The Juggerbard Concept

[Cryohazard]

Introducing the Juggerbard,
(16 Bard/ 2 Rogue / 2 ranger)
A mele/ranged EE capable bard concept

Note: I will be editing this post as I test the build, and receive feedback from other players and forumites

BUILD GOALS

This concept build is loosely based off of Lurzifer's Juggernaut (By the way, thanks for the inspiration in advance!).

So what does the "Juggerbard" do? Well, its primary form of DPS is THF mele coupled with Fury/Dreadnaught, and then every 2 minutes (when manyshot is off timer), open up with a devastating volley of ranged DPS. The Juggerbard is reasonably self-sufficient, with evasion, access to heal scrolls and wands & can cast souped-up Cure Crits. It has access to many party-friendly buffs (blur, haste, rage, and bard songs). It can also serve as pseudo-CC If you build properly. It has reasonable trap skills. It might be considered "newb-friendly" as it isn't quite as gear and past-live intensive as the Juggernaut (although gear and pastlives certainly do help!)


BUILD BACKGROUND

Again, the main purpose of the build is to create a Bard that does respectable damage in Epic content, possibly enough to solo EE content. I've been wanting to attempt a bard for once in my DDO career, but never knew quite how to build one. After partying with several of Thelanis's finest Juggernauts, and a little experience from my own Juggernaut project, I got a crazy idea to try a bard version of the juggernaut, using 16 Bard levels instead of 16 Arty levels.

The reason for 16 bard levels is to get the most out of the Bard abilities. I've been told that as a mele-focused bard, there's not much reason to take more than 16 bard levels. This is mainly because the levels beyond don't offer much for the build. And this particular build needs a lot more than what Bard auto-grants can give.

So by taking 2 rogue levels, you get access to evasion and trap skills. By taking 2 ranger levels, you get access to some auto-granted ranged feats that make it possible to pick up Manyshot by cap, which would otherwise be impossible by staying pure bard.

DIFFERENCES FROM THE JUGGERNAUT

Its worth noting that, although the Juggernaut and the Juggerbard have a few similarities with a primary focus on Mele and a secondary focus on high burst-DPS ranged damage, they still have significant differences. Juggerbard =/= Juggernaut. In a nutshell, the Juggerbard is a somewhat simplified and watered-down version of a Juggernaut, but still maintains the same playstyle.

In a head-on competition, the Juggernaut will be a better all-around DPS because of the weapon buffs & Tensers. However, the Juggerbard can provide more crowd control than the Juggernaut because of the nature of bard spells & songs. Here's some more differences.

The Juggerbard is VERY tight on feats. Many of the feats that make the juggernaut shine simply can't be taken on a Juggerbard because of a lack of available feat slots.

The Juggerbard does NOT have a quickened reconstruct equivalent. A Juggerbard may depend on a healer to get through many hard-hitting EE mobs if in a group. While solo, it can fascinate mobs, break away and heal-scroll itself, then charge back into the fray.

The Juggerbard can self-cast many useful buffs without having to juggle UMD/Scrolls in the heat of the battle. Basic spells like Displacement, Haste, Rage, GH, Freedom and the like. Not having to worry about switching to a scroll then back to your weapon = moar dps!


RACIAL VARIANTS

There appear to be several ways to build a Juggerbard, depending on your taste for flavor. For the purpose of this post, I'll be using the human version. But here's a brief breakdown of the other variants.

Half-Orc - "Pete Townshend"
- Feel like smashing your guitar over a kobold's head? The Half Orc Juggerbard takes advantage of greater strength, as well as Powerattack and THF enhancements for mele damage.

Half-Elf - "Keith Richards"
- Want to look as ugly as hell, and still do respectable damage? Play a helf version of the Juggerbard. Gets access to the Helf Dilletante line, as well as racial Arcane Archer PRE.

Halfling - "Angus Young"
- Want to be a DPS legend in a tiny package? Play a halfing. Bonuses to reflex saves & trap skills.

Drow - "Jimi Hendrix"
- If you like having your songs influenced by phosphorescent underground mushrooms, the Hendrix might be your build. Higher CHA allows for better CC abilitites.

Elf - "Jimmy Page"
- Pick up the AA line to lay down some blistering numbers on your foes.

Dwarf - "Billy Gibbons"
- Always be at home with your axe, as well as sturdy with bonuses to CON, and sport that massive beard around.

Human - "Eric Clapton"
- Be good at everything with an extra feat, more skill point, heal amp, etc.

Warforged - "Joe Satriani"
- Be a metallic monster with THF, Tactics, and CON bonuses. Be wary of negative heal amp.

