Pale Master Guide

[Andoris]

Agreed on Alacrity & Colors.


I was thinking more of the increase to saving throws ("Brace"), personally.


Fort's not bad, though I like the skill increase, too.

Brace is not a bad option as Reflex saves are in the "effective" range. It does nothing for fort and will saves though (all though you are immune to most will save effects)

I need to do some more testing on death aura/NEB and see if I can get my math to correspond to in-game testing -- then see how useful that 30 extra spell power is.

I don't understand why you like the skill increase. The only skill you are somewhat short on is UMD, and even then I am at 37 standing (no tome) and easily hitting mid 40s with a few gear swaps (if I ever end up needing to be a [crappy] backup Raid healer).
Other than UMD all it really gets me is +3 spell power (which doesn't seem to be worth it). Now, I agree that the extra fortification is pretty meh as well, but it is lots better than the skill points.

Unless I am missing something?

[Andoris]

I agree completely with the Colors, however, considering that Colors will proc and potentially on you because of your death aura, I think for the time being this is a bad idea actually.

I really haven't studied all the Shiridi procs. Outside of grease what "bad" effects proc against the players?

If it is only grease, I am not too worried -- most people are either running FOM or immunity to slippery surfaces these days due to all the grease spam anyways -- so whats a little more *shrug*.

At least I can start mine on fire

[Ancient]

I agree completely with the Colors, however, considering that Colors will proc and potentially on you because of your death aura, I think for the time being this is a bad idea actually.

For the palemaster, it isn't so bad. I wear gear to deal with grease, and the poison and/or neg levels don't bother undead form. I have had the occasional issue where someone in the party is getting hit with something... I just give them a lil space. Not everyone can handle being that close to an undead robot wearing a bunny hat.

[Andoris]

I was doing some testing this morning, trying to make my math models on healing from Death Aura and NEB match in game results (I got it working btw, I'll be updating post #223 in a few minutes). When I noticed that my listed spell power on the Character Sheet, didn't match what I should have when I add everything up. My OCD kicked in and I started tracking down the discrepancy, what I found was someone interesting.

Spell Critical: Elemental and Force out of the Archmage tree is giving an additional 1% spell power.

Dark Reaping out of the Pale Master Tree is giving an additional 4.5% Negative spell power.

Deathless Vigor is giving an -1.5% Negative Spell power (Basically counts as 1 point spent in the tree, versus 2).

Finally I am getting 2% more spell power that I can't account for anywhere. I currently have 1 epic past life (Arcane Alacrity which might be the cause of it -- I'll keep an eye on it as I add more ETRs).

Through my testing the tool tip on the Character Sheet is correct, so these adjustments are having a real affect in game.

Just some things to be aware of.

[Andoris]

I was thinking more of the increase to saving throws ("Brace"), personally.

Finally got my models working -- Power over life and death x3 (30 neg spell power) will net on average ~20 more hp on a NEB and ~9 more hp per tick on DA (4%-6% increase) assuming end game spell power and critical chance.

Seeing how minor that increase is I agree with you.. Brace is more worthwhile. I would prefer to add a 15% chance to make a reflex save over 20 hp of burst healing.

[azziem]

Finally got my models working -- Power over life and death x3 (30 neg spell power) will net on average ~20 more hp on a NEB and ~9 more hp per tick on DA (4%-6% increase) assuming end game spell power and critical chance.

Seeing how minor that increase is I agree with you.. Brace is more worthwhile. I would prefer to add a 15% chance to make a reflex save over 20 hp of burst healing.

honestly i think there isn't really a "d20" involved in the save, i have experienced at certain breakpoints going from almost completely useless to 80% effective with only upgrade of 2 dc's. the way things happen in the game, while the designers don't want to disclose completely, aren't a sincere depiction of the "ui overlay" mechanics. also if that is the case, for saves that melee use for stunning blow or stunning fist have to be mid to high 70's those should just be fort saves, and our fort dc's cant but barely crack 70 with bard buffs and all bonus' in game. also rogue assassinate cant get to where finger or wail are, yet their move goes off with a dc that would never work if it was finger.

