Monster Manual: General Feedback

[Silverleafeon]

SOON (tm)

I like "soon tm" personally. It means its on "the stack" (MTG) working on being created, debugged, and resolved.

[jakeelala]

And then the Devs set a date, like say Dec 16, and then they say "it got pushed back due to [some problem cropping up] so it won't be ready until Jan 1." And the players go "BUT YOU SAID DEC 16!!!!ONE!!!! HOW DARE YOU LIE TO ME! I'M GONNA STRING YOU UP BY YOUR TOES AND THROW CATS AT YOU!!!"

And that's how we got SOON(tm).

Disagree. And thanks for the neg rep, I forgot that not agreeing with other people = neg rep on these forums, instead of it being limited to people actually doing something negative or non-constructive. Everyone here is so mature, I forgot why I turned it off before.

By the way, if Turbine gave a fart about complaining customers (on the forum), MANY MANY MANY changes never would have seen day. That's clearly not their motivation and I challenge you to prove to me otherwise. So that's not why we have Soon (TM). We have soon because Turbine clearly runs DDO in a way that is poorly scheduled and managed (look at the disaster every single release is with bugs, breaks and exploits). DDO is not the work of fastidious, OCD perfectionists who worry about every little detail. I would even go so far as to guess it's run by some seriously sloppy people (that's not to say everyone who works on DDO is sloppy, I have no idea who is responsible for what, I just see the finished result, sue me).

We have soon, because no one at Turbine seems to know what is going to happen when. Whether it's employee firing (RIP Breca) or hiring (Hi, FoS), or weird mergers (Hi Atari) and weird un-mergers, Turbine is a freakin' mess. I don't play LOTRO so I don't know if it's better, worse or the same. I have been playing this since release in '06, and it's never been worse in terms of releases, quality, breadth and depth of content.

I love this game, I enjoy it most of the time. But after 6 years I feel confident going to the mat and stating for the record that Turbine is piddling away a very, very good thing they have. Not keeping the player base informed has been a HUGE issue for the last 4 years since dev diaries were canceled (stupidest thing Turbine ever did besides never making ranged a viable combat style). So now we drool and swoon over itty bitty leaked details of things like a new augment system, or upgraded enhancements.

Instead, as Forum stalwarts and Lama testing contributors, we should be front and center during their development process. We, the players who know this game BETTER than the dev's who design and program it, who know every nook and cranny and find and relay bugs to Turbine better than Mournlands, Lama, and their entire testing team combined, should have far more input, early and often, than we ever have. Certainly more than we do now.

Soon (TM) is a slap in the face to everyone who plays this game, and cares about it. Of course, I wouldn't expect someone with a join date of September or October 2009 to understand what those of us playing since March of 2006 (or before that in Beta) understand. You're still a bit wet behind the ears.

[oradafu]

I can understand where Jakeelala, to a degree.

The Monster Manuals were introduced as something that would be added in future updates. With the bugs in the MM, which appear most have been fixed (excluding the Crooktooth type mobs), I'm willing to give the Devs a bit more time to flesh out the next set of books.

With that said, although I'm not at the point where Jakeelala is right now, I understand it. There does seem to be a habit that something new is introduced that is pitched as a new element in the game that will be regularly updated, but Turbine ends up shooting 90% of the wad (if not the whole wad) with the first release. Examples:
* The obvious one to point out is the prestige classes and now the new enhancement system.
* When Cannith Crafting was introduced, players were told that there would be more shards in future updates. Since the release, there's been maybe two updates with new shards.
* The various cosmetic items in the DDO store. Since I've been in the game, there's been no new hair and only a handful of new cosmetic hats. On top of that, the Armor Kits were added to the game with a big roll out, but after a few updates with very few new additions, that has appeared to end also.
* The Guild system also was pushed out in one chunk with no real follow up. This is not about renown decay, but the other aspects of the guild system. First, the shrines haven't had anything added since they were introduced, such as guild renown bonus shines. Second, the guild slots haven't had anything new added to them. Third, the Devs keep forgetting to put renown in the new activities of the game, such as Challenges and the MM.
* A personal peeve that's only started to being corrected: Between Update 1 and the expansion, there was no new unique Docents. The Cannith updates should have included multiple docents and players had to remind the Devs to include Docent to the sets in MOTU.

Those are examples that I can roll off without straining myself.