STARTING STATS

-STR - Your main DPS stat. This should be as high as possible since your primary focus is mele DPS. Also, you get your STR Modifier added to your ranged damage because of the Bow Strength autogranted from Ranger 2. All ability raises from level ups should be put into STR.

-DEX - Your AC/Reflex stat. Not really necessary if you don't think you'll be doing much ranged DPS outside of manyshot. However, base DEX 19 is required for Imp. Precise Shot, (which is only available for the human version). If you opt not to take Imp Precise Shot, you can drop Dex to 14 and put the leftovers into STR or CHA.

-CON - Your HP/Fort stat. For 28/32 pt builds, you can get away with 14 Base CON to start. HP won't really be an issue with this build since you'll be in Fury/LD at endgame.

-INT - Skill Points & Trap skills. A base INT of 12 should give you enough skill points to Max UMD, Search/Disable, Perform, plus a few extras like Haggle or Jump.

-WIS - Dump it. I know its your will save stat, but most of the spells/songs you can cast block most effects that require a will save (Freedom, GH, etc)

-CHA - This is your casting stat. 28/32 pt builds should be able to start with 14-16 base CHA, and have respectable endgame capability.


LEVEL PROGRESSION

1: Rogue
2: Bard (lets you start putting skill points into perform early)
3: Ranger
4: Rogue
5: Ranger
6-20: Bard

FEATS

Again, the Juggerbard is a fairly feat starved concept. Here's the basics of what you need to acquire Overwhelming Critical at Lvl 21, and squeeze Improved Precise Shot in.

(Improved Precise Shot Version)
1: Toughness
1: (Human Bonus): Power Attack
3: Cleave // Ranger Favored Enemy: Undead
6: Great Cleave
9: Poing Blank Shot
12: Improved Critical: Slashing
15: Manyshot
18: Precise Shot
21: Overwhelming Critical
24: Improved Precise Shot

Alternatively, you *could* opt not to take the 2 Precise Shot feats, if you would rather focus on mele and only whip out a longbow for raid boss situations. This would allow you to take other Bard-useful feats such as Empower Heal, Quicken, or Inspire Excellence.

(Bard Meta Version)
1: Toughness
1: (Human Bonus): Power Attack
3: Cleave // Ranger Favored Enemy: Undead
6: Great Cleave
9: Point Blank Shot
12: Improved Critical: Slashing
15: Manyshot
18: Quicken or Empower Heal
21: Overwhelming Critical
24: Quicken or Empower Heal or Inspire Excellence

Finally, a 3rd alternative is picking up the racial Arcane Archer line (which is only possible for a rather complicated Elf or Half-Elf version of the Juggerbard

(Helf AA Version)
1: Toughness
1: (Helf Dilettante): Paladin
3: Power Attack // Ranger Favored Enemy: Undead
6: Cleave
9: Great Cleave
12: Improved Crit: Slashing
15: Point Blank Shot
18: Manyshot
21: Weapon Focus: Ranged
24: Overwhelming Critical

SPELLS

Level 1 (5): Charm, Focusing Chant, Hypnotism, Sonic Blast, Expedious Retreat
Level 2 (4): Rage, Soundburst, Blur, Invisibility
Level 3 (4): Haste, Displacement, Good Hope, Crushing Despair
Level 4 (4): Freedom, Dim Door, Otto's Sphere, Cure Crit
Level 5 (4): GH, Mind Fog, Cure Light Mass, Shadowwalk
Level 6 (2): Otto's Irresistable, Greater Shout

You'll also have access to fairly high UMD, so you can scroll pretty much anything short of high level arty buffs.

ENHANCEMENTS

These are very much in limbo because of the imminent enhancement pass. It shouldn't affect the Juggerbard much because most of its power comes from Feats & EDs. But while we're waiting on Turbine, I'll at least mention the PREs.

-Warchanter - This is a good option for leveling up, but becomes a bit "meh" at endgame. DR 5/- can be found easily or surpassed by lvl 25. The Enhancement Pass may make this a bit more useful.

-Virtuoso - Seems to be a better option for this build. While soloing EE, it can fascinate a large group of mobs and pick them off one at time. Song of Capering obviously has its uses, and Sustaining Song is nice niche tool for a group/raid situation.

-SpellSinger - Meh, doesn't work for this playstyle.

