Need some help... Badly

[firemedium_jt]

You're missing the important point that, to many Cleric players, healing is not the "main purpose", but merely one of many talents.

If that's YOUR "main purpose", that's fine, but don't project your attitude onto everyone who happens to have a certain class icon in their build.



Nothing at all. I'm planning on going pure Cleric when I get to my final life. Not because I'm worried about detracting from my healing, but because I'm worried about detracting from my Spell Penetration. Offensive casting will be my "main purpose".

+1

Healing is just a Clerics best talent. So much so that they do not have to be pure because they over heal. Splashing or staying pure does not change healing ability. It is such a small difference that there are more benefits by add casting or melee abilities. So much so that it actually mitigates incoming damage making the requirement to heal less often... meaning you can heal for a longer period of time in some cases.

[SirValentine]

I can absolutely give you a spoiler alert to the sociological analysis: people aren't bringing you into the group for Greater Commands or your embarrassingly low falchion DPS. If they wanted CC, they would get an arcane. If they wanted melee DPS, they would get a melee. Your role is healing.

Maybe that's how you treat other players when you have the star. Personally, I usually just take the first 5, and expect them to contribute.

If your DPS is embarrassing low, you might want to work on improving it. If your CC is ineffective, the same.

Much TL: DR; what was described above as a healer/healer build does not deserve the scorn so often directed towards it on these forums.

It deserves MORE!

A divine that only heals is as much or more of a waste of a party slot than the mythical divine that never heals at all. Either way, they are ignoring huge portions of their abilities.

OK, I'll make a couple caveats:

Some people, for whatever weird reason of personal taste (laziness, maybe?) LIKE being nothing but healers. The people with that attitude (and who manage to KEEP that attitude long-term) are very rare.

And some people don't want to play a divine at all, but roll one up solely to heal guild raid runs, and never play it otherwise.

[Odysseus2011]

[QUOTE=CarpeNoctu;4955985] I've decided that I'm going to roll one to run with my fiancee and fully concentrate on heals and buffs with as little combat action as possible, concentrating on my ability to keep others alive and my own defenses.

Personally I've played a survivability build and as a healer it is very helpful, so here goes

Base stats: 36 point legend (2 cleric past lives)
Str(8)
Dex(17)
Con(18)
Int(8)
Wis(15)
Cha(10)

I chose a lower wisdom because it doesn't help you heal in any way except give you a couple more spell points, because this build isn't ment to cast offensive spells there's nothing gained from having a 18 wisdom, and i find the points are much better used in Constitution and Dexterity.

Key skills:
Balance - Can't heal if you're knocked down
Concentration - When using heal scrolls for tanks
UMD - Very useful for fire shield scrolls
Jump - just nice to have

Feats:
Empower/Quicken
ToughnessX2/Epic Toughness
Mental toughness-Epic Mental toughness
Half-Elf Dilettante Barbarian
Lightning reflexes

Enhancements:
Capstone (very useful when there is a death timer, that way you don't actually die)
Both prestiges
Elven dexterity( I and II)
Improved recovery (I and II), helps with the aura
Racial Toughness (I and II)
Improved Heal (I and II) so you can get the prestiges
Prayer of Life (I-III)
Prayer of Incredible life (I-III)
Cleric Energy of Zealot (I-IV)
Cleric Life Magic (I-IV)
Cleric Charisma I
Half-Elf Barbarian Constitution I
Cleric Wisdom (I and II)
Half-Elf Barbarian Toughness (I and II)
Divine Vitality I
Extra Turning I
Improved Turning I
Wand and Scroll mastery I

Gear:
Epic Helm of the Mroranon
Greensteel Goggles/SP version
Greensteel Necklace/Hp Version, with blur as a tier 3
Envenomed Cloak
Bracers of the sun soul
Epic Belt of the Mroranon
Epic Kardin's eye
Epic Gloves of the forgotten craft
Epic Ring of the Dijin - right ring
Omniescence/Epic ring of shadows - left ring
Cannith Propulsion boots
Flawless blue/green Armour
Epic Bejeweled letter opener left hand/Nightmare, the fallen moon right hand

Most of this gear isn't easy to pick up as soon as you hit level 20, it might take you awhile, keep in mind I've been playing this character for almost 3 years straight, with almost no time spent on any alts.

