ddo store suggestion

[Jindo-Nagaki]

Hi, I have been a massive fan of this game since it went Free to play. Having previously spent over three and a half thousand hours playing Guild Wars, when the franchise died I found DDO to be the perfect replacement as I would never (out of principal) "rent" a game by paying a monthly fee. I am not against spending money on a game at all, I would just rather spend it on content to actualy "own" rather than "rent" and have spent over £160 on DDO so far.

In the past few years I have played 6 characters (3 of them to level 20) and when Guild Wars 2 arrived, I was inevitably tempted to try it out. After giving it a go for a month, I have come to the conclusion that I still prefer the business model and gaming experience of DDO. I am however now faced with an unexpected problem and find it VERY dificult to return to the game I once loved.

Guild wars 2 has shown that DDO can be incredibly repetitive. There is too much XP available (for a player with all the packs) and I find that my characters now get to level 17 before even attempting a quest any higher than lvl 12 on elite. The solution to this so far has been to find a VIP who can unlock a new quest on Elite, rather than playing it through 3 times. At first playing normal/hard/elite was fun, but being a seasoned player now, I realy find it too tedious to play through a quest twice, getting rubbish in the chests and no or very little XP just to unlock Elite.

My suggestion is this: PLEASE sell an Elite quest unlock pack in the DDO store. (a one time fixed price pack, which then unlocks elite on all quests on your account now and future) I for one would buy it without hessitation and I would asume there must be others out there with a similar view to me. As far as I can make out, this is the only thing that a VIP gets that a P2P player cant even buy.

I really hope that this idea is taken on and implemented as without it, at present, I cant see a way back into the game that still keeps it fun & surely having fun is the main idea.
I would really love DDO to be fun for me again.

Gary

[Memnir]

As far as I can make out, this is the only thing that a VIP gets that a P2P player cant even buy.

Which is exactly why it should remain a VIP-only perk.



/not signed

[varusso]

Which is exactly why it should remain a VIP-only perk.



/not signed

Pfft thats hardly a deal-breaker compared to all the other slaps in the face for VIPs.
Sure thing, sell a permanent dif unlock. And while youre at it, give Premium Hard as a perk.

[Jindo-Nagaki]

Which is exactly why it should remain a VIP-only perk.



/not signed

I am sorry to hear you feel that way & fail to see why you felt the need to say it. I fully understand the need to have content set aside for paying players over F2P players, but fail to see the difference between a VIP and P2P player (in Turbines eyes) They are just two different forms of payment. Large chunks spread out or small regular monthly payments.

I simply want to point out to Turbine that if they want me to part with more of my cash, this is the way to do it. Otherwise I doubt I will be spending any more, no matter what new content comes out. Until this problem is resolved I will just swap to playing my level 20's up to level 25 with the content I have bought already. (I havent even started the Underdark packs yet) I just find it hard to muster the enthusiasm to play my level 20's when I know I have this problem with all of my other characters & have other games to play (GW2 and Skyrim)

[Dysmetria]

Which is exactly why it should remain a VIP-only perk.



/not signed

Why?

I don't see any VIPs complaining that premiums can purchase shared banks or monks or warforged or adventure packs or anything else VIPs get as part of their subscription...

So why shouldn't premiums be able to purchase the permanent ability to unlock on elite for first and second life characters too?

Make it expensive, make it per server, or even per character, it'll still sell like crazy. With the bravery bonus, this is really long overdue.

[muny21]

Which is exactly why it should remain a VIP-only perk.



/not signed

I really do not see the harm in allowing it to be a store bought option. Like the poster above said, all other options are sold in store.

What would it harm you personally if they sold it in store? Would it affect your game play? Would it really upset you that much that people would no longer need the "VERY IMPORTANT PEOPLE" to come open elite for them? Would it make you feel less important?

I am truly interested in some answers as to why this would be bad to VIPs. Maybe I just don't see it from their perspective.

