Guild Renown Changes

[Tshober]

You do say you support eliminating decay, but most people realize Turbine isn't open to that. You haven't offered or agreed to any suggestions about lower decay for small guilds that I've seen.

I have suggested eliminating decay entirely. How do you know Turbine is not open to that? I have been advocating for the removal or massive reduction of renown decay for many months. Up until very recently, I was pretty sure Turbine was not open to that. But now they are testing a system that is a massive reduction in renown decay. You don't know what Turbine is open to, and neither do I.

I have also proposed increasing the small guild bonus percentages, if needed, to keep small and tiny guilds viable and advancing.

The only other suggestion I can remember seeing for reducing the decay on small and tiny guilds was the one you made. But your suggestion involved going back to the old decay system and that I am not open to. The old decay system was just awful. I will not support any plan that can't be built upon the new decay system and forces us back to the old decay system. I am unwilling to undo all the good that has been done. I am perfectly willing to add to that good though.

[Dandonk]

how? how does what my guild does have anything to do with your guild i dont understand

I just stated it - relative value.

[eris2323]

I was warned by someone that Turbine has a loot debuff mechanism and that if I complain about the proposed guild system too much they will assign it to my account. Does anyone know if this is truth or mythology? I was told it was primarily used on people that submit many tickets or hassle GMs, but it's also used when the devs don't like what they see on the forums.

I got a +4 tome recently so I assume if such a mechanism exists, I am not on the list.... yet. I would be curious if anyone else knows about it - I never heard of it before.

Now we're talking... a shadowy conspiracy... tell us more...

Who warned you? Did they have any special or occult symbols on their outfits?

[theslimshady]

I just stated it - relative value.

alrighty then

[Gremmlynn]

Obviously, some large guilds have issues getting people to play. Otherwise we wouldn't hear the large guilds being so upset about the decay they were having.

Um, why would they even want to try. People will play as often as desire meets opportunity which seems to be the exact right amount of time to play.


It's a game, not an obligation and the guild system should support that.

[Dandonk]

Um, why would they even want to try. People will play as often as desire meets opportunity which seems to be the exact right amount of time to play.


It's a game, not an obligation and the guild system should support that.

Precisely. So why are small guilds still under the old system?

[Gremmlynn]

Indeed, some of us have the same problem. But then the large guilds with casuals got a huge boost, while the rest of us got left behind.

Well I'm for getting rid of that problem by completely eliminating decay.

I'd be all for a per player based system if it wasn't so easy for the most active players to game such by cutting the less active off from viable guilds to a large extent.

[jhadden30]

Even though this wasn't directed at me I will comment. It's a very fair point, but those of us in small guilds feel that there is a double standard as we are expected to cover a large decay tax while those in large guilds don't have to. Believe it or not people small guilds also have real life issues come up and some even have babies, holidays and deployments.

.

Exactly, I have a family and I work 60 hours a week so why should I still have grind renown to cover decay and advance? Turbine, please just eliminate decay all together.

[Gremmlynn]

Well from the previous posts, keeping everyone interested in playing for one thing and striving towards a goal for another. Isn't it the guild leaders (manager's) job to keep a guild functioning and moving forward? Or is just a gigantic free for all?

This game is rather lacking in guild based goals other than that next level and that should simply be a side effect of playing the game. But keeping everybody interested in playing is mostly accomplished by trying to have enough critical mass to ensure that, at least during peak times, there are enough on-line on any particular day to provide others to play with and enforcing just enough discipline to keep things civilized (basically enough to remind everyone that there is some accountability for being a jerk).

[jhadden30]

This game is rather lacking in guild based goals other than that next level and that should simply be a side effect of playing the game.

Your right, because that is really the only goal set in place which sadly promotes leveling over playing. Good point.

[Gremmlynn]

It would be great if it supported that concept for all guild sizes instead of assessing a massive decay tax on only small guilds.

I'm all for the complete elimination of the tax, or even the whole, drama inducing, guild leveling system itself.

That way maybe we can all form and run our guilds how ever we like for whatever purposes we choose. Because, to be honest, I don't even understand what the purpose your guild, as you describe it, serves and it's likely others feel the same way about mine. Best if we could just discount it completely.

