DDO or Neverwinter

[Deathdealr]

Never winter to me is a poorly made diablo 3, and I didn't really care much for diablo 3. I don't see the wow comparisons at all I think that has just become a phrase to regurgitate when you find a game to be non innovative, standard fare. I didn't care about any of the chars didn't read any of the quests just followed the glitter line and spammed the attack hotkeys (to be fair there is some strategy later into the game when you get a full complement of abilities). The combat can be fun for a little while but becomes very repetitive.

The depth of char creation doesn't compare to DDO. Even the visual char customization is better in DDO, minus the ugly half elves of course :-)

Overall the game just feels unpolished and smells of a cash grab on the popularity of the never winter name.

-my 2 cents your mileage my vary

[phorking]

I've played neverwinter nights platinum and they had a regular spell list and stores where you could buy a +2 sword. Somebody that never played dungeons and dragons of any kind must have made that game, it sucks, no gamepad the moving is llame and what is wrong with jump. I hit level 60 in 2 weeks and my guys sucked, I deleted him and made a new guy, and he is following the exact same quest line so no thanks to that gameDELETE

SO hey there guys, spent last night playing the new Neverwinter Online...
Seems to be a lot of games recently hypes themselves up and turns out to be a big let down.
Yeah I hear you, Im a fan boi, *err wrong* i hold no allegiance I am chaotic Neutral.
In any case, after downloading the game and client, which by the way must be capped or its all the other ten thousand ppl downloading at the same time, I managed to create a character on Dragon server and had to wait in que for about 40 minutes at 10pm PST(only 3 servers, hmmm sounds like a beginning of D3 oops again) the beginning graphics looked okay, not the top notch but hey we know once they start they lag behind newer stuff coming out.
Played till level 8, but here are my thoughts on it

Graphics - eyecandy is a little above so so, cranked at max but basically looks a lot like a combo of GW2, DDO, and Terra - oh and no way to set full screen at 1920 - yup sticks itself in window mode. although you really dont notice it after a while.
Quite of abit of things not syncing up and tearing from movements. But other than that, it does beat DDO's outdated graphic engine.

Environment - Most items are not interactable, you cant break barrels, go on a rampage etc, mostly no interactions or static movables. some places to search for collectable type stuff, but you need to spend money on kits before you can even use things like an arcane alter, or nature things, yup you gotta cough up dough to farm. But the non interaction with environment really detracts from it all. DDO you win this one hands down. [I dont always rage, but when I do, I break always break boxes with head ~Horig the halfling barbarian]

Controls and layout - This is typical of what MMO games have become, its a rehash of GW2 button setup, No customizable anything, you are limited to what you can immediately use, so macros? dont even think about it. If any of you have ever played Age of Conan, yup thats about it. Even WoW had a better set up than this. Your screen blacks out when you go into inventory or any other windows.
Props DDO we can run and have window open and a near unlimited bar space for macros and clickies.

Audio - Holy cow, did someone kill their audio production team, muted background music that is lack luster, Actors that really would be better off not saying anything at all, cheesy sounds and yes mouth and voice no where near working together. DDO is better but not a whole heck of a lot.

Enemies and AI - DDO kobold union workers.... its either they stand around while you hit them or they stare at you trying to drool on you, very very low AI, they wont even run at you if you are close to line of sight, so archer away and you will win the day. most places respawn the same enemies within 2 minutes of death or less. So what you will but DDO AI is a load lot better.

Quests - This one is kind of a toss up depending on what you prefer, the quest layouts etc for Neverwinter are al la GW2 exactly, everyone running around in the same area trying to kill enemies and complete quests which are the same type of quests that you would see in GW2, WoW - bring me 5 of those, kill 10 of them. Blah. DDO quest set ups are my personal favorites. Its kind of hard to achieve the diverse objectives, but then I know others like the GW2 way.

Microtransaction - sheesh you thought Turbines inclusion of astral shards was bad, Neverwinter has 4 different currencies including *gasp* Astral shards. After seeing this I had to see if Cryptic studios was owned by WB or Turbine subsidiarity. Its not.

------------------
I had high hopes for Neverwinter Online, but its kind of a let down in what I was expecting, certainly no DDO killing machine by any means. Its free to play now where as DDO only went free to play much later in the game after release. What is no doubt vexing the population of NEverwinter is those long wait ques, those who paid for their founder packs from $50 on up to $200, and others are playing the game for free and they still have to wait in line to log in.

