Collector NPCs Feedback!

[Deadlock]

There's obvious a disconnect here between the devs and the player base on the quantities of collectables required for these things.

The devs have previously said that they do play the game, so they must know what we're talking about.

Maybe they should post up a screenie of their collectable bags. I'll show them mine if they show me theirs. We can compare what I have from 6 odd years of playing and rarely handing stuff in (apart from the odd Cannith crafting or three).

[Cleanincubus]

You do know a technical constraint doesn't always refer to bugs and code changes right? It is a deadline based system. They announce a schedule and have to keep to it. Each week they get closer to the schedule, more and more bugs get pushed off the to do now list and get put on the to do later list. The lower the severity, the further out it gets pushed.

As a tester, it is our task to describe and relate the bug in the most common impactful to bussiness manner. Sometimes something that crashes the game can be let loose if it is soo rare that no one really hits it, or that the repro is soo difficult that it is not going to be seen. The bugs exists, but the work for it is just done when it becomes visible to the customers and they put in a ticket.

Something like these changes, don't functionally break the game, so they get let loose while more important bugs are worked on. And sometimes the bugs are never exposed to the outside world; they just would be catastrophic if they were, so all time is focused internally to fix them.

Now if the release notes we saw contained everything QA submitted internally, we may have less to complain about.

I understand what you're saying, and agree for the most part, but not completely. Lets say that the issue is in fact a time constraint. Lets say they absolutely had to release the new collector barter system. They could have released the original version, that required lesser amounts of collectables. Releasing the updated version was simply the wrong thing to do, and they were informed of that in multiple threads for Lamannia.

And yes, they had time to revert it back.

Here's the original list, that was uploaded to Lamannia on 3/5:
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=410895
Example:

Goldscutle - Religious Icon Collector
Potion of Aid = 3 Strings of Prayer Beads
Potion of Lesser Restoration = 3 Strings of Prayer Beads
Randomly Selected Colorless Augment of ML 0 = 3 Strings of Prayer Beads, 2 Small Wooden Idols, 1 Icon of Khyber
Diamond of Str, Dex, Con, Int, Wis, or Cha +1 = 4 Astral Shards

Only 2 day later, 3/7, and they updated it:
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=411111
Example:

Goldscuttle
Potion of Aid - 30 Prayer Beads
Potion of Lesser Resotration - 30 Prayer Beads
Random Diamond Augment of +1 Ability - 30 Prayer Beads, 10 Wooden Idols, 5 Khyber Icons
Selectable Diamond Augment of +1 Ability - 4 Astral Shards

My main point is that they need to stop rushing these new systems into the game before they are even close to done. It was on Lamannia for less than 2 weeks before it was released. That's clearly not enough time. It's clearly never been enough time for any new system. Two days to change it on Lamannia, and they had a week to change it back before it hit the Live servers. I say a week, because obviously it takes quite a bit of time to get the release ready to be packaged for Live. Who knows how long it really was. The community would have been far happier with the system as it was originally updated to, and then "nerfed" at a later date, rather than immediately "nerfed" at the time it's released. At least then the players would be using the new system, rather than simply ignoring it completely until it's fixed. Is having random augments available for a cheap price, and then raising the price later, really that big of a deal? Do many people really care that much about augments, that they would have horded them before an increase in collection amounts? Generally, I would say no.

[Nibor]

We also saw this as an opportunity to give players the ability to purchase low-level augments.

The intention was to increase the price of Augments to properly manage their supply in-game

The problem is you're not taking feedback on the part of the system that players have the most feedback on - the way augments have been made available, and the system made onerous so that it could be monetized. (Hint - stop doing that. Make the game FUN and people will pay to play it. Make the game annoying, and only fun if you keep paying over and over...and people go find other fun things to pay for.)

Can't wait for lvl 28 augments to be in the same sort of system - exceptionally rare in game, but available at a "very reasonable" astral shard price, since you appear to feel that part of the system is just fine.

[rfachini]

I have avoided collectibles like the plague for the last six years. Before bags were introduced to the game, I used to collect everything. I made printable sheets to keep track of what I collected and who to turn them in to.
After a while, I found the rewards to be not worth the time or inventory space.
We can buy most of those items very cheaply from vendors in-game.

Augments are a step in the right direction. To make "collecting" worth it, you need to have the rewards be things you can't just buy: augments, XP pots, slayer pots, special "buffs" etc.

[Flavilandile]

We'll be taking a look at the costs of collectibles available at Collector NPC in the coming months, and adjusting things as is deemed appropriate.