Epic Destinies:
Main destiny - Exulted Angel
Twist 1: Energy Sheath - Electricity
Twist 2: Unearthly Reactions
Twist 3: Lithe

This build is designed to survive anything that's ever going to be throwing at it, with 800 base HP and a reflex save of mid to upper 60s, it takes alot to kill him. By far the most notable aspect of the build is it's reflex which allows alot of benifits include being able to survive EE Von 6 smoke, survive the new lightning dot in FoT taking only 100 damage, and swim the Crucible EE if on the rouge destiny. While the survivablity of this build is incredible for a pure cleric the damage and killing capacity is absolutely abominable, therefore I use Nightmare when fighting because of the chance for energy draining mobs which even works in EE while having the positive healing aura on to heal the group. Some of the newer benefits I've seen is in EE Tor at the blue dragon when making the reflex save for the traps along with the energy sheath/ring of the dijin the damage taking is about 15 points. However getting mobbed in EE can be very deadly for anyone, however if you stay out of the fight until the melees get aggro, or toss up a displacement clicky from the greensteel it's not a problem to get in the middle of the fight. Having a high UMD is nice for scrolls, the ones I use the most are fire shield scrolls whenever the group is about to fight alot of fire elementals or for example in von 6. Recently I've found that the spell Death Pact has become obsolete for me, mainly because I rarely die, but also in many of the newer raids with the death timer you can't instantly rez yourself, you simply die again and in these cases I always use Divine Intervention, because it prevents you from dying, putting you at -9 then a few seconds later gives you about 30 hp, making it very useful in the new raids.


Drkivorkian - Level 25 cleric/5 epic, on Ghallandra
Fear No Reflex Save!! Simply heal on

[firemedium_jt]

To my knowledge no one has performed even a mechanical analysis of which is the superior path, but I can absolutely give you a spoiler alert to the sociological analysis: people aren't bringing you into the group for Greater Commands or your embarrassingly low falchion DPS. If they wanted CC, they would get an arcane. If they wanted melee DPS, they would get a melee. Your role is healing. It sucks. Someone's got to do it. Why do you think so many groups (pug and guild) are looking for a healer rather than anything else?

Much TL: DR; what was described above as a healer/healer build does not deserve the scorn so often directed towards it on these forums.

Yeah,

I was in a good mood when I read this the first time and just posted my numbers to back it up. Not the second time.

Of course he did not post a comparison of a pure melee dps 'numbers' verse and melee cleric at different levels and with what gear because he can't handle the truth. He must think we are doing like only 20% of the "melees" damage when in fact at low lvl if you read the forums you are 30% ahead in DPS and HP of newbie melees that don't read for forums, and only about 80% behind pure melees at Heroic lvls that do read the forums, and build right, and gear right. Clerics can take the same feats as melees and the same gear, if built right, and close the gap with Epic Destinies even more for most content. I would say that a divine is a minimum 60%+ (and I think this is pessimistic, but far from gimp) of a pure melee DPS and probably average even higher than that. But I only played a melee to lvl16 and got really bored with it.

My average damage is 150+ depending on max buffs or not. Average Critical 600. And average 19-20 Momentum swing 1000 and 19-20 Lay Waste 1500 with my EAGA. I have not even hit lvl 4 Legendary Dreadnought yet? I got another 20% and 2x critical damage on top of this coming to me.

And a keen Falchion or Falchion with ICS feat is far from gimp. It will be very effective with seeker gear, has a great critical range and is my favorite weapon for Heroic levels. That negative remark about Falchions was either ignorant or just trolling.

[firemedium_jt]

Personally I've played a survivability build and as a healer it is very helpful, so here goes

Base stats: 36 point legend (2 cleric past lives)
Str(8)
Dex(17)
Con(18)
Int(8)
Wis(15)
Cha(10)


snip...........................................

Nice build and info. Constructive.

[susiedupfer]

I find this quite interesting for a seasoned divine player. Do you mean you can't pay attention to your surroundings or can't see what's going on with other people and navigate at the same time ?

