MOTU vs Cannith challenge items

[Aalric]

I'm really torn atm whether the new MOTU items for monks are better all in all than the Cannith Challenge items. Apologies - this is a bit long....

Let me explain:

My set up before MOTU

Head: Cove hat NA + 5
Armor: Frozen tunic with toughness slotted
Boots: used to be madstones - now using whatever catches my fancy at the time. Will revert to madstoned when fixed.
Bracers: Bracers of the wind with GFL slotted
Gloves: Fabricators
Belt: Spare hand
Necklace: Shintao
Ring 1: Shintao with Holy Burst
Ring 2: Stalker
Goggles: Tharnes
Cloak: GS 45 HP heavy fort
Trinket: Head of good fortune (upgraded)

With MOTU I could change the following:

Bracers, Belt & Armor - sun soul & spider Caparison
Ring - Seal of dun rubar
Gloves - purple dragon gloves (this I will almost definately do - no downside & not really part of the discussion)

So - what do I gain & lose with both options:

Lets say I used the sun soul, spider Caparison & teh dun rubar ring. I would gain...

* About +4 wisdom which = +2 DC & AC
* + 1 AC (9 AC robe vs 8 AC robe)
* + 1 reinforced fists
* + 2 to hit & dmg (does it stack with shintao?) and the special abilities that proc on a 20
* +4 AC from Superior Parrying
* + 4 dodge
* + 10 stunning on everything

Sounds nice. But here is what I lose with this set up:

* Freezing Ice - this procs a lot & is a real help, especially if I get mobbed
*Blur from the bracers - don't always have a mage on hand to cast it
* - 3 dodge from the bracers
* GFL - not sure where I'd have room to slot this in if I used all the new shinies from MOTU. I suppose I could use my Epic spectral gloves & slot it in there, but that would mean I wouldn't be able to use the new purple dragon gloves which seem to be more useful
* Exceptional Combat mastery from the spare hand belt - I suppose I could survive without this but it is definately nice for stunning when you already have +10 stunning on the wraps
* Ring of the stalker - +6 seeker, sneak attack, manslayer & yellow & clear slot - it's a nice combination ring & it is hard to juggle gear & get all the effects from somewhere else.

So there you have it - not really sure what to do. Maybe the best I could hope for is to keep the shintao & stalker rings & forget about the dun robar seal. I could slot GFL in the stalker ring & then I would just be loosing blur, Exceptional Combat mastery, 3 dodge and Freezing Ice - all of which (especially the loss of frezzing ice & 3 dodge) hurts

Any ideas?

[Xezno]

Well all i can say is that the new set bonuses seem really strong - specially in fire and earth stance. I would really try to work them in.

Also not sure how often the freezing ice lands in the tougher content (35 save DC).

Also with the new items all u really need to slot is GFL.

[Kaledor]

I'm really torn atm whether the new MOTU items for monks are better all in all than the Cannith Challenge items. Apologies - this is a bit long....

Let me explain:

My set up before MOTU

Head: Cove hat NA + 5
Armor: Frozen tunic with toughness slotted
Boots: used to be madstones - now using whatever catches my fancy at the time. Will revert to madstoned when fixed.
Bracers: Bracers of the wind with GFL slotted
Gloves: Fabricators
Belt: Spare hand
Necklace: Shintao
Ring 1: Shintao with Holy Burst
Ring 2: Stalker
Goggles: Tharnes
Cloak: GS 45 HP heavy fort
Trinket: Head of good fortune (upgraded)

With MOTU I could change the following:

Bracers, Belt & Armor - sun soul & spider Caparison
Ring - Seal of dun rubar
Gloves - purple dragon gloves (this I will almost definately do - no downside & not really part of the discussion)

So - what do I gain & lose with both options:

Lets say I used the sun soul, spider Caparison & teh dun rubar ring. I would gain...

* About +4 wisdom which = +2 DC & AC
* + 1 AC (9 AC robe vs 8 AC robe)
* + 1 reinforced fists
* + 2 to hit & dmg (does it stack with shintao?) and the special abilities that proc on a 20
* +4 AC from Superior Parrying
* + 4 dodge
* + 10 stunning on everything

Sounds nice. But here is what I lose with this set up:

* Freezing Ice - this procs a lot & is a real help, especially if I get mobbed
*Blur from the bracers - don't always have a mage on hand to cast it
* - 3 dodge from the bracers
* GFL - not sure where I'd have room to slot this in if I used all the new shinies from MOTU. I suppose I could use my Epic spectral gloves & slot it in there, but that would mean I wouldn't be able to use the new purple dragon gloves which seem to be more useful
* Exceptional Combat mastery from the spare hand belt - I suppose I could survive without this but it is definately nice for stunning when you already have +10 stunning on the wraps
* Ring of the stalker - +6 seeker, sneak attack, manslayer & yellow & clear slot - it's a nice combination ring & it is hard to juggle gear & get all the effects from somewhere else.