EPIC DESTINIES

I'm still working on capping my 1st life Juggerbard, so I haven't got around to planning my destinies out yet. But in general, I'm looking at:

• Primary Soloing Destiny: Legendary Dreadnaught w/ Master's Blitz + various twists
  
• Primary Group/Raid Destiny: Fury of the Wild, w/ Dreadnaught twists (Momentum Swing/Lay Waste)

Depending on flavor, you can also make Fatesinger or Shiradi your primary destiny. But be warned, you're missing out on the sheer power of Masters Blitz or Adrenaline

EPIC GEARING

Will be generally the same regardless of Race.

(Still In Progress)

Head: Black Dragon Helm
Goggles: Conc-OP - EE Dream Visor
Neck: - Torc -
Trinket: Planar Focus: Prowess (mele-ish)
Armor: Epic Black Dragon (Light)
Bracers: 20% Heal Amp + Sup Parrying
Gloves: Eveningstar PDK
Belt: ---
Boots: Cannith // Treads of Falling Shadow
Ring 1: ---
Ring 2: ---
Quiver: GH Poison

Weapons: Cleaver, Pinion

[Cryohazard]

Here's a Character Planner breakdown of the Human Juggerbard (32 Point build). For reference, I'll post a 28 pt and a 36 Pt Human build eventually, as well as the Helf AA version.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

The Human Juggerbard 
Level 20 True Neutral Human Male
(2 Rogue \ 2 Ranger \ 16 Bard) 
Hit Points: 226
Spell Points: 500 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 20
Will: 10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    22
Dexterity            16                    19
Constitution         14                    17
Intelligence         12                    15
Wisdom                8                    11
Charisma             14                    17

Tomes Used
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    26
Bluff                 2                     3
Concentration         4                    25
Diplomacy             2                     3
Disable Device        5                    25
Haggle                6                     7
Heal                 -1                     0
Hide                  3                     4
Intimidate            2                     3
Jump                  6                    12
Listen               -1                     0
Move Silently         3                     4
Open Lock             7                     9
Perform               n/a                  26
Repair                1                     2
Search                5                    25
Spot                  3                     4
Swim                  2                     6
Tumble                7                     8
Use Magic Device      6                    26

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Bard)


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 7 (Bard)


Level 8 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot


Level 16 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR

Level 21 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Overwhelming Critical

Level 24 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot

36 PT Human Juggerbard

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

36 Pt Juggerbard
Level 20 True Neutral Human Male
(2 Rogue \ 2 Ranger \ 16 Bard) 
Hit Points: 226
Spell Points: 500 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 20
Will: 10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             16                    24
Dexterity            16                    19
Constitution         14                    17
Intelligence         12                    15
Wisdom                8                    11
Charisma             14                    17

Tomes Used
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    26
Bluff                 2                     3
Concentration         4                    25
Diplomacy             2                     3
Disable Device        5                    25
Haggle                6                     7
Heal                 -1                     0
Hide                  3                     4
Intimidate            2                     3
Jump                  7                    13
Listen               -1                     0
Move Silently         3                     4
Open Lock             7                     9
Perform               n/a                  26
Repair                1                     2
Search                5                    25
Spot                  3                     4
Swim                  3                     7
Tumble                7                     8
Use Magic Device      6                    26

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Bard
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Bard
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Bard)


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 7 (Bard)


Level 8 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot


Level 16 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR

Level 21 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Overwhelming Critical

Level 24 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot

28 Pt Human Juggerbard.
Note, this version doesn't have Imp. Precise Shot. Its pretty tough to get enough base dex to use it as a 28 pt build.
If you're a new to the game, I would recommend taking some metamagics instead. Makes the build a little bit more newbie-friendly.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

28 Pt Juggerbard
Level 20 True Neutral Human Male
(2 Rogue \ 2 Ranger \ 16 Bard) 
Hit Points: 226
Spell Points: 500 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 19
Will: 10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(28 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    22
Dexterity            14                    17
Constitution         14                    17
Intelligence         12                    15
Wisdom                8                    11
Charisma             14                    17

Tomes Used
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               6                    25
Bluff                 2                     3
Concentration         4                    25
Diplomacy             2                     3
Disable Device        5                    25
Haggle                6                     7
Heal                 -1                     0
Hide                  2                     3
Intimidate            2                     3
Jump                  6                    12
Listen               -1                     0
Move Silently         2                     3
Open Lock             6                     8
Perform               n/a                  26
Repair                1                     2
Search                5                    25
Spot                  3                     4
Swim                  2                     6
Tumble                6                     7
Use Magic Device      6                    26

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Bard)


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 7 (Bard)


Level 8 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot


Level 16 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Heal


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR

Level 21 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken

Level 24 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Overwhelming Critical

Helf 32 Pt AA
Note. Of all the Juggerbard variants, this is probably most likely to be affected by the enhancement pass. You've been warned!

