My friend had 4.5kTP in AS stolen from him today...

[YoureDown]

My buddy [insert fake name here, lets say felicity] agreed with [insert other fake name here, lets say, J] that felicity buys him Astral shards with 4.5k TP and in return J gives him a pre-order code for the expansion. He bought the shards and traded him them, then J logged off. later he sent him a mail saying: "Gregory House:"Everybody Lies"", and another PM saying "haha, gotcha". Now from what I understand and told him the fact he gave him the shards without items in return or some kind of protection items (something worth a lot) means he just lost it all. though he contacted support and they told him they cant do anything (which is a lie), but now they sent him a mail a senior GM is working on it. anyone else thinks J should be banned and felicity should be given back his 4.5k TP?

[Krelar]

anyone else thinks J should be banned and felicity should be given back his 4.5k TP?

Not really.

felicity has learned a valuable lesson about not trading with people you don't know well. Turbine does not officially support the trading of codes for in game items and you do it at your own risk.

[Vint]

Not really.

felicity has learned a valuable lesson about not trading with people you don't know well. Turbine does not officially support the trading of codes for in game items and you do it at your own risk.

It is sad that a Dbag can get away with it, but I have to agree with this.

[Adarro]

Sadly, I have to go with the herd on this one.
There's no trade box or technical audit mechanism in place (highly possible to do, [INAL] but I think may be legally unadvisable for Turbine to implement)

Karma and Neg Rep is about all your friend has.

[ZeebaNeighba]

Karma and Neg Rep is about all your friend has.

Edit: yes we are talking about the same guy. Still, it does suck if that's just an alt pulled out for scamming. You can't really track the guy's alts if he's got half a brain to not tell anyone about it.

"J", in the case I am talking about, is guildless as of a couple days after the incident, I'm not sure if his guild booted him or if it's because the toon is a mule just recently pulled out to rip off a trade.

[redspecter23]

Absolutely disgusting behavior. Not only to rip someone off, but to taunt them about it after the fact. If the scammer received AS then it should be very easy to trace, especially with the tells if a log is kept. You can't launder AS too many times before you end up with practically nothing because of the 30% cut. So Turbine could do something about this if they wanted to. It would be nice if they did as it might be a deterrent to future scammers.

Ideally, it would be great if there was a way to trade AS through the trade window as well as things like TP codes and xpac codes. It could be done, but there is likely a good reason why Turbine has chosen not to do so.

[YoureDown]

Yeah that is what I told him and what I think.
Since it isnt implemented into the game (trading both AS and codes) then its a loss. which is why I never trade non items / money for it. well he's going to be sad, but lesson learnt. Maybe ill be awesome and buy him the expansion, got some $ lying around.

[Wanesa]

Hey folks, i don't understand. Why do you need to trade for $$?

[kwyjibo_lol]

Yeah it's a case of at your own risk when there isn't a formal exchange process which both have to agree to. To be honest I am suprised people can be so gullible. But that said, it still sucks to be skinned. Bet the coward did it on an alt too.

[TrinityTurtle]

So Turbine could do something about this if they wanted to. It would be nice if they did as it might be a deterrent to future scammers.

Unfortunately it would work the opposite. and we would see more scammers, not less. Insurance and credit consumer protection for cc's have spawned an astonishing wave of 'the only people who get hurt are greedy corps, so who cares, I'll just get what I want!' at all levels form the small petty frauds (ex. buying a dress for a date, wearing it, returning it for the cash back the next day) to the huge ones (identity theft that steals everything, etc). My sister is a criminal lawyer in NJ, and she can't believe how many theft clients honestly feel they've done nothing wrong, and that is what "insurance or the stores are for".

[redspecter23]

Unfortunately it would work the opposite. and we would see more scammers, not less. Insurance and credit consumer protection for cc's have spawned an astonishing wave of 'the only people who get hurt are greedy corps, so who cares, I'll just get what I want!' at all levels form the small petty frauds (ex. buying a dress for a date, wearing it, returning it for the cash back the next day) to the huge ones (identity theft that steals everything, etc). My sister is a criminal lawyer in NJ, and she can't believe how many theft clients honestly feel they've done nothing wrong, and that is what "insurance or the stores are for".

Actually, I was referring not only to reimbursing the one that was scammed, but also negative repercussions for the scammer up to and including a permaban on their main account. This is the part that would hopefully be a deterrent. If I had no main account in the game, I'd be much less likely to want to stick around and rip people off. As I mentioned, with astral shards, the "main" account that was to be the recipient of the ill-gotten shards can't be all that far removed from the account that did the scamming because of the 30% cut from each transaction. The paper trail could be traced as all transactions should be recorded somewhere.

