Ice Sorc.

[knockcocker]

Thank you - This is what I was looking for.

I'm soloing atm but I want this to be a group capable caster {I can't solo high level content yet on any of my alts}.

Primary Element is Ice 7/5/5
Secondary Element atm is Electric {for Eladar's} 4/1/1
I have nothing in Acid atm but Acid Blast still works pretty well when I need it {admittedly I am soloing low-mid lvl content as I know she's not rdy for High lvl grouping as yet.}.

I have Frost Lance - I've edited my OP as I was probably naive in not realising that people would take my omission of my cold spells as saying that I didn't have them.

My Cannith Crafter is around Lvl 70 in all.
I loathe the challenges - Frozen Tunic may be the one thing I have to do without.

I realise my equipment is trash - This above all is what I was hoping to get help with - I listed my spells and feats so y'all'd know that I'm not totally out of touch.

Not sure what makes you think I'm after CC - I have Web and that's it {it is a conju spell and doesn't get knocked out by cold based spells so is synergistic}.
Finger is the only Necro spell I have and was taken mainly because I like it {and it being one of the spells that is seen as a must have for any caster of course}.

PK is going - It should have gone when I got Finger tbh.

TTS is staying {conju again - synergy} - I will be adding Polar Ray when I get my next Lvl 8 spell.

OK, you're starting to make a little more sense now

As you're a squishy, I'm assuming you're going to be mobile. This means jump +
displacement + stoneskin for secondary damage avoidance (you can add incorporeal to
that as well with the right gear). Your primary form of avoidance should be mobs being
dead before they can hit you. To this end, you want max. + emp. + the highest SPWR
item you can slot at your level. Get some +15 SPWR pots from House P - every little
helps. I have a L15 Fire Savant whose DBF is doing approx ~480 on a non-crit, non-
save - those are the numbers your should be getting with your Otiluke's.

For soloing, Ice Storm/Acid Rain are very efficient. Ice Storm has a nice slow effect
which, when coupled with WoE, is very useful - even on EE.

Switch to evocation focus - basing your whole strategy around 2sp Niac's is going to
fail. You can lower reflex saves with Solid Fog, Waves of Exhaustion, Otto's etc. to
give you a 0 cost opportunity with Niac's in a rotation.

Your crafter should be able to make greater focus items. Bracers or ring with a guild
slot for SP makes a very nice item. As you're true neutral, a superior stability item can
also be nice (e.g. light mithral shield).

Greater Shout is also very good CC which does not have an SR check and leverages
your evocation DC - as does Electric Loop.

I still think Minos is the best helmet choice at this level (I still use it on my L25) - you
can slot Wizardry or Magi elsewhere.

Frozen Tunic is the best SPWR item you can get at that level and will see you right
through to L20 (upgraded). Without it, your looking at lootgen or Belashyrras Sceptre
I think. As others have pointed out, Infused Chaos Robe or Dragon Touched, if you
have access, would be better body choices.

Don't dismiss Meteor Swarm because you're a Water Savant.

[FranOhmsford]

-Take empower. Maybe justifyable on divine, or possibly wizard, but sorcs get a lot of mileage out of it.

I'm taking Empower at Lvl 18

-Evoc foci are better than conj focus for a water savant. Straight up, not even really debatable (ok, everything is)

Then why do I always see Conju focus in Builds? I could probably change Greater Conju to Spell Foc. Evo. BUT losing both seems too much

-Take cone of cold and polar ray. Polar ray is the best single target nuke. cone of cold is about as good as otilukes and different cooldown)

Taking Polar Ray as my second Lvl 8 spell - Relooked at my Lvl 5 spells in Character sheet and it seems I actually have Cone of Cold {Just wasn't on my Bar}.

-expiditious retreat is fine, but if you are playing fast haste is plenty

I don't play that fast! No Extend = Haste only really used on other players and Hirelings - Expeditious works for me {and anyway - What 1st Lvl spell would you recommend when I already have Niac's SLA?}.