I think the more you play and become more comfortable with your keyboard, targetting, selecting and better with evaluating classes defense and hp, the less you have to "watch" the bars.
It becomes more like " peripheral vision", just something you know it's on the edge of the screen, and you can notice any change or drop immediately ( unless you have too much clutter, I find numbers/percentage on bars distracting too ) without needing to focus less on your movement, where your mouse is or whatever.
"Hjeal" sense, hitting f1-f6, then your appropriate shortcut for particular spell/ability.

Raids need more attention of course.
Do you use shortcuts or/and play some fps games ? Too much clutter on screen or super high resolution ?
Divines/arcanes/roles with any responsibility are more demanding on "manual" skill/awareness/focus understandably.
Please don't take it as criticism, excellent post as always, just some thoughts

(S)He is a person LEARNING how to play a cleric. With a desired statement that all (s)he wants to do is buff and heal. The only way I know to learn how to do that is to watch red bars. Once they learn it, of course they can do other stuff. But learning? Not so much.

I would never, ever build a toon to do nothing but healing ever again. Ever. It is so unnecessary. You can make a reasonably competent divine caster, and still heal well. But, I will agree with the OP...if you want to learn how to heal, you need to do nothing but that for the first toon. Then you can branch out and do other stuff after you get the minding red bars with your peripheral vision down.

[SirValentine]

I would never, ever build a toon to do nothing but healing ever again. Ever. It is so unnecessary. You can make a reasonably competent divine caster, and still heal well. But, I will agree with the OP...if you want to learn how to heal, you need to do nothing but that for the first toon. Then you can branch out and do other stuff after you get the minding red bars with your peripheral vision down.

Oh yes, I fully agree. Sure, I might rant a little against heal-only builds, and will rant lots against the bigotted "Clerics SHOULD only heal" attitudes. But if your player skill level isn't there yet, and you want to mainly concentrate on that for play, sure.

And by having a build capable of more, the divine will be able to branch out, to both be more useful to their parties, and to have more fun and challenge for themselves, once they get more practice in the mechanics of play.

[Kinerd]

Just a touch of casting and melee advice, so you are actually a more effective healer by being able to mitigate incoming damage to the group.

I'm not singling you out with this, this is a very common theme. But suppose you cast Greater Command and don't pass any target's SR, let alone DC. Or suppose you cast Blade Barrier and everything evades. What damage did you mitigate? Obviously, none. What was the increased group risk due to your hitting that button instead of anticipating hitting a heal button? Very small, certainly, but more than zero. Giving up something for nothing is a bad trade IMO.

Of course he did not post a comparison of a pure melee dps 'numbers' verse and melee cleric at different levels and with what gear because he can't handle the truth. He must think we are doing like only 20% of the "melees" damage when in fact at low lvl if you read the forums you are 30% ahead in DPS and HP of newbie melees that don't read for forums, and only about 80% behind pure melees at Heroic lvls that do read the forums, and build right, and gear right. Clerics can take the same feats as melees and the same gear, if built right, and close the gap with Epic Destinies even more for most content. I would say that a divine is a minimum 60%+ (and I think this is pessimistic, but far from gimp) of a pure melee DPS and probably average even higher than that. But I only played a melee to lvl16 and got really bored with it.

I will stipulate to all of this, that all of your empirical claims are exactly correct. My responses:

1. Is it relevant what a very well built divine does vs. a very poorly built melee?
2. Do those clerics who take the same feats as melees have room for Spell Pen? If not, how significantly is their negative leveling ability impaired?
3. Does any of that impact my central claim, which is not what you can do but what you are chosen for?

I didn't bother filling in the skills here, but I dumped everything into Balance, Jump and Tumble. I'm still a bit unsure about Maximize and still a bit concerned about the lack of Mental Toughness, but if I feel it absolutely necessary I can switch them later on...

Maximize is critical because it works on Divine Punishment, which has (1) no save, (2) no Spell Pen check, (3) outstanding base damage, and (4) only needs to be cast once every 15 seconds without losing any efficiency whatsoever, greatly reducing the impact on healing.

Also keep in mind that unlike arcanes, you do not get full instant kill proficiency out of focusing on Necromancy. They get Circle of Death, (ideally) Wail, and Finger of Death. You get Destruction and Slay Living, but not Implosion (Evocation). This goes back to my point about inferior palettes: you have less choices, less ability to enhance them due to less feats, and less inability to enhance them due to more schools required.

