So, nerfed healing is WAI?

[MRMechMan]

Out of all the nerfs I have seen Turbine cook up during the last six years, this takes the cake - big time. Playing a Divine is one of the most ungrateful, expensive and stressing party roles you can have in this game. So the devs make it harder, more expensive, and more stressful. This is the most stupid nerf ever. Grats devs.

This.

I enjoy healing.

I don't enjoy having to chug pots to do it because they nerfed heal spells.

[Mubjon]

I have stopped drinking mana pots unless I find them in a chest during a quest. And then I still might not drink it. Why does anyone feel the need to drink mana pots? Much less mana pots they spend real money on? If the raid is going to succeed, it will succeed with everyone contributing what their character comes with.

As far as the nerf to heal? I have only noticed a difference with Warforge not getting hit as much. I have ran pugs and had no problem keeping the melee's topped off. With the right gear my heals are still hitting for about 500 on average, just as they did pre U14 with just a superior potency.

My divine punishment is hitting for more with the proper gear as well. 1 tick on my divine punishment is hitting on average of 114. It was hitting for around 90 before the xpac.

So the question becomes, are you carrying the proper gear to cast now on your cleric? It means you have to have a devotion, radiance, and impluse item. It is great if you can find a staff with all three of course, but those seem to be rare.

[Dolphious]

I get why people are frustrated by the process, and I don't know if this is the best way to go about it, but I do like the idea of making taking damage more painful.

Defense is much easier to come by now, making healing more expensive makes it more important to invest in defense.

The whole "Shade's school of DDO" where you did absolutely nothing to mitigate incoming damage besides killing stuff quickly always struck me as tactically shallow and uninteresting. I wouldn't mind getting back a sense that taking a ton of damage and just power healing through it is a bad and inefficient way of playing.

I'll grant that the devs should explain their reasoning, and the way they implemented this by letting everyone assume it was a bug, then making a "documentation change" is weird and frustrating. I'm not saying I think it's overall a good idea, but I do see *some* basis for wanting a change like this.

[TheDarkTraveler]

Frankly, I'm happy to see heals "nerfed". The game has gotten more interesting and challenging ...

[simo0208]

Frankly, I'm happy to see heals "nerfed". The game has gotten more interesting and challenging ...

I'm guessing you don't play a divine then. When clerics and favored souls are relegated to JUST healing, the game is really boring for them, causing them to no longer play their clerics or favored souls and then you have nothing but hirelings healing (and no raid healers). But hey, if you think the game is more challenging this way, then don't ever play with a cleric or favored soul. No one is making you. I personally run many quests and lives without the need of a cleric or favored soul and when they join my groups, I let them do as they please.

[Udalric]

Frankly, I'm happy to see heals "nerfed". The game has gotten more interesting and challenging ...

Light spells are nerfed also. I'm sure you would be happy with 50% reduction on your barb rages and strength bonuses from equipment . That will make game more challenging as well,wouldn't you agree ?

[justagame]

Remember the context in which this is happening...

... Enemies deal more damage now
... PCs have more HP than ever
... Arcane damage is increasing (I love, by the way, how all the complaints about sorc damage have left us with a divine nerf!!!)
... Melee damage is increasing


Also, I think that people who openly cheer for / celebrate nerfs to other classes have NO leg to stand on when their own favorite class or ability gets chopped.

[zwiebelring]

It seems we all are just to stupid to understand Turbines REAL intention.

This is finally a buff to Warforged. After all WF Melees will still have someone in the party that can throw them a "heal"...

....All hail WF barbs once again? :I

-edit-
Further reading on thsi topic is confusing me now. Will healing get nerfed nay further or will it be like it is now and just an announcement was made to it being WAI?

[ShadowFlash]

Everyone keeps mentioning "properly equiped" and healing remaining the same. What is properly equipped now, without using weapon slots? My level 20 cleric wears....
Alchemist Crown...Supeior Devotion & Superior Radiance (always on)
Arcane Lore (always on)
I use to use clickie kamas for 75% cure/light...practically useles now.
Staff of Fleshshaping as a swap in to pop aura's (major healing lore)
Luminous Truth as a swap in every 12 seconds once DP's are fully stacked (major radiance lore)

Almost all other times, I swing dual D.axes.

Not the worst gear to survive the U14 changes. I've been collecting the new staves, but haven't quite found the perfect combination to upgrade.