a few things about my personal choices in my necromancers spec that varies a bit from you, i like archmage: illusionist spec, it gives you a second pk cooldown (that can be used in anti-magic fields of beholders and the like for 10 sp with a 5 sec cd) my necro and illusion dc's are both over 65. i think dead is a better cc state than held ;p also all the illusion sla's are all pretty useful so they save spell slots and less importantly minor sp savings when you buff. with the dirt cheap pk sla i can also support almost any dungeon in the game single target killing all trash mobs with pk, pk sla, or finger. only two that are close or i like to make sure i have a friend in is cry for help and aurum lair (one shrine in each of those are rough for single target) i also dont see much time when enervate at 25 sp or drain at 50 sp are worth it, and honestly i dont see the sla being worth the time to cast when i dont see saves against my spells that often.

[SirValentine]

i like archmage: illusionist spec, it gives you a second pk cooldown (that can be used in anti-magic fields of beholders and the like for 10 sp with a 5 sec cd)

Note having SLAs work in anti-magic is going away. It's in the Lama release notes. And, to be fair, it never should have worked.

[Andoris]

a few things about my personal choices in my necromancers spec that varies a bit from you, i like archmage: illusionist spec, it gives you a second pk cooldown (that can be used in anti-magic fields of beholders and the like for 10 sp with a 5 sec cd) my necro and illusion dc's are both over 65. i think dead is a better cc state than held ;p also all the illusion sla's are all pretty useful so they save spell slots and less importantly minor sp savings when you buff. with the dirt cheap pk sla i can also support almost any dungeon in the game single target killing all trash mobs with pk, pk sla, or finger. only two that are close or i like to make sure i have a friend in is cry for help and aurum lair (one shrine in each of those are rough for single target) i also dont see much time when enervate at 25 sp or drain at 50 sp are worth it, and honestly i dont see the sla being worth the time to cast when i dont see saves against my spells that often.

Enervate SLA is only 10 sp which make it a nice and efficent debuff. Also the level drain effect is very handy in reducing hp on Orange named mobs.

The problem with illusion focus is that when you get into EE Stormhorns the dual save of PK will make the spell useless. Most mobs up there have strong Fort and/or will saves, add to it the loss of cheap and easy debuffs, and your going to have difficulty with both Illusion and Necro instakills. Also, the Orc's in EE WGU have a crazy high fort save, without a decent enchantment dc to deal with them -- your dead in the water.

I do agree that for all other content it is a lot of fun. I keep PK slotted as a spell for the easier content and use it often when the necro instakills are on timer.

Now if you don't plan on running EE Stormhorns, then Illusion focus is not a bad plan.

[Andoris]

With U21 right around the corner, and all the of the DC caster goodies in it, I figured it was time to start the conversation around gear changes.

Here are my current gear thoughts:

Trinket: Litany (alchemical resistance ritual)
Head: Shades Hood (Green: False Life 40, Yellow: +2 Illusion DC)
Neck: Green Steel: Pos/Neg/Water +10hp, +150sp, +2 con skills, +4 int skills, +6 wis skills; +6 wisdom
Goggles: Intricate Field Goggles +3 insightful intelligence (Green: +2 Evocation DC /Yellow: +1 exp Int)
Bracers: Health +9 Bracers of Dodge 10%
Body: Shadowscale Robe: +1 Profane Spell DC's (Blue: Vitality 20 Green: +2 Conjuration DC)
Cloak: Sages Mantle or Deathwyrm (Green: Open)
Ring: Guardian’s Ring (yellow: 250 spell points)
Ring: Crafted Evocation Focus +2 of Ice Lore 15% (LGA: 80 Spell points)
Boots: Spiked Boots (Green: +2 enchant dc, Yellow: +15 Spellcraft) / TOD boots / Cannith Boots of Propulsion
Gloves: EE Master Illusionist (Yellow: +2 Necro DC)
Belt: EE Belt of the Seven Ideals (Green: Good Luck+2 /Yellow: +11 heal)
Quiver: Qiver of Alacrity


Weapons: Thunderforged Scepter 150 Combustion, +6 Necro DC, Fire Lore 22% (Orange: Glaciation 138) + Thunderforged Orb 150 Nullification, +2 Exceptional DC, Void Lore 22% (Orange: Meridian Fragment)

Potentially create a Thunderforged Sceptre 150 Combustion, +6 Encht DC, Fire Lore 22% (Orange: Glaciation 138); if the weapon swapping for enchantment spells isn't too clunky.