Maybe that's how you treat other players when you have the star. Personally, I usually just take the first 5, and expect them to contribute.

If your DPS is embarrassing low, you might want to work on improving it. If your CC is ineffective, the same.

It could be that I just suck at building divines, yes. It could also be that you have an overly inflated opinion of your divine's abilities. How shall we settle this? I feel that my posting history demonstrates my inclination towards the mathematical and objective, making it implausible (though possible) that I just have some grudge against clerics. Does that seem fair to you?

[SirValentine]

I'm not singling you out with this, this is a very common theme. But suppose you cast Greater Command and don't pass any target's SR, let alone DC. Or suppose you cast Blade Barrier and everything evades. What damage did you mitigate? Obviously, none. What was the increased group risk due to your hitting that button instead of anticipating hitting a heal button? Very small, certainly, but more than zero.

That's as silly as asking a melee how his DPS is when he's using a Disruption weapon on Elementals and a Banishing weapon on Undead.

If you know your DC sucks and the mobs have Evasion, of course you wouldn't cast Blade Barrier. If you know you don't have Spell Penetration, you're not going to cast Greater Command against a group of Drow.

Knowing the right tool for the job is part of the game. I'm not sure what the point is of mentioning that it's possible for someone clueless to use the wrong tool and get poor results from it.

3. Does any of that impact my central claim, which is not what you can do but what you are chosen for?

It's not what someone else thinks he's choosing me for, it's what I choose to do. You don't get to decide that for me, sorry.

Maximize is critical because...

I would take and suggest Maximize for a caster divine. But one might not have room for the feat on a melee divine. I didn't take it my melee divine. And didn't miss it.

It could be that I just suck at building divines, yes. It could also be that you have an overly inflated opinion of your divine's abilities. How shall we settle this?

You were the one who started insulting divines as having "embarassingly low DPS" and how nobody wants any CC from them, just healing, etc.. Now you want get all personal about my divine build versus your divine build? Whatever, dude, I'm not going there.

You play your divine how you like, and if that's a hjealbot, that's your choice, but that's not how would play a divine, nor how I'd suggest others play a divine.

I feel that my posting history demonstrates my inclination towards the mathematical and objective, making it implausible (though possible) that I just have some grudge against clerics. Does that seem fair to you?

I don't track your posting history, but I think it has become obvious in this thread that you have a grudge against non-hjealbot divines.

[firemedium_jt]

See this Ax right here. Works on everything.

http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Epic_Antique_Greataxe
Just slotted it with a Devotion Ruby and now I kiss it before every battle, lol.

I don't bother in groups much with Implosion, Greater Command blah blah blah. Like I said a simple build with just a dab of melee and casting.

Divine Punishment is a +1 and a cleric without some smiting lines will not have much for bosses.

Bosses are hard to insta kill.
My ax works always............

Mobs can be insta killed. Who cares! They are mobs.
Ax again. Maybe a BB to quicken things. Maybe not.
Not worth the spell pen cause they are mobs.... not worth the extreme DC cause they are mobs...... IMHO, but you can if you want. It's cool.

And my BB is really so that the mobs don't run around. So they stay close while I Cleave and special attack them and use my Epic Destiny attacks. I rarely kite and when I do it is tight circles if you can call it kiting, but really it isn't. Kiting are these long lines through the BB that keeps the melees from killing stuff quick cause the kite'r pulled aggro, and is really not a good idea unless you are soloing.


Still>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


No attack numbers of Pure Melee vs. Melee Cleric?????????????????


That is what I asked for. Not an argument of whether you should take spell pen or evocation. A melee comparison.

Yeah Necro is a tough build, so +1 on that to take Evocation.

___________________

Guy asked me if I was a Battle Cleric today. I told him no. A Generalist. Then he got specific and asked if I am Wisdom or STR build, and I told him both. Gave him some specifics that I took STR for Overwhelming Critical then the rest into Wisdom and that I have a +4 Wisdom tome, but that.................

Don't worry I know when to heal.........................

which is all he hopes for. And expects

[Kinerd]

That's as silly as asking a melee how his DPS is when he's using a Disruption weapon on Elementals and a Banishing weapon on Undead.