That's an easy one :

- Keep the Turn-In price of the Augments as it is.
- Put back the Turn-In price that appeared first on Lamania and met everybody's approval for the rest.

You don't need months to fix that.

Oh and as a side note : Augments are useless unless we have a bag to store them... and No the Ingredient Bag will not do.

[EnjoyTheJourney]

I find the core game itself to be a lot of fun. I find the number and complexity of different in-game systems presented to players to be off-putting, when considering the different crafting systems, augments, collectables, etc.

I also believe that you end up earning less money when you try to create new revenue streams by making complicated preexisting systems even more complicated, putting yet another learning curve in front of players, to get value from money that they might spend.

[Alavatar]

Oh, look! It's another Official "lets post an official thread on the topic to give an illusion of wanting feedback on something the players are upset about or interested in, but actually ignore the thread while we push forward based on our own internal decisions" topic.



It kind of reminds me of having to deal with certain regulatory agencies.

[Cordovan]

Not ignoring the thread at all, I've read every single post in here, and am gathering feedback. Thanks!

[Battlehawke]

Its definately a step in the right direction. I actually stopped for the first time in three years to pick up collectables last night. Tonight I'm going to go check out the barters and see whats available. Anyone make a link/list yet for turn ins and awards?

Ps If this continues to expand and grow with the game and includes the high level augments, the it will be impressive.

[Furelli]

Getting Augments at 30+15+5 is not ok if the Augment you get is random. That is a lot of collecting random collectables, purposely having to farm to maybe get the Augment you want. 30 OR 15 OR 5 [i.e. 3 separate recipes] I can see for a random Augment or 30+15+5 for a specific Augment but otherwise it is not helpful for getting while leveling up which I thought was the game, more often than not the forums and the designers seem to see the game as the high levels.

I am fully aware that you have set the price high to encourage the spending of Astral Shards on the augments instead of the collectables but the currently set prices are too high for the casual gamer and in fact some dedicated hoarders are saying they have only the collectables for two or three punts.

I really like the Augment system, I have always found it difficult to slot everything I wanted on the characters equipment and this system solves my issues if I can get the Augment crystals. Random drops are random, sellers and traders should not be.

Furelli

[droid327]

Anyone make a link/list yet for turn ins and awards?

Yeah its on the Lammania forum, I think - I cant get the link right now.

Basically nothing is useful except for augments and one or two things (like Treasure from Lordsmarch). Everything else is so overpriced that you'd never be able to acquire enough collectables (like 30 uncommons) to use them with any reliability. Like you could get one Potion of Int Skills +3 every three or four weeks, maybe.

I really dont need a Potions of Bull's Strength that bad (for 30 Fragrant Drowshoods or something)

[LoneWolfie]

Its definately a step in the right direction. I actually stopped for the first time in three years to pick up collectables last night. Tonight I'm going to go check out the barters and see whats available. Anyone make a link/list yet for turn ins and awards?

Ps If this continues to expand and grow with the game and includes the high level augments, the it will be impressive.

Oops linked wrong post... can't find the list i had now... sorry
found that list but can't swear to it's accuracy.

[Battlehawke]

Oh, so its not a true barter system for augments? Its random? That's dissapointing. It would be nice if I knew I four turn in 100 Drowshard for a specific augment. That would be a no brainer Turbine!

[Bogenbroom]

I've been thinking about the 30/10/5 split for the barter and it comes to mind that if there were a 3-to-1 trade up mech this might be reasonable. Meaning if I could trade my 3 common collectables for 1 rare and then 3 rare for 1 very rare, that might make the split more palatable.

[patang01]

As of today's update (Update 17.1), Collector NPCs now function with a Barter Shop interface. We think this increases their accessibility and ease-of-use, compared to the "old" conversation-based interface. We also saw this as an opportunity to give players the ability to purchase low-level augments.

The intention was to increase the price of Augments to properly manage their supply in-game, but due to a technical constraint, all collectible turn-ins had their price increased. For upcoming releases we will be adjusting prices based on the barter value or availability of items, among other factors.

We hope to bring new and more interesting items to offer as well. What would you like to see Collectors offer? We'd love to get your feedback. Thanks!

Here's an honest suggestion.

a) adjust the turn in rate for common (say half) and rare (say a third). We know which ones are rare and required in other recipes (stone of change and crafting). The across the board 10x the original amount is not only off but simply wrong.

b) Increase drop rates. Don't expect them to increase because you have the lottery. I tried gold but I won't anymore. After I got ONE ingot for my 5 shards I prefer to do silver when I remember and be done with it. Make all places and bags have a chance for common, average and rare drops. All. Enough with the one khyber idol spam. Critters should be carrying other things.