[Memnir]

Would it really upset you that much that people would no longer need the "VERY IMPORTANT PEOPLE" to come open elite for them? Would it make you feel less important?

Upset me? Not a whole lot, no. I'm VIP mainly for that reason - as so I imagine are a lot of other people. If it were made a Store option, even an expensive one I'd buy it - as so I imagine would a lot of other people. And therein is why I don't think it'll happen - nor should happen.

Simply put, even made expensive - it would reduce the amount of money Turbine would reliably pull in every month. More money means the lights in this game stay on longer, and more development happens for it. Yes, yes... I know Premiums put money into the game, and I don't in any way suspect they don't. However, making it a One and Done unlock would knock one of the last pillars out from underneath VIP - and in the long-run this would harm the game no matter the price tag slapped on the unlock. Even if it was per-character and not account (which is a silly idea anyhow, because if you invest that much in a character you will likely TR it, and then people would complain about diminishing returns on TRing).


No, I don't think Turbine should kill their Golden Geese... even willing ones like the VIPs.This is not about me feeling special because I have a privilege others don't... hey, TR twice and anybody can have this "right". It's about keeping at least one carrot in front of the cart.

& fail to see why you felt the need to say it.

Because that's how forums work. And because silence implies consent. I don't agree with the idea strongly enough to express my views on it, even if those views don't line up with yours.

[muny21]

Upset me? Not a whole lot, no. I'm VIP mainly for that reason - as so I imagine are a lot of other people. If it were made a Store option, even an expensive one I'd buy it - as so I imagine would a lot of other people. And therein is why I don't think it'll happen - nor should happen..

I am sure it will never happen as well. But here is my take on this. I do not see it as a VIP perk anymore since all you have to do is TR a couple times and you have the ability to unlock elite. It then just becomes a convenience item.

I do not think people would really drop sub for the luxury of opening elite if it were sold. Most, assuming here, VIPs have multiple TRs already and thus do not even need that perk anymore.

I do agree that this game needs constant money incoming to keep developing and running so we can all enjoy new content. However, I highly doubt that it all ties in with the elite unlock perk enticing people to stay VIP.

Well thanks for your take on it. Was truly curious as to why you were against it.

[Uska]

Either tr twice go vip or ask a friendly vip to open for you it should never be sold

[varusso]

Folks, you do realize that the DDO store already sells an elite unlock, right? It can be used once for a single quest on a single toon, and it does not last through TRs. Dunno bout you guys, but I would never purchase that piece of junk, effectively making it yet another useless newbie-trap item. But an account-wide unlock? Now that is something with potential sales on it. I am a VIP, and I would not drop that just for a permanent elite unlock; its not like its actually hard to get someone to open elite for you anyway -- with or without the VIP-perk players to do it, and even if I didnt have TRs and a second account with alll the important quests unlocked to elite..

Turbine's likelihood of losing my VIP sub when it runs out has absolutely nothing to do with an elite unlock perk, as it the case with the majority of players who have expressed an intention to drop VIP. Given the overall lack of incentive to remain VIP in the first place, if the concern is the loss of revenue, then it seems to me an alternate source of revenue (even one based on one-time sales per player) should be more carefully considered.

VIP is obviously low on the priority ladder for Turbine. If they wanted to rely on subs, they would not have used the F2P model to begin with. They are making their real money through the "micro-transactions". VIP is really just a half-assed version of a sub. If they actually cared about VIP to any extent, there wouldnt be silly squabbling about minor perks, as the benefits of VIP would not be so miniscule as to cause players to scratch for every little crumb in the first place.

Let them have their unlocks. It wont make a bit of difference in whether or not I remain VIP. That is going away regardless.

[Mastikator]

[snip] There is too much XP available (for a player with all the packs) and I find that my characters now get to level 17 before even attempting a quest any higher than lvl 12 on elite.[snip]

Give TRing a whirl, you'll find that there is no such thing as "too much XP available".

[Vellrad]

Which is exactly why it should remain a VIP-only perk.