If you know your DC sucks and the mobs have Evasion, of course you wouldn't cast Blade Barrier. If you know you don't have Spell Penetration, you're not going to cast Greater Command against a group of Drow.

Knowing the right tool for the job is part of the game. I'm not sure what the point is of mentioning that it's possible for someone clueless to use the wrong tool and get poor results from it.

You are aware, of course, that Drow are not the only enemies in the game with SR?

It's not what someone else thinks he's choosing me for, it's what I choose to do. You don't get to decide that for me, sorry.

The group leader's choice certainly has no causal impact on you, and I certainly did not mean to imply it did. However, the same is true the other way around: your choice has no causal impact on what the group leader chooses you for. This is why I chose the word "sociological": grouping is a collaborative endeavor. Clerics who put other priorities above healing, for whatever reason, are going to cause and experience friction. You may believe this should not be the case, but that is a separate discussion to what is the case.

You were the one who started insulting divines as having "embarassingly low DPS" and how nobody wants any CC from them, just healing, etc.. Now you want get all personal about my divine build versus your divine build? Whatever, dude, I'm not going there.

You play your divine how you like, and if that's a hjealbot, that's your choice, but that's not how would play a divine, nor how I'd suggest others play a divine.

I am not sure how this happened. I insulted no one, and posited my potential inferiorities. Surely you also might have inferiorities? I am only trying to pursue the truth between two people who believe they are correct.

I don't track your posting history, but I think it has become obvious in this thread that you have a grudge against non-hjealbot divines.

Yes, it could also be that I have a particular grudge that goes against the mindset of every other post I have made. Do you feel this possibility warrants equal consideration?

No attack numbers of Pure Melee vs. Melee Cleric?????????????????

If you recall, the first claim I made was that clerics have no melee (or offensive casting) PrE. If you would like to debate that, a simple ddowiki link will suffice. I assume from your not doing so that you agree to this claim, so let us move on.

The next claim I made was that a cleric's DPS was "embarrassingly low". Do you have a fighter's Strength? A barbarian's? A paladin's enhancements? You can twist Haste Boost via ED, but what does the fighter twist instead? A tier 3 twist is no joke. It is literally impossible to cast a healing spell and melee (or cast a non-healing spell) simultaneously, how often do you cast healing spells? If "never", surely the group would do just as well with a full DPS. If "frequently", what are you doing meleeing? If "the exact break point between those two extremes", how often does that occur?

I do not understand why people are taking this so personally. Do you think I do not play a cleric, that I have not been subject to the same fair and unfair criticisms?

[firemedium_jt]

The next claim I made was that a cleric's DPS was "embarrassingly low". Do you have a fighter's Strength? A barbarian's? A paladin's enhancements? You can twist Haste Boost via ED, but what does the fighter twist instead? A tier 3 twist is no joke. It is literally impossible to cast a healing spell and melee (or cast a non-healing spell) simultaneously, how often do you cast healing spells? If "never", surely the group would do just as well with a full DPS. If "frequently", what are you doing meleeing? If "the exact break point between those two extremes", how often does that occur?

I do not understand why people are taking this so personally. Do you think I do not play a cleric, that I have not been subject to the same fair and unfair criticisms?

Well that use to be the case about the Prestige enhancements, and the DPS percentages were less for a Divine than they are now compared to a Pure Melee, but now that is not the case with Epic Destinies. Epic Destinies have closed the gap. Cleric melee can be a higher percentage to a pure melee's dps output now, and was always far from gimp, IMHO. You can say the pure melee dps is better against high lvl heroic mobs lvl16-20, but with a Paralzyer it does not matter with Cleave type attacks.

The Epic Destinies have closed the gap. You can talk about STR, but feats can matter more and the requirements for epic destiny special attacks and enhancments even more so.

Still waiting on those pure melee numbers because yeah I know they are higher as they should be, but the percentages are not what you think they are in a comparison???

Sorry but you were outright wrong to make fun of my Keen Falchions. I know what newbie low lvl melee does for damage. I was one a few years back without a clue. My low lvl Clerics have 30% more hitpoints than newbie pugs and do twice that damage with Power Attack, a +1 Keen Festival Icy Burst Falchion of Pure Good or of other (min lvl 4-6), and with a slight boost to attack from FTR attack or Human versatility or a Divine Power item and Divine Favor...... hit most of the time, and critical a lot.