Right now, without swapping in a staff, my heals, aura's, bursts, and DP's all hit for less. With staff swap in's, my aura is equal to previously, my bursts still less, and my DP's still less. My heal spells only show a marginal improvement while holding a new tharmaturgy (sp) staff. Now to maintain the same level of healing and light based spellcasting, I must hold a staff.

So, my heals and light spells were not directly nerfed, as with dedicated gear I can at minimum "equal" what I had. What was nerfed, was my ability to contribute outside of these abilities (melee). If the -50% spellpower from items was not in affect, this would not be the case. Of course there's other things that irk me as well, such as with my 2 monk splash, I can't stance at shrines for a few more SP's due to the Fortification bug. And with the new AC, I have very little hope in ever gaining any realistic defense while wearing robes...no stoneskin, dodge, displacement, armor, or gear slots to use for melee offense or defense (due to perma slotting caster gear)

All-in-all...not happy times for my "battle-cleric". I guess the problem is melee-divines were finally acceptable as filling healing roles as well...back to the days of battle-clerics don't heal I guess...

ShadowFlash

[Anihsod]

sad .. my cleric won't be able to throw a mass heal and I see green 1800, 1500 etc. Numbers high enough to heal that 480 hp rogue for the next week and a half. It's also a shame that +healing amp gear drops on random loot because that will put that mass heal right back to the 40% over healing it was doing before the numbers were adjusted. man i hate that.

[Terebinthia]

Everyone keeps mentioning "properly equiped" and healing remaining the same. What is properly equipped now, without using weapon slots? My level 20 cleric wears....
Alchemist Crown...Supeior Devotion & Superior Radiance (always on)
Arcane Lore (always on)
I use to use clickie kamas for 75% cure/light...practically useles now.
Staff of Fleshshaping as a swap in to pop aura's (major healing lore)
Luminous Truth as a swap in every 12 seconds once DP's are fully stacked (major radiance lore)

Almost all other times, I swing dual D.axes.

Not the worst gear to survive the U14 changes. I've been collecting the new staves, but haven't quite found the perfect combination to upgrade.

Right now, without swapping in a staff, my heals, aura's, bursts, and DP's all hit for less. With staff swap in's, my aura is equal to previously, my bursts still less, and my DP's still less. My heal spells only show a marginal improvement while holding a new tharmaturgy (sp) staff. Now to maintain the same level of healing and light based spellcasting, I must hold a staff.

So, my heals and light spells were not directly nerfed, as with dedicated gear I can at minimum "equal" what I had. What was nerfed, was my ability to contribute outside of these abilities (melee). If the -50% spellpower from items was not in affect, this would not be the case. Of course there's other things that irk me as well, such as with my 2 monk splash, I can't stance at shrines for a few more SP's due to the Fortification bug. And with the new AC, I have very little hope in ever gaining any realistic defense while wearing robes...no stoneskin, dodge, displacement, armor, or gear slots to use for melee offense or defense (due to perma slotting caster gear)

All-in-all...not happy times for my "battle-cleric". I guess the problem is melee-divines were finally acceptable as filling healing roles as well...back to the days of battle-clerics don't heal I guess...

ShadowFlash

See, I think this is a very interesting post.

My main is also a melee divine - a hybrid caster melee based on the Superior Soul (a human twf longsword specialist). I port a potency item at all times (a cove hat) but other than that, nothing really (I have popped an Amrath clicky in raid situations but only sporadically). I have healed every single epic quest and I think every Epic raid pre update 14 with this set up. I have this toon mainly set up to solo or shortman but am basically planning to grab the priestess dagger as an alternative to epic timeblade and slot in the alchemist crown for group situations. That or the gauntlets of eternity if to hit from the raven's eye set isnt that much of an issue.

So, I am clearly a lazy player, I swap very little but have found epic content eminently doable. I understand that some folk want to be optimal at all times but will it clearly be unplayable?

[Brennie]

Light spells are nerfed also. (...)

Can anyone confirm this? I've heard that light spells and even untyped divine spells (Bladebarrier/cometfall) and alignment spells (Holy smite/chaos hammer etc) are all getting half power from spellpower. I've *also* heard that potency is now supposedly stacking with devotion. However, i refuse to believe *any* of this until i have heard from a confirmed source who has done sufficient testing, with numbers and maths. I don't want to be believing or repeating what essentially boils down to someone's "Feeling" or "Gut instinct" about spell power changes :/

[ShadowFlash]

See, I think this is a very interesting post.