My suggestion is 75% common level 1-10 stuff with 20 average and 5 rare and with each of that include a small chance for either gem or plat. Small amounts. It makes sense and would entice people to pick stuff up. Then increase the drop rate to 50% common, 40% average and 10% rare in 11-20. With a lil' more gems and plat. And finally in Epic levels make each bag or item have a chance for 1-3 drops. Make it interesting.

If you b) it would be possible in the long run to keep a slightly higher turn in ratio (not like now) since there will be more of these things in circulation.

Finally - let us do something with soul gems. I mean something beyond recipes and crafting (it's only for a limited amount of them anyways). Add a turn in guy for them - for something. Like plat and gems mostly and a small chance for rare mats. Based on the 'power' of the soul gem.

And please, pretty please stop making everything a cash grab. I mean really. I know you need to make money - but make 'your' cash grab a benefit for the community and not the end and be all of everything you develope.

[CaptainSpacePony]

Oh, so its not a true barter system for augments? Its random? That's dissapointing. It would be nice if I knew I four turn in 100 Drowshard for a specific augment. That would be a no brainer Turbine!

IMO, the random factor is a holdover from the old system. During initial design, someone probably thought it would be cool to make collectibles like mini-lotto tickets. Maybe someone does find that more fun, but Battlehawke and I don't.

I envision my battle-weary hero, still spattered with Splinterskull blood Bartering with Bowdin in House Phiarlan.

Skookumchuk: "I have returned from the Tangleroot. I know you are on an expert on soarwood. What do you make of this?"

Bowdin: (whistles) "That's a beauty there. Don't see many of those. Usually when lightning strikes a soar tree, it burns. But in the case of your specimen, the wood split cleanly open.
"Look here--you can see there is some light scorching on the outside, but inside, the energy of the lightning super-heated the soarwood sap so quickly it burst the wood open and left the inside with a dazzling varnish of crystalized soarwood sap that shines like Starfire!
"These are highly, HIGHLY sought after and so darned rare that they are almost priceless. Collectors like me prize them for their uncanny natural beauty. Crafters have used them since time immortal to imbue magic items with a unique protective alchemical property.
"Yes indeedy. You've found yourself a real treasure there. Something like that, why a seller can pretty much name their own price. I won't lie and say I'm not interested, because I am interested--very interested. It's true I don't have the huge bank roll needed to buy such a rare and valuable item--only the Coin Lords or some Epic Adventures have that kind of money. But, I am flattered and excited you came to me first. I won't let the opportunity escape me so I'm going to make you an offer you CAN'T refuse--I'll TRADE you for it!
"If you give me your Lightning-Split Soarwood, I will reach into my bag over there (it used be full of old dresses but prom season you know)... I say, I'll reach into my bag of augment gems over there and pull out something you can have in exchange. (No you can't have the BAG, son, so don't even ask.) You don't know what it will be. Even I don't know what it will be. But the mystery, the excitement, that will be FUN!
"What do you say? Do we have a trade?"

Skookumchuk: "...
"...
"...
"...I'll just put it on the auction house for a few million gold pieces."

[bigolbear]

As of today's update (Update 17.1), Collector NPCs now function with a Barter Shop interface. We think this increases their accessibility and ease-of-use, compared to the "old" conversation-based interface. We also saw this as an opportunity to give players the ability to purchase low-level augments.

This is all good, I think 99% of your player base agrees - and there was much positve feedback here.

The intention was to increase the price of Augments to properly manage their supply in-game, but due to a technical constraint, all collectible turn-ins had their price increased. For upcoming releases we will be adjusting prices based on the barter value or availability of items, among other factors.

Technical constraint! Sory but im calling ******** on that. Technical error by the code monkey or managerial error or comunication error - now THAT i could believe. Its prety darn obvious some one messed up (either in terms of design, or coding) and you didnt have time to fix it - because you wanted to get the AS options out.

As a coder/analyst my self i cant honestly think of any kind of technical constraint that could posibly have caused this - time constraints... coder errors... design errors... all possible. Hell cordovan your a comunity guy, im not even accusing you of fibbing to us, your no doubt just passing on what you are told - but some one is.

Honestly Im not seeing the big deal here tho, not many folks bothered turning in collectables any ways. Its actualy more of a big deal that as a company you think the player base will buy that line.

