Guild Renown Changes

[Blue100000005]

Something like 30th October last year?

Right, point being, we are still discussing it for fun cause they havent looked in 70 pages, or we really think that they are looking in...

[Dandonk]

Right, point being, we are still discussing it for fun cause they havent looked in 70 pages, or we really think that they are looking in...

I want to believe (TM) that they're still looking in...

[Blue100000005]

I want to believe (TM) that they're still looking in...

+1 Elliot, phone home

[Hendrik]

reported. First I am not trolling by discussing guild decay in an official topic about guild decay. Secondly I am not making anythin up. The name callig is unnecessary just because you disagree with my viewpoint - this tactic of attacking people that disagree with a viewpoint must stop. The moderators should not allow this tactic.

When a guild gains a level there is a renown penalty as stated in the first thread. This penalty was increased since it is so much easier for large guilds to level. The wording is confusing but the developers have acknowledged the point in this thread.

I wasn't even aware of this change until our guild level and was having trouble getting enough renown to cover decay. I asked about it on the forums and was pointed to this thread. The change was extremely difficult for our small guild as trying to get enough renown to cover decay with the new ransack penalty required us to stay up many hours later than usual.

It has become time to proove you are not making things up - this broken record can only go around for so long.

Again, what is the name of your Guild - can PM me and the name will remian private as per CoC. Let's all see what kind of gains you are making per day. Find it very hard to swallow that you cannot make 4500 renown a day with +70% renown bonus on the high side of the chart.

While your at it, again, name the Guilds that are 'prevented from leveling'. Who are they? You seem to know who they are, so let us all in on it.

You are going to have to back up these claims with facts and actual numbers.

We will wait....

[Impaqt]

reported. First I am not trolling by discussing guild decay in an official topic about guild decay. Secondly I am not making anythin up. The name callig is unnecessary just because you disagree with my viewpoint - this tactic of attacking people that disagree with a viewpoint must stop. The moderators should not allow this tactic.

When a guild gains a level there is a renown penalty as stated in the first thread. This penalty was increased since it is so much easier for large guilds to level. The wording is confusing but the developers have acknowledged the point in this thread.

I wasn't even aware of this change until our guild level and was having trouble getting enough renown to cover decay. I asked about it on the forums and was pointed to this thread. The change was extremely difficult for our small guild as trying to get enough renown to cover decay with the new ransack penalty required us to stay up many hours later than usual.

then you are mistaken. The ransack penalty does NOT work that way.

[Dandonk]

then you are mistaken. The ransack penalty does NOT work that way.

That is not my experience. Every time my guild gained a level (the same one, over and over for days on end), we got less renown than before levelling. When we didn't level for a day, we suddenly got more.

Is it anecdotal? Yes. But as I said, this is my experience with the current system.

[Impaqt]

That is not my experience. Every time my guild gained a level (the same one, over and over for days on end), we got less renown than before levelling. When we didn't level for a day, we suddenly got more.

Is it anecdotal? Yes. But as I said, this is my experience with the current system.

The power of suggestion.......

I've watched my guild level a few times since this change. I noticed no such drop off. Several of my own guildies have even said they do notice a change.. yet we still continue moving forward at a pace ahead of projections.....

[twigzz]

It has become time to proove you are not making things up - this broken record can only go around for so long.

Again, what is the name of your Guild - can PM me and the name will remian private as per CoC. Let's all see what kind of gains you are making per day. Find it very hard to swallow that you cannot make 4500 renown a day with +70% renown bonus on the high side of the chart.

While your at it, again, name the Guilds that are 'prevented from leveling'. Who are they? You seem to know who they are, so let us all in on it.

You are going to have to back up these claims with facts and actual numbers.

We will wait....

This has got me thinking. I'm gonna start recording our guild renown everyday at noon and see what the numbers look like. We are a small RL friend guild of 7(2-3 actives almost everyday and 4 casuals that play maybe twice week at best). We are almost lvl64 and I've noticed no slow down in lvl'ing at all.

[Hendrik]

This has got me thinking. I'm gonna start recording our guild renown everyday at noon and see what the numbers look like. We are a small RL friend guild of 7(2-3 actives almost everyday and 4 casuals that play maybe twice week at best). We are almost lvl64 and I've noticed no slow down in lvl'ing at all.

Please do!

Love to see some factual numbers. Gladly supply my own as well.

However, I bet the ones claiming how unfair, how broken, or it is preventing small guilds from leveling will be suprisingly quiet and will not supply numbers or names so ALL can see for themselves.

The facts will speak for themselves - so will the silence.

[Dandonk]

The problem with providing the numbers is that you have to be 100% sure you run exactly the same stuff with exactly the same levels, before and after levelling. And even then, there's the element of chance in getting good vs. bad renown drops.

Neither my anecdotes nor anyone else's will constitute proof. Until we get word from Turbine on this (another thing we would like word on), either version of the facts could be true.

Do I believe my version is true? Of course I do. We levelled many times, and every time it was noticeable to us. But this is such a small sample that it could simply be randomness.

[Impaqt]

The problem with providing the numbers is that you have to be 100% sure you run exactly the same stuff with exactly the same levels, before and after levelling. And even then, there's the element of chance in getting good vs. bad renown drops.

Did you read what you just wrote?

if the massive reduction in renown cant even be noticed because of common variations in renown drops... Its probably not really there to begin with.

Neither my anecdotes nor anyone else's will constitute proof. Until we get word from Turbine on this (another thing we would like word on), either version of the facts could be true.

why would that help? we already have a Turbine rep stating int eh very first post of this thread that it takes 3 levels to hit the renown ransack. why would anyone believe them if they said it again?