/not signed

VIP/PREMIUM IS JUST A PAYMENT OPTION AND ALL PERKS SHOULD BE AVAIBLE AT STORE
Stop arguing about who is better/worse, who is paying more/less etc.
All theese threads are boring already...

[Jindo-Nagaki]

Thanks everyone for your input so far.

OK, here is my stand on all mentioned:

TR: I will not TR with any character for the exact reason I want an Elite unlock. I don't want to play the same quest over and over.

VIP: I will never go VIP, even if Turbine dosn't sort this problem, I will end up leaving the game altogether once I get bored playing the high level quests

Asking VIP's: While DDO was my sole game, I didn't mind waiting around for 20 or so mins asking for unlocks (although some quests - particulally chains like Deleras make unlocking this way very tricky) But now I have other games to play I find myself saying "why am I waiting around for an unlock when I can just load up game X instead"

VIP's strongly complaining about having Elite unlock as a store account upgrade:
I would be interested In some official feedback from Turbine as I am pretty sure they make a LOT more revenue p.a. from P2P than they do in VIP subscriptions. I'm pretty sure that I heard some official on some forum that they made more money in the fist few months of going F2P than they got in VIP subscriptions from the whole of the previous year. Also, how many VIP's would actualy cancel their subscription because of this?

and Memnir, I hope you don't consider my previous post as rude. I did not see the impact you thought this may have (with VIP's leaving), so genuinly thought you were just trolling for the sake of it. Appologies.

So Turebine officials, can you please clear up what percentage of your revenue is between VIP & P2P
and VIP's how many of you feel like Memnir and would go P2P if they implemented this?

[der_kluge]

Legend builds already get elite unlock. Hero builds get hard. I don't know why you're so against TR'ing. To me, there are HUGE benefits to TR'ing. Both of my main characters are Legend builds now for this very reason - I never have to run something on normal again unless I want to.

And as Varusso already pointed out - there already is an elite unlock one-shot item in the store. If it's that important to you, use it. It's perfect for long, high XP quests like The Pit or VoN3.

[varusso]

Legend builds already get elite unlock. Hero builds get hard. I don't know why you're so against TR'ing. To me, there are HUGE benefits to TR'ing. Both of my main characters are Legend builds now for this very reason - I never have to run something on normal again unless I want to.

And as Varusso already pointed out - there already is an elite unlock one-shot item in the store. If it's that important to you, use it. It's perfect for long, high XP quests like The Pit or VoN3.

I also said I wouldnt waste my TP on it, as it is ridiculously easy to get an Elite unlock on any one quest. A DDO store pack that gives a permanent unlock to all toons on a given account has much more appeal. It is unlikely I would personally buy that either, as I have access to elite unlocks for nearly everything I run without even posting an LFM for it. But I can certainly see the appeal it would have to others.

Even the folks who are arguing against it effective demonstrate that they would value it as well; hence why they dont want it added, because they fear it will be another nail in the coffin of the VIP model. If it werent something that had any appeal, it wouldnt be a threat to that.

[Galeria]

because that's how forums work. And because silence implies consent. I don't agree with the idea strongly enough to express my views on it, even if those views don't line up with yours.

+9000

[Uska]

Thanks everyone for your input so far.

OK, here is my stand on all mentioned:

TR: I will not TR with any character for the exact reason I want an Elite unlock. I don't want to play the same quest over and over.

VIP: I will never go VIP, even if Turbine dosn't sort this problem, I will end up leaving the game altogether once I get bored playing the high level quests

Asking VIP's: While DDO was my sole game, I didn't mind waiting around for 20 or so mins asking for unlocks (although some quests - particulally chains like Deleras make unlocking this way very tricky) But now I have other games to play I find myself saying "why am I waiting around for an unlock when I can just load up game X instead"

VIP's strongly complaining about having Elite unlock as a store account upgrade:
I would be interested In some official feedback from Turbine as I am pretty sure they make a LOT more revenue p.a. from P2P than they do in VIP subscriptions. I'm pretty sure that I heard some official on some forum that they made more money in the fist few months of going F2P than they got in VIP subscriptions from the whole of the previous year. Also, how many VIP's would actualy cancel their subscription because of this?

and Memnir, I hope you don't consider my previous post as rude. I did not see the impact you thought this may have (with VIP's leaving), so genuinly thought you were just trolling for the sake of it. Appologies.