-TTS is not a strong spell for a sorc, conj foci or not...polar and PWS ftw!

Never used PWS on my Wizzies - Didn't even consider it - BUT again: I like TTS

-I think you are relying on niacs cold ray too much. favor farming it is ok but in elite at level content it WILL be close to useless on most targets, hard to get the DC and it gives everything evasion.

Yep - I've said that I'm favour farming - Highest Lvl Elite quests I've run on her so far are VoN 1&2 and Sorrowdusk up to Fane of the Six - None of my spells were doing well in VoN 1 {surprisingly}.
My current Spell Power is:
Cold 187
Acid 87
Electric 79

-blur isn't a great spell..yea OMG I said it....either you REALLY don't want to get hit, and displace yourself, or it doesn't matter and blur isn't needed, IMO. perhaps gust of wind to whoosh out disco balls is a better choice

Gust of Wind? Really? - I can't see myself dropping Blur anytime soon BUT come Epics maybe it will be reconsidered

-not sure how blade barrier or ice storm are a hinderance when soloing...I don't even know what you mean by that. Both are awesome grouped or solo. Insane damage/sp and decent CC effect. If you are having sp issues, use more ice storm.

I'm NOT a Kiter - And even so: BB and Ice Storm don't get Archers and Casters/Divines - Firewall is so much easier to handle

Again, you seem to be doing favor runs where niacs ray is landing, but most people will be giving advice for at-level content where it will be semi-useless. Hitting for hundreds of damage for 2sp is awesome, but it is single target and won't land often in difficult content.

I know about Niac's - TBH Though - I can't see it being of any use whatsoever unless Maxed out with Foci etc. - Which is why I've been concentrating on getting Conju focus up.
This of course also helps with Web and TTS and Acid Blast.

Sounds like you are on the right track though, 268hp at 16 isn't bad for a first lifer.

If I could find a medium guild augment item that could go higher - GS won't be available to me for a while yet of course

If you are running into sp issues you may need to group mobs up more before nuking, or even use more of ice storm/acid rain (you do have this spell, yes?), SLAs, etc and less otilukes/cone of cold/polar ray. SP conservation can take a while to learn, and without twink gear you might need to play a bit smarter to avoid empty blue bar syndrome.

Lvl 4 spells are:
Ice Storm
Enervate
DDoor
Fire Shield
Where do I fit in Acid Rain?

If the character is on Cannith hit me up ingame, I can possibly help with gear-I think I also have an arti at level 17 so maybe can slay some vale.

Did the world end when I wasn't looking?

In Red - Am happy to run some Vale Slayer with ya Mech - Not sure how much use Alla will be out there as Shrines are pretty rare and I like to do full runs of Slayers NOT in and out
As for Gear - I'm not looking for handouts BUT I took a look at Cannith Crafting and even though my Crafter is Lvl 70 in all the best Glaciation she can make is 54/58? This doesn't come close to what I have from random drops.
Also - I made a Greater Ice Lore shard But that's already min Lvl 7 - Adding a good enough Glaciation to that would probably take me over Alla's Lvl.

I have in the bank a +4 Glaciation 96 Sceptre of Superior Ice Lore for her once she reaches Lvl 21 too.

[sireric]

I have already said that I will be taking Polar Ray - Just not as my first Lvl 8 spell {TTS was needed at the time as I didn't have a Wizard who could cast 8th Lvl spells on Cannith back then}.

I don't have a Dragon's Blood handy and replacing PK with Enervate cost me 10k plat alone.

Plus Polar Ray is much more costly than Frost Lance {never mind the Niac's SLA - Which is still working pretty well in the content I'm running atm} - I WILL be getting Polar Ray at the next opportunity!

As for Cone of Cold - I've got Otiluke's - Which in my view is a vast improvement.

And Displacement is a short term buff for Boss fights only - I can't fit Extend into my build so will definitely not have it on permanently.
Blur lasts all quest for 15sps.

