Sagas simplified

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 04:09 AM

I originally posted this on our guild forum, but haven't saw anything posted since to explain how Saga's work. So in the absence of anything else ...

I don't think that Turbine have done a particularly good job of explaining the Saga system.

So here's my simplified version

Currently there are 4 Heroic Saga's and 7 Epic Saga's, comprising of the following quests:

Code:

==============================================================================
                             |         |Honor of the|Perils of|Pirates of the|
Heroic Saga                  |Gianthold|Huntsilver  |Cormyr   |Thunder Sea   |
==============================================================================
Irestone Inlet               |         |            |         |      **      |
==============================================================================
The Legend of Two-Toed Tobias|         |            |         |      **      |
Prove Your Worth             |         |            |         |      **      |
Ghost of a Chance            |         |            |         |      **      |
Garl's Tomb                  |         |            |         |      **      |
Garl's Tomb Part 2           |         |            |         |      **      |
==============================================================================
Bargain of Blood             |         |            |         |      **      |
The Black Loch               |         |            |         |      **      |
Storm the Beaches            |         |            |         |      **      |
The Tide Turns               |         |            |         |      **      |
==============================================================================
Feast or Famine              |    **   |            |         |              |
A Cabal for One              |    **   |            |         |              |
Crucible                     |    **   |            |         |              |
Maze of Madness              |    **   |            |         |              |
Trial by Fire                |    **   |            |         |              |
The Madstone Crater          |    **   |            |         |              |
Foundation of Discord        |    **   |            |         |              |
A Cry for Help               |    **   |            |         |              |
The Prison of the Planes     |    **   |            |         |              |
Gianthold Tor                |    **   |            |         |              |
==============================================================================
Murder by Night              |         |            |    **   |              |
The Riddle                   |         |            |    **   |              |
Don't Drink the Water        |         |            |         |              |
Belly of the Beast           |         |            |         |              |
==============================================================================
Outbreak                     |         |            |    **   |              |
Overgrowth                   |         |            |    **   |              |
Thorn and Paw                |         |            |    **   |              |
The Druid's Curse            |         |     **     |    **   |              |
==============================================================================
Detour                       |         |     **     |    **   |              |
Lost in the Swamp            |         |     **     |    **   |              |
A Stay at the Inn            |         |     **     |    **   |              |
Rest Stop                    |         |     **     |    **   |              |
The End of the Road          |         |     **     |    **   |              |
==============================================================================
Disciples of Shar            |         |            |    **   |              |
Escape Plan                  |         |            |    **   |              |
Shadow of a Doubt            |         |            |    **   |              |
==============================================================================
Friends in Low Places        |         |     **     |    **   |              |
A Lesson in Deception        |         |     **     |    **   |              |
The Thrill of the Hunt       |         |     **     |    **   |              |
Army of Shadow               |         |     **     |    **   |              |
Through a Mirror Darkly      |         |     **     |    **   |              |
==============================================================================
The Tracker's Trap           |         |     **     |    **   |              |
Lines of Supply              |         |     **     |    **   |              |
Breaking the Ranks           |         |     **     |    **   |              |
A Break in the Ice           |         |     **     |    **   |              |
What Goes Up                 |         |     **     |    **   |              |
==============================================================================

and

Code:

==================================================================================================================
                             |         |Honor of the|Perils of|Menace of the|The End of|The Chosen|Pirates of the|
Epic Saga                    |Gianthold|Huntsilver  |Cormyr   |Underdark    |Eberron   |of Mystra |Thunder Sea   |
==================================================================================================================
Feast or Famine              |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
A Cabal for One              |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
Crucible                     |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
Maze of Madness              |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
Trial by Fire                |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
The Madstone Crater          |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
Foundation of Discord        |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
A Cry for Help               |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
The Prison of the Planes     |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
Gianthold Tor                |    **   |            |         |             |          |          |              |
==================================================================================================================
Bargain of Blood             |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
The Black Loch               |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
Storm The Beaches            |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
The Tide Turns               |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
Spies in the House           |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
==================================================================================================================
The Legend of Two-Toed Tobias|         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
Prove Your Worth             |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
Ghost of a Chance            |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
Precious Cargo               |         |            |         |             |          |          |      **      |
==================================================================================================================
The Lords of Dust            |         |            |         |             |    **    |          |              |
Servants of the Overlord     |         |            |         |             |    **    |          |              |
The Spinner of Shadows       |         |            |         |             |    **    |          |              |
Beyond the Rift              |         |            |         |             |    **    |    **    |              |
==================================================================================================================
Impossible Demands           |         |            |    **   |      **     |          |          |              |
The Unquiet Graves           |         |            |    **   |      **     |          |          |              |
The Lost Thread              |         |            |    **   |      **     |          |    **    |              |
The Battle for Eveningstar   |         |            |    **   |      **     |          |          |              |
==================================================================================================================
Murder by Night              |         |            |         |             |          |          |              |
The Riddle                   |         |            |         |             |          |          |              |
Don't Drink the Water        |         |            |    **   |      **     |          |          |              |
In The Belly of the Beast    |         |            |    **   |      **     |          |          |              |
==================================================================================================================
The House of Rusted Blades   |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |          |              |
The House of Broken Chains   |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |          |              |
The House of Death Undone    |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |          |              |
The Portal Opens             |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |          |              |
==================================================================================================================
Trial by Fury                |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |    **    |              |
The Deal and the Demon       |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |    **    |              |
Reclaiming the Rift          |         |            |         |      **     |    **    |    **    |              |
==================================================================================================================
Outbreak                     |         |            |    **   |             |          |          |              |
Overgrowth                   |         |            |    **   |             |          |          |              |
Thorn and Paw                |         |            |    **   |             |          |          |              |
The Druid's Curse            |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
==================================================================================================================
Detour                       |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |    **    |              |
Lost in the Swamp            |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |    **    |              |
A Stay at the Inn            |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |    **    |              |
Rest Stop                    |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |    **    |              |
The End of the Road          |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |    **    |              |
==================================================================================================================
Friends in Low Places        |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
A Lesson in Deception        |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
The Thrill of the Hunt       |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
Army of Shadow               |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
Through a Mirror Darkly      |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |    **    |              |
==================================================================================================================
The Tracker's Trap           |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
Lines of Supply              |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
Breaking the Ranks           |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
A Break in the Ice           |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
What Goes Up                 |         |     **     |    **   |             |          |          |              |
==================================================================================================================

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 04:10 AM

You receive 1 Saga Point for completing a quest on Casual or Normal, 2 for Hard and 3 for Elite.

You can track your progress on a saga by speaking to the Saga Giver

Code:

Heroic
======
Gianthold                  : Infernys (Gianthold)
Honor of the Huntsilver    : Antone Corluk (Eveningstar)
Perils of Corymyr          : Horton Waxley (Eveningstar)
Pirates of the Thunder Sea : Drell Jake (Three Barrel Cove)

Epic
====
Gianthold                  : Prooj (Gianthold)
Honor of the Huntsilver    : Belvedere Huntsilver (Eveningstar)
Perils of Corymyr          : Fidilee Fallowfield (Eveningstar)
Menace of the Underdark    : Lady Azana Winter (Eveningstar)
The End of Eberron         : Gizla (Eveningstar), Gatekeeper Grazla (Harbour)
The Chosen of Mystra       : Istine Madrovelle (Eveningstar), Eclesta Xillian (Harbour)
Pirates of the Thunder Sea : Cassiopia Carragher (Three Barrel Cove)             :

You will notice that some quests appear in more than one Saga. Completing a quest will update all Sagas that it belongs to. You do not need to repeat a quest multiple times just for it to count for multiple Sagas. Repeating a quest on a higher difficulty will update the relevant Sagas and count for more Saga Points.

When you speak to a Saga Giver, they will give you an overview of the quests

And then when you ask for a list of quests they will give you an overview of your current position with the Saga:

It would be much better if we had an extra tab on our Adventure Compendium to let you see how many points you have in a Saga and what quests you have done on whatever difficulty. Hopefully it's on the drawing board along with a load of other UI improvements we could be doing with.

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 04:11 AM

When you have enough Saga points you can turn in ALL OF YOUR POINTS IN THAT SAGA for a Reward.

In this example, all Gianthold quests have been done on Epic Elite:

This gives you an end reward list that contains a choice of 4 tomes, XP and Guild Renown:

The tomes are BTCoA so can't be traded in any way.