[Gremmlynn]

Precisely. So why are small guilds still under the old system?

You got me? I didn't make the change or decay would have gone away entirely.

I wont even try to understand what purpose a small casual guild serves (to me it's like a cloud of hydrogen that hasn't the critical mass to form into a star), but if it works for you I'm all for a solution that let's you do your thing.

[Dandonk]

You got me? I didn't make the change or decay would have gone away entirely.

I wont even try to understand what purpose a small casual guild serves (to me it's like a cloud of hydrogen that hasn't the critical mass to form into a star), but if it works for you I'm all for a solution that let's you do your thing.

Thank you.

(though I do not appreciate your comment about small guilds... should I call large guilds "mobs" instead? I think not)

[Gremmlynn]

Thank you.

(though I do not appreciate your comment about small guilds... should I call large guilds "mobs" instead? I think not)

If that's how you see them, go for it. But please explain why you see them that way.

Personally I see the pug scene as a mob, as it lacks the threat of expulsion to enforce at least trying to act as a team and enforce biting one's tongue when that doesn't work out. My large guilds have that going for them anyway.

[slarden]

You got me? I didn't make the change or decay would have gone away entirely.

I wont even try to understand what purpose a small casual guild serves (to me it's like a cloud of hydrogen that hasn't the critical mass to form into a star), but if it works for you I'm all for a solution that let's you do your thing.

It's hard for a few of you to go very long without taking a shot at small guilds. If you run high level raids at higher difficulty levels I think you will see very high representation from small guilds. They are obviously doing something right because the members are well trained and know how to contribute effectively to parties. That didn't happen by accident.

Ultimately much of the social aspect of the game involves actually running the content, building a good party and sharing ideas. That doesn't have to happen in guild chat. In fact many people from large guilds are active in channels on Sarlona. So even folks in large guilds understand the larger social structure of the game and aren't isolated to the confines of their guild.

[Dandonk]

If that's how you see them, go for it. But please explain why you see them that way.

Personally I see the pug scene as a mob, as it lacks the threat of expulsion to enforce at least trying to act as a team and enforce biting one's tongue when that doesn't work out. My large guilds have that going for them anyway.

How can people in large guilds know each other well? I know everyone in my guild well, we've played together for years, having fun, getting to know each. We're not just 1 in 200 accounts that noone really knows of, anyway.

[eris2323]

How can people in large guilds know each other well? I know everyone in my guild well, we've played together for years, having fun, getting to know each. We're not just 1 in 200 accounts that noone really knows of, anyway.

Getting to know each other is part of the fun for some of us.

We've also played together for years; having fun - or at the very least, combatting the old, evil decay system, which I think was one of the worst decisions the game designers ever made.

Luckily they seem to agree; woopsies.

Time for a change.

A change for the better; for the vast majority of us.

If Tiny guilds need to work (the same as they always did) or harder, I have no complaints about that; seems logical to me.

[Dandonk]

Getting to know each other is part of the fun for some of us.

We've also played together for years; having fun - or at the very least, combatting the old, evil decay system, which I think was one of the worst decisions the game designers ever made.

Luckily they seem to agree; woopsies.

Time for a change.

A change for the better; for the vast majority of us.

If Tiny guilds need to work (the same as they always did) or harder, I have no complaints about that; seems logical to me.

As long as OTHER people have to work harder, it's OK? Good one, I like that sentiment.

How can you know 200 other people as well as 10 others? You can't.

[eris2323]

Gremmlynn is just bating you. If you look at the thread (and I pity you if you read it all) you will see the same 5-6 people picking arguments and starting fights whenever someone from a small guild raises a valid concern or idea. By doing so it effectively buries the good idea in pages and pages of arguments about guild size. It's a pity because there are some good ideas and concerns raised. Turbine will likely only notice the fighting and stop reading.

Riiiiiiiiight.

SO, about that conspiracy you were talking about... the one about the secret loot debuff for people that argue on the forums...

Where'd you hear that?

*wink**wink* *nudge* *nudge*

conspiracy theories rule.

[eris2323]

As long as OTHER people have to work harder, it's OK? Good one, I like that sentiment.

How can you know 200 other people as well as 10 others? You can't.

They don't have to work harder; just the same as they always have.