How to improve my monk?

[DarkGospel]

I have a lvl 14 monk that I don't use anymore since last year. It's a dex based wind stance build I would appreciate if you guys can help me improve it I know it's not that easy to improve mid-lvl character but the problem is not the feats but the enhacements, I read somwhere that you won't use a single stance all the time since some times you would need a earth stance tor the extra con or fire stance for more damage and ki regen, etc.

This build was completely focused on wind stance I don't know what I should drop since I use most of the enchacements I choose. =/

Strength 16 (20)
Dexterity 16 (27)
Constitution 14 (16)
Intelligence 8
Wisdom 14 (21)
Charisma 8
All lvl ups in dex.

Current Gear
Head:
Neck: Wise +4 neckelce of haggling +3
Goggles:
Trinket: Voice of the master
Robe: Deathblock outfit fo moderate fortification
Bracers: Jidz-Tet'ka
Gloves: Ogre Power +4 gloves of inflict light wounds
Cloak: Matle of the Worldshaper
Belt: Health +4 belt of spell resistence 13
Boots: Striding (15%) boots of tumbling +3 / Featherfalling boots
Ring 1: Dextrous +4 Ring of Sustenance +5
Ring 2:
Main Hand: Stonedust handwraps/more five non-named handwraps for various situations
Off Hand:

Everything in yellow is what I already have.
Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Luck of Heroes (though it was a good idea at the time but plan to swamp this)
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Improved Concentration I

Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge

Level 3 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse (not sure if it apply to handwraps)
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Lifting the Veil
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Void Strike I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I

Level 4 (Monk)
Enhancement: The Receptive Earth
Enhancement: Improved Concentration II

Level 5 (Monk)
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Dexterity I
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise II
Enhancement: Restoring the Balance

Level 6 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist
Enhancement: Shintao Monk I

Level 7 (Monk)
Enhancement: Adept of Wind
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II

Levvel 8 (Monk)
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom II

Level 9 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Difficulty at the Beginning

Level 10 (Monk)
Enhancement: Rise of the Phoenix

Level 11 (Monk)
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom III

Level 12 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons
Enhancement: Shintao Monk II

Level 13 (Monk)
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise III
Enhancement: Master of Thunder

Level 14 (Monk)
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Wisdom I

Level 15 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise IV

Level 16 (Monk)
Enhancement: Adept of Flame

Level 17 (Monk)

Level 18 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Fists of Iron
Enhancement: Shintao Monk III
Enhancement: Grandmaster of Storms
Enhancement: Adept of Rock

Level 19 (Monk)
Enhancement: Void Strike II
Enhancement: Adept of Rain

Level 20 (Monk)
Enhancement: Monk Serenity
Enhancement: Void Strike III

It's not on my main server but I don't like the idea of having a weak toon if I ever went back to thelanis but I play there once in a while since one of my RL friends plays a paly there. I might be able to aford one or two feat swamps and still have fred's free feat swamp what makes 3 swamps at total so if there is anything useless this build that I really must change than please tell me.
Enhancements are easier to chance so any suggestion are welcome but I'd like to keep it a main wind stance if possible.

[Therigar]

First, you should not believe everything you read. I only, ever, use Wind and play that way on all my monks. I like melee and the speed boost from Wind means that this is what I get the biggest kick out of.

Second, monks are as easy or complicated to play as you want them to be. Me, I'm not a button masher. So I play them easy. Very little of the finishing moves -- I don't even keep the finishing moves icon on my primary hotbar. I use three basic attacks -- stunning fist, quivering palm and kukan-do/touch of death depending on if light/dark path.

Weapon finesse does apply to handwraps.

[Arkat]

Wind Stance? Yes, always a good choice.
Dex-based? No, always a bad choice.

Make it Strength-based. You do more damage, you save a feat by not using Weapon Finesse, and you can eventually qualify for Overwhelming Critical.

[Therigar]

Make it Strength-based. You do more damage, you save a feat by not using Weapon Finesse, and you can eventually qualify for Overwhelming Critical.

This is not good advice.

Stunning Fist DC is 10 + Character level/2 + Wisdom modifier + Stunning item bonus.

Quivering Palm DC is 10 + Monk level/2 + Wisdom modifier.

Touch of Death DC is 10 + Monk level + Wisdom modifier.

Kukan-Do DC is 10 + Monk level + Charisma modifier.

None of these uses STR.

In fact, the current state of thinking with monks is that they should be neither STR nor DEX based but WIS based.

The epic feat Overwhelming Critical pales in comparison to the two monk epic feats Improved Martial Arts and Vorpal Strikes.