As a sorc you should have plenty of sp so that even if you do not have extend, multiple castings is displace is far better then blur. Also most bosses have true seeing so only using displace on boss fights defeats it's purpose. If you prefer blur, and will only cast displace against bosses you might as well dump displace all together and go with a completely different spell.

Also cone of cold and freezing sphere is a deadly combo, not using both in conjunction with each other is not doing max damage. You are right Otiluke's does more damage and is all around better spell then CoC, but that doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't use CoC as well. spam them both for fantastic damage.

[voodoogroves]

Enervate is available via scroll in the Portable Hole.

(like I said, anything I can toss from a scroll, I tend to do that instead of slotting the spell on a sorc)

[goodspeed]

Not sure about aa but anyway as a sorc as said your main things are stoneskin and displacement. Those are your defense.

After that it's pretty simple. Level evo. Take the class feats, craft a +2 evo item, stack cha as much as possible. Every single level up, enhancement, the best gear, everything stack it toward evocation. You catch but one break being a water savent. Thank the lord polar ray isn't reflex based (Well and neither is frost lance which is your top sla.)

But everything else, well mostly, is reflex based. Your ball of ice that will vaporize things, cone of cold, more then likely most of your secondary spells will be reflex based as well. So you wanna jack it up as high as possible.

After evocation then it's a toss up. You can either go enchantment or conjuration. Personally I think web is just great. It sticks most anything, you can whip a solid fog over it to drop reflex saves, (Also helps for your evo spells) and for some reason unlike your spells, monsters seem to really suck at saving against it.

Which brings around the next factor. Spell selection. At the end you'll pretty much have a rotation you do, though it may differ when you come up to things that are immune. But your also going to need spells that make your main spells work better. For instance solid fog. It drops the reflex save by 4 I believe. Hypno, your prolly not going to get it to land but it doesn't matter, cause no matter what it's making them more vulnerable to will attacks. Which makes it great where whipping a dancing sphere. Theirs all sorts of spells that extremely pave the way for your grandaddy spells.

Best thing is to look at each spell individually. Hell look at wiki, get a listing of sorcerer spells. Reach the descriptions, you'll find out really quick which ones you want in your lineup.

Spell power isa lil different but still the same. You'll want your gear which will consist of your first and secondary element in a 1 hander. (For instance a glaciation of superior ice lore. That extra crit is very necessary.) Then you'll want your enhancements maxed about. (For this you'll need to choose a meta to go for. Now I never choose maximize because you can make clickies that make max free for 20 seconds I think. I like to go empower so I can get the full sp savings.)

After that then you get into clickies. Now you'll want the potions for glaciations that give 15 or 20 alchemical bonus. Then if possible if you are so lucky, round up the eardweller for more. I think the tod set adds some small thing to the crit but i'm not sure, and in the end it probably wouldn't be worth it.

[DarkForte]

snip

A few pointers:

* On conjuration focus: that's mostly for earth savant builds, due to acid blast and acid rain's reliance on conjuration. You should focus on your stronger spells: the ice ones. If your enemies are saving on otiluke's/cone of cold, your DPS output just dropped in half, which is bad (it's also one of the reasons there's a lot of non-WF sorcerers at higher levels of play: every point of DC makes a difference).

On your spell list:

She has Eladar's as well as Niac's.
Her other DPS Spells are: Acid Blast, PK, Finger and Trap the Soul.

She has Web and Invisscrollable.

Buffs are: Nightshield, Expeditious, Jump, Resists, Blur, GHscrollable and Mass Prot Elescrollable.
Short term Buffs are: Haste, Displacement and Fire Shieldscrollable.

I've also taken Detect Secret Doors, DDoor, Teleportscrollable and Reconstruct.

My suggestion: drop everything I marked as scrollable: you don't have enough spell slots for all the cool spells, so your spell list should have the ones you can't get from elsewhere: scrolls for all of those are available in the portable hole.