Dont really foresee this one getting a lot of callers.

[phorking]

when you fight multiple targets you are flailing your mouse back and forth with ferocity.

Never winter to me is a poorly made diablo 3, and I didn't really care much for diablo 3. I don't see the wow comparisons at all I think that has just become a phrase to regurgitate when you find a game to be non innovative, standard fare. I didn't care about any of the chars didn't read any of the quests just followed the glitter line and spammed the attack hotkeys (to be fair there is some strategy later into the game when you get a full complement of abilities). The combat can be fun for a little while but becomes very repetitive.

The depth of char creation doesn't compare to DDO. Even the visual char customization is better in DDO, minus the ugly half elves of course :-)

Overall the game just feels unpolished and smells of a cash grab on the popularity of the never winter name.

-my 2 cents your mileage my vary

[Chai]

There does seem to be a lot of dissatisfaction being expressed in the Neverwinter forums. There are many people complaining about exploits that allow easy farming of the highest tier gear - so nothing left to do afterwards when everything can be sold on the AH and bought from the AH, repetitive boss mechanics (spawn adds, then spawn some more adds), loot system that allows loot ninja-ing, queuing system that doesn't check for roles in the party etc.

Yeap, it gets even more hilarious.

Clerics have a healing debuff on themselves so they cant solo a dungeon reliably. None of the pther party members do, so the cleric can keep them alive, but have to drink a pot themselves if they are burst damaged and low on hp.

If 5 people ignore you, you get "silenced" (banned from chat) for a period of time. Griefing someone is a matter of having 4 friends.

Players can be kicked at any time from the party, including right before the end of a PVP match or when someone won the loot roll and the leader came in second.

Lots of 5 boxers exploit farming xp and loot. The minute anyone says anything about it, they are ignored on all 5 of the exploit farmers accounts, which triggers the chat silence ban.

Its been my experience in MMOs that if theres a way to grief someone in game, some players will do it. PW will need to change some of this stuff before the community will begin to balance itself out and treat eachother equally. I remember when DDO had some of the same loot issues, and people stopped raiding in full groups just to have the 2 guaranteed drops to themselves, and Turbine changed that to what we have today which encourages o have more people show up. PW needs to get on that before the entire game population turns into a colossal mass of trolls. The game is good, but there are too many griefing mechanisms which allow players to take complete advantage over others.

[~griffin230]

Yeap, it gets even more hilarious.

Clerics have a healing debuff on themselves so they cant solo a dungeon reliably. None of the pther party members do, so the cleric can keep them alive, but have to drink a pot themselves if they are burst damaged and low on hp.

If 5 people ignore you, you get "silenced" (banned from chat) for a period of time. Griefing someone is a matter of having 4 friends.

Players can be kicked at any time from the party, including right before the end of a PVP match or when someone won the loot roll and the leader came in second.

Lots of 5 boxers exploit farming xp and loot. The minute anyone says anything about it, they are ignored on all 5 of the exploit farmers accounts, which triggers the chat silence ban.

Its been my experience in MMOs that if theres a way to grief someone in game, some players will do it. PW will need to change some of this stuff before the community will begin to balance itself out and treat eachother equally. I remember when DDO had some of the same loot issues, and people stopped raiding in full groups just to have the 2 guaranteed drops to themselves, and Turbine changed that to what we have today which encourages o have more people show up. PW needs to get on that before the entire game population turns into a colossal mass of trolls. The game is good, but there are too many griefing mechanisms which allow players to take complete advantage over others.

Yeah, I was aware of most of those since those issues get brought up in the Neverwinter forums (the mods have now removed the thread(s) about the exploits to easily kill epic dungeon bosses and make farming tier gear trivial) and I've noticed them myself while playing. I'm really not a fan of the kicking and looting system. It just gets abused too much, especially since you can sell everything you get in the AH so there's too much temptation. It makes for unpleasant grouping experiences.

[~adfsdasdaf]

Neverwinter almost makes me think the 4E mechanics weren't made for a videogame, because they suck there too.

There are a lot of good F2P MMO and MMO-type games out there. Neverwinter beta isn't a contender.

[nibel]

Neverwinter almost makes me think the 4E mechanics weren't made for a videogame, because they suck there too.

That thing is not 4e. Is GW2 using 4e power's names. Except it is worse than GW2.

Want to know what a videogame of 4e would looks like?