So Turebine officials, can you please clear up what percentage of your revenue is between VIP & P2P
and VIP's how many of you feel like Memnir and would go P2P if they implemented this?

I will play until my VIP sub runs out and quit I dont want to buy all that I have now and if the last perk beyond being able to play is taken I will leave

[Ranncore]

I will not TR with any character for the exact reason I want an Elite unlock. I don't want to play the same quest over and over.

I will end up leaving the game altogether once I get bored playing the high level quests

While DDO was my sole game, I didn't mind waiting around for 20 or so mins asking for unlocks

But now I have other games to play I find myself saying "why am I waiting around for an unlock when I can just load up game X instead"

This is one of the biggest issues this game faces. It is a grind game. I played for years and never had any interest in TRing until Bravery Bonus came out for the same reason as this fellow - grinding is not fun. The game just does not have enough content, and that's why it forces the grind.

That being said, I think new players realise this by the time they hit level seven or so - that they will have to repeat many quests in order to advance. I think this is where DDO loses most of its new players.

When I dropped my subscription, I told my friends, "the only thing I miss is being able to unlock Elite right away."

I think selling a permanent unlock for elite in the store would be a good idea - within limits. Perhaps sell it per character. And make it too expensive to justify buying solely for the purpose of grinding Turbine Points across servers.

I'm thinking something like 1495 TP for a permanent elite unlock on a character of your choice.

As an aside... I think it's about time you gave your VIP players a new bonus. A substantial new bonus, I mean... not 10% run speed in town.

Unlocking content is what everyone pays VIP for... so unlock something new for them. Be creative. And make it a convenience perk... DDO has too much pay2win BS as it is.

[Ranncore]

Anyways, if a player suggests it, you can be sure Turbine won't do it, so you're SOL, guy.

[donfilibuster]

Simply put, even made expensive - it would reduce the amount of money Turbine would reliably pull in every month. More money means the lights in this game stay on longer, and more development happens for it. Yes, yes... I know Premiums put money into the game, and I don't in any way suspect they don't. However, making it a One and Done unlock would knock one of the last pillars out from underneath VIP - and in the long-run this would harm the game no matter the price tag slapped on the unlock. Even if it was per-character and not account (which is a silly idea anyhow, because if you invest that much in a character you will likely TR it, and then people would complain about diminishing returns on TRing)

Good to be concerned but that's just condoning Turbine on milking the cow instead of pushing proper value in store products that everyone would want to susbscribe for.

There gotta be a better way to keep VIPs subscribing, having to throw shinies in fear of losing that playerbase only makes a vicious circle, and a sad circle, and also lead to players asking more perks.

TR'ing is fine but people that won't do it is more than likely to be paying for it, be it casual players, doing epic destinies or alts that never TR.

Neither is good if you are forced to a party or change to vip when already a premium.
What good is to not be able to play the way you want with the payment method you pick?

Obviously no one had straight elite until some time ago, but it grew to be a mandatory thing.
It has grown beyond something nice to hand out as perk to something everyone needs or want.

If there's so much need of keeping the monthly payments flowing then it'd take more than perks to keep ddo alive.
One solution is to make the access expire, faintly similar to ship ammenities expire or quest passes.
Timed access would be a new thing to ddo, but something already exists in the world of games with microtransactions.

And gotta get rid of the bias. Microtransactions are not evil, meant to happen where subscriptions weren't selling.
They need be done right tho, else players will indeed settle for the cheaper option.
If either method is not good to have or not working, they need to do something about it or shut it down.
And preferrably not by alienating the other side of the players.