My current epic level monk has virtually no STR having started from a 14 base and putting nothing into raising STR. With Vorpal Strikes running, Drow Smoke Goggles and Shadowdancer destiny it seems like mobs just disappear.

I ran him up until a week ago as a pure DEX/WIS monk and reached L25 with zero issues. I switched because the forums keep pushing WIS based monks. This was correct.

The old notion that you should be STR based or that you should be DEX based is wrong for the current game.

DEX based to level then WIS based for epic is the current best choice if you have the free lesser reincarnation available. Otherwise WIS based all the way with a bigger emphasis in DEX than STR to make sure you qualify the whole TWF line.

STR based is so pre-U14.

WIS based is the wave of the future.

[Arkat]

Vorpal Strikes? VORPAL STRIKES??

Really? REALLY??

Vorpal Strikes is one of the biggest wastes of a feat you can choose. If they hadn't nerfed Vorpal they way they did, I might be there with ya in choosing Vorpal Strikes but...

If you're a Light Monk, a 42 STR and a 42 WIS would suit you well. If you're a Dark Monk, STR (48+) is the way to go.

Regardless, DEX is a POOR way to go.

[DarkGospel]

First, you should not believe everything you read. I only, ever, use Wind and play that way on all my monks. I like melee and the speed boost from Wind means that this is what I get the biggest kick out of.

Second, monks are as easy or complicated to play as you want them to be. Me, I'm not a button masher. So I play them easy. Very little of the finishing moves -- I don't even keep the finishing moves icon on my primary hotbar. I use three basic attacks -- stunning fist, quivering palm and kukan-do/touch of death depending on if light/dark path.

Weapon finesse does apply to handwraps.

I see, so my current build shoul be fine for the most part it would be very annoying to change it now that there are just 6 lvls left before epic lvls.

Wind Stance? Yes, always a good choice.
Dex-based? No, always a bad choice.

Make it Strength-based. You do more damage, you save a feat by not using Weapon Finesse, and you can eventually qualify for Overwhelming Critical.

Sice I'm already lvl 14 it would be to late to make it str based guess I'll try str-based after TRing than getting cleave istead of Luck of Heroes and Great Cleave instead of weapon finese.

Which items should I go for? I usually play with casters or hybrid-classes which has both spells and melee so I'm not sure of what itens to target at end-game and I stayed away from DDO for a long time so I don't know much about most of the new items it includes the alchemical ones since they where included when I stoped playing.

[Arkat]

Sice I'm already lvl 14 it would be to late to make it str based guess I'll try str-based after TRing than getting cleave istead of Luck of Heroes and Great Cleave instead of weapon finese.

Good plan.

Which items should I go for?

Light Monk or Dark Monk?

[DarkGospel]

Light Monk

[phillymiket]

Monk is definatetly my favorite of favorites.

I have tried strength, dexterity and wisdom lives.

Currently I am doing wisdom from the start. (actually its a weird splash monstrosity but still 16 wisdom start and all level up)

I figure if its stunned, it's dead so I go with the highest stun handwraps until level 12 or so when better options open up.

You can have +8 wraps amazingly early with crafted wraps if you forgo the + and masterful craft something with a guild slot.

Last monk life was enough strength for overwhelming critical and the rest in wisdom (16 start with +4 tome and 3 level up points maybe?).

It was nice but I felt too much was sacrificed to strength so LRed to wisdom and was much happier just making all the mobs disappear with my mind @.@

Boss fights were where the strength build had shined while the wisdom one shined on the way to the boss.

AP is a hard thing to figure out because you always feel you need more then you can get.

I like water and wind.

Wind if I'm solo or w/o a haster and too lazy to hit haste clickies and water any other time.

Dark is great but I like light a bit better.

I don't do any of the stuff leading up to rise of the phoenix.

IMO its too expensive so rather I go for basics: heal amp, wisdom, toughness etc

UMD heal scrolls on a human monk with a lot of heal amp basically puts you back to full every time plus you have crazy concentration so you can scroll yourself while being wailed on.

I play the monk very simply usually, just alternating between healing curse, stun, quivering palm and dismissive/jade/kuku-kachoo and then switch to a mirror hotbar for boss fights with all the elemental strikes in place of the DC stuff bosses are immune to.

Sometimes I try to get fancy and switch back and forth from the two bars and hit the combo finishing moves and all that jazz but mostly not. (although earth,wind,fire:dance is fun)
.

[Arkat]

Light Monk

Ok, that means Grand Master of Flowers should be your ultimate Epic Destiny so your gear should be focused towards raising your STR and WIS. CON items are also good.

