What's all this Shiradi talk about?

[anivaj]

...



Should you really be invoking "honesty?"

You do realize what random drops means dont you?

[maximus123123]

can make numerous mobs helpless with NO SAVE for 6 seconds

You can usually make one mob (sometimes two) helpless. Not surprising you say "numerous" given the veracity, factuality of your previous posts...

[Therigar]

Lots of pages, sorry but I did not read them all.

Would it be worth splashing ranger prior to picking up the ED just to start in Shiradi and then undoing the splash after picking the destiny? It is a long walk from Fatesinger to Shiradi.

[anivaj]

You can usually make one mob (sometimes two) helpless. Not surprising you say "numerous" given the veracity, factuality of your previous posts...

Yep about one mob for each cast, you are correct. Too bad noone casts once....

BTW Im sure the devs totally intended all these procs so most casters would love to play a ranger ED :P I just hope you are not deluded enough to believe this will not get nerfed.

[HungarianRhapsody]

1) I've run CitW over 100 times and never saw Twilight fall, even for someone else.

Just because I enjoy statistics...

The probability of running CitW 100 times in full parties and not seeing Twilight drop even once is 0.245% *if* Twilight has a drop rate of 0.5% chance per person per raid.

I'm fairly sure that Twilight drops more often than 1/2 percent of the time per person in the raid, so the actual chance of running CitW 100 times in full parties and not seeing Twilight drop is WELL under the 1/4 percent chance that I calculated here.

...of course, you could just be really, really unlucky. Or maybe they introduced a loot verson of the Wi Flag.

[Viconiax]

Hmmmm, that mixed with:

Name: Chain Missiles
School: Evocation (Force spells)
Level: Sor/Wiz 3
Spell Point Cost: 15
Metamagic: Empower, Enlarge, Maximize, Quicken
Range: Standard (Has some AOE, see text)
Target: Foe
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
Cooldown: 3 seconds (Wiz), 2 seconds (Sor)

Regular CM has a 3 second CD. Regular CD, SLA CM, MM, CM, SLA CM.....on and on. Completely spammable, and requires absolutely no skill and can make numerous mobs helpless with NO SAVE for 6 seconds. If you can't see how this is overpowered, then there is no way I can ever convince you.

Compare it to pre-nerf wail, it basically is the same thing, but instead of maxing out DC, people maxing out spellpower. Fix DC, people will start using wail again, none of this shiradi talk has been happen until EE GH hit. Why? Mobs save are too high. Conjunction it with chain missle even, the proc chance for nerve venom on individual mobs is not that high.

Shiradi requires no skill? Go solo ee w/o drinking pots, re-entering and see how it is. Oh and don't do easy epics.

[anivaj]

Compare it to pre-nerf wail, it basically is the same thing, but instead of maxing out DC, people maxing out spellpower. Fix DC, people will start using wail again, none of this shiradi talk has been happen until EE GH hit. Why? Mobs save are too high. Conjunction it with chain missle even, the proc chance for nerve venom on individual mobs is not that high.

Shiradi requires no skill? Go solo ee w/o drinking pots, re-entering and see how it is. Oh and don't do easy epics.

You know an ED is Oped when the only way you can try to challenge someone is to tell them to solo EEs with it

[HungarianRhapsody]

Yep about one mob for each cast, you are correct. Too bad noone casts once....

One mob per cast doesn't happen unless your Nerve Venom luck is insane enough to make up for your CitW loot luck. The chance for a proc of Nerve Venom on a target is (1-0.7)^n where "n" is the number of hits you make with the spell. The probability of stunning an enemy with a magic missile, for instance is actually just over 30% and not the 35% that Viconiax had mentioned earlier.

If you are gathering up enough enemies on an EE quest to get one mob stunned per cast, then playing a Shiradi caster certainly does require a lot of skill because you have to deal with all of the enemies that aren't stunned in addition to the one that you have.

[Darkrok]

Lots of pages, sorry but I did not read them all.

Would it be worth splashing ranger prior to picking up the ED just to start in Shiradi and then undoing the splash after picking the destiny? It is a long walk from Fatesinger to Shiradi.

My opinion? No. Not because you're wrong on it being a long walk from Fatesinger to Shiradi. More because it's worth taking that walk from Fatesinger to Shiradi (and more to boot) for the twist points. Especially useful is getting enough levels overall to twist Energy Burst. That would be a level 4 twist so would be 1 + 2 + 3 + 4 fate points needed for a total of 10 points, or 30 levels, to get there. So just that twist alone would take far more than the walk from Fatesinger to Shiradi (Fatesinger 4, Shadowdancer 3, LD 4). I highly recommend at least getting Energy Burst opened before you go into Shiradi just so you don't have to switch out of Shiradi as often to level.