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Juggerbard 
Level 20 True Neutral Half-Elf Male
(2 Rogue \ 2 Ranger \ 16 Bard) 
Hit Points: 246
Spell Points: 585 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 21
Will: 12

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             16                    24
Dexterity            14                    17
Constitution         14                    17
Intelligence         12                    15
Wisdom                8                    11
Charisma             14                    19

Tomes Used
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               6                    11
Bluff                 2                     4
Concentration         4                    26
Diplomacy             2                     8
Disable Device        5                    25
Haggle                6                     9
Heal                 -1                     0
Hide                  2                     3
Intimidate            2                     4
Jump                  7                    12
Listen               -1                     4
Move Silently         2                     3
Open Lock             6                     7
Perform               n/a                  33
Repair                1                     2
Search                5                    25
Spot                 -1                     0
Swim                  3                     7
Tumble                6                     7
Use Magic Device      6                    26.5

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Paladin
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Bard)


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Ranger)


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave


Level 7 (Bard)


Level 8 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 16 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR

Level 21 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot

Level 24 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Overwhelming Critical

Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Burst Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song III
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song IV
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Music of Makers
Enhancement: Bard Music of the Dead
Enhancement: Bard Virtuoso I
Enhancement: Bard Virtuoso II
Enhancement: Improved Paladin Dilettante I
Enhancement: Improved Paladin Dilettante II
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Improved Perform I
Enhancement: Improved Perform II
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic I
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic II
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic III
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic IV
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music II
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery II
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery III

[Cryohazard]

<reserved for post-enhancement pass revisions>

[Bolo_Grubb]

+1 just because the names for the different racial types made me laugh.

[voodoogroves]

Drow is probably more "Prince" than "Hendrix". Half-Orc I'd go with Slash. WF is clearly Lemmy.

[AzB]

Thread of the week! +1!

The idea is interesting, I might have to try a variation at some point. Bard is a class that mixes well with other classes, but requires that you know what you're doing. Good luck, and keep us informed how things are working out!

(Currently waiting for the enhancement pass before I build any more bards)

[Dodoroq]

Just wandering why the H-elf AA version is built as 32-point... when the other two are 36-point and 28-point. But that is mere curiosity.

As of note, check the link in my signature, just TRed for the final time to Half-Elven AA Bardcher with the same split, will be repairing some minor things in the build though in a close future.

Few comments:
- if you are building for end-game, you may want to do better level progression to get better benefits regarding skillpoints. You do not need Evasion that early, and even DD may be postponed with crafting/easy access to +5 tools/hoarded equipment.
- try to calculate the damage you will be doing THF and TWF (remember you are getting one feat free in this field from Ranger), you might be better off with TWF in combat. I haven't thought about that too intensely, but I believe that TWF should be better against a single target at least. Will have to do some number crunching though
- you are missing some pretty necessary feats in the build, namely Quicken Spell. Without that, your healing spells will fail way too often. Also, I am somewhat missing Maximize or Empower Healing spell, which means your spells will not be able to top you up with just a single casting. This is a huge drawback compared to Juggernaut. And, once again, at endgame you might be expected to use Inspire Excellence, but you don't have it. I know, feat starvation of a bard is big as opposed to Arti :-(.

I hope to hear some feedback from you - how this goes. I sure will give mine from my experience.

[Cryohazard]

Just wandering why the H-elf AA version is built as 32-point... when the other two are 36-point and 28-point. But that is mere curiosity.

As of note, check the link in my signature, just TRed for the final time to Half-Elven AA Bardcher with the same split, will be repairing some minor things in the build though in a close future.

Few comments:
- if you are building for end-game, you may want to do better level progression to get better benefits regarding skillpoints. You do not need Evasion that early, and even DD may be postponed with crafting/easy access to +5 tools/hoarded equipment.
- try to calculate the damage you will be doing THF and TWF (remember you are getting one feat free in this field from Ranger), you might be better off with TWF in combat. I haven't thought about that too intensely, but I believe that TWF should be better against a single target at least. Will have to do some number crunching though
- you are missing some pretty necessary feats in the build, namely Quicken Spell. Without that, your healing spells will fail way too often. Also, I am somewhat missing Maximize or Empower Healing spell, which means your spells will not be able to top you up with just a single casting. This is a huge drawback compared to Juggernaut. And, once again, at endgame you might be expected to use Inspire Excellence, but you don't have it. I know, feat starvation of a bard is big as opposed to Arti :-(.

I hope to hear some feedback from you - how this goes. I sure will give mine from my experience.