We hope to bring new and more interesting items to offer as well. What would you like to see Collectors offer? We'd love to get your feedback. Thanks!

Ok What id like to see collectors offer is USEFULL items. curently the system is mostly a waste because the only realy useful items we get are ammo & healing wands

1 common collectable - common potion.
5 common collectables - common weapon OR 1000 stack of ammo.
10 common collectables - common wand.
20 common collectables - 5 Astral shards OR 5d20 assorted crafting mats.

1 uncommon collectable - rare scroll (ie a scroll that cant be purchased from a vendor) OR uncommon potion.
5 uncommon collectables - your CHOICE of rare scroll or your CHOICE of uncommon potion.
10 uncommon collectables - 10 astral shards OR 10d20 assorted crafting mats.

1 rare collectable - your choice of rare potion/scroll.
5 rare collectables - +1 returning (100%) ammunition - with +x bonus dependant on who you turn in to.
10 rare collectables - your choice of: 100 astral shards, 400 turbine points, lesser/greater/true heart of wood.

Astral shards:
3 AS - a ml 1 augment of your choice.
6 AS - a ml 4 augment of your choice.
9 AS - a ml 8 augment of your choice.
12 AS - a ml 12 augment of your choice.
15 AS - a ml 16 to (lvl cap) augment of your choice.


Common potion list: (all pots bound and stack with ones purched from guild vendor)
cure x, repair x, remove blindness, remove disease, remove curse, remove poison, heroism, greater vigor.

Common weapon list:
+1 weapon(of players choice) with a bane suffix dependant on collector/location.

Common wand list:
cure x, repair x, fireball, lightning bolt, searing light.

Rare scroll list:
ALL scrols not purchaseable in game from vendors for platinum.
OR
stack of scrolls...
heal, recon, GH, teleport, deathward, raise dead, fom, ddoor.

Uncommon potion list: (these pots should be unbound)
deathward, mumy elixir, greater heroism, heal(110 hp), reconstruct(110 hp), standard spell point elixir, 10% xp pot, 10% crafting xp pot, slayer boost.

Rare potion list: (these pots should be unbound - but have durable casings to prevent easy breakage)
empowered heal pot (250 hp) , superior reconstruct pot (250 hp), major spell point elixir, 30% xp elixir, 30% crafting xp elixir.

wizards elixir (+2 alchemical int, minor SP return, duration 15 mins)
Elven fire wine (+2 alchemical dex, haste, duration 15 mins)
Experimental house cannith brew (+4 to all DEX, WIS, and INT skills duration 15 mins)
Braehg - blood whisky. (+2 alchemical STR and CON, rage, duration 15 mins)
Jorsco spiced Tea (+2 alchemical WIS, minor SP return duration 15 mins)
Dwarven ale (+4 alchemical CON, imunity to poison duration 15 mins)

[fco-karatekid]

This is all good, I think 99% of your player base agrees - and there was much positve feedback here.



Technical constraint! Sory but im calling ******** on that. Technical error by the code monkey or managerial error or comunication error - now THAT i could believe. Its prety darn obvious some one messed up (either in terms of design, or coding) and you didnt have time to fix it - because you wanted to get the AS options out.

As a coder/analyst my self i cant honestly think of any kind of technical constraint that could posibly have caused this - time constraints... coder errors... design errors... all possible. Hell cordovan your a comunity guy, im not even accusing you of fibbing to us, your no doubt just passing on what you are told - but some one is.

Honestly Im not seeing the big deal here tho, not many folks bothered turning in collectables any ways. Its actualy more of a big deal that as a company you think the player base will buy that line.



Ok What id like to see collectors offer is USEFULL items. curently the system is mostly a waste because the only realy useful items we get are ammo & healing wands

1 common collectable - common potion.
5 common collectables - common weapon OR 1000 stack of ammo.
10 common collectables - common wand.
20 common collectables - 5 Astral shards OR 5d20 assorted crafting mats.

1 uncommon collectable - rare scroll (ie a scroll that cant be purchased from a vendor) OR uncommon potion.
5 uncommon collectables - your CHOICE of rare scroll or your CHOICE of uncommon potion.
10 uncommon collectables - 10 astral shards OR 10d20 assorted crafting mats.

1 rare collectable - your choice of rare potion/scroll.
5 rare collectables - +1 returning (100%) ammunition - with +x bonus dependant on who you turn in to.
10 rare collectables - your choice of: 100 astral shards, 400 turbine points, lesser/greater/true heart of wood.