[~KrelarVersion2]

That thing is not 4e. Is GW2 using 4e power's names. Except it is worse than GW2.

Want to know what a videogame of 4e would looks like?

I like it. It even includes miniatures.

[voodoogroves]

I'm a content-fan. I'll play anything, no matter what, with some names. One of those (and the largest) is 'D&D'.

I've played / am playing a bit Neverwinter. It does some things VERY well. Others, it's a wash and then some it is just tragically bad.

GOOD
- You can't really screw up a character so that it's totall gimp
- Mechanics are scaled so that damage numbers / etc. can be tweaked more easily in the future
- Even though their skins are limited, the cosmetic framework of options is there and ready to be expanded
- Quest and objective pathing is really helpful for a new player
- Few quests need a party, at all. Very very few.
- For the party-centric quests/skirmishes the teleport-to-quest and grouping works very well.
- It's new. Just being new means running the content is interesting.
- Their bonus system is very visible in-game and has a big impact on who's playing what. Bonuses to
- Foundry.

NEUTRAL
- 4e vs 3e ... some care, I don't.
- The loot system (need/greed/pass) is a nice idea - it doesn't work quite right but it's got the feel it is the start of something promising.
- It is largely a single player game until cap, with a few specific quests. You can group, but it is unnecessary - can be fun if you want to be social, but it can also just slow you down EVEN with a good player, just because you tend to gate at key zone transfer points.
- Foundry. Some of them are ****.

BAD
- Flip side to not being able to screw up a character is that they essentially removed all the mechanics that would function like that. It's all % resist, % duration of CC effect - no saves, no save limiters, no DCs, etc.
- While they are scaled so they can make adjustments in the future if damage, etc. is deemed too out of whack, it's really not on a scale that is relevant to any D&D player. HP, damage, etc. way off the chart. XP and levels as well.
- Mechanics of combat are not D&D related (not even 4e) ... Power? Armor Penetration? Deflection? Recovery speed on cooldowns?
- Most items are bound to your specific build. You can't have a cleric with a shield (or a big 2-h weapon) or a wizard with a staff.
- Monsters have freaking weak AI.
- At the core, much like 4e, everyone is actually very similar.
- With rare exception, you can't move and fight. You also can't cast magic missile at the darkness - you have to have a target.
- It's all mouse steering - I can't steer and mouselook independently (like running forward, looking to the right and attacking - or running sideways, looking foward and attacking)
- The rooting moves and lack of real movement boosters makes the game seem slow. In DDO I'm a speed junky - chugging haste pots, winging around the market, you name it. Difficult to achieve in NWO.
- If you like a quest and want to repeat it, it isn't intuitive how to do it.
- Foundry. Some of them are not well balanced.
- Game has lots of bugs and exploits. At times, you do need to drink potions - except I've had several characters simply lose that ability (to drink a healing potion) and had no response to my tickets. Due to the exploits and loot / whatever grabbing there are already people asking for a wipe.

[SweetDude]

I agree with mr. woodoogroves in the most of his statemetnts about NOW. I'll also state some of the things that I didn't like on NWO.

- The glittering dust guiding you through the maps: serious what'tha heck is that? Are the players soo dumb nowdays that they can't find the quest entrance?? I know we can disable it and it's lame to complain about it, yet it is ridiculous.

- The traps system: serious, you can't even call that a trap system, the damage is ridiculous low and it just glows to you inviting you to disarm it.

- It isn't D&D really. It just has the label.

- It isn't Neverwinter Nights(I mean the old franchise) too, it just a random game that took the name from the neverwinter franchise.

That's it

[voodoogroves]

I agree with mr. woodoogroves in the most of his statemetnts about NOW. I'll also state some of the things that I didn't like on NWO.

- The glittering dust guiding you through the maps: serious what'tha heck is that? Are the players soo dumb nowdays that they can't find the quest entrance?? I know we can disable it and it's lame to complain about it, yet it is ridiculous.

It does help with the new/vet issue (combined with the teleport to quest ... which works in NWO

- The traps system: serious, you can't even call that a trap system, the damage is ridiculous low and it just glows to you inviting you to disarm it.

totally agree, traps are lame

- It isn't D&D really. It just has the label.

- It isn't Neverwinter Nights(I mean the old franchise) too, it just a random game that took the name from the neverwinter franchise.

That's it

Heh


On the NWO+ ... the gateway rocks. AH, mail and profession / crafting via a browser app ...

