you can fit (8 in dragon armor) seems more useful than the extra PRR a heavy armor provides, imo.

About the build, is one of my favourites. Excelent defenses with excelent healing, and the dps is decent enough.

[bucyrus]

Hey Numot, I have been playing the 17Cl/2Pa/1Fi build on Khyber as well and have been having some fun with it. Currently at L25 holding while i max out Fury to qualify for feats

As for L26/L28 Feats I was planning the Perfect THF and Perfect TWF for the doublestrike. L27 is a toss up between Blinding Speed and More PRR

I have been respecing the enhancements as a I play - Currently I have have been going deeper into the WP line up to Ameliorating Strike for the debuff and free heals on a 15s timer which is working well. I am also using the Paladin Divine Might enhancement over the Cleric line to use the regening turns where possible.

[sirgog]

Hey Numot, I have been playing the 17Cl/2Pa/1Fi build on Khyber as well and have been having some fun with it. Currently at L25 holding while i max out Fury to qualify for feats

As for L26/L28 Feats I was planning the Perfect THF and Perfect TWF for the doublestrike. L27 is a toss up between Blinding Speed and More PRR

I have been respecing the enhancements as a I play - Currently I have have been going deeper into the WP line up to Ameliorating Strike for the debuff and free heals on a 15s timer which is working well. I am also using the Paladin Divine Might enhancement over the Cleric line to use the regening turns where possible.

How much does Ameliorating heal for in practice? Is it a Haste radius or something different? And how long after you hit the 'Smite' button does the heal actually land on players?

[Rusty_Can]

My ungeared WF cleric was rushing to 20 in order to TR, so I didn't run any extensive testing, but I played with Ameliorating Strike a bit.

How much does Ameliorating heal for in practice?

The following seems about right:

1d2 per character level (Still based on total level in all classes, and affected by Spell Power).

At lvl 20ish, I was getting 30-40 hp, before spellpower; metamagic feats don't seem to apply.

Is it a Haste radius or something different?

I'm not sure, but it seemed to me pretty much the same area you would expect to hit with Radiant Burst.

And how long after you hit the 'Smite' button does the heal actually land on players?

Pretty much immediate. However, you must actually hit your target; in my experience (I might be wrong here thou), it doesn't go off on grazing hits.

Other things worth noting:
- it's a smite (think paladin): it seems to go off also on off-hand attacks.
- the animation is buggy: if you hit it while running, the character stops; same thing used to happen with a few bardic songs; hopefully it will be fixed soon;
- as i said, my character was ungeared; I'm assuming Healing Lore applies;
- according to Feather, it's based on character level, not class.

[voodoogroves]

I haven't played a melee divine in quite a while, but this confirms what I've seen/read/felt: the Warpriest tree is a failure, since it's target audience is better off NOT using it.

Only on a cleric ;-)

FVS don't suffer from that "other good options" problem.

[axel15810]

Really tempted to try this build instead of my normal 17 cleric/ 2 fighter / 1 wiz. This build has much better survivability but what hurts is you don't get Kensei +3 to tactics and you lose 2 feats as oppossed to the fighter/wiz splash. So stunning blow is tough to pull off which really hurts your DPS alot of the time...still though having that survivability looks awesome....I may have to roll up an alt sometime

[axel15810]

I haven't played a melee divine in quite a while, but this confirms what I've seen/read/felt: the Warpriest tree is a failure, since it's target audience is better off NOT using it.

Thanks for the build, BTW.

I sorta agree...although the tree is great for splashing and a T5 warpriest may not be optimal but it certainly is viable. And a warpriest certainly serves well as a 2nd healer in pretty much any situation and bring some buffs that other divines don't. It could use a little more buffing though...possibly add to the party buffs and perma abilities.

[Vellrad]

Really tempted to try this build instead of my normal 17 cleric/ 2 fighter / 1 wiz. This build has much better survivability but what hurts is you don't get Kensei +3 to tactics and you lose 2 feats as oppossed to the fighter/wiz splash. So stunning blow is tough to pull off which really hurts your DPS alot of the time...still though having that survivability looks awesome....I may have to roll up an alt sometime

I got this, its very fun to play.
I don't use any tactical feats (I might try to trip, I think I'd have a medicore succes rate on low str mobs, but I don't see reason to).

I really miss 40spellpower for 1 AP from pre U19 times.

Unfortunately, this build got quite low saves.

[axel15810]

I got this, its very fun to play.
I don't use any tactical feats (I might try to trip, I think I'd have a medicore succes rate on low str mobs, but I don't see reason to).

I really miss 40spellpower for 1 AP from pre U19 times.

Unfortunately, this build got quite low saves.

I miss the 40spellpower as well...I'm still sticking with 1 wiz though because if you're going for a melee cleric and plan to splash 2 fighter levels there's no reason in my opinion to take an 18th cleric level. I think the extra wizard feat and the ability to use blur wands, ect still makes the wiz level better than the 18th cleric level.

And yeah...the saves are awful. But if you're human it's not so bad. You can make up for the bad saves by having a strong aura and strong healing amp so the aura keeps you up if cometfalled or stunned.

Unfortunately I went Horc this life after going human the previous life...the extra damage is nice, as is the +20% damage to helpless mobs but I miss the human healing amp so bad so I'm really feeling the lack of saves this time around.