Gains over current Gearset:
+5 Evocation DC
+4 Necro DC
+3 or +4 enchant (depends if I can get weapon swapping to work out
+12 Primary elemental and +18 Negative Spell power, +70 spell power to secondary element
+7% Spell Crit chance (Primary element and Void), +15% spell crit chance secondary element
+3 DC to all other Schools (except Conjuration)
Potentially +10% Neg Healing Amp and +30 Negative Spell power (Depends if I can get weapon swapping to work out)
-6 sp cost on Maximized spells
+80 spell points
+30% Fortification


Losses over current Gearset:
30 Light Resistance (I have an epic Mirror Cloak and Shroud of the Abbot to use as swap items if Divine punishment starts to stack up)
-1 Spell Pen (Arcane Augmentation)

Let me know your thoughts.

[EllisDee37]

Looks good, though it makes me sad to see how far torc has fallen. Greensteel on a wizard's necklace? Oofa.

[Andoris]

Looks good, though it makes me sad to see how far torc has fallen. Greensteel on a wizard's necklace? Oofa.

If it makes you feel better, I still carry the Torc in inventory -- it is a nice swap item when I am doing quick XP runs and find myself low on mana -- but ya, I think of all the work that went into getting the item (and getting the stuff to epic it), it is somewhat depressing that I can't find a slot for it anymore.

[Portalcat]

If it makes you feel better, I still carry the Torc in inventory -- it is a nice swap item when I am doing quick XP runs and find myself low on mana -- but ya, I think of all the work that went into getting the item (and getting the stuff to epic it), it is somewhat depressing that I can't find a slot for it anymore.

I'm strongly looking at dropping Belt of the Seven Ideals and slotting Epic Torc as my spell pen item instead. Prior to U21, this would have made augment slotting very tight, but we pick up a few slots on the robe. I currently slot GS on bracers.



Also, what are your thoughts on taking eternal chilling darkness as a tier 3 on one of the crafted caster sticks? 50 spell points every 45s just seems very, very good to me. The tradeoff would probably be to take the 17% spell lore on the other stick instead of 22% sticks.

[Andoris]

I'm strongly looking at dropping Belt of the Seven Ideals and slotting Epic Torc as my spell pen item instead. Prior to U21, this would have made augment slotting very tight, but we pick up a few slots on the robe. I currently slot GS on bracers.

The slots are not a big deal (Currently there is 2 colorless slots on the weapons that are no in use), so it would just take some shuffling around to make it work. Bigger issue is that you lose the only source of potency currently in the build. The 80 spell power is not that big of a deal.. but it is helpful for when I pop off a disintegrate every once in a while. While I would love to slot a Torc full time (my gear would feel a bit less getto then), I don't see the trade off being worth it (unless we can cover potency somewhere else).

Don't forget, the Torc proc rate only works out to ~3.375 sp per hit. That was fine when we had enough guards and heal on hit items that the damage was almost negated. When we are getting hit for 300hp+, that 3 or 4 spell points doesn't really make sense.

Also, what are your thoughts on taking eternal chilling darkness as a tier 3 on one of the crafted caster sticks? 50 spell points every 45s just seems very, very good to me. The tradeoff would probably be to take the 17% spell lore on the other stick instead of 22% sticks.

I completely missed that ability. After reading it again, I really like the concept, however; temp spell points many times don't work out as well in practice as they do on paper. Assuming the thunderforged weapons are not too crazy to make, it might be worthwhile to build one for testing.