[DeathdefyBeta]

I played Neverwinter till level 34 on a Trickster Rogue and level 26 on a Control Wizard. Which isn't much for the record (it goes to 60), but I also only ran 3 foundry quests, which I'm reliably informed is a faster way to level up. e.g. with something called "Ogre farm" that involves a map with many, many ogres, and you kill them, each giving you reasonable xp. Anyway, here's my pros and cons versus DDO.


THE GOOD

I really, really liked:
- Tumble does something! I could leap/teleport out of the way of attacks that weren't just cometfall, flamestrike or fireball. You REALLY want to tumble out of super-flagged 'red danger zone' areas, but you also can dodge a lot of regular spells and only moderately flagged attacks. It's usually not a dps loss since many, many attacks come with a mini-stun component, like an 'ouchie' from standing in fire, or a chain interrupt from being hit, etc. I can't see a way for ddo to seamlessly integrate tumble being useful now, but NWO has, and it's really cool.

- Backstabbing matters. Getting behind a monster with someone else distracting it from the front does more than increase your chance to hit; it increases your damage! For every class!

- Open areas with quests in them. Picture explorer areas with objectives like 'Cleanse 20 Bearded Devils' from the Vale of Twilight. NWO also has collector quests. Yes, some people say that's super boring. Whatever. I'll collect 40 carrots for Farmer John and I'll feel good about it.


I liked:
- It's prettier than ddo in my opinion.

- The dungeon bosses require actual teamwork. I got whupped by the first dragon in the game. It was a mean ol' thing, and at level 32 comprised my 3rd (and first non-falling off a random ledge) death in the game. Eventually, 2 entirely new pug groups (that eventually quit) and a few wipes later, I got it done. Everyone in that party was solid, as opposed to the first two, and we still had a few post-wipe strategy chats.

- Damage dealt / health healed / damage taken meters are not only existent, but genuinely useful. For my first few runs of the Cloaktower (first dungeon) I was not on top of the damage meters (which as a Trickster Rogue I should have been), and I also was taking more damage than I should have.

Once I realised how to play, I corrected that (err on the side of dodging not continuing to attack, attack when you aren't moving, use missile attacks if moving in would mean you had to jump out of an attack soon after you went in to melee, don't get stunned if at all possible since it's a huge dps loss, use dailies whenever they're somewhat useful).

I realise some people don't like seeing that they're not doing well. I was in one party where control wizards (basically the exact same character no matter what choices they'd made to this point) both topped and bottomed the damage dealt meter. I realise some players will abuse other players who aren't doing well. Regardless, I personally like the constructive criticism that those stats provide. Oh, NWO also has 'killing blows' as a metric, which I literally never topped for reasons I genuinely still don't know understand since I can now consistently the damage dealt meter. Kills, a la DDO, is just kind of dumb.

- No random bugs (that I noticed). No disconnecting the first time you load in sometimes. No load screens that take hours. No lag explosions.

- The rogue can teleport to his foe. Think the ever-underrated teleporting Assassin kick from Diablo 2. Why can no one in ddo teleport to their foe?! I know 'we have abundant step', and 'if you move too fast the game asplodes'. But just literally teleport them, say in front of the monster.

Char x,y,z := Monster x,y,z - (characterHitBoxRadius x (direction monster is facing x, direction monster is facing y, 0 z)).
If the character would end up in a rock, don't teleport.

Similarly, where is dimension door to somewhere you can see at? Let's introduce blink as this. If we can target ray spells at discrete points on the ground, let's get our blink (dimension door in pnp, but hey) on too.

TL;DR - Teleporting is really fun and NWO reminded me of that undeniable fact haha.


- The LFM system works. You click 'I want to do this dungeon' and after a while it says 'party available' and you click 'I'm ready' and it teleports you into the dungeon with your group. Hooray! I would actually use 'public groups' in DDO if it teleported the plebs, err pugs, into the dungeon.


I think others will like:
- Better PvP? It is limited to 5v5 arenas, but NWO at least attempts class balance (though control wizards and rogues are again the top of the pile I'm told). There is also a 20v20 mega-arena coming. I played one pvp match and was called a noob. I agree with the assessment. At one point I thought I'd killed someone, but then I read on the screen I had to press a button to perform a 'killing blow' but while I was reading that I died again.


THE BAD

I disliked:
- All boss fights are remarkably similar. Adds, more adds, big super-flagged attacks, lots of dodging. Not to say that it's easy, just not a variety-fest. An exception to that is when you fight an enemy party of 5 adventurers - that's a cool fight, and one DDO could easily copy (hint hint!).