And that is the "sociological" reality of it.

Used implosion to solo Dreamdark for the Eardweller optional at lvl 20 before th expansion. Had a Wiz20 hire cast Energy Drain on mobs. That was about the only time I enjoyed Implosion, but it is a great spell.

[SirValentine]

Clerics who put other priorities above healing, for whatever reason, are going to cause and experience friction.

Didn't you just forget:

the same is true the other way around

Yes, there is going to be friction between people who attempt to force there preconceptions on other people's builds, and people who have builds different (and quite possibly better) builds than those preconceptions.

You choose to say it is caused by the person who doesn't conform to somebody's sterotype, but I say it is caused by the person trying to project their narrowmindedness on others.

I do not understand why people are taking this so personally. Do you think I do not play a cleric, that I have not been subject to the same fair and unfair criticisms?

I wasn't personal until you started telling me how I have "have an overly inflated opinion" of my divine.

Oh, and feel free to continue to point out how characters who do only one thing can do it slightly better than multitalented characters who can do lots of things.

Yes, a Barb should out-DPS a melee divine, other things being equal. So what? That's irrelevant unless the divine is ONLY doing melee. A melee-ONLY divine is just as much of a waste as a healer-ONLY divine.

[firemedium_jt]

The funniest thing about

CLR3/WIZ1 (I take the WIZ1 at lvl2)

to CLR17/WIZ1

is that no one really had a clue I was a STR build on my HOrc. Even with the Falchions in my hands.

I would rest and cast Master's Touch on one or two of my 2 handed weapons for Martial Proficiency and his melee did very nicely. I can not tell you how many times in slayers and non raid quests I would sit there with a nice pool of spell points for the red/orange named fights. CLR17/WIZ1/FTR2 the sp looked a little low on this lower Wis build, but went a long way.

Now on my Human CLR17/WIZ1/FTR2 Generalist with 2 lvl ups in STR to get it to 23 for OC and 3 in WIS plus all the heroic WIS enhancements does nicely and gets some max BB in there.

For some reason I tend to DOT more and end the fights with about 20-40% of my sp while others end fights with 60% of their sp if pure. I think they might be too worried about running out of sp to heal, and not using Divine Punishment enough. Geezh at least get a triple stack in there.

_________________

Then there was one time we formed for King's Forest Quest on EH

Pure wiz25 he was a Pale Master
Pure Fav22 self healer here
a pure arti23 Self healing robot
and my CLR17/WIZ1/FTR2/E3

While we waited for more to join I casually said that "well I might as well get out my ax to do some melee"
and the WIZ proceeded to tell me that since I am not going to heal he is going to drop group.

What a pus#y.

I have never seen that after level 13. Most players have a clue that Clerics can heal and do something else when someone is not losing red on their bar.

[firemedium_jt]

I would take and suggest Maximize for a caster divine. But one might not have room for the feat on a melee divine. I didn't take it my melee divine. And didn't miss it.



You were the one who started insulting divines as having "embarassingly low DPS" and how nobody wants any CC from them, just healing, etc.. Now you want get all personal about my divine build versus your divine build? Whatever, dude, I'm not going there.

You play your divine how you like, and if that's a hjealbot, that's your choice, but that's not how would play a divine, nor how I'd suggest others play a divine.



I don't track your posting history, but I think it has become obvious in this thread that you have a grudge against non-hjealbot divines.

Sorry but I cant imagine too many reasons to drop maximize. It helps your bursts and dp and bb. There are not too many melee feats that beat it.

[firemedium_jt]

Sir,

Post your melee cleric builds t hat u r referencing.

[PNellesen]

Then there was one time we formed for King's Forest Quest on EH

Pure wiz25 he was a Pale Master
Pure Fav22 self healer here
a pure arti23 Self healing robot
and my CLR17/WIZ1/FTR2/E3

While we waited for more to join I casually said that "well I might as well get out my ax to do some melee"
and the WIZ proceeded to tell me that since I am not going to heal he is going to drop group.

What a pus#y.

I have never seen that after level 13. Most players have a clue that Clerics can heal and do something else when someone is not losing red on their bar.

Wait - a level 25 PALE MASTER said that? Really?