Astral shards:
3 AS - a ml 1 augment of your choice.
6 AS - a ml 4 augment of your choice.
9 AS - a ml 8 augment of your choice.
12 AS - a ml 12 augment of your choice.
15 AS - a ml 16 to (lvl cap) augment of your choice.


Common potion list: (all pots bound and stack with ones purched from guild vendor)
cure x, repair x, remove blindness, remove disease, remove curse, remove poison, heroism, greater vigor.

Common weapon list:
+1 weapon(of players choice) with a bane suffix dependant on collector/location.

Common wand list:
cure x, repair x, fireball, lightning bolt, searing light.

Rare scroll list:
ALL scrols not purchaseable in game from vendors for platinum.
OR
stack of scrolls...
heal, recon, GH, teleport, deathward, raise dead, fom, ddoor.

Uncommon potion list: (these pots should be unbound)
deathward, mumy elixir, greater heroism, heal(110 hp), reconstruct(110 hp), standard spell point elixir, 10% xp pot, 10% crafting xp pot, slayer boost.

Rare potion list: (these pots should be unbound - but have durable casings to prevent easy breakage)
empowered heal pot (250 hp) , superior reconstruct pot (250 hp), major spell point elixir, 30% xp elixir, 30% crafting xp elixir.

wizards elixir (+2 alchemical int, minor SP return, duration 15 mins)
Elven fire wine (+2 alchemical dex, haste, duration 15 mins)
Experimental house cannith brew (+4 to all DEX, WIS, and INT skills duration 15 mins)
Braehg - blood whisky. (+2 alchemical STR and CON, rage, duration 15 mins)
Jorsco spiced Tea (+2 alchemical WIS, minor SP return duration 15 mins)
Dwarven ale (+4 alchemical CON, imunity to poison duration 15 mins)

I think this could use slight tuning (it is a bit generous wher uncommons are concerned), but is a very good model to start with. In all honesty, I was looking forward to the FIRST iteration that came from the Lammania thread... just go with that one

[ReaperAlexEU]

could you tailor the new system to give our newbies a leg up into the BOYH groups? i'm thinking both cure pots and buff pots, all the pots you can think of that vets are happy to plough tons of plat into. allow our newbies to get a steady supply of pots and other handy gear from turning in collectables from as early as mid way through the market place quests.

things like bottom rung DR beaters should also be on offer. this way a newbie can get all the tools they need and save their plat for buying the fun stuff they want, like a weapon that does some nice damage instead of the freebies they will be getting from the collectors.

same thing with the augment system, let them use it as they level up. an augment that is going to be stuck on a weapon they will upgrade from every few levels shouldn't have a significant cost attached. much like you gave them ember weapons in korthos so they get a fun looking weapon on day one, so too can you give them the lower level augments if they get lucky. it's hardly going to compete with a vets twinkage gear, but it will make that first trip to lvl20 a lot more fun. if it's wiser to save a low level augment for later because it costs so much it's only worth putting on uber twink gear then i think the system isn't balanced properly

the worst newbie friendly systems are the ones they get no use from until they are capped. i made a brand new character when crafting came out to see if a newbie could get anything from it. for the first half of the game i was buying stuff i needed off the auction house as my crafting levels didn't give me a competing item. this was a problem as the bulk of my plat from loot had gone into my crafting levels, leaving me worse off than if i had sold my loot and focused on buying the bits i needed. crafting was billed as being something newbies could get into, so is the new augmentation system.

as players get towards end game where they are starting to acquire things they will use for a lot longer, then the cost can rise up as a result.

as for the vets using the same system, maybe this will get a few more to pile on the pots, maybe some will stop using the pot vendors as a plat sink, maybe others will decide the pot vendors are a better use of their time than running all over town to different collectors. of course they will improve on their twink gear with it, but there are already so many ways to bypass early content that i assume this is not something you are concerned about.

i think focusing on making the collectable system fun for newbies is more important than making it useful for us grumpy vets. let them become self sufficient with a bit of extra work, we can still throw our piles of plat at that if we can;t be bothered with the leg work. sure some stuff like a reliable source of long lasting pots would be great, but i'd much rather have a game full of happy newbies that will become vets over time than yet another system newbies can look at and wish they were higher level so they could use it.

[droid327]

Hoo man I'd love to be able to farm 400 TP from rare collectibles. 40 TP a piece for Icons of Khyber or Amulets of the Archbishop? Just go farming Butcher's Path on Casual....I'd have every quest pack unlocked by the time I was ready to TR again