So there you have it - not really sure what to do. Maybe the best I could hope for is to keep the shintao & stalker rings & forget about the dun robar seal. I could slot GFL in the stalker ring & then I would just be loosing blur, Exceptional Combat mastery, 3 dodge and Freezing Ice - all of which (especially the loss of frezzing ice & 3 dodge) hurts

Any ideas?

I haven't pulled the spider pj's yet nor do I have enough favor to give them the sun soul set bonus. I do wear the sun soul set.

Helm- GSMin2 HP
Neck- Henshin (Shintao)
Trinket- Voice of the master (still looking for a good trinket)
Goggles- Woodsman goggles
Bracers- Bracers of the SunSoul
Boots- Boots of the Woodsman
Belt- Belt of the SunSoul
Gloves- Epic brawling gloves (these are actually really nice again now that the glass jaw strike is working)
Ring1- Seal of DunRobar +10 stunning, +8 Dex
Ring2- Henshin with Holy Burst (still looking for the Shintao ring)
Armor- Sun Soul Pj's


I plan on working favor and farming up a set of the spiderspun pj's, also need to finally get my shintao ring from ToD, haven't decided on a trinket as yet. I ended up dumping GFL, but I did pick up the epic toughness feat, and also with the additional hps and EDs I still have around 700 health.

I dumped Epic Jidz, Epic Raven's sight, Epic Spare hand, Bloodstone, was a sad day but afterwards I did feal alot better, the mtn stance proc goes off alot and is really helpful.

[rantbar]

Those gem slots are nice but even without them here is what I would lose.
---------------------------------
Robe
Fire shield cold = -50% to fire dmg is great , reflex does cover for some of that
Freezing Ice, coupled with the alchemical air set, this or lit strike = death to most things kinda doubles my free kills

Bracer
10 inherent stacking elect reist
Blurry 20% , always having blur on or constant 20% dmg avoidance unless mob has TS
Dodge bonus 3% , I like me some dodge, but I'm not giving up dmg rings for a dodge item
Air guard , things fall down sometimes

Belt
3% double strike , doesn't stack with my tier 3 air alchems but sometimes I do take them off, nice to have constant 3% at least ( I sit 22% normally I am big on double strike)
+5 combat mastery, This is just pimp stun fist, stun blow ect.. (54 DC unbuffed, how much is overkill?)
Riposte, counterattack as a dmg shield.. I think backstab goes off on it too as I see 2 numbers (half elf dil rogue for 3d6) seems to do like 70 pts
Staggering blow, not sure I have ever seen that go off, hard to tell when wearing air guard

----------------------------------------
The new set I lose the above for the following

Set bonus +2 to hit and dmg, might not stack with shinto set
On a 20 roll
Fire - cure mod, with standard monk amp like 50 ish hp maybe
Earth - 10 sec buff to reduce incomming dmg by 25% ( great if you tank, but I dont like the aggro you get, and with my build either I can tank it without it or for instance in epic elite, it doesn't help enough ... those guys dont play =)
Air - 6% to doublestrike temp buff (unsure if it stacks with epic destiny stuff )
Water - Fire shield cold -50% to fire dmg is great , reflex does cover for some of that

Robe
+2 more resist
+1 more ac
Reinforced fist , doesnt stack with alchemical wraps (think its not working currently anyway) but would be nice for other wraps

Bracer
+1 more wis (not taking off shinto ring set)
+2 con , hpts are yummy
+4 to saves and +4 to ac , very nice love the save (not having issues failing saves currently) , and the ac but 4 ac aint what it use to be

Belt
+1 extra con , This would free up the neck slot if the shinto set bonus doesnt stack.
+2 wis this gives an ac and a dc back to stun fist but not stun blow (I use both)
+15 con - duplicated on shinto neck set

---------------------------------------------------


Might free up a neck slot, give me 23 hpts , like +5 or 6 to most saves and 6 ac
The stance effects seem to be taking some of what I lose and giving it back as a temp buff, grated it might stack and they are kinda cool, Might be worth it on a tankie type monk, if you are buffed with blur and have a +4% dodge somewhere it could be cool.

However;
I am a DPS build (If I want to tank I have a defender build fighter, no point building 2 tanks =), normally in wind stance but also grandmaster earth and I think I lose alot more than I get back if I equip the new set, maybe the raid crafted armor can make up for all that, a solid neck with +5 combat mastery would go a long way to making it feasible. ( I stun everything constantly, thumb button bound )

PS I have my toughness and greater false life item on epic gem slots I would be losing too.


Anyway thats my breakdown, it might not be for everyone, and the gear from the house C challenges takes a little longer to get and is kinda more grind tasktic