- Only one person could open a treasure chest at a time. That takes ~2 seconds. There are 5 members in each party. Oh, and you can't loot while someone else is looting. I have 0 doubt this will be fixed, but it's a bit lame.

- Customization is limited. Not non-existent, but compared with DDO it's laughable. If you'd never played DDO, you might love it, but having played DDO I cannot avoid the comparison and it's super painful.
Rogue = Damage,
Wizard = Damage + CC,
Cleric = Damage + Healing,
Guardian Fighter = Tank
Heavy Weapon Fighter = (AoE) Damage

End of list, and no blurring of the lines anywhere. Hybrids aren't a thing, multi-classing isn't a thing. It just sort of blows. The customization in rogue was like 'better at stealth' or 'better at crits' or 'better at general damage and faster use of abilities'. You could be a hybrid within those 3 areas, but that's still all within the super narrow role of damage dealer.

Compare ddo, where I'll soon be able to make a dual kama-wielding 7 wizard / 1 monk / 12 rogue Self-Healing, Energy Draining on Vorpal Strikes, Vampire with Decent Sneak Attacks, and Instakills via Executioner's Strike (after Improved Sunder and -1 fort save from Heartseeker poison) from being dex-based. Maybe I'll also be able to add my int to repeating crossbow attacks.

Point being, customization in the two games is like comparing 'apples' and an abstract noun like 'disappointment'.

- The Zen (their real world cash equivalent) is really in your face. I'm unsure if it's patched now, but they would do a server-wide announcement every time someone got the rare mount from opening a nightmare lockbox with a zen money key. That happened a lot. It's not a huge issue, but the amount of referring to zen and the zen shop is just a bit ugly.

- No Insta-kills. Literally none. That's not fun.

- You can't press [enter], type part of a chat message, and then fight for a bit and finish the message later. If you press [enter], by golly you aren't fighting or moving until you finish what you had to say. It's beyond idiotic, and therefore I assume going to be fixed.

- The fighting is less fun. This one's pretty subjective. Maybe it's the you have to stand still to attack thing, or maybe it's that there's no IPS and corresponding positioning fun. Maybe it's the lack of Action Boosts and that even Daily Abilities are just on a cooldown. Maybe it's that weapons almost all just do damage in one way or another (though lifesteal and that thing that makes enemies to less damage) are expections to that. Whatever.

You can't blind something from afar then go up and assassinate it. You can't Web things or Charm the big hezrou or Discoball, or kite through Solid Fog and Icestorm, or... cripple / stench / tendon slice / hamstring something and watch it limp after you... or enervate/energy drain the hell out of something, or DoT and run, or fool the stupid zombie by making it climb the stairs, then jumping off the top repeatedly (oh wait you can't do that in DDO either because it will get a yellow box over its head because the Overgrowth quest and surrounding module makes no sense. It's a ZOMBIE SO WHY WOULD IT STOP CHASING YOU?! WHY WOULD IT HEAL? HUMANS ARE BETTER THAN ZOMBIES BECAUSE WE'RE SMARTER AND FASTER. LET US USE ONE OR THE OTHER OF THESE ADVANTAGES.).

But in all seriousness, you just can't do as much, and while the combat is probably as 'fast' as DDO in my opinion, it's just not as good.



THE CONCLUSION

I like NWO and will keep it on my computer. It's fun enough, and while the Foundry at the moment is a little lacklustre for someone like me who isn't very into a big ol' roleplay, I think it'll get better. Right now it doesn't have:
- 3D - you can't put stuff on top of other stuff.
- Bosses with a little cut scene.
- The ability to designate specific loot.
- The ability to place a friendly npc next to an enemy monster without it gnawing their face off.

There's heaps of potential though, and has at the very least, generic MMORPG appeal.

For me though, it does really re-enforce to me that despite DDO's many foibles, it remains the best MMO on the market.

[SweetDude]

For me though, it does really re-enforce to me that despite DDO's many foibles, it remains the best MMO on the market.

+1

[Dilbon]

I'm starting to like the combat system, but I just wish the game was D&D without boring generic MMO stats and gear.

[Zai]

I didn't read all the posts in this thread, but just wanted to say I'm playing DDO right now because of Neverwinter.