There's nothing preventing you from choosing a Tome that you have already used - so it's up to you to be careful with what you select.

If you need to ask which option I went for, then shame on you ....

(Guild: ): Your guild has earned 22,666 renown. (15,000 base + 7,666 medium guild bonus!)

Claiming a reward will reset your Saga Points only for that Saga. It will not affect other Saga's - so for example, claiming a reward for the Epic Menace of the Underdark will not remove the Sschindylryn quests from The End of Eberron or The Chosen of Mystra.

Note that XP and Guild Renown rewards are awarded immediately. XP cannot be banked in the same way as daily dice XP can. XP is not boosted by XP Pots, VOM etc. Guild Renown is boosted by Guild Renown pots.

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 04:12 AM

A VIP can choose to skip 1 quest per Saga. To do this, select Give me the details about the next quest in the saga from the initial dialogue. This will detail the "next" quest and give you the option to skip it:

Note that you can use the option What quest do I need after this one? to cycle through the quests to choose a different one to skip.

After I use the VIP skip option with Don't Drink The Water showing, my quest list with Fidilee Fallowfield looks like:

Notice that Don't Drink The Water has been given an Elite completion. You cannot "upgrade" a completion from Normal or Hard to Elite to get more Saga Points using the Skip option. The only way to get more Saga points for a quest you have showing as a Normal or Hard completion would be to run it on a higher difficulty.

If you try and VIP skip more than once per Saga you get an error message:

(Dungeon Master): You have already skipped the maximum number of quests allowed for VIPs in this Saga.

For each Saga you can also choose to spend Astral Shards to skip the "next" quest in the Saga. The number of times you can do this depends on the Saga. Speak to the Saga Giver for details.

With Fidilee, the next quest is now In The Belly of the Beast:

A confirmation option appears when you choose to spend shards to skip it:

It is added as an Elite completion

This now leaves me with all quests in the Saga completed, some on Hard and some on Elite:

This would give me an Elite Reward, not True Elite. I also have the option to spend 15 AS to upgrade my reward by spending 15 AS.

A confirmation window appears to confirm you want to upgrade your reward:

And then your upgraded end reward list will appear, True Elite in my case:

So that's now 45,332 renown from handing in Saga's so far.

Claiming a reward resets the Saga completely, so the astral shard and VIP skip options get reset back to 0 ready for the next pass through the saga.

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 04:12 AM

Starting off with a Saga list that looks like:

I then run about and hit the ones that I haven't done on Casual. One quick runabout later, that gets me to:

Really can't be bothered with Elminster piking in Portal Opens, so I turn in my VIP skip option on that one which takes me to

By lucky coincidence (honest) that gets me to the exact number of Saga Points for a Hard reward. I'm not going to spend 15 shards to upgrade it from Hard to Elite, and not in the mood to run all those quests over again on higher difficulties. So I'll claim my reward which gives me:

Notice that you still get +3 skill tomes, but you only get a choice of 2 for Hard, 3 for Elite and 4 for True Elite. When you ask the Saga Giver about your rewards, they say

Playing more quests on higher difficulties give rewards at higher tiers: more XP, more renown, and larger bonus Skill Tomes.

This isn't actually correct, it increase the number of options you get for your skill Tomes, but they are always +3 for Epic Saga's.

Or in my case ....

(Guild: ): Your guild has earned 11,333 renown. (7,500 base + 3,833 medium guild bonus!)

So if you're looking for Skill Tomes then Sagas could be a very effective way of getting them - you'll need a bit of luck to get the skills that you want (and UMD won't be an option!) but you don't need to run everything on Epic Elite to get your tomes.

Any questions on how it works, reply to this thread and I'll answer them as best I can from what I've learned so far.

For a guild determined to boost their guild renown levels right up, you can see how a full party running through these and picking up the renown could really add up.

That's me up to 56,665 guild renown in just a few hours.

**Qaliya** · 09-30-2013, 06:11 AM

Great info, thanks! Now if only the saga givers were actually there...

**Ron** · 09-30-2013, 06:25 AM

Sorry if this was already explained, but one thing I'm not clear on.

Suppose I complete all the quests and turn in for my normal reward.