My spell suggestions (which are what I'm planning for when I get my fvs through a human sorc life incidentally)
- Expeditious retreat -> hypnotism (will save debuff), get some striders in its place or use haste
- Invis -> gust of wind (I second mrmechman on that one)
- GH/Recon -> Disintegrate (essential against some constructs) + acid fog (for concealment). There's no such thing as cursed WF tanks for vod/tod anymore, reconstruct is a no-go for a fleshy.
- Teleport -> Mind Fog (to help land enchantments).
- Mass protection from elements -> otto's sphere of dancing
- Enervate -> drop for acid rain, enervate is scrollable too (SR can become an issue, but when you get to that stage, energy drain is better anyway).

[Kinerd]

* On conjuration focus: that's mostly for earth savant builds, due to acid blast and acid rain's reliance on conjuration. You should focus on your stronger spells: the ice ones. If your enemies are saving on otiluke's/cone of cold, your DPS output just dropped in half, which is bad (it's also one of the reasons there's a lot of non-WF sorcerers at higher levels of play: every point of DC makes a difference).

While DC is important, I think its contribution to raw damage is overstated. When Niac's Biting Cold, Eladar's Electric Surge, Polar Ray, and Black Dragon Bolt all have no save, a significant portion (perhaps a majority) of your DPS works just as well with 10 DC as 50. If you're into the DI abilities, you're at +13 DC over spells anyway, reducing the need to max it out.

[DarkForte]

While DC is important, I think its contribution to raw damage is overstated. When Niac's Biting Cold, Eladar's Electric Surge, Polar Ray, and Black Dragon Bolt all have no save, a significant portion (perhaps a majority) of your DPS works just as well with 10 DC as 50. If you're into the DI abilities, you're at +13 DC over spells anyway, reducing the need to max it out.

It also powers greater shout. If you're not tanking DCs, it's a matter of choosing between that one and web.

[wildbynature]

I don't know if you'll like this suggestion or not, but I love the fanion shield that comes from collecting the shield pieces in necro 4. Greater false life, archmagi, and no arcane spell failure.

[Inouk]

I apologize - It seems that even after editing my original post I forgot a spell.

BUT...


Ice Storm was of course THE FIRST Lvl 4 spell I took.
I am however finding that it has a short delay between casting and taking effect - Never noticed this on my Wizards - and in the content I'm currently working on has only been needed on ONE MOB: Whisperdoom! in TR pt 4 on Elite. - Yes there's a first time for everything and now I know that she is indeed killable in that quest.

If Snowball Swarm doesn't take em out...Otiluke's will! - If Niac's doesn't take em out...Frost Lance will!

In groups I will obviously be using Ice Storm a lot more than when soloing - Much like Blade Barrier I find it to be more of a hindrance when soloing {Not great at siting either spell} - Firewall works much better but is obviously not on my list as an Ice Sorc.

I have mentioned indeed that mana is an issue for me - But I'm thinking about when I actually start running those high level quests NOT the ones I'm running atm.
P.S. I had full SPs when I went into the fight with Whisperdoom along with a Lvl 18 Ftr/Rng/Rog Guildie and his Panther and my Cleric Hire. By the time Whisperdoom went down I was on 123 sps.

I have a Wizardry V hat but would like the extra 100sps from a Cunning Trinket {not available to this character atm.} definitely.
She has no RoSS, No Torc, No Bauble.
She won't have ConcOpp for a few more levels yet!


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now - I've gone thru her equipment - The Cape of the Roc is now in the bank - Replaced by a Tough Cloak off the AH.
I also grabbed a pair of Cheap FF Boots as the Golden Greaves are more easily swapoutable. {Boots and Ring of the Mire are on my list of must haves for every character}.

@JBleargh will be glad to know that the Belt is also safe in the bank - Replaced by a Greater False Life belt.

Death's Locket has joined them in the bank - Health 6 Necklace.

I now have 268hp {Lvl 16}.