I think overall the 2 pally splash is better for EE and raids.
I think overall the 17 cleric/ 2 pally / 1 figher build is better on EE content and raids because of the saves.

[Rusty_Can]

I think the extra wizard feat and the ability to use blur wands, ect still makes the wiz level better than the 18th cleric level.

Well, Warpriest 4th Core Abilitiy is permanent Blur and Blur as a lvl 2 spell in your spellbook, so no need to whip wands anymore.

Warpriest 5th Core Ability, which requires 18 class levels and 30 points in the tree, is Haste spell.

[axel15810]

Well, Warpriest 4th Core Abilitiy is permanent Blur and Blur as a lvl 2 spell in your spellbook, so no need to whip wands anymore.

Warpriest 5th Core Ability, which requires 18 class levels and 30 points in the tree, is Haste spell.

Good point, I personally don't dip that far into the warpriest tree to get those abilities though. And I actually like not being blurred often times so I can regen SP better from the Torc so I personally find that having the option is nice.

[bucyrus]

How much does Ameliorating heal for in practice? Is it a Haste radius or something different? And how long after you hit the 'Smite' button does the heal actually land on players?

Strike hits me for 230-250 but i have healing amp. As said before looks instantaneous on strike and has a haste aura radius

[Vellrad]

I miss the 40spellpower as well...I'm still sticking with 1 wiz though because if you're going for a melee cleric and plan to splash 2 fighter levels there's no reason in my opinion to take an 18th cleric level. I think the extra wizard feat and the ability to use blur wands, ect still makes the wiz level better than the 18th cleric level.

And yeah...the saves are awful. But if you're human it's not so bad. You can make up for the bad saves by having a strong aura and strong healing amp so the aura keeps you up if cometfalled or stunned.

Unfortunately I went Horc this life after going human the previous life...the extra damage is nice, as is the +20% damage to helpless mobs but I miss the human healing amp so bad so I'm really feeling the lack of saves this time around.

I think overall the 2 pally splash is better for EE and raids.
I think overall the 17 cleric/ 2 pally / 1 figher build is better on EE content and raids because of the saves.

Im dwarf only :P
Anyway, today I'd choose monk splash over a wizard.

Well, Warpriest 4th Core Abilitiy is permanent Blur and Blur as a lvl 2 spell in your spellbook, so no need to whip wands anymore.

Meh, I'd save point for something better.

Warpriest 5th Core Ability, which requires 18 class levels and 30 points in the tree, is Haste spell.

I'd prefer to take 2 ftr and 1 monk or wiz level, to take extra feat, to fit perma haste later on.

[guardianx2009]

How much does Ameliorating heal for in practice? Is it a Haste radius or something different? And how long after you hit the 'Smite' button does the heal actually land on players?

Having solo'd EE servants on my cleric w/warpriest, I can say this:
- I am TWF. Ameliorating strike heals for about 200-400 on average thanks to double proc. If you are THF, expect 100-200. The lesser number being more frequent.
- When you are already swinging, it is instant. Unlike burst, you do not have to interrupt your melee.

Good point, I personally don't dip that far into the warpriest tree to get those abilities though. And I actually like not being blurred often times so I can regen SP better from the Torc so I personally find that having the option is nice.

For what it's worth: at the end fight in EE servants, I torc'ed up the 5-6 drow archers just fine with perma-blur. In fact it helped reduce the incoming damage to a manageable so I can heal with cocoon while torc'ing.

[wtorchia]

I have posted in several other threads about my 2nd life for my cleric with a similar build. I went Half orc to make the most out of THF and Power attack. I feel that the build is the BEST solo setup there is. You have a TON of free healing, great saves, and with the right gear/EDs you have great DPS.

I forget my stats now, but I maxed St, so 20 starting, put some in Int for skills with a +3 tome, and had an OK wis/char. Dex was left at the base.

Here is what I put in another thread for gear:

Metas:
Maximise
Empower heal

Melee:
THF
ITHF
GTHF
PA
Cleave
Greater Cleave
IC : Slashing
Overwhelming crit

DPS gear:
Head: EH black dragon helm (8 con)
Goggles: GS Con op SP item
Bracers: 20% HA, +4 saves (can't remember name)
Ring 1: Ring of the stalker( 200 SP, some stat gem)
Ring 2: 106 pos ring
belt: GS smoke HP item
Neck : EE Jorga (stat gems)
Gloves: Purple dragon
trinket: Melee focus
Boots: Epic boots of corrosion
Armor : Black (epic) or red dragon (Corm) full plate
Wep: Cleaver, Hewer of Suffering (tier 3)


I will say this again. I LOVED this build. It is just an absolute HOUSE. I am soooooooooooo tempted to go back. I just want to try out a full caster for a while after YEARS as a melee cleric. I really feel like this is THE cleric build now. You get the most our of everything that cleric can bring. You can heal, fight, and cast (some) . What more could you ask for?

[Rusty_Can]

Good point, I personally don't dip that far into the warpriest tree to get those abilities though. And I actually like not being blurred often times so I can regen SP better from the Torc so I personally find that having the option is nice.

If I'm not mistaken, it's a toggle; thus, it can be switched off.

Meh, I'd save point for something better.

I was just pointing out another option, since the wizard splash was also intended to gain access to wands ....

[Vellrad]

If I'm not mistaken, it's a toggle; thus, it can be switched off.

Its permanent.