Can I then repeat some of the quests at a higher difficulty, and subsequently turn in for Hard, then Elite, then True Elite?

Or is it a one time reward only?

**Munkenmo** · 09-30-2013, 06:45 AM

if you repeat and complete a quest at a higher difficulty level before accepting your saga reward, your saga will count the higher completion.

Once you collect the saga reward, you start over again.

**Ivan_Milic** · 09-30-2013, 08:16 AM

Originally Posted by fTdOmen

if you repeat and complete a quest at a higher difficulty level before accepting your saga reward, your saga will count the higher completion.

Once you collect the saga reward, you start over again.

So you can do them as much as you want, there is no limit?

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by Ivan_Milic

So you can do them as much as you want, there is no limit?

Correct.

As fast as you can complete the quests that make up the saga's you can claim the saga reward, and then go and do them all again.

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by Ron

Sorry if this was already explained, but one thing I'm not clear on.

Suppose I complete all the quests and turn in for my normal reward.

Can I then repeat some of the quests at a higher difficulty, and subsequently turn in for Hard, then Elite, then True Elite?

Or is it a one time reward only?

As soon as you turn the quests in for your normal reward, the saga is reset. So you then need to redo all of the quests in the saga before you can claim a second reward. You can claim saga rewards as many times as you like - you just need to redo the quests. And the difficulty of the reward you claim just depends on the number of saga points you've accumulated in that saga when you claim your reward.

**Ron** · 09-30-2013, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by Deadlock

As soon as you turn the quests in for your normal reward, the saga is reset. So you then need to redo all of the quests in the saga before you can claim a second reward. You can claim saga rewards as many times as you like - you just need to redo the quests. And the difficulty of the reward you claim just depends on the number of saga points you've accumulated in that saga when you claim your reward.

Awesome. Good to know, thanks!

**Krelar** · 09-30-2013, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by fTdOmen

if you repeat and complete a quest at a higher difficulty level before accepting your saga reward, your saga will count the higher completion.

Once you collect the saga reward, you start over again.

If you complete the quest on a lower difficulty before turning it in will it reduce your reward? Basically does it track highest completion or last completion?

**Deadlock** · 09-30-2013, 11:09 AM

Originally Posted by Krelar

If you complete the quest on a lower difficulty before turning it in will it reduce your reward? Basically does it track highest completion or last completion?

Highest until you claim your reward.

So if you do Normal -> Hard -> Normal then you still get your 2 points for the Hard completion.

**LOOON375** · 09-30-2013, 11:38 AM

Great thread. Thanks very much.

**danotmano1998** · 09-30-2013, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by LOOON375

Great thread. Thanks very much.

Agreed, thanks for the info.

These have been down for most of the time they have been released now, so I haven't even had a chance to look at them.
Appreciate the screenies and the detailed explanations.

**Cordovan** · 10-01-2013, 03:25 PM

Very nice writeup!

**SpatzAI2** · 10-01-2013, 04:24 PM

1) Did you ever take the XP tokens? Are they BTC or BTA? Logically BTC would make more sense, coding-wise I'd assume they work the same as the Dice roll ones and be BTA
2) Looks like the XP reqards vary significantly by arc, and not just by heroic/epic. You wouldn't happen to have collected data on that

Thank you very much for this and clarifying the tome thing. What you explained doesn't at all match the way I thought it was going to work, and if I had found out after completing an arc, boy would I have been ticked off.

**Trillea** · 10-01-2013, 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by SpatzAI2

1) Did you ever take the XP tokens? Are they BTC or BTA? Logically BTC would make more sense, coding-wise I'd assume they work the same as the Dice roll ones and be BTA
2) Looks like the XP reqards vary significantly by arc, and not just by heroic/epic. You wouldn't happen to have collected data on that

Thank you very much for this and clarifying the tome thing. What you explained doesn't at all match the way I thought it was going to work, and if I had found out after completing an arc, boy would I have been ticked off.

The XP tokens are automatically used as soon as they are chosen. You cannot bank them for a TR or anything.. (boooooo)

**Myrddinman** · 10-01-2013, 06:15 PM

Thanks for taking the time to pull all of this together! Once again, your contribution to the DDO community is inspiring.

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