I have Upgraded Katra's Wit!
I have replaced the 30% striding Ring with a Dex 5 ring that I had in my inventory - Will now be looking for some Dex 6 gloves so I can use that ring slot for something more useful. {It seems that absolutely nothing of any use to a pure caster comes on Gloves at mid levels atm.}

The gloves I did have on - Molb's Fist - I have better Wizardry and Ice Lore elsewhere and don't have Enlarge so they weren't actually doing anything.

Oh and the Suppresed Ioun Stone has been replaced by the Giantcraft Compass {+6 to my Will save} for now.

All this does of course mean that the Garments of Equilibrium will be worn for quite some time.

Maybe I'm simply paranoid about grouping at high levels on a pure caster as I don't want the Onus to be on me in every quest - Casters seem to be expected to be amazing and I know I'm not.
Maybe she isn't that bad apart from gear.
I hope so.

You have this backwards: in groups ice storm is often too slow to be effective, in solo it's a must. Ice storm will do more damage over it's course than any spell you have at your level, you just have to be patient enough to use it. It's great for single target mobs that won't move (i.e. archers), you can ice storm and move on. For small groups use ice storm and let hireling heal you (or scroll heal if you do that) for larger groups combine with Sphere or combine sphere with cone for fast kills (ice storm has no save so it's more reliable for finishing what sphere misses). Ice Storm and Sphere should account for about 90% of your kills, so if you don't have SF evocation (and GSF) and use ice storm, that's where your problem is. Conjuration is nice, but your conjuration spells (that get saves) are frankly all secondary. Every. Last. One.

Not sure why you dislike the challenges. The gear there is nothing short of stellar for the investment in time and effort. Personally I find them fun and a sorc is perfect for farming them. The tunic, boots, bracers, chime, both rings, and a variety of weapons are all very serviceable for various builds. I don't think I have a single active toon that isn't using at least one of the items I just listed, and my TR elite streak ranger/fighter build is using (at least swapping) 4 at the moment at level 18 (boots, stalker ring, tunic, bracers). If you spec for electric as secondary then bracers will be great for you. Ditto for acid/boots. For GS con ops is a great choice, but I would also consider a 3xpos weapon with cha +1 and cha +2 (really few other ways to get these until epic levels) which also gets you a raise dead clickie.

Things get easier at 18 when you a) get 9th level spells b) get frost lance SLA and c) get icy prison SLA. Frost lance in particular will ease your SP burden quite a bit.

[soulaeon]

Always take Empower on a sorcerer. You have a lot of spell-like abilities that will benefit the most from all of your damage modifications. I would not Empower anything but those because it's wasteful, unless you're at the end of the road then have at it.
For spell focus, may a well take Conjuration. Only one ice spell has a DC for Evocation, which does not even do as much damage as Polar Ray, and Web well be useful at at all levels of the game especially if you do not wish to bother with spell penetration. As a first lifer, you could take both feats depending on whether or not you took Toughness.
Cold savants have the distinct advantage of having their highest damage spells with no DC, so just be sure to get

[johnnyputrid]

For spell focus, may a well take Conjuration. Only one ice spell has a DC for Evocation, which does not even do as much damage as Polar Ray, and Web well be useful at at all levels of the game especially if you do not wish to bother with spell penetration.

Cone of Cold - evocation
Otiluke's Freezing Sphere - evocation
Frost Lance - evocation
Snowball Swarm - evocation

3 of those are staple cold DPS spells that every water savant should have. Snowball Swarm, while not a whole lot of damage, is dirt-cheap to cast, so why not use it? I would go evocation focused on a water savant. Web will still be useful even without being conjuration-spec'd.

[soulaeon]

3 of those are staple cold DPS spells that every water savant should have. Snowball Swarm, while not a whole lot of damage, is dirt-cheap to cast, so why not use it? I would go evocation focused on a water savant. Web will still be useful even without being conjuration-spec'd.

My bad.