Do I believe my version is true? Of course I do. We levelled many times, and every time it was noticeable to us. But this is such a small sample that it could simply be randomness.

this last statement completely counters your first. make up your mind. If the decrease is so dramatic, please provide the numbers so we can see them. 1 Level should not hurt anyones renown drops.

[Dandonk]

Did you read what you just wrote?

if the massive reduction in renown cant even be noticed because of common variations in renown drops... Its probably not really there to begin with.

Randomness is huge with regards to renown drops.

why would that help? we already have a Turbine rep stating int eh very first post of this thread that it takes 3 levels to hit the renown ransack. why would anyone believe them if they said it again?

That's not how I read it. I read it to mean: Gaining one or more levels will increasingly give less renown drops, to the point where no renown drops after getting 3 levels in a day.

this last statement completely counters your first. make up your mind. If the decrease is so dramatic, please provide the numbers so we can see them. 1 Level should not hurt anyones renown drops.

I can't give you any numbers because:

1) I never wrote them down back then, and
2) At the moment so few people are playing that we're not going to gain that level back anytime soon

[Dandonk]

From the first page:

"Renown ransack has been increased. Previously when a guild earned levels in a day, it would gradually reduce the renown drop rates. We’ve increased the rate so that a guild can only earn roughly 3 levels in a single day. This should prevent large guilds from completely dominating the field in terms of levels per-day."

My emphasis.

[Impaqt]

From the first page:

"Renown ransack has been increased. Previously when a guild earned levels in a day, it would gradually reduce the renown drop rates. We’ve increased the rate so that a guild can only earn roughly 3 levels in a single day. This should prevent large guilds from completely dominating the field in terms of levels per-day."

My emphasis.

the term "Previously" tends to indicate that in no longer does so.

As in

'Previously, when your guild gained a level, renown would ransack making it difficult to gain another level. We've increased the rate so that the ransack doesn't kick in until three levels have been gained.'

this change really only effects newer guilds gaining lower levels. No legitimate guild is gaining more than a level a day once you get into the 60's and 70's.

[Dandonk]

the term "Previously" tends to indicate that in no longer does so.

The only change mentioned is increasing the rate. So I still believe I am correct in my interpretation.

[slarden]

It has become time to proove you are not making things up - this broken record can only go around for so long.

Again, what is the name of your Guild - can PM me and the name will remian private as per CoC. Let's all see what kind of gains you are making per day. Find it very hard to swallow that you cannot make 4500 renown a day with +70% renown bonus on the high side of the chart.

While your at it, again, name the Guilds that are 'prevented from leveling'. Who are they? You seem to know who they are, so let us all in on it.

You are going to have to back up these claims with facts and actual numbers.

We will wait....

Why is it hard to swallow that small guilds can't make that much renown when the large guilds argued that it was impossible for lage guilds to make that much? Many people from small guilds in this thread talked about how difficult it is for small guilds to level due to decay. I don't need to name them you can read the thread yourself.

Small guilds have 10x more decay/person than people in other large guilds. Why did large guilds need a reduction in decay if people in small guilds should be able to easily earn 10x more renown than people in large guilds can earn.

I am sorry but I don't need to prove that people in small guilds are having a hard time earning 10x more renown than people in other large guilds. You can do the research and disprove it if you think it's the case.

I think decay should be eliminated, but if it's not the # of accounts in a guild should be part of the formula.

As I've stated several times in this thread. My guild is moving rather fast at the moment because I have massive time availabilty for 3 months ending next week. In addition I followed advice given to me by a small high level guild about how to level fasers. Namely, stop forming lfms and solo/zerg or group with only zerg parties. I've done that about 90% of the time and since then renown generation is not a problem. I've turned down party requests a lot but still group with some of my friends that like to take their time in dungeons. I adjust my play style to the party I don't zerg in party of people that like to move slow. So I just group with them much less now.

[Dandonk]

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...78#post4738478

"Unless your guild gained a level in the past day, renown drops are completely unchanged."

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...97#post4748497

"Renown drops are reduced by less than half if you've gained one level in the past day, at the original or increased test rates."

Yes, renown is decreased after gaining a level.

[Chaos000]

The only change mentioned is increasing the rate. So I still believe I am correct in my interpretation.

"This should prevent large guilds from completely dominating the field in terms of levels per-day."

so... the renown ransack mechanic intended to prevent large guilds from progressing more than 3 levels per day is prohibitive to smaller guilds from progressing after gaining 1 level?

solution: apply the 3 lvl per day ransack only to large guilds ("from completely dominating the filed in terms of levels per-day") and medium to smaller guilds are restored back to the previous renown ransack.

[Dandonk]

"This should prevent large guilds from completely dominating the field in terms of levels per-day."

so... the renown ransack mechanic intended to prevent large guilds from progressing more than 3 levels per day is prohibitive to smaller guilds from progressing after gaining 1 level?

solution: apply the 3 lvl per day ransack only to large guilds ("from completely dominating the filed in terms of levels per-day") and medium to smaller guilds are restored back to the previous renown ransack.

That would help with one aspect of the problem.

The larger issue, of larger guilds having it monumentally easier compared to small guilds, will not be solved purely by that.

Turbine, in the person of Vargouille, stated that the new system was unfair to small guilds. I'm just waiting for Turbine to actually do something about that unfairness.

[Cordovan]

We'd like to allow people to continue to discuss guild renown and provide feedback and analysis of the current system, but in order to do that we need people to stop insulting and fighting with each other. Remember, even though this is the Internet, it's okay for someone to have an opinion that differs from you.