Shoot for a 40-42 STR and a 40-42 WIS by the time you max your Epic Destinies and hit 25th level.

Good handwraps (+10 Stunning ones like Grave Wrappings or Antipode are key) are also a MUST.

Look at the Purple Dragon Knight Helmet and Gauntlets (30% Healing Amp). Also look at the House Cannith challenge item - Spare Hand. It has +5 Combat Mastery which will also help your Stunning Fist.

As for armor (I'm assuming you're a fleshy), look at +8 WIS Spider-spun Caparison. If you're REALLY ambitious and REALLY patient, try for the new Cormyrian Red Dragon Scale Robe.

As for rings, Shintao ring with the Shintao necklace (both from Tower of Despair raid) and a +7 DEX, +7 Resistance ring will be VERY useful.

As for boots, this is where I'd put my Greensteel 45 HP item.

Convalescent (20% Healing Amp) Bracers of Superior Parrying would go in your wrist slot.

If you have one, a Mabar Festival Cloak would be a good thing to have. It's got LOTS of good things on it.

As far as a trinket goes, look to fill that slot with one of those Planar Conflux-type trinkets from the expansion quests (U14).

As for goggles, look at the Lenses of the Woodsman. You get those for turning in 5 Druid commendations which also come from some quests in the expansion.

[phillymiket]

Vorpal Strikes is one of the biggest wastes of a feat you can choose. If they hadn't nerfed Vorpal they way they did, I might be there with ya in choosing Vorpal Strikes but...

Yeah it kinda blows but you can't get anything else really better without putting level ups in constitution or strength.

It's that or bulwark of defense so I go with that but I'm not happy with it.

On the up-side while the vorpal doesn't show up as much as I'd like it gives you slash DR so with spike studded stuff a Shintao can by-pass any DR while still fighting unarmed.
.

[DarkGospel]

Monk is definatetly my favorite of favorites.

I have tried strength, dexterity and wisdom lives.

Currently I am doing wisdom from the start. (actually its a weird splash monstrosity but still max wisdom)

I figure if its stunned, it's dead so I go with the highest stun handwraps until level 12 or so when better options open up.

You can have +8 wraps amazingly early with crafted wraps if you forgo the + and masterful craft something with a guild slot.

Where the damge came from on a wis-build? I understand a dex build with weapon finese or a str build but I don't get the idea behind a wis build. Ok, it makes de DC's higher but what about the normal damage without using the hotbar?

Ok, that means Grand Master of Flowers should be your ultimate Epic Destiny so your gear should be focused towards raising your STR and WIS. CON items are also good.

Shoot for a 40-42 STR and a 40-42 WIS by the time you max your Epic Destinies and hit 25th level.

Good handwraps (+10 Stunning ones like Grave Wrappings or Antipode are key) are also a MUST.

Look at the Purple Dragon Knight Helmet and Gauntlets (30% Healing Amp). Also look at the House Cannith challenge item - Spare Hand. It has +5 Combat Mastery which will also help your Stunning Fist.

As for armor (I'm assuming you're a fleshy), look at +8 WIS Spider-spun Caparison. If you're REALLY ambitious and REALLY patient, try for the new Cormyrian Red Dragon Scale Robe.

As for rings, Shintao ring with the Shintao necklace (both from Tower of Despair raid) and a +7 DEX, +7 Resistance ring will be VERY useful.

As for boots, this is where I'd put my Greensteel 45 HP item.

Convalescent (20% Healing Amp) Bracers of Superior Parrying would go in your wrist slot.

If you have one, a Mabar Festival Cloak would be a good thing to have. It's got LOTS of good things on it.

As far as a trinket goes, look to fill that slot with one of those Planar Conflux-type trinkets from the expansion quests (U14).

As for goggles, look at the Lenses of the Woodsman. You get those for turning in 5 Druid commendations which also come from some quests in the expansion.

Thanks, I'll check them out. Btw would a DT be good till I get Spider-spun Caparison or Cormyrian Red Dragon Scale Robe?

--------------

Was taking a look at the epic feats and it seems I'll be able to get Improved Martial Arts and Vorpal Strilkes it's the only ones I match requisites. Even if vorpal is nerfed it's the only epic feat I can get now.

[Arkat]

Where the damge came from on a wis-build? I understand a dex build with weapon finese or a str build but I don't get the idea behind a wis build. Ok, it makes de DC's higher but what about the normal damage without using the hotbar?



Thanks, I'll check them out. Btw would a DT be good till I get Spider-spun Caparison or Cormyrian Red Dragon Scale Robe?