*head axeplodes*

[SirValentine]

Sir,

Post your melee cleric builds t hat u r referencing.

My melee Cleric life build? That was a long time ago (life #3, I'm on 14 now, that was way pre-EDs), and I didn't keep a record, but I'll try to remember the basics:

Half Orc

Clr19/Ftr1 (for full power aura, base of 7; RS gives +2 to caster level, and it's CL/3; a deeper splash would have impacted aura)

Starting stats:
Str 20 (all level-ups here)
Dex 8
Con 15
Int 6
Wis 14
Cha 12

I had +2 tomes all around as well.

Skills: Concentration

Feats (7 regular + 1 Ftr)(not in order taken):
Toughness
Empower Healing
Quicken
Power Attack
Improved Crit: Slashing
THF
ITHF
GTHF

Enhancements included:
Clr: Radiant Servant 2, Life Magic 4
Ftr: Haste Boost, Toughness
Half-orc: Toughness, Strength, Melee Damage, Power Attack, and Great Weapon lines all maxxed

Did good melee damage and healed just fine. Did lots of old-style Epics with him, no trouble. Smaller SP pool no problem at all in 6-man quests since not offensive casting. Hurt a bit in some raids, but not too bad. Aura, bursts, mass cures all centered on self in the thick of it while swinging eAGA.

This guy was better in a group that had another caster to cover CC than my caster Cleric. Caster Cleric was better solo and was quite capable of BEING the CC.

[firemedium_jt]

My melee Cleric life build? That was a long time ago (life #3, I'm on 14 now, that was way pre-EDs), and I didn't keep a record, but I'll try to remember the basics:

Half Orc

Clr19/Ftr1 (for full power aura, base of 7; RS gives +2 to caster level, and it's CL/3; a deeper splash would have impacted aura)

Starting stats:
Str 20 (all level-ups here)
Dex 8
Con 15
Int 6
Wis 14
Cha 12

I had +2 tomes all around as well.

Skills: Concentration

Feats (7 regular + 1 Ftr)(not in order taken):
Toughness
Empower Healing
Quicken
Power Attack
Improved Crit: Slashing
THF
ITHF
GTHF

Enhancements included:
Clr: Radiant Servant 2, Life Magic 4
Ftr: Haste Boost, Toughness
Half-orc: Toughness, Strength, Melee Damage, Power Attack, and Great Weapon lines all maxxed

Did good melee damage and healed just fine. Did lots of old-style Epics with him, no trouble. Smaller SP pool no problem at all in 6-man quests since not offensive casting. Hurt a bit in some raids, but not too bad. Aura, bursts, mass cures all centered on self in the thick of it while swinging eAGA.

This guy was better in a group that had another caster to cover CC than my caster Cleric. Caster Cleric was better solo and was quite capable of BEING the CC.

Did u take him to epic?

What epic feats?

Why only FTR1?

and not Wiz1/ftr2?

Is Aura really worth it?

For cleaves for overwhelming critical?

What epic destiny mix??
I am wondering what are the best twists??

All I have is LD and EA Epic Destinies. U must have Fury of the Wild if u dont have Cleaves?

[SirValentine]

Did u take him to epic?

What epic feats?

Did Epics on him all the time.

But this was when level cap was 20.

Why only FTR1?

and not Wiz1/ftr2?

Explained why I only wanted to splash one.

I got the feats I needed, and kept maximum aura.

Any deeper would just cut into my SP pool even more, and weaken my Mass Heals. I raid-healed with him often. There was nothing else I needed to splash for. One bonus feat, Haste Boost, and Martial Weapon Proficiency were what I wanted and got.

Is Aura really worth it?

Don't know if it's as important anymore with the plethora of healing Epic Destiny abilities, but it was worth it to me then.

It equated to a difference between, say, 28 points per tick and 24 points per tick. 4 HP per tick, times 6 party members, times 45 ticks, adds up to over 1000 HP worth of healing per aura use. Not counting crits, or healing amp, etc..

For cleaves for overwhelming critical?

What epic destiny mix??
I am wondering what are the best twists??

All I have is LD and EA Epic Destinies. U must have Fury of the Wild if u dont have Cleaves?

Like I said, this was all pre-ED.

I haven't played a melee of any sort with EDs.