I agree however that if each and every person that were scammed got their stuff back then it would just lead to more scam attempts. The scammers have to feel the hurt or they will just keep at it. Not only that, but public acknowledgement of the "crime" would go a long way toward letting others know that there is a system in place to discourage these acts. Turbine dealing with the problem wouldn't be enough. The community has to see that something has been done. It's good for them and it's good for us.

[debo]

Actually, I was referring not only to reimbursing the one that was scammed, but also negative repercussions for the scammer up to and including a permaban on their main account. This is the part that would hopefully be a deterrent. If I had no main account in the game, I'd be much less likely to want to stick around and rip people off. As I mentioned, with astral shards, the "main" account that was to be the recipient of the ill-gotten shards can't be all that far removed from the account that did the scamming because of the 30% cut from each transaction. The paper trail could be traced as all transactions should be recorded somewhere.

I agree however that if each and every person that were scammed got their stuff back then it would just lead to more scam attempts. The scammers have to feel the hurt or they will just keep at it. Not only that, but public acknowledgement of the "crime" would go a long way toward letting others know that there is a system in place to discourage these acts. Turbine dealing with the problem wouldn't be enough. The community has to see that something has been done. It's good for them and it's good for us.

While these are great ideas, I think turbine has the best solution offered. There solution of at users own risk. Pretty self explanatory.

[Enoach]

This is a regretful lesson learned.

The problem with trades like this are that they are not controlled outside of "Trust" something one side can play against the other. Using the trade windows gives each player a chance to "See" what is being traded. And in this case even if the code was given there would be no way to verify it without using it.

Personally I warn people away from these types of trades unless you actually know the person. But even that is not 100% protection.

[Ilindith]

There is always a risk with trades like that. If you are not ready to possibly lose whatever you had, never do those kind of trades.

Things like this happen on every online game there is, I've learned my lesson years ago, you just learned yours. No one can be fully trusted, it's so easy to scam people that are not in front of you.

[redspecter23]

While these are great ideas, I think turbine has the best solution offered. There solution of at users own risk. Pretty self explanatory.

That's true of course. I just find it unfortunate that Turbine has created some high demand commodities that are actively traded but cannot be safely traded. My little OCD voice in my head looks for things that could be done more safely and efficiently and wishes it was that way.

[rojo]

Ya, things like this happen. I only do trades with people that have been playing for awhile. Most of the time if its a big trade I do a background check. As in guild they are in and if my in game friends have done trades with them. Trust me there is a strong trade community here on Sarlona.
Any and all trades done with EMPIRE guild will be 100% straight .
RoJox

[debo]

That's true of course. I just find it unfortunate that Turbine has created some high demand commodities that are actively traded but cannot be safely traded. My little OCD voice in my head looks for things that could be done more safely and efficiently and wishes it was that way.

Definately. I would love to see astral shards or tp codes actually tradeable ingame. The tp codes could even be used like guest passes are kinda, but just tradeable instead of having it used on you.

[nevergiveup]

DDO is a survival game.we should make a blacklist of villains.

[fredericko]

I've been thinking on buying one of those myself, and the way I'm doing it (if I'm ever doing it) is, provided I don't know who it is I'm dealing with, I'm asking a friend we both know to act as a mediator, so that I, the buyer, give the payment to our mutual friend, then the mediator tells the seller he's holding the payment; the seller then hands the goods to the buyer (me) knowing that his payment is secured. Next I use the code or whatever, and if it's a valid code I let my friend know so he gives the payment to the seller.

Downside is you have to bug a friend with doing that. And if I don't know the guy, and we don't have any common friends, I'm not doing it. Period.

[hermespan]

My buddy [insert fake name here, lets say felicity] agreed with [insert other fake name here, lets say, J] that felicity buys him Astral shards with 4.5k TP and in return J gives him a pre-order code for the expansion. He bought the shards and traded him them, then J logged off. later he sent him a mail saying: "Gregory House:"Everybody Lies"", and another PM saying "haha, gotcha". Now from what I understand and told him the fact he gave him the shards without items in return or some kind of protection items (something worth a lot) means he just lost it all. though he contacted support and they told him they cant do anything (which is a lie), but now they sent him a mail a senior GM is working on it. anyone else thinks J should be banned and felicity should be given back his 4.5k TP?

Why not just buy the expansion? Why buy turbine points, buy astral shards with them, then trade the shards to another player for an expansion code? To say this is the hard risky way to something really simple is an understatement.

My philosophy is if you are dealing with a stranger and there's a chance you might get screwed, you almost certainly will. This comes from personal experience dealing with other gamers. As a general rule, they can't be trusted unless you really know them. This comes from me getting burned several times. I don't trust anyone unless I know them.

This is true of life in general. You wouldn't hand a total stranger $60 because he promised to go to gamestop and pick up a game for you would you? Why is doing it on the internet any different?