I would either drop the other stick down to 17% universal spell crit as you suggested, or keep that one at 22% for negative and then swap my crafted ring to be 15% of the primary element (versus the secondary element).

[Portalcat]

The slots are not a big deal (Currently there is 2 colorless slots on the weapons that are no in use), so it would just take some shuffling around to make it work. Bigger issue is that you lose the only source of potency currently in the build. The 80 spell power is not that big of a deal.. but it is helpful for when I pop off a disintegrate every once in a while. While I would love to slot a Torc full time (my gear would feel a bit less getto then), I don't see the trade off being worth it (unless we can cover potency somewhere else).

My thought would be to take potency 100 as tier 1 on one caster stick, negative 150 on the other, and slot 138 augments in the orange slots, or maybe just one 138 augment and the Meridan fragment (I'm not really sold on it).

I'm willing to largely eschew a secondary element, and/or would be satisfied just with potency 100 and spell lore 17% feeding it. I take acid as my primary, and very little is immune to it. Moreover, when we talk of a secondary element, we're talking about a backup to a backup plan, and I'm happy to not invest too much in it.

I completely missed that ability. After reading it again, I really like the concept, however; temp spell points many times don't work out as well in practice as they do on paper. Assuming the thunderforged weapons are not too crazy to make, it might be worthwhile to build one for testing.

I would either drop the other stick down to 17% universal spell crit as you suggested, or keep that one at 22% for negative and then swap my crafted ring to be 15% of the primary element (versus the secondary element).

I guess I'd opt not to use the ring slot for a crafted ring if I could avoid it (I've been tangling over what to slot instead of the ring of shadows now that the robe gives ghostly and I'm not yet sure what I'd slot, but I feel like 80 sp and something that could be slotted in a yellow slot isn't enough), plus the 17% universal spell crit just seems more flexible, e.g. when we jump into Shiradi for some content.

[Andoris]

My thought would be to take potency 100 as tier 1 on one caster stick, negative 150 on the other, and slot 138 augments in the orange slots, or maybe just one 138 augment and the Meridan fragment (I'm not really sold on it).

I'm willing to largely eschew a secondary element, and/or would be satisfied just with potency 100 and spell lore 17% feeding it. I take acid as my primary, and very little is immune to it. Moreover, when we talk of a secondary element, we're talking about a backup to a backup plan, and I'm happy to not invest too much in it.




I guess I'd opt not to use the ring slot for a crafted ring if I could avoid it (I've been tangling over what to slot instead of the ring of shadows now that the robe gives ghostly and I'm not yet sure what I'd slot, but I feel like 80 sp and something that could be slotted in a yellow slot isn't enough), plus the 17% universal spell crit just seems more flexible, e.g. when we jump into Shiradi for some content.

Not a bad solution, but giving up potentially a secondary element or a bunch of spell power doesn't feel worth the few SP you will gain. If acid is your primary element, I assume you are still investing in Lightning or Ice for the dots (what else is there to do for red names with 200k+ hp).

I still use my Torc for EH content where the damage is manageable, but on EE incoming damage is just too much. That being said, your planned inclusion is not a bad one, and I completely understand the emotional reasons for wanting to wear your Epic Torc.

I also never swap to Shiradi (actually thinking of TRing him into a melee for Primal lives, or just lose 2 DC and use primal avatar) -- but if you are using it, having higher universal spellpower/lores is helpful.

[Portalcat]

Not a bad solution, but giving up potentially a secondary element or a bunch of spell power doesn't feel worth the few SP you will gain. If acid is your primary element, I assume you are still investing in Lightning or Ice for the dots (what else is there to do for red names with 200k+ hp).

I still use my Torc for EH content where the damage is manageable, but on EE incoming damage is just too much. That being said, your planned inclusion is not a bad one, and I completely understand the emotional reasons for wanting to wear your Epic Torc.

Use of the torc and eschewing a secondary element seem like largely separate issues to me.

I like the torc mostly as a spell pen item with a slot in the otherwise lackluster neck slot. If our colored slots are covered such that we don't really need them off the belt, then I'm happy to slot spell pen on the neck instead of the belt.