I don't think NWO is a bad game, it's just that leading up to it's release I was preparing myself for a D&D game, and there's really nothing about NWO that's any more D&D to me than WoW or EQ are. Elves, dwarfs, and orcs are just a common fantasy setting, there might be some background 4e lore in there but I didn't recognize it, and the gameplay is just totally foreign to me. It's a half decent action RPG, in a very early beta stage, but since I was in the mood for a D&D game it couldn't hold my interest and made me want to pick up DDO again (almost went back to NWN2 instead but I somehow uninstalled it by accident at some point and didn't feel like disc hunting). I'm glad I did because DDO has improved a lot in the past few years and turned out to be exactly what I wanted to play.

I would not even say these two games compete with each other. I think anyone who wants the complexity and customization that D&D is supposed to be about is going to play DDO, and people who want a simple action MMO on rails will enjoy NWO. These are typically two entirely different audiences.

[UurlockYgmeov]

I'm trying NWO when not in my static TR group.

So far it is just evercrack of worst of war.... they claim D&D but just hp alone....

NO OPTIONS - and feels like that microsoft game - Dungeon Siege (which I liked) sans any options.

we will see --- and the dungeon / adventure tool might be what I use.... for pnp

but at the same time - DDO needs to again bring itself up to date and increase the fan base.

note: the number of NPC's makes the town feel overcrowded - but that isn't a bad thing. Would like to see more PC's and NPC's in public areas of DDO>

[TheNewSlarden]

I didn't read all the posts in this thread, but just wanted to say I'm playing DDO right now because of Neverwinter.

I don't think NWO is a bad game, it's just that leading up to it's release I was preparing myself for a D&D game, and there's really nothing about NWO that's any more D&D to me than WoW or EQ are. Elves, dwarfs, and orcs are just a common fantasy setting, there might be some background 4e lore in there but I didn't recognize it, and the gameplay is just totally foreign to me. It's a half decent action RPG, in a very early beta stage, but since I was in the mood for a D&D game it couldn't hold my interest and made me want to pick up DDO again (almost went back to NWN2 instead but I somehow uninstalled it by accident at some point and didn't feel like disc hunting). I'm glad I did because DDO has improved a lot in the past few years and turned out to be exactly what I wanted to play.

I would not even say these two games compete with each other. I think anyone who wants the complexity and customization that D&D is supposed to be about is going to play DDO, and people who want a simple action MMO on rails will enjoy NWO. These are typically two entirely different audiences.

Didn't get to finish my post. Was going to say I agree completely they are different games. I think they do overlap for some people including myself, but not most people. My friends prefer NWO over DDO so when I game with them it will be NWO instead of DDO. DDO has some really great positives with some extremely annoying/unnecessary aspects to it. NWO seems to have done a better job of keeping punishment type mechanics out of the game which will appeal to casual gamers more..

DDO recently passed 100k facebook likes and they had a celebration about it. NWO did that as well and is growing by several thousand per day. Despite the fact that most DDO players will prefer DDO - it seems NWO will clearly win the #s contest in the long run. Partially because it's model is more ftp-friendly and partially because there is less of an entry barrier for new players.

For me I will keep my hands in both games. The only thing that could possibly make me quite DDO entirely is the guild system which I and many others find frustrating. Other than that I really prefer DDO, but the guild system frustration level is so high it's entirely possibly I follow the guild leader to NWO and abandon DDO as he did. But that wouldn't be because I think DDO is just a bad game - more of a just a bad fit for someone that likes to group the way I do.

[Zai]

So you joined DDO in 2006 in anticipation of NWO? Interesting.

Huh? If that was a joke it went over my head. *is confused*

[waryJerry]

I think some of you people are giggling with insane glee whenever anyone says anything negative about Neverwinter--particularly those of you who say the most negative things on hearsay rather than trying out the game personally. Much of the criticism here is valid, especially when it comes to the lack of character depth when compared to this game, which is true enough. Still, the game has time to evolve and I very much doubt it's going away. Furthermore, it it's anything like a success you can bet it's going to have some sort of impact on this game. Competition will be good for DDO or, worst case scenario, the brain trust at Warner decides it's had its day.

[TheNewSlarden]

Huh? If that was a joke it went over my head. *is confused*

Yes it started out as a joke but I accidently saved before I could finish it. Then I I couldn't edit to fix and asked mods to remove it - which they eventually did. So I just decided the punch line wasn't all that good and scrapped it all together. Sorry for the confusion - I am not sure if the edit button just fails for me or if it's browser-specific.