My main is also a melee divine - a hybrid caster melee based on the Superior Soul (a human twf longsword specialist). I port a potency item at all times (a cove hat) but other than that, nothing really (I have popped an Amrath clicky in raid situations but only sporadically). I have healed every single epic quest and I think every Epic raid pre update 14 with this set up. I have this toon mainly set up to solo or shortman but am basically planning to grab the priestess dagger as an alternative to epic timeblade and slot in the alchemist crown for group situations. That or the gauntlets of eternity if to hit from the raven's eye set isnt that much of an issue.

So, I am clearly a lazy player, I swap very little but have found epic content eminently doable. I understand that some folk want to be optimal at all times but will it clearly be unplayable?

unplayable? no.

My burst went from 157 clickied, and TWFing D.axes...to 124 while clickie'd (+15 alchemical) and NOT fighting (staff +15 implement)...definately a nerf. I could improve this with a dedicated staff for better spellpower (only 72+15 atm) to attempt to reach where I already was, but again...still less, and NOT meleeing.

My heal spell went from 484 clickie'd and TWFing D.Axes, to 412 clickie'd AND holding the same staff (72+15)...again..worse, AND not meleeing.

All the U14 changes taken together hurt quite a bit, but I could soldier through it if I choose. This latest round, is pushing my limit of creative swapping and multi-tasking. I'm questioning why I bother at this point, as TRing into a Pally with better DPS, and at least some solo/duo/shortman healing would work just as well, and free me of the added difficulties of keeping a party up while enjoying the playstyle I choose. For me, It's not about any one game-breaking nerf, it's about pigeon-holing me into a role that I only occasionally enjoy anymore.

ShadowFlash

[mystafyi]

I've *also* heard that potency is now supposedly stacking with devotion.

does not stack.

on a further note. the following only give 50%(rounded down ofc) of their stated value to the heal spell.
heroic enhancements
epic destiny enhancements
universal spell power bonus
devotion items

disclaimer: testing was done on a naked 20+cleric with reset enhancements/destinies. baseline heal spell was 150hp. as enchancements/items were added to the mix, in game results were as expected.

[Brennie]

does not stack.

I was most skeptical about this claim.

Any insight into light/untyped/alignment spellpower?

[Udalric]

I was most skeptical about this claim.

Any insight into light/untyped/alignment spellpower?

Pre u14: Nimbus of light: 100 % Maximize + 50% Empower + 40% Full smiting line + 75% Superior Brilliance clickie = non crit average 160-170 dmg

After nerf: Nimbus of Light: Maximize 150 Spellpower + Empower 75 SP + 80 Enhancement Sp + 102 Sp Radiance item + 25 Sp Alchemical potion = non crit average 130-140 dmg

Go figure. Even with best equipment you can't reach pre Motu numbers...

[krtkoo]

read many (not all) posts in this thread...

from U14 I play high lvl content (epics) only with my fvs - and I didnt notice big difference. imo many of you are playing together with your guildies who are properly equipped, so you shouldnt have any problems to keep with healing. imo with the changes to the game, the healing was hardly touched. mass heals are now hitting for more, cos you can buff them without the need of extra rare items with devotion IX.

so much fuss about nothing.

enjoy the game

[Feralthyrtiaq]

I dont know what to say....

PrE.. Not Complete....

Epic Destiny.. Not there.....

Healing power.. Chopped in half....

this is just plain depressing now. I dont know if I will ever pug a divine again... Group with guildies and friends and solo Scaled content... Thats what my clerics are good for now,.....

Had a blast 2 manning Epic Casual ADQ1 (entered by mistake, meant to do heroic casual) with my FVS20 and my GFs AA.

Her first epic quest....

Her first epic XP....

Felt like a big *WIN* to me

I'm finding lately its the people I play with that make the game enjoyable despite the Developers attempts to EFF us constantly for playing it.

[Auralana7214]

read many (not all) posts in this thread...

from U14 I play high lvl content (epics) only with my fvs - and I didnt notice big difference. imo many of you are playing together with your guildies who are properly equipped, so you shouldnt have any problems to keep with healing. imo with the changes to the game, the healing was hardly touched. mass heals are now hitting for more, cos you can buff them without the need of extra rare items with devotion IX.

so much fuss about nothing.

enjoy the game

I don't even think all of the fuss is about the mechanics. We assumed that the discrepencies in numbers was a bug. Many posts were written to this effect. No response until now when they claim it was a description error. It's about respect for the players, which I think many players feel is lacking. Transparency! That's all I'm asking for!

[Bolo_Grubb]

I have not had any desire to play my level 20 FVS or level 20 cleric since all these changes. Just not much fun.