--------------

Was taking a look at the epic feats and it seems I'll be able to get Improved Martial Arts and Vorpal Strilkes it's the only ones I match requisites. Even if vorpal is nerfed it's the only epic feat I can get now.

When you TR, make sure you get the feats necessary for Overwhelming Critical.

Regarding DT, if you have one already, sure, use it. If you don't already have one, don't waste your time. In one of the recent updates, they buffed the white Dragonscale and black Dragonscale robes. Those are MUCH easier to get these days so take a look at those.

[Therigar]

Vorpal Strikes?

Yes.

I had some of the same doubts that you are expressing. However, I LR'd Tangledroots into a WIS based build and don't regret it one bit. Content that he had to work on to get thru is now a cake walk. Content that he wouldn't try except in a group he now does with some work.

The trick is to have the high WIS so that the DC is high.

Tangledroots is a halfling so that means with reasonable investment in all stats that raw base was 14 STR. That is all the STR that he's carrying before tomes and items. He's at a 24 STR with those. And, I'm seeing no reason to have tried to push it higher at build or to have invested stat points.

I guess you could technically call it a STR build if you wanted to restrict that to meaning the stat used to hit. I'd have gone with DEX if I'd had the extra feat for Weapon Finesse (human) but I didn't (halfling).

Overwhelming critical is underwhelming IMO when you are killing stuff outright.

And, I'll reiterate, DEX+WIS on heroic content cannot be touched by any other build strategy.

If OP is wanting to level to 20 then DEX+WIS is the way to go. If they are wanting to really see a huge increase in their melee on hitting epic then WIS is the way to go. No investment in STR, none in DEX, everything in WIS.

Stun everything. Watch the vorpal effect proc regularly.

One thing about Vorpal Strike is that it is a stance. You have to turn it on. But, you can have it active along with Wind stance and Precision. Turns mobs into mush.

[phillymiket]

Where the damge came from on a wis-build?

Well, I guess I should clarify.

I don't mean not putting anything in strength.

I see monk as a balance.

I don't like any build that dumps any of wisdom, dexterity, strength or constitution.

I just mean that wisdom is my primary focus with all the level ups.

All of the four stats are going to start somewhere between 14 and 17 no matter how I build.

The wisdom build therefore is probably only sacrificing +3-5 damage (and +1 critical multiplier for overwhealming critical) and in return getting the ablity to stun/quiver/everything-is-nothing stuff at will.

I think the effectiveness of those abilities at the end of the day are better then the extra damage per hit.

Soloing quests just seem to go faster with the wisdom build's consistent success using special abilities and I feel safer with the improved defenses.

When questing in party, being able to stun a dangerous foe or clear the whole room with EiN is tactically huge.

But mainly I like wisdom because the playstyle imo is more fun.

The whooosh of a quivered enemy, the ding-dong dinner bell of a stunned orange boss, I love that.

But its just a choice.

Obviously, a strength build can land stuns, just not as well, and wisdom build can do raw damage, just not as much.

What Arkat suggests works great.

I just prefer the wisdom way.
.

[xSeverinax]

I don't mean not putting anything in strength.

I don't like any build that dumps any of wisdom, dexterity, strength or constitution.
I just mean that wisdom is my primary focus with all the level ups.
All of the four stats are going to start somewhere between 14 and 17 no matter how I build.

The wisdom build therefore is probably only sacrificing +3-5 damage (and +1 critical multiplier for overwhealming critical) and in return getting the ablity to stun/quiver/everything-is-nothing stuff at will.

I think the effectiveness of those abilities at the end of the day are better then the extra damage per hit.

Soloing quests just seem to go faster with the wisdom build's consistent success using special abilities and I feel safer with the improved defenses.

When questing in party, being able to stun a dangerous foe or clear the whole room with EiN is tactically huge.

But mainly I like wisdom because the playstyle imo is more fun.

The whooosh of a quivered enemy, the ding-dong dinner bell of a stunned orange boss, I love that.


.

100% agree, Wisdom build is the way to go. My first light monk was wisdom based, I would stun the mobs and then kick their butts. I would use fire form at the begining unti ki was maxed then switch to water. I would still manage a strength of over 20 with 14 base, +6 item, +2 ship so damage wasn't too bad even with the -2 from form. The fact that the mobs were stunned and several would have the healing curse meant i could clear rooms easily.

My second monk life included Druid levels, and again was Wis based, I would stand in a self cast fire wall or ice storm and stun mobs. With robes of equilibrium and active monk past life feat my dps was resonable ok so not the highest in the party, but at the same time I was healing the party with druid spells and fists of light, and doing decent aoe damage.