The 36 Pt is there just for illustration if you were on a 3rd life or completionist version. Similarly, the 28 pt is just there for the F2pers and new players that might be interested in playing a juggerbard. There really isn't much difference between the different starting points versions other than starting stats, so I only listed a 32 pt Helf for reference to help with the feats/enhancements.

To be honest, I don't think there's anything wrong with the level progression. I'm getting 8 skill points per bard level which is good enough for my purposes (maxing UMD, perform, and trap skills + other things like concentration, balance ,and haggle). Trapping isn't an issue at all. Yesterday, I had crafted myself some ML9 +13 search/disable rings and I was disabling Elite Von5 traps as a lvl 11 without issues. I'm also a bit of an evasion junkie, so there's some personal preference there

I had mulled over going TWF as well. Speaking from experience with multiple TWF characters, its all 3 TWF feats or nothing, and the Juggerbard just doesn't have enough feats to squeeze the other 2 in. On the flip side, the 3 THF feats are rather useless and you can easily get by without taking them, freeing up 3 vital feat slots. Also, the Fury and LD benefit THF a bit more than TWF. Thats primarly why I'm committing to 3 feats with Cleave, Greatcleave, and Overwhelming Crit; Master's Blitz w/ Momentum Swing & Laywaste is where the bulk of the builds DPS comes from. I'm terrible with DPS/AC/Save calculations, but I'll try to crunch some numbers once I cap this thing and post them here.

And I agree with you. The biggest question mark for this build is not having any key metas like Quicken or maximize. I'm *hoping* that the build can avoid enough damage (through displacement, blur, decent AC/PRR, etc) to be able to fire off a heal scroll when necessary, and use the cure crit spell in an emergency. It's certainly not fully self-sufficient like the Juggernaut. It'll probably be good enough for soloing anything up to EH, but EE may be out of the question. Once I get to cap, I'll torture test it in some tougher content and see how badly it needs the metas.

[Rusty_Can]

Introducing the Juggerbard,

Juggerbard =/= Juggerbard.

Ok, I'm lost .... *coughs*

[moriedhel]

I contemplated this for a while but anything I could think off based on a bard just paled in comparison to a real jugger, just because of the lack of feats, the lack of healing, the lack of saves from paladin levels. I decided not to roll one but I'll keep an eye out if you ever come back and post some in game tests, maybe it's better than how it seems to me

[Cryohazard]

Ok, I'm lost .... *coughs*

D'oh...fixed that. Some things shouldn't be done while half-asleep

[Cryohazard]

Just a quick update. I just hit 20 on my Juggerbard last night and ran a few epic quests/raids (EH Chrono, EH Velah, H Shroud) right off the bat. I managed to not die and contribute somewhat, so at least this build is good for singing to the party.

I will note that I'm woefully gimped and undergeared as a first life with no EDs grinded out. I'm barely cracking 400 hp without any destinies. Primary weapons at the moment are a Mad Lute and Bow of Sinew, and armor is the Parasitic Breastplate. Unfortunately, I'm probably stuck with these until I can either grind out an eAG or a Cleaver and a eBlack Dragonscale armor. I'm acquiring other gear slots as I level.

I also made a grievous error by choosing halfing for his first life, and the lack of a feat is really killing me. I'll eventually TR into the human version. Speaking of feats, I opted not to take Precise Shot and went with Maximize instead to help ramp up my self heals. So far, I'm not having an issue with self-sufficiency. As far as the new enhancements go, I'm still trying to decypher all the information that got dropped on Lamannia.

All this being said, I probably wouldn't recommend the Juggerbard build for a first life character. Like the Juggernaut, it will work much better if you TR into it, bring some pastlives with you, and have existing gear/EDs already set up. I've got my work cut out for me, but I'm going to keep plugging away and keep you guys informed.

[Nii]

Hi!
week ago TRed same class split after enjoing it for 3 months. Had a lot of fun with it and can share some experience. Soloed all of ES quests on EE and few others. Most difficult for me was end of the road but i did it. But i had few differencies from your build.
1. Droped precise ind imp. precise shot for Extend and Quickness metamagic. Extend is great SP saver and quicken is mandratory for effective combat self heals.
2. Droped Toughness for Inspire exelence. It gives you and all your party +25HP due to +2 con and also others perks. Used lvl 4 fatesinger twist that gives 25 HP to compensate loose of enhancement HP. Fully geared in FotW 700+ HP. Buffed 800+
3. Droped Overwhelming crit for imp.crit ranged. Seems like it adds more burst manyshot DPS and helps with tough bosses.

PS. Sorry for my english
PPS. Just registered only to answer to your thread