[Viconiax]

You know an ED is Oped when the only way you can try to challenge someone is to tell them to solo EEs with it

There already is an pm solo ee da back then in magister. Yes, no shiradi.

EDIT: should we nerf magister just because of this? No.

[HungarianRhapsody]

You know an ED is Oped when the only way you can try to challenge someone is to tell them to solo EEs with it

Since even I can do EN and EH solo with a Pale Master in the Paladin ED (and I'm not an exceptionally good player), what else is there to judge as a challenge level.

[Viconiax]

Since even I can do EN and EH solo with a Pale Master in the Paladin ED (and I'm not an exceptionally good player), what else is there to judge as a challenge level.

There is a pally that solo ee too in the achievement forums.

Who said pally is gimp?

[maximus123123]

One mob per cast doesn't happen unless your Nerve Venom luck is insane enough to make up for your CitW loot luck.

I think you're on to something....his insanely bad luck in CitW was translated into insanely good luck with Shiradi in his ability to always stun his targets and stun "numerous" mobs at that ! I've only ever been able to stun two at a time...

Just goes to show, bad luck in one arena gets translated into great luck in another !

[anivaj]

Since even I can do EN and EH solo with a Pale Master in the Paladin ED (and I'm not an exceptionally good player), what else is there to judge as a challenge level.

I can solo EN and EH with a 7 cleric/7 FvS/6 wizard with no ED. The way to compare EDs is what they bring to a party in EEs, and currently a Shiradi with nerve venom spamming chain missiles brings more to a party than a caster in DI or Magister.

[anivaj]

One mob per cast doesn't happen unless your Nerve Venom luck is insane enough to make up for your CitW loot luck. The chance for a proc of Nerve Venom on a target is (1-0.7)^n where "n" is the number of hits you make with the spell. The probability of stunning an enemy with a magic missile, for instance is actually just over 30% and not the 35% that Viconiax had mentioned earlier.

If you are gathering up enough enemies on an EE quest to get one mob stunned per cast, then playing a Shiradi caster certainly does require a lot of skill because you have to deal with all of the enemies that aren't stunned in addition to the one that you have.

If there is only 2 mobs, ALL ten of the chain missile secondary procs will hit only the second mob...

[Viconiax]

I can solo EN and EH with a 7 cleric/7 FvS/6 wizard with no ED. The way to compare EDs is what they bring to a party in EEs, and currently a Shiradi with nerve venom spamming chain missiles brings more to a party than a caster in DI or Magister.

And why is that? Saves are too high.

[HungarianRhapsody]

I can solo EN and EH with a 7 cleric/7 FvS/6 wizard with no ED. The way to compare EDs is what they bring to a party in EEs, and currently a Shiradi with nerve venom spamming chain missiles brings more to a party than a caster in DI or Magister.

I agree entirely.

That's because DI and Magister are currently ****. So is the Unyielding Sentinel and Exalted Angel. Both have some nice things to twist in, but as a whole, they're just not good.

[HungarianRhapsody]

If there is only 2 mobs, ALL ten of the chain missile secondary procs will hit only the second mob...

1-(1-0.07)^10 = 51%

51% chance of stunning the second enemy. That's less than one per chain missile. It turns out to be an average of one per two chain missiles.

I think the fact that you're using numbers that aren't at all accurate might be some of the reason why you think that Shiradi is so very overpowered.

[anivaj]

1-(1-0.07)^10 = 51%

51% chance of stunning the second enemy. That's less than one per chain missile. It turns out to be an average of one per two chain missiles.

I think the fact that you're using numbers that aren't at all accurate might be some of the reason why you think that Shiradi is so very overpowered.

You're not adding in the primary missile proc, AND you're not acknowledging the number of cheap spells you can throw in seconds before a mob reaches you.

Also, Shiradi is a cheap DPS ED. Using chain missiles is already adding DPS, throwing in CC for free is what puts it one step over balanced.

[HungarianRhapsody]

You're not adding in the primary missile proc, AND you're not acknowledging the number of cheap spells you can throw in seconds before a mob reaches you.

Also, Shiradi is a cheap DPS ED. Using chain missiles is already adding DPS, throwing in CC for free is what puts it one step over balanced.

I'm not failing to acknowledge anything. I'm just fixing your math. You keep making claims about how Shiradi works. The numbers that you are using in your claims are incorrect.