[Duke-H-]

Vorpal Strikes? VORPAL STRIKES??

Really? REALLY??

Vorpal Strikes is one of the biggest wastes of a feat you can choose. If they hadn't nerfed Vorpal they way they did, I might be there with ya in choosing Vorpal Strikes but...

If you're a Light Monk, a 42 STR and a 42 WIS would suit you well. If you're a Dark Monk, STR (48+) is the way to go.

Regardless, DEX is a POOR way to go.

5 average damage per hit and slashing bypass.

What other feat would you take thats better?

[DarkGospel]

Well, I guess I should clarify.

I don't mean not putting anything in strength.

I see monk as a balance.

I don't like any build that dumps any of wisdom, dexterity, strength or constitution.

I just mean that wisdom is my primary focus with all the level ups.

All of the four stats are going to start somewhere between 14 and 17 no matter how I build.

The wisdom build therefore is probably only sacrificing +3-5 damage (and +1 critical multiplier for overwhealming critical) and in return getting the ablity to stun/quiver/everything-is-nothing stuff at will.

I think the effectiveness of those abilities at the end of the day are better then the extra damage per hit.

Soloing quests just seem to go faster with the wisdom build's consistent success using special abilities and I feel safer with the improved defenses.

When questing in party, being able to stun a dangerous foe or clear the whole room with EiN is tactically huge.

But mainly I like wisdom because the playstyle imo is more fun.

The whooosh of a quivered enemy, the ding-dong dinner bell of a stunned orange boss, I love that.

But its just a choice.

Obviously, a strength build can land stuns, just not as well, and wisdom build can do raw damage, just not as much.

What Arkat suggests works great.

I just prefer the wisdom way.
.

I guess I'll haveto see for myself which one lucks better but I'm sure I won't play well with a wisdom build I don't use the hotbar that much since for so reason I don't generate enough ki to use those habilities often, I wonder how people max the ki bar so fast.

[johnnyputrid]

I guess I'll haveto see for myself which one lucks better but I'm sure I won't play well with a wisdom build I don't use the hotbar that much since for so reason I don't generate enough ki to use those habilities often, I wonder how people max the ki bar so fast.

I'm positive you'll play better with a Wisdom build. Generating ki is actually easier if you use less strikes and simply focues on stuns and various effects on your handwraps. The more strikes you use, the faster your ki bar depletes. Use less strikes, build up more ki. It sounds like an amatuerish way to play a monk, but you really don't need to spam every elemental strike constantly. You can play a monk simply and successfully without having to hotbar every tier of every single elemental strike you have. A stun-focused Wisdom build will land stuns and quivering palm consistently, and you'll have plenty of ki to hit various strikes when you need them.

There are some people who will argue that not constantly spamming your strikes is a failure to maximize dps, but it simply isn't true. If you stun it without fail, and can repeatedly stun it if necessary, it will die. The couple of extra hits you need to kill a mob due to a lower strength is negligable at heroic levels and even epic normal/hard for the most part. A few extra swings means more ki to go and stun the next mob anyway.

Another thing is gear. Getting yourself a lvl 16 Frozen Tunic with Enhanced Ki +1 will give you a dramatic increase in ki building. 2 ki per hit with the speed of wind stance and you won't be worrying about ki very much. The monk capstone and Grandmaster destiny also grants you additional passive ki regen, so once you cap out and start grabbing destiny levels, ki won't be a problem at all.

[TeacherSyn]

I agree with many others. WIS is the Monk's magic stat. If you think too much like a Fighter and overdo STR, you compromise your CON or WIS. Go Weapon Finesse with low WIS and too high DEX is also bad as you reduce your AC and chance to proc most of your abilities.

Generally, you don't need Weapon Finesse provided that you keep your STR and DEX in relative balance but work hard on WIS. It's not an intuitive thing to do for many non-Monk melee players to do this. But, as someone posted, WIS determines the DCs of all that a Monk excels in, and, I feel, determines their ultimate fate by Heroic Capstone and beyond. It's all about balance on a Monk, with WIS as the keystone.

I've generated Monks that favor Earth, or Fire, or Wind, with now a Fire stancer on the way. I have one more Monk that is a Grandmaster of all Elements--a halfling that's such a complete badass over my other Monks that (if I could do so) she'd likely kill all of them in a PvP because I've leveraged everything that a Monk can do in her--and I couldn't do that without her WIS being far higher than the 18 minimums needed on STR, DEX and CON to make it happen.