Let me point to something that the Devs did correctly: cosmetic pets. Now this might be because they were more successful than the MM, Kits, Hair and Hats, but there has been a new pet added to the game quite frequently. With the Armor Kits (and some of the other examples above), there should have been a handful of MM done and ready to be released at least every other update. Again, I'll give the MM a pass since there were a few bugs and missing mobs, but there should have been a supply of these type items either prepared for release over several weeks or updates (depending on the item).

With all this said, it's good to hear from a Dev that the Monster Manual still appears to be on the Dev's agenda for now and not something forgotten about, like Docents and Guild Renown have been.

[Jaxom_Faux]

my general opinion is favorable. i like it and hope it gets finished up relatively quickly instead of soon...

[DarkPhoenix888]

Unlocking a type of monster's HP requires a lot of dedicated work. Hunting all those rare named monsters and killing thousands of monsters are a lot of grind, so I think a better reward is in order:

More information/stats about the monsters besides HP: abilities (strength, dexterity etc), fortification, AC, saving throws, SR, DR, resists/weaknesses and more - the more numerical stats we can see the better!

Numerical stats are helpful, but more importantly they are fun! It'd be so cool, for example, to actually watch a monster's strength goes down as we hit it with a weakening of enfeebling weapon.

* These stats should be shown per monster when it is viewed in the focus orb (and not the general stats that are shown in the monster manual).

[Cyr]

I can understand where Jakeelala, to a degree.

The Monster Manuals were introduced as something that would be added in future updates. With the bugs in the MM, which appear most have been fixed (excluding the Crooktooth type mobs), I'm willing to give the Devs a bit more time to flesh out the next set of books.

With that said, although I'm not at the point where Jakeelala is right now, I understand it. There does seem to be a habit that something new is introduced that is pitched as a new element in the game that will be regularly updated, but Turbine ends up shooting 90% of the wad (if not the whole wad) with the first release. Examples:
* The obvious one to point out is the prestige classes and now the new enhancement system.
* When Cannith Crafting was introduced, players were told that there would be more shards in future updates. Since the release, there's been maybe two updates with new shards.
* The various cosmetic items in the DDO store. Since I've been in the game, there's been no new hair and only a handful of new cosmetic hats. On top of that, the Armor Kits were added to the game with a big roll out, but after a few updates with very few new additions, that has appeared to end also.
* The Guild system also was pushed out in one chunk with no real follow up. This is not about renown decay, but the other aspects of the guild system. First, the shrines haven't had anything added since they were introduced, such as guild renown bonus shines. Second, the guild slots haven't had anything new added to them. Third, the Devs keep forgetting to put renown in the new activities of the game, such as Challenges and the MM.
* A personal peeve that's only started to being corrected: Between Update 1 and the expansion, there was no new unique Docents. The Cannith updates should have included multiple docents and players had to remind the Devs to include Docent to the sets in MOTU.

Those are examples that I can roll off without straining myself.

Let me point to something that the Devs did correctly: cosmetic pets. Now this might be because they were more successful than the MM, Kits, Hair and Hats, but there has been a new pet added to the game quite frequently. With the Armor Kits (and some of the other examples above), there should have been a handful of MM done and ready to be released at least every other update. Again, I'll give the MM a pass since there were a few bugs and missing mobs, but there should have been a supply of these type items either prepared for release over several weeks or updates (depending on the item).

With all this said, it's good to hear from a Dev that the Monster Manual still appears to be on the Dev's agenda for now and not something forgotten about, like Docents and Guild Renown have been.

Yup, Turbine is notorious for rolling out half finished systems which they then basically abandon.

These sorts of deliverables should be tied to update cycles in clear terms. It helps for marketting and player retention when you actually have new product to hype (of course the inverse is also true when you have far too little new product to hype so you hide details to try and keep customers around a little longer).

[QuantumFX]

SOON (tm)

No.

SOON™

Yes.

[lorenpechtel]

Any chance that as a bonus for finishing all the goals in one of the volumes of the MM, you get the next one for free? I.E. If I do EVERYTHING in the prologue, I get vol. I for free?

I definitely like this. It's hard enough that I don't think there would be many sales lost to it.


I also like the idea of full stats when you've completed all the quests for a monster type.


I see no need for the 1xp that some on here have talked about. One should get xp for overcoming challenges, not for grinding. I find the slayers questionable, I don't want more xp for simply killing.