I also think that taking 100 potency on one of the sticks makes a great deal of sense on its own merits, especially when we get 2 orange slots to slot 138 augments in if we're particularly dedicated to additional elements. We lose 12 spellpower on our primary to make this investment and get to choose between the Meridan fragment or 38 spellpower to our secondary. Thus, dumping the belt only forces me to take a choice which I think makes a lot of sense anyway.

I also never swap to Shiradi (actually thinking of TRing him into a melee for Primal lives, or just lose 2 DC and use primal avatar) -- but if you are using it, having higher universal spellpower/lores is helpful.

I do it mostly for raids and Tor. It also made my primal lives far more bearable than my divine lives.

The kicker: the single target DPS (joy of the queen notwithstanding) is roughly the same if not worse than just cycling necrotic ray, black dragon bolt, scorching ray, energy burst, and dragon breath; it's just that in Shiradi it costs a 4th of the sp and almost nothing is immune or resistant to force.

[Andoris]

Use of the torc and eschewing a secondary element seem like largely separate issues to me.

I like the torc mostly as a spell pen item with a slot in the otherwise lackluster neck slot. If our colored slots are covered such that we don't really need them off the belt, then I'm happy to slot spell pen on the neck instead of the belt.

I also think that taking 100 potency on one of the sticks makes a great deal of sense on its own merits, especially when we get 2 orange slots to slot 138 augments in if we're particularly dedicated to additional elements. We lose 12 spellpower on our primary to make this investment and get to choose between the Meridan fragment or 38 spellpower to our secondary. Thus, dumping the belt only forces me to take a choice which I think makes a lot of sense anyway.

What would you put in the belt slot then?

[Portalcat]

What would you put in the belt slot then?

I'm looking to move my con/dodge item there - I'm currently slotting con/dodge on boots, which is suboptimal given the need to use occasional swap items there, or potentially run the sage's boots for web DC.

[azziem]

Enervate SLA is only 10 sp which make it a nice and efficent debuff. Also the level drain effect is very handy in reducing hp on Orange named mobs.

The problem with illusion focus is that when you get into EE Stormhorns the dual save of PK will make the spell useless. Most mobs up there have strong Fort and/or will saves, add to it the loss of cheap and easy debuffs, and your going to have difficulty with both Illusion and Necro instakills. Also, the Orc's in EE WGU have a crazy high fort save, without a decent enchantment dc to deal with them -- your dead in the water.

I do agree that for all other content it is a lot of fun. I keep PK slotted as a spell for the easier content and use it often when the necro instakills are on timer.

Now if you don't plan on running EE Stormhorns, then Illusion focus is not a bad plan.

idk it took me 200++ runs of trackers trap to get necro focused ee orb, i seemed to do well on the trash, thought i wasnt much help on red and orange named monsters, what do you use on red and orange named on ee storm horns, sable and brothers? 200-300k is a sink of mana for my guy. 3300 mana only goes so far....

[Andoris]

idk it took me 200++ runs of trackers trap to get necro focused ee orb, i seemed to do well on the trash, thought i wasnt much help on red and orange named monsters, what do you use on red and orange named on ee storm horns, sable and brothers? 200-300k is a sink of mana for my guy. 3300 mana only goes so far....

Gratz on finally getting your Necro orb -- sad thing is that it will be made somewhat obsolete, by the thunderforged weapons (+6 dc at level 26) come Monday.

For Orange named mobs, I dance them (OID) and then use my Enervation SLA, Necrotic ray, and Energy Drain to massively reduce their HP, when it gets low enough an Energy burst/dragon breath usually finishes them off.

As for Red names -- if it is the end of the quest or if there is a shrine around the corner, you can mana dump on them: stacking dots on them, using energy burst/dragon breath, and dumping necrotic and polar ray. If it is a mid-quest Red named, with no shrine in sight -- well then I use my amazing piking skills and let the Melee's in the party get a kill

The lack of ability to deal with red named mobs is what reminds you that you aren't a complete god.. and gives your minions (aka other party members) something to do.